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Bet not paid out and cancelled

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124

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    #92
    Heres Johnny
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Heres Johnny


    yaboya1 wrote: »
    The odds minutes before kick off were as I stated above.
    Assuming what you say to be true the day before (Leinster -2 @ 10/11), how did the semi pro punter get a shorter price the same day for Leinster -4?
    As I said, I smell a rat.

    Missed the bit where he said semi pro, but I see it now. I don't believe in semi pro gamblers anyway, the best and biggest gamblers I know admit they are down over their lives. Anyone who thinks they're up long term are deluded


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    #93
    Nunu
    Registered Users Posts: 2,894 ✭✭✭Nunu


    Staff in bookies take large stakes all the time and then get a call from hq who was that customer... you should have rang that one over...ring next bet etc...

    I’ve never heard of them cancelling a bet if the the market and price were legit.
    If that’s the case you’ll defo get paid out if you push it.


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    #94
    chooseusername
    Registered Users Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Bet instructions may have been ambiguous,
    Can happen unintentionally or otherwise especially with handicap betting.
    What price would Munster have been +4?


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    #95
    BoldReason
    Closed Accounts Posts: 704 ✭✭✭BoldReason


    This is almost certainly fantasy. But on the off chance it is not do the following.

    1. Under absolutely no circumstances accept your money back until you have exhausted all avenues to getting paid.
    2. Contact customer support and bet dispute over the phone and ask to speak to someone senior. Also send an email to their bet dispute department to open a case with them.
    3. Contact @BoycottBetfred and @gondorffhenry on twitter. Explain the issue and also send them a screenshot of the bet. Paul will help if there is a case to be made.
    4. Open a case with IBAS. This will take 6 months to 2 years to resolve. However if all is how you say the bookies don't have a leg to stand on.

    Do not accept your original stake back until you have exhausted these channels.
    Best of luck.


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    #96
    gmufc19
    Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭gmufc19


    Why will it take IBAS 6 months to 2 years to resolve the dispute?

    Could OP ask IBAS to instruct that the bet is refunded while the dispute is resolved? Six months, let alone 2 years, is an awful long time to leave €1,800 with the bookie.


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    #97
    Wilfuler.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 183 ✭✭Wilfuler.


    gmufc19 wrote: »
    Why will it take IBAS 6 months to 2 years to resolve the dispute?

    Could OP ask IBAS to instruct that the bet is refunded while the dispute is resolved? Six months, let alone 2 years, is an awful long time to leave €1,800 with the bookie.

    No regulation ,they slow-play the dispute


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    #98
    BoldReason
    Closed Accounts Posts: 704 ✭✭✭BoldReason


    gmufc19 wrote: »
    Why will it take IBAS 6 months to 2 years to resolve the dispute?

    Could OP ask IBAS to instruct that the bet is refunded while the dispute is resolved? Six months, let alone 2 years, is an awful long time to leave €1,800 with the bookie.

    Unfortunately that is just the way it is. They work at their own pace and will usually look for any possible way to rule against the punter.

    It is a long time indeed and quite often the bookmakers may just pay out to avoid having to deal with the dispute in the first place. But as I said if this is how the OP says it is he needs to be prepared to go all the way. If he is indeed a semi pro punter then 1 bet held up is hardly going to cause him to go hungry.

    If it was me I would not be collecting 1800 quid just because you don't want the bookies having it. I would not be accepting a partial payout or stake returned without more answers.

    Who is the bookmaker OP?


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    #99
    BoroMan32
    Registered Users Posts: 616 ✭✭✭BoroMan32


    yaboya1 wrote: »
    Only if it happened, which is very unlikely.

    I completely agree, and was dubious about the OP from the start, but in fairness this thread has thrown up some interesting discussion.

    As for IBAS you'll need a tighter than tight case, as they'll do all in their power to find in favour of the bookmaker.


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    #100
    BoldReason
    Closed Accounts Posts: 704 ✭✭✭BoldReason


    BoroMan32 wrote: »
    I completely agree, and was dubious about the OP from the start, but in fairness this thread has thrown up some interesting discussion.

    As for IBAS you'll need a tighter than tight case, as they'll do all in their power to find in favour of the bookmaker.

    I'm also sceptical but I said I would put up advice anyway as it may be helpful to someone. I have opened a case with IBAS myself in the past. They are beyond useless tbh. The dispute ended up getting resolved during the IBAS process. The bookmaker called me one day to tell me they would pay me the full amount owed and so I closed the IBAS case.
    But I think it is worth it to open the case with them just to show that you are willing to fight it.

    If you are opening a case with IBAS ensure you have a dispute logged with the bookmaker first. Do this by calling or emailing them. Ask them for a dispute number that you can provide to IBAS


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    #101
    Getoffmytrain
    Registered Users Posts: 104 ✭✭Getoffmytrain


    As others have pointed out the game went off Munster -1, it was Leinster -1 the day before.
    The fact the bet was placed at odds of 5/6 rather than 10/11 indicates it was probably an In-running bet, possibly when Leinster went 7-0 up when playing with the wind.


    I'm guessing the odds might have changed while the bet was being put on or the money counted etc.


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    #102
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users Posts: 5,771 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    In general regulation of bookies in inadequate. They are basically allowed assymetric T&Cs that say that they can cancel the bet but that you cannot. Given the nature of the industry this is needed to some extent, but they should be at least required to pay some compensation.


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    #103
    JPCN1
    Registered Users Posts: 895 ✭✭✭JPCN1


    Name and shame them.


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    #104
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Getoffmytrain wrote: »
    I'm guessing the odds might have changed while the bet was being put on or the money counted etc.
    If the story is valid, this could be the likely scenario i.e. large bet on a dynamic live market, subject frequent to price changes.

    Online you might expect a price adjustment (even automated) every 10secs or so and would often have to accept any +/- movement just in order to get it through with any sense of gusto.


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    #105
    chooseusername
    Registered Users Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Getoffmytrain wrote: »
    As others have pointed out the game went off Munster -1, it was Leinster -1 the day before.
    The fact the bet was placed at odds of 5/6 rather than 10/11 indicates it was probably an In-running bet, possibly when Leinster went 7-0 up when playing with the wind.


    I'm guessing the odds might have changed while the bet was being put on or the money counted etc.
    5/6 would be very generous when 7-0 up,
    also would he not be offered the bet at whatever the odds were at the time the bet was placed?


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    #106
    Confused Punter
    Registered Users Posts: 16 ✭Confused Punter


    Ok this is the last post I will make in regards to the post.

    Firstly they have refunded all 3 bets on the match. So I'm all square no profit. Yes the 3rd bet placed during the game.

    Apparently the bet was null and void shortly after I left shop when they must have rang it through.

    I have been accused of arbo betting and apparently was seen in same shop day before placing the other 2 bets. My mistake placing the bets in same shop and just being lazy.

    They have informed me that i may continue to wager with them but my bets will be limited to a max €100 per wager.

    No i wont post screen grabs of my tickets or wager because that would show how the bets were done.

    And for those who dont know nor understand arbo betting its a strategy used to cover all aspects of a result ensuring a ROI (return on investment). This happens when over odds are posted usually 24 to 48 hrs before a match.

    Been laying bets like this for over 12 months here now 1st time I have had an issue, so lesson learnt will have to be more aware of where and when I place the bets now.

    Thank you for your replies.


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    #107
    Getoffmytrain
    Registered Users Posts: 104 ✭✭Getoffmytrain


    chooseusername wrote: »
    5/6 would be very generous when 7-0 up,
    also would he not be offered the bet at whatever the odds were at the time the bet was placed?

    Hard to say unless the OP lets us know but 5/6 Leinster -4 would seem around right allowing for the wind advantage and a closing line of Munster-1.


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    #108
    Ashleigh1986
    Registered Users Posts: 672 ✭✭✭Ashleigh1986


    Confused Punter wrote: »
    Ok this is the last post I will make in regards to the post.

    Firstly they have refunded all 3 bets on the match. So I'm all square no profit. Yes the 3rd bet placed during the game.

    Apparently the bet was null and void shortly after I left shop when they must have rang it through.

    I have been accused of arbo betting and apparently was seen in same shop day before placing the other 2 bets. My mistake placing the bets in same shop and just being lazy.

    They have informed me that i may continue to wager with them but my bets will be limited to a max €100 per wager.

    No i wont post screen grabs of my tickets or wager because that would show how the bets were done.

    And for those who dont know nor understand arbo betting its a strategy used to cover all aspects of a result ensuring a ROI (return on investment). This happens when over odds are posted usually 24 to 48 hrs before a match.

    Been laying bets like this for over 12 months here now 1st time I have had an issue, so lesson learnt will have to be more aware of where and when I place the bets now.

    Thank you for your replies.

    So in other words ....
    You didn't give us ALL THE INFORMATION ... Yet asked us to comment on " what you should do about been refused winnings " .
    How about in future .... Give the whole story !!!


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    #109
    Wilfuler.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 183 ✭✭Wilfuler.


    What's the big deal about the screenshots

    Its not like its anything new


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    #110
    Sultan of Bling
    Registered Users Posts: 1,915 ✭✭✭Sultan of Bling


    BoroMan32 wrote:
    It is a sad state of affairs that you'd even have hassle with a so called 'major' bookmaker taking €1,800 on a sports handicap bet @ 5/6. The industry in this country badly needs some form of regulation as the behaviour of the bigger firms is absolutely disgusting in many respects. I was in Powers over Christmas and the two lads on the in shop 'radio' were constantly sh!tting on about horses and dogs being certainties and one of them actually referred to a greyhound race by saying ''gambles at Crayford nearly always win''. Sickening stuff.


    Ah come on!!

    Anyone who has a bet on the "advice", of the bookie deserves everything they get.

    It reminds me of that episode of bottom involving sad ken. Couldn't put the link up but you tube "sad ken bottom"


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    #111
    BoldReason
    Closed Accounts Posts: 704 ✭✭✭BoldReason


    Well that moves the goal posts considerably. You will get banned out of every bookie on the planet for arbing and IBAS will have a good laugh off you as well so I wouldn't waste your time with that either.


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    #112
    Dice75
    Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Dice75


    Was following this out of curiosity. And there it is. A semi-pro(?) punter who arbs in the same shop.


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    #113
    SonOfGoat
    Registered Users Posts: 1,190 ✭✭✭SonOfGoat


    I don't believe a word of the OP. I said it yesterday, this whole story is fictitious. The whole situation didn't/does't exist, hence changing the story to make people believe, and people did actually believe a bookmaker wouldn't pay out on a winning bet?! I dunno


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    #114
    BoroMan32
    Registered Users Posts: 616 ✭✭✭BoroMan32


    For once I'm on the same page as GOAT. The whole story is just made up nonsense. If it wasn't you'd have made it clear what had occurred in the opening post.


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    #115
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Dice75 wrote: »
    Was following this out of curiosity. And there it is. A semi-pro(?) punter who arbs in the same shop.

    Could someone explain what arbing is please?


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    #116
    Dice75
    Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Dice75


    Stheno wrote: »
    Could someone explain what arbing is please?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbitrage_betting


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    #117
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Dice75 wrote: »
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arbitrage_betting

    So op was basically changing increasing his winnings with different bets and different odds?


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    #118
    Heres Johnny
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,738 ✭✭✭Heres Johnny


    There we have it, 10 pages based on incomplete information before the truth comes out. How did you think you even had a case with them?


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    #119
    Dice75
    Registered Users Posts: 644 ✭✭✭Dice75


    Stheno wrote: »
    So op was basically changing increasing his winnings with different bets and different odds?

    No, he was guaranteeing himself a profit on the match by betting seperately on all outcomes of the handicap market as the market changed from a couple days before the game up to early in-running prices. All done in the same shop. Which he neglected to mention in the OP as this would have given the correct quick answer as to why they were witholding the bet(s).

    Im not arguing either way on the merits of arbing just discussing what happened in this thread.


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    #120
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,688 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Dice75 wrote: »
    No, he was guaranteeing himself a profit on the match by betting seperately on all outcomes of the handicap market as the market changed from a couple days before the game up to early in-running prices. All done in the same shop. Which he neglected to mention in the OP as this would have given the correct quick answer as to why they were witholding the bet(s).

    Im not arguing either way on the merits of arbing just discussing what happened in this thread.

    Thanks that was what I meant and just put it badly

    Appreciate the clarification


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    #121
    Always Tired
    Closed Accounts Posts: 945 ✭✭✭Always Tired


    What a pr*ck, you had me on your side but of course you left out the part that you were arbing... in the same shop. Which they will always reject.


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