FF senator gourging at the trough.

KaneToad

salmocab wrote: »

On the first point yes they go for their jobs again every few years whereas most employees once in the job have to perform consistently or get sacked they only have to convince a voters that they are there for them every few years. I’d argue they have it easier than normal workers.

On the second point keeping getting elected certainly doesn’t mean your doing a good job it means your constituents think you are, there is a world of difference between those two things.

The opinion of the constituents is what counts, though. Not your opinion, nor mine. Personally, I can't abide the Healy-Raes and their ideas but who am I to say that those thousands of Kerry voters are wrong.

salmocab

KaneToad wrote: »

The opinion of the constituents is what counts, though. Not your opinion, nor mine. Personally, I can't abide the Healy-Raes and their ideas but who am I to say that those thousands of Kerry voters are wrong.

That’s exactly my point, you only have to keep the constituents happy, that doesn’t make you a good politician for the country. The dail is rammed with people who aren’t really worth the money we pay them but they keep constituents happy or enough of them to secure the seat.

KaneToad

STB. wrote: »

Politics is in a bad state in this country and has been for some time.

They are better than option B is the premise on which these people are voted in time and time again.

They then do a u-turn on every policy they promise.

We need a new party that can deliver on its promise, preferably one that's not religiously inclined and with new open mindedness to solving problems, like the state of our healthcare and general infrastructure that FG have run down to nothing over the past 8 years and what FF did before. We also need one that wouldn't have the working class paying for every other layabout through taxes.

They don't exist though.

Well why not start a party with like minded persons? If you can't find like minded people, it would suggest your views are in the minority.

This country is a centrist, conservative country. We are that way because, in general, we have a stable economy and decent living conditions. We have reasonable health care, high life expectancy, low crime, above average education system and good welfare systems.

The electorate like to return FF govts, as they are the party that most closely reflects the people. Occasionally FF drive the ship onto the rocks and the electorate can't bring themselve to vote for them. They opt for the other centrist party, FG. FG get given their turn for a while before the FF status quo returns.

I'm not a centrist voter, personally, but I can't bemoan the fact that the majority of the country doesn't share my opinion. As the great philosopher (Dunphy) says - that's politics baby!

Seth Brundle

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

FF are the same as FG. Same right wing politics. Same careerist attitudes. Never voted either of them them and never will.

Neither FF nor FG are right wing :rolleyes:

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

That’s exactly my point, you only have to keep the constituents happy, that doesn’t make you a good politician for the country.

Constituents are the country. FG or FF policies don't always filter down and help at a local level.

How do you define "a good politician for the country"?

salmocab

Boggles wrote: »

Constituents are the country. FG or FF policies don't always filter down and help at a local level.

How do you define "a good politician for the country"?

Fair question, it’s hard to define but certainly someone that won’t vote along party lines if they genuinely don’t believe it’s best for the country or will risk the ire of their constituents for something they know is right. Also being in opposition shouldn’t mean opposing everything. An Australian leader of I think Queensland years ago when they brought in gun control knew he would lose his job but did it anyway because it was the right thing to do. That’s leadership.

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

Fair question, it’s hard to define but certainly someone that won’t vote along party lines if they genuinely don’t believe it’s best for the country or will risk the ire of their constituents for something they know is right.

The Whip system makes that pretty redundant.

Any dissent we have seen is usually personal choice or based on religion or morality, which when analysed wouldn't be what is best for the country or society.

I agree though effective opposition is very important.

salmocab

Boggles wrote: »

The Whip system makes that pretty redundant.

Any dissent we have seen is usually personal choice or based on religion or morality, which when analysed wouldn't be what is best for the country or society.

I agree though effective opposition is very important.

I don’t think other countries take the whip as far as we do, not that I’d be holding the English up as the way to go but I think they often vote as they want and only really use the whip for certain items. We just seem to use it for everything and that’s across the main parties.

Boggles

salmocab wrote: »

I don’t think other countries take the whip as far as we do, not that I’d be holding the English up as the way to go but I think they often vote as they want and only really use the whip for certain items. We just seem to use it for everything and that’s across the main parties.

The English take it to the extreme as well. Wasn't 20 odd members expelled from the conservative party for voting against Bozo not so long ago?

Free votes are as rare as here as is defying the Whip.

touts

McMurphy wrote: »

What's your own thoughts on the story?

All I can take from your op is that you copied and pasted a fairly short snippet of info from the link, gave no opinion of your own on the matter, and then said something about negative fg stories.

I mean people might be forgiven for thinking you didn't actually give a sh1t about the "gourging" of the senator, you just want a story to divert from FG

Martin should give your man his marching orders imo. No use shouting from the rafters at others if you're going to be all trousers and no arse when your own lads caught at it.

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Jinglejangle69

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Pathetic.

touts

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Pathetic.

Hit a nerve did we. You getting overtime for this? Redacted must be pumping money into his party for the election.

Shefwedfan

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Pathetic.

Yes it is a fairly pathetic thread alright

JohnnyFlash

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Treble time over Christmas, dude.

Jinglejangle69

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Yes it is a fairly pathetic thread alright

Awh it’s not portraying FG in a bad light, sorry about that.

You boys can’t have it all your own way in current affairs all the time:)

Jinglejangle69

touts wrote: »

Hit a nerve did we. You getting overtime for this? Redacted must be pumping money into his party for the election.

No I just think it’s pathetic that you believe the nonsense your typing!!

Proper loony tin foil hat stuff:)

Seth Brundle

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

In fairness, every party will have a social media team who take direction from a Comms director.
What's your point or is it simply a deflection from FF?

Jinglejangle69

Seth Brundle wrote: »

In fairness, every party will have a social media team who take direction from a Comms director.
What's your point or is it simply a deflection from FF?

Exhibit B.

The poster doesn’t realise he’s part of a spin unit himself on boards:)

Beasty

touts wrote: »

Fine Gael staffers in their social media spin department dont have any thoughts. Only talking points handed to them by the Communications Director.

Attack the post, not the poster

Annasopra

Mortelaro wrote: »

I don't think left wing is in the ascendancy either though or ever is it
Right wing is perceived as wrong but all it is ,is the embodiment of selfishness
Everybody is selfish
Anyone that says they aren't is a liar

Selfishness though should have some limits,let's call that decency
Slopping too much from the trough is indecent
Being ambitious or careerist is not
Limit incentives and you will get sloth
Get more and more sloth and you'll get a failing economy

I couldnt care less if left wing is ascending or not I will never support right wing politics.

Boggles

Seth Brundle wrote: »

In fairness, every party will have a social media team who take direction from a Comms director.
What's your point or is it simply a deflection from FF?

Very sophisticated.

Join boards, annoy people.

Comms director may want to rethink his strategy.

:pac:

Galwayguy35

Jimbob1977 wrote: »

The Seanad was retained to give Enda a kicking.

We had our chance and we blew it... in typical Irish style

Exactly. We had one chance to get rid of this undemocratic gravey train and the electorate bottled it.

And when it was saved all the little senators sat back in their cushy chairs and promised the whole system would be reformed...

bmc58

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin has admitted a party senator has questions to answer over his poor voting record in the Seanad, where he claimed €73,000 in expenses but didn't vote on most days.

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/fianna-fail-senator-who-missed-three-quarters-of-seanad-votes-has-questions-to-answer-martin-admits-972014.html


I’m sure people will be just as outraged here as about other politicians on other threads.

Won’t hold my breathe as it’s not a negative FG story.

The're all at it.Easy money,no accountability,no receipts,the taxpaying mugs pay for it.They made these rules about "phobbing in".They phob in and feck off to other buisness.Time for this shi@e to stop.Fair play to the journalists who have dug deep and highlighted this scam.People must make this clear to these "elites" who will soon be calling to your door and looking for your vote at the soon to be called election.Enough of these con men/women.

Mortelaro

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

I couldnt care less if left wing is ascending or not I will never support right wing politics.

I don't know what right wing politics is in Ireland tbh
I wouldn't count labour as left wing,not even SF,left of centre ie heavier on social policy but not mad
The 2% parties verging on wealth distribution were what I was referring to

tjhook

KaneToad wrote: »

But the people had their chance to amend it, they declined.

I don't think so. The people had their choice to scrap the Seanad.

Personally, I think a Seanad/Senate is a great concept. It should be a balance against the relatively unaccountable Dáil with its whip system. Unfortunately, the Irish Seanad is both badly appointed, and has insufficient power. Given a chance, I would vote to properly restructure it. Scrapping it would make it very difficult to do that in the future.

expectationlost

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

And people wonder why there's a low turn out for elections !!!

he wasn't elected by people but politicians (nominated by The Institute of Community Health Nursing)

tayto lover

vicwatson wrote: »

But only a select few people can vote for the Seanad

How undemocratic is that

Totally unacceptable.
The Taoiseach appoints 11 afaik. Jobs for the boys.
Universities appoint 6.
43 appointed by vocational committees made up of TD’s.

Keep it in the family so to speak.

Ashleigh1986

expectationlost wrote: »

he wasn't elected by people but politicians

Is he not a politican ???
You are well aware of the point I was making .

expectationlost

Ashleigh1986 wrote: »

Is he not a politican ???
You are well aware of the point I was making .

I don't think there was a low turnout in the seanad election.


'why isn't anybody outraged about this' are the worst kind of ways to start a thread but heres what this is about

Dr Swanick has a general practice in Belmullet, Co Mayo. Last year, he received €520,000 under the General Medical Services (GMS) scheme, the highest amount for any GP in Mayo. In a statement, Dr Swanick said this figure was a "gross amount" and did not represent his personal income.

On Monday 8 July, RTInvestigates phoned his surgery to see if he was available to see patients the following day, Tuesday 9 July, which was also a Seanad voting day.

We were told Dr Swanick would be available for appointments that Tuesday at 3.30pm and at 4.50pm. Oireachtas records show Dr Swanick was recorded at Leinster House that Tuesday.

He was at Leinster House the following morning, Wednesday 10 July, at 9am and participated in a Health Committee meeting.

RT Investigates asked Dr Swanick if, following the completion of surgery on Tuesday 9 July, at around 5pm, he drove to Leinster House - about a four-hour drive from Belmullet - to record his attendance that evening.
He did not respond.

https://www.rte.ie/news/investigations-unit/2019/1211/1098496-senators-expenses-and-the-missed-votes/ and he still hasn't responded to that point despite talking to the Indo and admiring himself https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/ff-member-defends-his-record-after-missing-75pc-of-vote-days-38810842.html

Snow Garden

tayto lover wrote: »

Totally unacceptable.
The Taoiseach appoints 11 afaik. Jobs for the boys.
Universities appoint 6.
43 appointed by vocational committees made up of TD’s.

Keep it in the family so to speak.

The Seanad is a complete and utter waste of money.