Housing and new people

Sleeper12

beejee wrote:

Not enough homes, combined with too many people. No shortage of more people coming here, every indication that not enough homes will be built.

We have enough accommodation to house more than double the 11,000 homeless.

All we need is a government willing to put a little effort in.

beejee

dxhound2005 wrote: »

English people won't do seasonal farm work. There was a steady supply of workers from EU countries in Eastern Europe. But not enough of them are coming following the Brexit vote. So the UK made new rules to allow workers in from non EU countries like Russia, Ukraine and Moldova. You couldn't make it up.

There's a lot to this comment!

For arguments sake, let's say the 60% odd people in this thread, who believe there is at least a strong connection between immigration and housing "problems", are indeed representative of the country at large.

So then, you must ask, how is this connection utterly devoid of mass commentary?

How can Rte publicise these immigration ceremonies, and within minutes of the same broadcast, rabbit on about housing this and housing that?

How can that be?

And the answer lies deeply hidden in your comment on the UK.

Who decided, in the UK, that it was a great idea to become reliant on an eastern European workforce? Now that that's dried up, who has now decided that this workforce be replaced by yet another migrant workforce from even further a field?

Secondly, it's a chicken and egg scenario that has been falsely created. An English guy isn't going to work in a low paid job because it's not enough money to pay the rent, say. It's not enough money to pay the rent because the costs of rent have shot up. And, I say, the costs of rent have shot up because of significant immigration.

What a disaster!

So... This is a situation that has not been rightfully sought by the citizens of a country, but instead by a very few, very hypocritical people pulling the strings. The results of this thread are indicating, even if slightly, that the same game is afoot here.

It won't end well.

X111111111111

enricoh wrote: »

There was an article on the front page of the Sunday times that Boris is to end non skilled migration to the UK. Skilled, useful people only thanks.
We need to follow suit, pronto!

The establishment here don't want that, they want cheap labour to keep wages and terms and conditions down.

Sleeper12

https://www.dublininquirer.com/2017/04/05/above-shops-thousands-of-apartments-are-still-sitting-vacant..

https://www.thejournal.ie/empty-homes-officers-uk-ireland-would-it-work-here-3278447-Mar2017/

beejee

Captain Red Beard wrote: »

Threads like this demonstrate why the forum needs to have down voting enabled.

There's jokers and people who won't defend their opinions at all. Fine.

But the likes of you, man, you're the worst. You want to keep your head so deep in the sand you may as well be an ostrich.

But worse than an ostrich, because you want to make sure everyone else is neck deep as well.

And I had only just commented on the massive divide between observed bloody reality, and the complete lack of social/mass commentary/engagement.

Thank you, Mr. Ostrich, for so adequately demonstrating it.

Deub

TwoMonthsOff wrote: »

I must have imagined all those immigrants living in tents in the centre of Paris.

Which has nothing to do with a high cost of living.

beejee

Sleeper12 wrote: »

We have enough accommodation to house more than double the 11,000 homeless.

All we need is a government willing to put a little effort in.

No we patently, observed, evidently do NOT have enough housing.

Are you counting all the places that are empty because nobody wants to live there. Cos the problem with that is... Nobody wants to live there.

It's like being in a burning house, and someone repeatedly telling you that we have fire extinguishers, but that we don't have them right now, and not here where it's needed.

You'll burn to death during your dreams of what could be and might be, but ultimately isn't.

Deub

beejee wrote: »

Well, I know France fairly well, not an awful lot. But it's housing costs in economically attractive places are also insanely expensive.

Perhaps it's not so publicised as here, with specific regard to housing. But maybe it's because Ireland is so much smaller that such basics as housing become more prominent.

So, I'll still stand by my comment that areas of high immigration are very, very expensive. Stating the obvious. France is no different. Whereas the question I asked was....

... Name a country that has high immigration and does NOT have such very high costs.

That goes to the heart of my original question, basically "is there a strong connection between immigration and housing costs?"

I'm not convinced by your answer, but I appreciate you trying

Answer : France.
Areas of high immigration doesn’t drive higher housing cost. That’s because there are enough houses and it is not difficult to build new ones.
You throw affirmation with nothing to back them up. Including naming countries that have “this” problem and in the same post saying you don’t know an awful lot about them.

dxhound2005

beejee wrote: »

Who decided, in the UK, that it was a great idea to become reliant on an eastern European workforce? Now that that's dried up, who has now decided that this workforce be replaced by yet another migrant workforce from even further a field?

Secondly, it's a chicken and egg scenario that has been falsely created. An English guy isn't going to work in a low paid job because it's not enough money to pay the rent, say. It's not enough money to pay the rent because the costs of rent have shot up. And, I say, the costs of rent have shot up because of significant immigration.

The workers decided. The English workers who do not like that sort of work had to be replaced by EU workers who made good money before the Brexit vote. The fall in the Pound made it less attractive and their home economies were getting stronger because of EU membership.

That meant the farmers had to look further afield to poorer countries, and the government had to amend the rules to let workers in from Russia etc. The money is not bad, but the work is too hard for English people, especially in winter.

izzyflusky

beejee wrote: »

Oh no, please don't!

I remember the bad old days of pre-mass immigration. Sure we didn't know what a hospital was till some philanthropist builders left their own utopias to build them for us.
And sure then, after they immediately left, all we had were bare walls to look at lick the thicko's we were. Lo and behold, more philanthropists left their own utopian countries to demonstrate what a "doctor" was. And then they told us about these things called "nurses"!

And sure, didn't those same philanthropists decide to stay in this backward country to help us wipe our own holes too!

God's gift, really. Sure 1999 may as well have been the stone age in this crap country that you so selflessly decided to help, and stay in, and not go back to that brilliant place that couldn't hold onto you.

I'm sure your family will learn to accept our backward ways as they go to our backward schools and backward hospitals and backward transport and be surrounded by our backward people.

Thank you for your selfless sacrifice.



Edit: okay, that's a bit mean-spirited of a reply. But I don't like people telling me, essentially, that "you owe me for this big favour", despite the fact that it was all done to help themselves. You know what I mean?

The more I read you the more I start to think you have some sort of inferiority complex and feel threatened. I never said anyone owed me any favours, it is a symbiotic relationship. Simple as.

But you are not seeing that. You just see that you have outsiders coming in and taking away from the Irish.
Well, these outsiders are contributing A LOT too and you as a nation also need them/us.
Companies are having to shell out thousands of euro in recruiting, relocation packages, Visa's etc and not out of the goodness of their heart. I worked for a company that was paying 9k per worker to be brought over in expenses (without counting what the employee was getting), and that was on the lower end of the spectrum.

Least not forget that little Shakira Murphy's iPad and her mammy's 70 inch TV in her newly built council house (because every new estate has to have them now too), also came out of my pay check. And all my "new Irish" and plain foreign neighbours' (like me) too. You know, the surgeon, the pilot, various nurses and IT workers down the road.

the_syco

Are the "new Irish" building the new houses cheaper than the Irish once did?

beejee

Deub wrote: »

Answer : France.
Areas of high immigration doesn’t drive higher housing cost. That’s because there are enough houses and it is not difficult to build new ones.
You throw affirmation with nothing to back them up. Including naming countries that have “this” problem and in the same post saying you don’t know an awful lot about them.

So riddle me this, batman.

It must take extremes for you to notice causation. Therefore imagine this extreme...

Half of the population of France leaves. Do housing costs stay the same?

The population of France doubles. Do housing costs stay the same?

France is a poor example from you. Further, I think you'll find that my question is impossible to answer, because the causative effect of more people means higher costs. As in, the thread title.

As a countrys population naturally grows or shrinks, the time element allows a natural adjustment to accommodate that slow change.

Rapid movement of huge numbers of people does the opposite.

bubblypop

bubblypop wrote: »

So basically, you believe no one other than Irish people should be allowed to live in Ireland until every single person in the country owns their own home?
Is that what you believe?

So
Are you going to answer this yet?

Padre_Pio

beejee wrote: »

So riddle me this, batman.

It must take extremes for you to notice causation. Therefore imagine this extreme...

Half of the population of France leaves. Do housing costs stay the same?

The population of France doubles. Do housing costs stay the same?

France is a poor example from you. Further, I think you'll find that my question is impossible to answer, because the causative effect of more people means higher costs. As in, the thread title.

As a countrys population naturally grows or shrinks, the time element allows a natural adjustment to accommodate that slow change.

Rapid movement of huge numbers of people does the opposite.

There's huge inward and outward migration in Ireland. All these "new Irish" are a drop in the ocean compared to Irish, EU, and non-EU people moving in and out of the country.

beejee

izzyflusky wrote: »

The more I read you the more I start to think you have some sort of inferiority complex and feel threatened. I never said anyone owed me any favours, it is a symbiotic relationship. Simple as.

But you are not seeing that. You just see that you have outsiders coming in and taking away from the Irish.
Well, these outsiders are contributing A LOT too and you as a nation also need them/us.
Companies are having to shell out thousands of euro in recruiting, relocation packages, Visa's etc and not out of the goodness of their heart. I worked for a company that was paying 9k per worker to be brought over in expenses (without counting what the employee was getting), and that was on the lower end of the spectrum.

Least not forget that little Shakira Murphy's iPad and her mammy's 70 inch TV in her newly built council house (because every new estate has to have them now too), also came out of my pay check. And all my "new Irish" and plain foreign neighbours' (like me) too. You know, the surgeon, the pilot, various nurses and IT workers down the road.

Nah man, it'll be a cold day in hell before I develop an inferiority complex. Especially with such ample ammunition around!

To the bolded:you speak out of one side of your mouth about "taking" but also "contributing". Zero sum, and that's generous.

Rather, I think the overall is negative. Further still, I think it's quite obvious to anyone with open eyes.

As for you belittling other Irish people as a way to extol your virtuous existence here, which, to state the obvious, is 100% to benefit yourself... Well, you're a gem, baby.

Maybe consider not doing us such a righteous favour and go back to the place that you purposefully decided was worse than Ireland in the first place, hence you coming here, a better place, instead.

Deub

beejee wrote: »

So riddle me this, batman.

It must take extremes for you to notice causation. Therefore imagine this extreme...

Half of the population of France leaves. Do housing costs stay the same?

The population of France doubles. Do housing costs stay the same?

France is a poor example from you. Further, I think you'll find that my question is impossible to answer, because the causative effect of more people means higher costs. As in, the thread title.

As a countrys population naturally grows or shrinks, the time element allows a natural adjustment to accommodate that slow change.

Rapid movement of huge numbers of people does the opposite.

Why is France a poor example?

Did half the population left the country?
Did the population double?
No to both. You are using extreme to Explain your logic.
I said that it is not difficult to build new houses but I see that you decide to ignore this. Maybe because it is not good for your assumption.

beejee

Padre_Pio wrote: »

There's huge inward and outward migration in Ireland. All these "new Irish" are a drop in the ocean compared to Irish, EU, and non-EU people moving in and out of the country.

The net result is skewed quite heavily towards inward migration.

beejee

Deub wrote: »

Why is France a poor example?

Did half the population left the country?
Did the population double?
No to both. You are using extreme to Explain your logic.
I said that it is not difficult to build new houses but I see that you decide to ignore this. Maybe because it is not good for your assumption.

You know the answer. You just can't bring yourself to admit it publicly, on an anonymous website of all things.

"here's an analogy, a million cats live on the moon... "

"but cats can't live on the moon!"

Consider boxing, because your ducking and weaving is top notch

Think the OP is nothing but a far right Ireland for the Irish type person.
No point even trying to engage with someone that won't engage back!

Sleeper12

beejee wrote:

Are you counting all the places that are empty because nobody wants to live there. Cos the problem with that is... Nobody wants to live there.

Absolutely not. DCC has thousands units not in use. They can leave a unit idle for years between tenants. They can buy a unit & keep it empty for years.

It's estimated that over 20,000 apartments above retail units are empty. All the government has to do is offer tax breaks for the building owner to bring these online. Bad and all as FF can be, they would have offered 5 to 7 years of tax breaks to bring these units back into the market. They would have done this years ago. The problem wouldn't be the crisis it is today. FG has no interest in solving the problem. They've only acknowledged that there was a colour three years ago but the problem is there three or four years before that.


It is a fact that we have enough accommodation to house more than twice the amount of homeless. Even forgetting about the homeless people. FG should give tax breaks to bring these units online. This will help bring rents down for everyone.

Padre_Pio

beejee wrote: »

The net result is skewed quite heavily towards inward migration.

True.

Net immigration was at its max in 2007.
104k extra people in the country that year, 77k in '06 and 55k in '05.

In contrast it's 34k this year, 34k last year and about 20k in 2017

Are houses today worth 1/3 of what they were in 07? Not a chance. It has an impact, definitely, but not to the extent you associate with it.
Also, many immigrants to Ireland are Irish, returning from Canada, Oz and elsewhere.

Deub

beejee wrote: »

You know the answer. You just can't bring yourself to admit it publicly, on an anonymous website of all things.

"here's an analogy, a million cats live on the moon... "

"but cats can't live on the moon!"

Consider boxing, because your ducking and weaving is top notch

Why ask a question if when people challenges you, you just say “you know the answer”. If you had arguments, you would give them...

dxhound2005

beejee wrote: »

For arguments sake, let's say the 60% odd people in this thread, who believe there is at least a strong connection between immigration and housing "problems", are indeed representative of the country at large.

Let's say they're not. Because in the Presidential poll on Boards more than 50% said they were going to vote for Peter Casey. In the real world 23% voted for him.

Your poll got 73 people to answer the questions. There is no way that you can make that out to be any sort of scientific exercise. Real polls are not self selecting.

dxhound2005

beejee wrote: »

Britain, France, Germany, USA, Canada.... Look, the costs of housing has dramatically risen in areas of high immigration. I don't consider exorbitant costs, rents, rising homelessness etc to be "managing it"

Here's a much tougher nut to crack for you. Tell me about all the countries that have high immigration that DONT have huge associated costs.

I answered you, you answer me, please.

What's the story with Canada?

whisky_galore

bubblypop wrote: »

But there's thousands of empty houses in the country

Try getting one so. One that's inhabitable and affordable in a place where you want to live.

There, problem solved.

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

Try getting one so. One that's inhabitable and affordable in a place where you want to live.

There, problem solved.

There are lots of houses available where I want to live, I just have to buy one.
The OP still hasn't stated what type of housing he is referring to.

Mules

Do you know why DCC leaves them idle? What do you reckon the reason is fo the government not introducing incentives to building owners to bring more properties on to the market?

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Absolutely not. DCC has thousands units not in use. They can leave a unit idle for years between tenants. They can buy a unit & keep it empty for years.

It's estimated that over 20,000 apartments above retail units are empty. All the government has to do is offer tax breaks for the building owner to bring these online. Bad and all as FF can be, they would have offered 5 to 7 years of tax breaks to bring these units back into the market. They would have done this years ago. The problem wouldn't be the crisis it is today. FG has no interest in solving the problem. They've only acknowledged that there was a colour three years ago but the problem is there three or four years before that.


It is a fact that we have enough accommodation to house more than twice the amount of homeless. Even forgetting about the homeless people. FG should give tax breaks to bring these units online. This will help bring rents down for everyone.

Mad_maxx

ArchXStanton wrote: »

You would want to be seriously braindead to not notice an ever increasing amount of foreign nationals here and of course its going to have an impact on services, there simply isn't enough housing, but at least the banks etc. will be happy... The house always wins

Brain dead or an ideologue

whisky_galore

bubblypop wrote: »

There are lots of houses available where I want to live, I just have to buy one.
The OP still hasn't stated what type of housing he is referring to.

Buy it already so.

SharonMcDougal

I have thought about this for a long time.

There are more net immigration into the country than there are units of housing being built. How can we keep doing this?

I love foreigners, they are more friendly than other Irish people, often work harder etc. and people will say that the solution is to just build more houses.

I agree, we need to build more houses, not restrict immigration, but we are now around 7 years into this crisis. Not just homelessness, but insane rent increases! Easy solution is to restrict immigration and allow the people living here currently some breathing space.

I'm sick of seeing this obsession of job creation, we're not in a recession anymore. There are plenty of jobs. How many do we want? 1 million more? We have to fill these positions with immigrants thus increasing pressure on services and housing more and more.

Many of these immigrants only come to Ireland for a few years, so they're happy to live in a house sharing a room with 5 others. They come from worse off conditions in their own country. This lowers the standard irish people can expect to have then because landlords know they can get X amount from 5 foreigners sharing so the 2 Irish ones have to pay the same if they want it.

This "house building" is not working! We need drastic action. To think that someone was 23, just out of college, getting their first job when the crisis started and now they're 30, possibly well advanced in their career, wanting to start a family and there's no end in sight to this crisis. Lives of young people are getting affected and will affect them for the rest of their lives.

I feel people fear being seen as racist for wanting to restrict immigration. If one solution hasn't worked for 7 years, need to try another.

ArchXStanton

SharonMcDougal wrote: »

I have thought about this for a long time.

There are more net immigration into the country than there are units of housing being built. How can we keep doing this?

I love foreigners, they are more friendly than other Irish people, often work harder etc. and people will say that the solution is to just build more houses.

I agree, we need to build more houses, not restrict immigration, but we are now around 7 years into this crisis. Not just homelessness, but insane rent increases! Easy solution is to restrict immigration and allow the people living here currently some breathing space.

I'm sick of seeing this obsession of job creation, we're not in a recession anymore. There are plenty of jobs. How many do we want? 1 million more? We have to fill these positions with immigrants thus increasing pressure on services and housing more and more.

Many of these immigrants only come to Ireland for a few years, so they're happy to live in a house sharing a room with 5 others. They come from worse off conditions in their own country. This lowers the standard irish people can expect to have then because landlords know they can get X amount from 5 foreigners sharing so the 2 Irish ones have to pay the same if they want it.

This "house building" is not working! We need drastic action. To think that someone was 23, just out of college, getting their first job when the crisis started and now they're 30, possibly well advanced in their career, wanting to start a family and there's no end in sight to this crisis. Lives of young people are getting affected and will affect them for the rest of their lives.

I feel people fear being seen as racist for wanting to restrict immigration. If one solution hasn't worked for 7 years, need to try another.

I've been in 3 different hospitals the last couple of weeks, trips with both parents and one myself and its impossible not to notice the amount of non Irish attending these places, I said it to the woman at reception in the waiting area as she was taking my details that it seemed crazy busy and she told me oh that's nothing, there was a line out the door the previous day to which I jokingly replied it seems like a UN meeting... "don't even get me started on that" was her response.

In my opinion the social contract between the Irish people and its government is basically non existent nowadays

sameoldname

ArchXStanton wrote: »

I've been in 3 different hospitals the last couple of weeks, trips with both parents and one myself and its impossible not to notice the amount of non Irish attending these places, I said it to the woman at reception in the waiting area as she was taking my details that it seemed crazy busy and she told me oh that's nothing, there was a line out the door the previous day to which I jokingly replied it seems like a UN meeting... "don't even get me started on that" was her response.

In my opinion the social contract between the Irish people and its government is basically non existent nowadays

You should have asked her how much of her wages come from foreign investment in the Irish economy.

Of course, the quickest way to an all-Irish utopia would be to destroy our own economy. Most of the foreigners would go home, a lot of Irish would leave too. There'd be loads of available housing and the health service would have a lot less patients. Of course the place would be a dump and a lot of the people moaning on here would be off to Australia or wherever the money is. They'd probably consider themselves ex-pats rather than immigrants though, which is convenient.

Padre_Pio

sameoldname wrote: »

You should have asked her how much of her wages come from foreign investment in the Irish economy.

Of course, the quickest way to an all-Irish utopia would be to destroy our own economy. Most of the foreigners would go home, a lot of Irish too. There'd be loads of available housing and the health service would have a lot less patients. Of course the place would be a dump and a lot of the people moaning on here would be off to Australia or wherever the money is. They'd probably consider themselves ex-pats rather than immigrants though, which is convenient.

For a nation of 5 million people that claims a diaspora of 50 million, it seems hypocritical to not like immigrants.

whisky_galore

whisky_galore wrote: »

Buy it already so.

I will when I find the house I want?

Sleeper12

Mules wrote: »

Do you know why DCC leaves them idle? What do you reckon the reason is fo the government not introducing incentives to building owners to bring more properties on to the market?

We have a crap government with Zero interest in fixing the housing crises they created.


I hate to point out anything that FF did but you can't take away the fact that they always came up with unique ways to stimulate the building trade or to get people to build in areas they wouldn't want to. Dublin city was dying on it's feet in the 80s, until they introduced tax breaks on building in certain areas. If you offer shop owners 5 to 7 years of not taxing their rental income if they rent out the rooms above the shop then they will rent them quickly enough



Where there is a will, there is a way. FG have no will to fix this problem. It took 3 to four years to get them to admit that there was a problem in the first place.

Mules

There's a middle way between both extremes.

sameoldname wrote: »

You should have asked her how much of her wages come from foreign investment in the Irish economy.

Of course, the quickest way to an all-Irish utopia would be to destroy our own economy. Most of the foreigners would go home, a lot of Irish would leave too. There'd be loads of available housing and the health service would have a lot less patients. Of course the place would be a dump and a lot of the people moaning on here would be off to Australia or wherever the money is. They'd probably consider themselves ex-pats rather than immigrants though, which is convenient.

marieholmfan

It would be a lot more honest of beejee just to say he thinks that there are too many foreigners around rather than this ridiculous claim about housing.

Irish people should be allowed to discuss immigration without being called racists. I'd even say that Irish people should be allowed to be racist; calling something racist doesn't necessarily invalidate it.

marieholmfan

Just build the ****ing houses.
Why can we have council houses in Derry but in Dundalk the government pays rent for you to a private landlord.

Sleeper12 wrote: »

We have a crap government with Zero interest in fixing the housing crises they created.


I hate to point out anything that FF did but you can't take away the fact that they always came up with unique ways to stimulate the building trade or to get people to build in areas they wouldn't want to. Dublin city was dying on it's feet in the 80s, until they introduced tax breaks on building in certain areas. If you offer shop owners 5 to 7 years of not taxing their rental income if they rent out the rooms above the shop then they will rent them quickly enough



Where there is a will, there is a way. FG have no will to fix this problem. It took 3 to four years to get them to admit that there was a problem in the first place.

X111111111111

Sleeper12 wrote: »

We have a crap government with Zero interest in fixing the housing crises they created.


I hate to point out anything that FF did but you can't take away the fact that they always came up with unique ways to stimulate the building trade or to get people to build in areas they wouldn't want to. Dublin city was dying on it's feet in the 80s, until they introduced tax breaks on building in certain areas. If you offer shop owners 5 to 7 years of not taxing their rental income if they rent out the rooms above the shop then they will rent them quickly enough



Where there is a will, there is a way. FG have no will to fix this problem. It took 3 to four years to get them to admit that there was a problem in the first place.

They won't fix it because it's not a crisis to them. Their friends in high places and indeed some of them themselves as landlords are absolutely coining it.

weldoninhio

izzyflusky wrote: »

I'm not a "new Irish" or Irish at all. I've also "taken"* one of those newly built houses you mention. Am I the cause of your nation's problems too or am I exempt because I haven't usurped the Irish title?




*Worked my a** off and saved for.

If you worked your arse off to buy one fair play. You are one of the people we want in Ireland.

I don't understand how EU law states that we can repatriate anyone from the EU that cannot support themselves after three months, yet we still have EU citizens clogging up housing lists and SW lists, when we could easily and legally send them home.

trashcan

Just to point out that citizenship and immigration are two different things. All of those granted citizenship are here legally (they have to be to apply) so citizenship in itself is adding no extra people to the pot. They are here anyway.

CitywestMan

ArchXStanton wrote: »

I've been in 3 different hospitals the last couple of weeks, trips with both parents and one myself and its impossible not to notice the amount of non Irish attending these places, I said it to the woman at reception in the waiting area as she was taking my details that it seemed crazy busy and she told me oh that's nothing, there was a line out the door the previous day to which I jokingly replied it seems like a UN meeting... "don't even get me started on that" was her response.

In my opinion the social contract between the Irish people and its government is basically non existent nowadays

You checked the line outside and spoke to the moany 'skilled' receptionist but you forgot to look at the doctors and nurses inside who outnumber the Irish by a wide margin. It goes both ways.

Sleeper12

CitywestMan wrote:

You checked the line outside and spoke to the moany 'skilled' receptionist but you forgot to look at the doctors and nurses inside who outnumber the Irish by a wide margin. It goes both ways.

Totally agree. Father in law is 89 and has been in different hospitals since May. Irish doctors, nurses and carers are definitely in the minority. This does not suit some posters mantra of immigrants are here for the welfare system

TwoMonthsOff

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cbOBncN4Fo

Mr. teddywinkles

Nah, more people would never equate to more housing needed. They'll just live under your beds lads.

Yurt2

Dublin is essentially a bunch of villages stitched together with designs on being a global city.

At some stage we're going to need to take a hard look at the type of immigration that's flourishing in Ireland. When the eastern accession states joined the EU, the Bill Cullen entrayprenoor class got addicted like crack to cheap labour. They got smart and their home countries wealthier, so now they don't typically have to put up with the crap conditions that Irish employers tried to make them accept. Now, IBEC and the like want to gov to take all comers from any corner of the globe to be the new economic underclass and damn the concequencs. Living 6 to a room on the north circular road.

noinc

touts wrote: »

Some of the most dedicated and hardest working people I've ever worked alongside were "new Irish". They are far more deserving of housing than many of the Irish welfare class who believe a hard day"s work involves sticking your hand out and expecting someone else to fill it with money.

When you refer to Irish welfare classes are you referring to people like me. I am receipt of a disability pension after I had a stroke 3 years ago and cannot work anymore due to the damaged as a result? Generations of my family obeyed the law and paid their taxes. My parents were forced to spend money on The Black Babies when could hardly afford to feed us now they want to cut the middleman out and come here to rip us off directly, I haven't heard of any reports of any "new Irish" being homeless.

Mules

marieholmfan wrote: »

Just build the ****ing houses.
Why can we have council houses in Derry but in Dundalk the government pays rent for you to a private landlord.

I think it's down to different political philosophies. Fine Gael follow neoliberal policy even when it's not cost effective.

Mules

weldoninhio wrote: »

If you worked your arse off to buy one fair play. You are one of the people we want in Ireland.

I don't understand how EU law states that we can repatriate anyone from the EU that cannot support themselves after three months, yet we still have EU citizens clogging up housing lists and SW lists, when we could easily and legally send them home.

I don't get it either. It's the reason a lot of people voted for Brexit. They have the same problems with health and housing. Their governments always implied that the EU controlled immigration. It turned out to be untrue and now the UK political class has Brexit as an unintended consequence. I'm sure the politicians still don't make the connection though :rolleyes:

Mules

Interestingly the central bank is now saying that new houses have to be built. The government has no interest in what the average person thinks but they do have an interest in the opinions of the central bank.