Veganism: Who is behind the Agenda?

Cantona's Collars

Just watching Sky News and during the ads one came up for Veganuary. Go vegan in January.
At first I thought it was for some kind of "make me a celebrity" show until I paid more attention.
Photogenic people having to catch various fruit and veg but recalling in horror and dropping meats thrown to them and then the whole "Go vegan in January" headline.
Who funded this as campaign as it can't be cheap?

_Brian

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Just watching Sky News and during the ads one came up for Veganuary. Go vegan in January.
At first I thought it was for some kind of "make me a celebrity" show until I paid more attention.
Photogenic people having to catch various fruit and veg but recalling in horror and dropping meats thrown to them and then the whole "Go vegan in January" headline.
Who funded this as campaign as it can't be cheap?

The whole promotion of fad gimmic month diets is just wrong, it goes against every bit of scientific medical advice by professionals..


Remember, state registered dieticians, who are the only recognised professionals in Ireland to give dietry advice advise a balanced diet including meat, dairy, reuit, veg, grains, nuts etc.. Eat as wide a variety foods as is possible with as little processing completed on them.



They advise against fad month diets, diets that restrict food groups, or diets that comprise of only one food group..

ganmo

_Brian wrote: »

The whole promotion of fad gimmic month diets is just wrong, it goes against every bit of scientific medical advice by professionals..


Remember, state registered dieticians, who are the only recognised professionals in Ireland to give dietry advice advise a balanced diet including meat, dairy, reuit, veg, grains, nuts etc.. Eat as wide a variety foods as is possible with as little processing completed on them.



They advise against fad month diets, diets that restrict food groups, or diets that comprise of only one food group..

it stems from febudairy..3 years ago where dairy farmers took to twitter to share their daily life.
last year vegans decided to preempt the next febudairy with a campaign of their own.

gozunda

ganmo wrote: »

it stems from febudairy..3 years ago where dairy farmers took to twitter to share their daily life.
last year vegans decided to preempt the next febudairy with a campaign of their own.

Think it might be the other way around. The blurb claimed the first event was in the UK in 2014. There is a UK based website promoting same.

Basically it's little more than a blatant attempt to bandwagon on the tradition of people eating less ****e after Christmas etc and all conflated with a minorty groups wanting to push their opinions on promoting veganism as a lifestyle

The veganuary website has the usual bull****e including wanting to get rid of all animal based farming and to have "A world where food production does not decimate forests, pollute rivers and oceans, exacerbate climate change, and drive wild animal populations to extinction.

Well I guess those same bunch wont be eating anything at all where they have to continue to rely on imported vegan foodstuffs from countries with few if any ethical or environmental standard or even areas devoted to arable and horticultural production which do "decimate forests, pollute rivers and oceans, exacerbate climate change, and drive wild animal populations to extinction" Funny how that part of the equation is always ignored by those pushing veganism. Little more than propaganda ...

Afaik Februdairy was a move to counter some of the ****e being pushed

Xcellor

_Brian wrote: »

The whole promotion of fad gimmic month diets is just wrong, it goes against every bit of scientific medical advice by professionals..


Remember, state registered dieticians, who are the only recognised professionals in Ireland to give dietry advice advise a balanced diet including meat, dairy, reuit, veg, grains, nuts etc.. Eat as wide a variety foods as is possible with as little processing completed on them.



They advise against fad month diets, diets that restrict food groups, or diets that comprise of only one food group..

Yeah but most people seem to think being a vegan is hard and is all about sacrifice, the likes of veganuary show it's achievable , affordable, tasty and completely healthy.

I don't class veganism as a diet which restricts food groups. Protein, fats and carbohydrates are all available in plants. Why on earth dairy and meat get their own group it's strange.

If you you want fads then keto diet, carnivore diet would tick those boxes.

_Brian

Xcellor wrote: »

Yeah but most people seem to think being a vegan is hard and is all about sacrifice, the likes of veganuary show it's achievable , affordable, tasty and completely healthy.

I don't class veganism as a diet which restricts food groups. Protein, fats and carbohydrates are all available in plants. Why on earth dairy and meat get their own group it's strange.

If you you want fads then keto diet, carnivore diet would tick those boxes.

Humans are omnivores, meat and dairy are food groups because whats what we evolved eating and its the best dietry advice to include these in your overall diet..
I don't want keto either, thats yet another fad diet that excludes food groups same as veganism, they are unnatural.


The natural diet for humand includes meat, dairy, fruit, veg, nuts, grains etc. This is scientifically widely accepted as the best diet.

gozunda

Xcellor wrote: »

Yeah but most people seem to think being a vegan is hard and is all about sacrifice, the likes of veganuary show it's achievable , affordable, tasty and completely healthy.

I don't class veganism as a diet which restricts food groups. Protein, fats and carbohydrates are all available in plants. Why on earth dairy and meat get their own group it's strange.

If you you want fads then keto diet, carnivore diet would tick those boxes.

Veguarary is little more than a blatant attempt to ride the excesses of christmas to push a plant food type lifestyle.

It remains that mainstream dietary advice recommends a diet based on a full selection of foods including vegetables, dairy and meat.

If some people want to adopt a restricted diet for personal reasons then thats fine but lets not pretend its anything else.

Panch18

It’s some COD is what it is

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2019/1209/1097987-vegan-influencer-confuses-followers-by-switching-to-all-meat-diet/

_Brian

Panch18 wrote: »

It’s some COD is what it is

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/food/2019/1209/1097987-vegan-influencer-confuses-followers-by-switching-to-all-meat-diet/

Just bull**** clickbait.
I’d say she was as much a vegan for 4.5 years than I was the pope for the last decade.

People like this just publish shock stories of bull**** carry on to build profile and followers in an attempt to monify them.

She does nothing for vegan, vegetarian or normal people, fake people like that do everything for themselves and contribute nothing to the world.

Xcellor

_Brian wrote: »

Humans are omnivores, meat and dairy are food groups because whats what we evolved eating and its the best dietry advice to include these in your overall diet..
I don't want keto either, thats yet another fad diet that excludes food groups same as veganism, they are unnatural.


The natural diet for humand includes meat, dairy, fruit, veg, nuts, grains etc. This is scientifically widely accepted as the best diet.

Yeah we are omnivores we can eat meat. It doesn't mean we have to to be healthy. Appealing to nature is pointless because humans do many things that are not considered natural.

Many health bodies and dietetic associations are on the record stating a properly planned plant based diet is healthy for all stages of life.

_Brian

Xcellor wrote: »

Yeah we are omnivores we can eat meat. It doesn't mean we have to to be healthy. Appealing to nature is pointless because humans do many things that are not considered natural.

Many health bodies and dietetic associations are on the record stating a properly planned plant based diet is healthy for all stages of life.

It’s not that we can eat meat, it’s that our bodies are developed to eat meat as part of our natural normal diet.
Excluding meat or animal products serves no health benefits, no biodiversity or climate benefits. It satisfies the emotional weakness of a small number of the population have with their food supply.

Consuming animals as part of the human diet is as natural for us as it is for Pandas to eat bamboo or cows to eat grass.

nthclare

The irony of being a vegan is that the compost and soil is composed of organic matter composed of dead animals insects plants etc

So you'll never be able to be a hard fledged vegan, and a lot of organic vegetable farmer's use seaweed as fertiliser which is peppered in sand hoppers and other critters.
Seaweed extract is the same...

If you want to be a real vegan you'd need to use 100% organic plant matter.

I only found out recently vegans can't eat honey either one of nature's most potent remedies...

elperello

I know as much about Veganuary as our cat knows about a holiday.

However I was talking to a lady today home for the Christmas and she told me she is doing Veganuary.

She has been a vegetarian for 25 years and has been experimenting with reducing dairy for the last year or two.

This woman is a professional, degree, Masters and currently doing a doctorate.

She is no tree hugger or eco warrior but cares about the planet and is nobody's fool.

I think farmers should stop knocking the likes of her and looking for a conspiracy and concentrate on doing what they do well.

ruwithme

I seen this evening on i t v news that red meat sales in the uk were down £77 million in 2019 or so they claimed anyway

Xcellor

nthclare wrote: »

The irony of being a vegan is that the compost and soil is composed of organic matter composed of dead animals insects plants etc

So you'll never be able to be a hard fledged vegan, and a lot of organic vegetable farmer's use seaweed as fertiliser which is peppered in sand hoppers and other critters.
Seaweed extract is the same...

If you want to be a real vegan you'd need to use 100% organic plant matter.

I only found out recently vegans can't eat honey either one of nature's most potent remedies...

""A philosophy and way of living which seeks to exclude—as far as is possible and practicable..."

Sometimes it's not possible or practical.

patsy_mccabe

What I find most ironic of all, is that all vegans are descendants of meat eaters going back millions of years.

cryptocurrency

Christy42 wrote: »

I think people are too keen to find a conspiracy.

People are interested in it. It has become far more of a serious choice in recent years without the same sacrifice. Possibly some people are going for it as a reaction to us too much meat as a society (I know plenty of people who gave up drink due to seeing too many overindulge). I know some (vegetarian admittedly) who go with it for environmental and the ability to feed more people. These have all become more and more topical over recent years. Meat is also an easy target for fad diets partially due to some eating too much for their own good. Especially as many of our more unhealthy meals involve meat/dairy cos both taste gooood. Frequently not due to the meat which can be healthy but it gets tarred with the fast food brush at times.

Certainly, like with anything, there are plenty of companies take advantage with plenty of dubious claims all over the place.Not sure there is anything I would call an Agenda though.

Maybe some are just interested in it.

Note I am a meat eater with no intention of ever joining the vegans/vegetarians.

Lot's of people are into Keto May and Paleo June...Let's see if that gets on TV and RAdio with as much relentless pushing

HillFarmer

Looking specifically here in Ireland, we are producing so much meat and milk we are ruining our rivers and our environment.

I for one love farming but in the last 20 years I've noticed a big decrease in wildlife around me.

I've seen trout floating on the river several times due to slurry runoff.

I think younger people are coming to realize the effect of over grazing and upping dairy numbers which results in even more fertiliser being spread.
( those Teagasc fellas have a lot to answer for )

Typically i think this is far worse on the East of ireland.
Anyway, back to the point, there will always be people who's values relate to veganism, however I think other people who are more concerned about climate change is increasing their numbers.

_Brian

HillFarmer wrote: »

Looking specifically here in Ireland, we are producing so much meat and milk we are ruining our rivers and our environment.

I for one love farming but in the last 20 years I've noticed a big decrease in wildlife around me.

I've seen trout floating on the river several times due to slurry runoff.

I think younger people are coming to realize the effect of over grazing and upping dairy numbers which results in even more fertiliser being spread.
( those Teagasc fellas have a lot to answer for )

Typically i think this is far worse on the East of ireland.
Anyway, back to the point, there will always be people who's values relate to veganism, however I think other people who are more concerned about climate change is increasing their numbers.

But there is no need to turn to veganism to support the environment, that’s like saying the best way to loose weight is cutting off your hands so you can’t over feed yourself.

I agree with your comments on industrial farming damaging the environment. But the solution to industrial farming isn’t no farming, it’s people going out and sourcing food from local more traditional style farms of which there are a growing number making produce available to buy.

roosterman71

HillFarmer wrote: »

Looking specifically here in Ireland, we are producing so much meat and milk we are ruining our rivers and our environment.

I for one love farming but in the last 20 years I've noticed a big decrease in wildlife around me.

I've seen trout floating on the river several times due to slurry runoff.

It's partly to blame. So too are councils who release raw sewage. Wasn't there part of Dublin bay or around that area closed off because the council did that. Or people buying chemicals to kill a few weeds in their driveway and then dump the remaining part down the sink/drain (can't do that in farming)

HillFarmer wrote: »

I think younger people are coming to realize the effect of over grazing and upping dairy numbers which results in even more fertiliser being spread.
( those Teagasc fellas have a lot to answer for )

Yeah Teagasc need a good kick in the hole. Their mantra is expand expand expand, but there is no benefit at all. Get bigger, do more, receive the same reward at the end. It's not the farmer benefiting from this expansion for sure.
I don't think we have an over grazing problem in Ireland. Grass is the best thing we can grow, and over grazing stunts that. I'd say it's a minority that do it, and that's down to bad management.
We actually have less cattle in 2018 than even 2016 (https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/lsd/livestocksurveydecember2018/).
In fact, since 1979, the number of cattle has increased by approx 300k head. At the same time, the population has gone from 3.4m to 4.9m. A near 50% increase. And it's that human increase that puts much more drains on our resources, not to mention the rampant unwarranted consumption desire. Buy clothes for a euro, and dump after one wear (same clothes shipped half way around the world too). Buy food for nothing, and dump whats not needed. Yet spend a grand on a phone!

HillFarmer wrote: »

Anyway, back to the point, there will always be people who's values relate to veganism, however I think other people who are more concerned about climate change is increasing their numbers.

And livestock farming will be key here to manage the soil to sequester carbon.

patsy_mccabe

Virtue signalling at it's worst;

https://nypost.com/2020/01/03/the-golden-globes-go-vegan-for-award-show-dinner/

roosterman71

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Virtue signalling at it's worst;

https://nypost.com/2020/01/03/the-golden-globes-go-vegan-for-award-show-dinner/

Be class if some of the big noises attending either refused the invite on the basis of trying to force an agenda on them, or brought their own steak in, or mentioned the bull**** of it all during a speech or something!

Good news for the local chippers all the same

mf240

Why did the vegan cross the road,

To tell a stranger that they were vegan

whelan2

mf240 wrote: »

Why did the vegan cross the road,

To tell a stranger that they were vegan

So many posts on Facebook's the last few days for the vegans. Makes you wonder wtf the future holds

gozunda

whelan2 wrote: »

So many posts on Facebook's the last few days for the vegans. Makes you wonder wtf the future holds

A lot is pure bs if you read what is written. Crazy to think that those who who know feck all about food production and agriculture are attempting to tell everyone else what is supposedly good for them and what is wrong with everything else.

That said much of what is around is this veguanary promotion. A lot of it is very slick and obviously has big money behind it. From the dedicated website to the promoted video of people been thrown random bits of raw meat and then vegetables. They claim their funds come from crowdfunding - ho hum. I suspect that the usual plant food corporate interests are donating generously and benefiting accordingly...

_Brian

gozunda wrote: »

A lot is pure bs if you read what is written. Crazy to think that those who who know feck all about food production and agriculture are attempting to tell everyone else what is supposedly good for them and what is wrong with everything else.

That said much of what is around is this veguanary promotion. A lot of it is very slick and obviously has big money behind it. From the dedicated website to the promoted video of people been thrown random bits of raw meat and then vegetables. I must check who is paying for all of it. I suspect that the usual plant food corporate interests are donating generously and benefiting accordingly...

Money, money, money.

Feeding hyper processed “foods” to newly converted vegans who can’t and won’t cook is going to be big business. That’s where the backing is coming from for these ads.

Even though 83% of vegans return to a normal diet within a year, there are enough coming in that it’s a multi billion euro business.

Honestly I’ve money sitting in Prize bonds and I should be looking into this market to exploit them. It would feel wrong though exploiting their stupidity and emotional weakness.
But people wealthy investors are flocking to vegan funds because its today’s gold rush, get in early, make a fortune and pull out when it gets old.

gozunda

_Brian wrote: »

Money, money, money.

Feeding hyper processed “foods” to newly converted vegans who can’t and won’t cook is going to be big business. That’s where the backing is coming from for these ads.

....

True. I'm not as a rule a fan of the Irish Times - but this article from last January I think covers a lot of it ...

Still a predominantly middle class concern, this new normalization of veganism has seen a glut of expensively-priced food products - distinguished by a big V sign on the packaging - hit the supermarket aisles. What’s known as the “Organic Tax” applies here - whereby if you call something Organic or Gluten-Free etc you can raise the price by 30% - which is particularly galling in the case of Vegan meals as they look like something last seen floating on top of a pond.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/beware-the-perils-of-veganuary-1.3757316

gozunda

Just comment on something in the link above. The article includes the quote that:

Renowned chef Anthony Bourdain once referred to vegans as 'the Hezbollah-like splinter faction of vegetarians'

Now personally I dont believe all vegans are like that. However It's often the few extremists which give the many a bad rap imo. No less exhibited by the likes of people like joey 'Carbstrong' ...

This from the 'This Morning' show during a debate about whether ‘Veganuary has gone too far' where he aggressively speaks over the other guest and takes to repeating the usual bs about crops been grown to nearly exclusively feed animals - something which has been busted many times as complete hogwash

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WOWD2Sy7YE

https://www.express.co.uk/videos/6119448801001/This-Morning-Vegan-activist-clashes-with-Eamonn-Holmes

patsy_mccabe

Don't be surprised by Joey Carbstrong's agression. Just Google his past in Austrailia;

In September 2011 he was arrested when police found a loaded, sawn-off pump-action rifle down the front of his trousers, which he apparently planned to take to a drug deal.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/02/09/peaceful-vegan-activist-joey-carbstrong-compared-dairy-farmers/

HillFarmer

_Brian wrote: »

But there is no need to turn to veganism to support the environment, that’s like saying the best way to loose weight is cutting off your hands so you can’t over feed yourself.

I agree with your comments on industrial farming damaging the environment. But the solution to industrial farming isn’t no farming, it’s people going out and sourcing food from local more traditional style farms of which there are a growing number making produce available to buy.

Ya completely agree, but I think we as farmers need to call out the 5uckers that are ruining the environment.

I do think we'll be hit price wise long term with people reducing the amount of meat they eat but imo the trend to veganism isnt going to snowball.

Re buying more local, couldn't agree more. via farmers online and markets I try to buy most of my food from locals.