General Premier League Thread 2019-20

MD1990

Teams will have to play in the next 9 months to stay afloat.
lthough you wont be able to be safe until a vaccine is out which may take 12 months or even 2 years.

noodler

noodler wrote: »

Picked it up at Cheltenham FFS

How can anyone know that?

noodler

[Deleted User] wrote: »

How can anyone know that?

Of the people he crossed path with in the preceding week, the vast, vast majority would have been at the racing festival with 60,000 crowds drinking and extremely unlikely to be practicing Social distancing.

But yeah, can't know for sure.

Rayne Wooney

April seems like a pipe dream now, they’ve started panicking over there which probably means a ****storm is coming, April/May likely the peak. I’d be surprised if any football is played until July.

Play the 9 between July/August followed by a 3/4 week break and then into the new season mid September. League cup scrapped, possibly FA cup also. Is 38 games plus European games spread over 9 months even possible though, no break before the euros either, players might not agree to that.

If they are determined to finish this season the format for next season will probably change.

y0ssar1an22

Can teams legally give aid to other clubs, under current rules?

Agent Coulson

Good news for City to spend a couple of billion in the next transfer window.

https://twitter.com/TheAthleticUK/status/1241070764285100032?s=20

Fitz*

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

Can teams legally give aid to other clubs, under current rules?

I don't think so no. Can see both sides of the argument.

windy shepard henderson

FitzShane wrote: »

I don't think so no. Can see both sides of the argument.

really good question to be fair , when you have owners of multiple clubs or share holders it would raise questions of money laundering and corruption .

only way to do it would be a fund set up from the top premier league clubs to be decided out across the smaller teams , i wonder if borris and his trillion doller bill notes he is handing out at the moment do anything , to be fair he shouldn't the top clubs should help the bottom

going watching outbreak next on netflix never seen it before, it was made around the 1994/95 season ...i wonder if Scarborough or darlington get a mention in the film :pac:

joeguevara

y0ssar1an22 wrote: »

Can teams legally give aid to other clubs, under current rules?

While I have studied Company law, I am not an expert in it and have not practiced it to any great extent.

From brief review, in basic company law there is no prohibition on one private company giving financial assistance to another. It may be subject to tax dependent on the payment.

An issue could occur if the club was technically insolvent before the injection. I don’t know much about specific FA rules but this could be a reason to revoke licence or penalise. However, as this is exceptional circumstances it is usual that any decision is subject to overrule.

Although I don’t know enough about Company Law, I do know loopholes. If none of the above was allowed in internal PL procedure, there is nothing stopping all PL clubs setting up a charitable organisation with the sole purpose of developing or maintaining football. This charitable organisation could then used money donated to assist clubs in difficulty.

If that was challenged, there is no restrictions on commercial agreements between clubs. An idea could be a friendly between two clubs and the premiership club paying an appearance fee of X million. Or purchasing a player for Xmillion and I’mmediately loaning back the player with a clause to buy of 1 pound. If it wasn’t used to defraud or for malicious purposes then it can’t be challenged unless any transfer could.

If the clubs wanted to assist they could. Just have to be creative in doing so. Man City got into trouble for receiving money for naming a training ground to bypass financial fairplay rules but this wouldn’t fall into that category. It’s not being used to allow transfers.

I think the easiest would be the charitable organisation.

joeguevara

From doing a bit more research there is specific clause on this:

https://www.efl.com/-more/governance/efl-rules--regulations/sections-10--11---association-and-dual-interests-and-additional-provisions/

Except with the prior written consent of the Board no Club may, either directly or indirectly:

104.2.5 lend to, gift money to, purchase future receivables from or guarantee the debts or obligations of that Club (or any other arrangement.

Therefore if approved by the Board, it can receive a gift from a PL club.

I think the issue would be is how much would sustain.

But this is how bored I am. I managed to find a document which specifically dealt with how financial transactions in football are dealt with under International Financial Reporting standards. It basically outlines how a club is required to account for income.

I believe this example falls straight into PL leagues providing assistance:

21. Grantsanddonations–thirdparty
Background
Relevant guidance
Solution
In September 20x7, Real London is notified that it will receive, in December 20x7, a payment from the local town’s council, which is willing to promote and celebrate the recent success of Real London. The payment is not subject to any conditions to be met, but it is a contribution towards Real London’s expenses incurred in May 20x7 for holding a party in the city for the citizens and supporters to celebrate victory in the cup final.


How should such payments be accounted for?
IFRS 15 para 6
IAS 20 paras 7, 20, 29

The grant received by the club is not within the scope of IFRS 15, because a grant is a non-exchange transaction (IFRS 15 para 6).

Instead, such a payment is within the scope of IAS 20 (and, in particular, para 20). Real London will therefore recognise the grant in its income statement when it becomes receivable (that is, in September 20x7), and not when it is effectively received (that is, in December 20x7) (IAS 20 para 7).

Such a payment will likely be presented as other operating income (separately from revenue), because there is no related expense that was incurred in the current financial period that could be netted against the grant income (IAS 20 para 29). The expenses were incurred in the year ending June 20x7, but the income was recognised in the year ending June 20x8.

Therefore, if a PL club provided a grant to ensure a club’s integrity and that of everyone connected to it after the effects of the coronavirus and no conditions are met, it will account for it in its P&L.

In a publicly traded company there would have to be authority to provide grants but if not an EGM could be held for changing articles.

Bottom line is, there are many ways it can be done. If there is appetite, then all systems go.

joeguevara

You got to love Zlatan. He set up a fundraiser to help Italian hospitals who are fighting the coronavirus. He made two 50k donations himself and calling on fellow professional footballers to donate.

But Zlatan being Zlatan finished his Instagram video with the line ‘and remember if the virus don’t go to Zlatan, Zlatan goes to the virus’. The guy should be a movie star.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/51947129

Another great story is Roma donating close to half a million euro to fund ICU ventilators and beds. First team players and coaching staff donated a days pay. On Tuesday last, Roma delivered 13,000 FFP2 masks to hospitals in the city, along with 120 500ml bottles of hand sanitiser. Then on Thursday last, the club and charity Roma Cares delivered 8,000 pairs of protective gloves and 2,000 bottles of sanitising hand gel to churches in key parts of the Italian capital - to be redistributed among the vulnerable in their communities.

While Football is not the most important thing in the world, it is class that at times like this it does something to help.

Mitch Connor

MD1990 wrote: »

Teams will have to play in the next 9 months to stay afloat.
lthough you wont be able to be safe until a vaccine is out which may take 12 months or even 2 years.

Once there is an effective treatment, which will come long before a cure, the world will start to normalise. And there are some promising treatments.

A truly effective vaccine is possibly not likely as the vaccine for other strains of coronavirus isn't great, we've just had effective treatment of it.

Even if you did get a vaccine, there will be a new strain the could be resistent to that anyway.

gimli2112

plus not all people believe in vaccines

Cantona's Collars

gimli2112 wrote: »

plus not all people believe in vaccines

Something tells me that a lot of them might now.
Once sh1t starts actually impacting their lives it can lead to them changing their tunes very quickly. If they don't then I don't mean to sound harsh but fook them.

Mitch Connor

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Something tells me that a lot of them might now.
Once sh1t starts actually impacting their lives it can lead to them changing their tunes very quickly. If they don't then I don't mean to sound harsh but fook them.

can i interest you in some essential oils?

pjohnson

The next Veloce ESports race features Courtois again, and golfer Ian Poulter, plus a second F1 Driver Nicholas Latifi.

Cork Boy 53

Interesting article assuming the PL season does get completed at some point.

https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/51962930

Guy:Incognito

On the financial aid for clubs, is there anything stopping a PL club offering say, 200k for a squad member of a struggling lower league club, giving him a 3 month contract, at the end of which he is released and goes back to rejoin his former club on a free. I mean, obviously everyone would clearly see what was going on, but would they actually be able to be punished?

joeguevara

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

On the financial aid for clubs, is there anything stopping a PL club offering say, 200k for a squad member of a struggling lower league club, giving him a 3 month contract, at the end of which he is released and goes back to rejoin his former club on a free. I mean, obviously everyone would clearly see what was going on, but would they actually be able to be punished?

I posted on this a good few posts back. It may be seen as overvaluing an asset and there are accounting standards that could be an issue. Nothing stopping a grant to promote training or something similar

MD1990

Could we yet see the campaign declared null and void?

During the conference call there was a collective, concerted message that the 2019-20 season had to be finished.

Ed Woodward, Manchester United’s executive vice-chairman, was among the most strident on this point. Described as being “very fair” in his wider input, Woodward was nevertheless firm in saying that even if the season had to run into September or October, that should be the course of action. There was no hint of trying to deny Liverpool a first title in 30 years, as might mischievously be proposed by some.

bit from the Atletic piece.

Fair play to Woodward.

Guy:Incognito

joeguevara wrote: »

It may be seen as overvaluing an asset and there are accounting standards that could be an issue.

Think theres a fair few clubs that need new accountants already so :D

joeguevara

joeguevara wrote: »

It may be seen as overvaluing an asset and there are accounting standards that could be an issue. Nothing stopping a grant to promote training or something similar

When you've got players going for over €100m then it would be very hard to say what is over valuing. The relatively immaterial amount would be written off over the contract period.

Cantona's Collars

Former Real Madrid President Fernando Sanz just passed away from the virus.
I think that's the first football related death.

bassy

MD1990 wrote: »

bit from the Atletic piece.

Fair play to Woodward.

he,s probably a pool fan :rolleyes:

Cantona's Collars

bassy wrote: »

he,s probably a pool fan :rolleyes:

Rugby is his sport but Andy Tate is convinced he's a Liverpool fan.

MD1990

MD1990 wrote: »

bit from the Atletic piece.

Fair play to Woodward.

It benefits his club. Of course he wants to finish it.

c.p.w.g.w

noodler wrote: »

Picked it up at Cheltenham FFS

I don't know if we can really blame the Brits who went to Cheltenham...

The approach from London was very weak and wasn't suggestive of it being as bad as it really is...

Also can't imagine your typical footballer is all that smart...Graeme LeSaux used to have to hide his newspaper when at Chelsea because he got such grief from teammates as it wasn't a redtop...

Even here, it took Leo's Patricks Day speech for many to realize just how serious this really is...and there are still folks who claim he was just fear mongering

noodler

c.p.w.g.w wrote: »

I don't know if we can really blame the Brits who went to Cheltenham...

The approach from London was very weak and wasn't suggestive of it being as bad as it really is...

Also can't imagine your typical footballer is all that smart...Graeme LeSaux used to have to hide his newspaper when at Chelsea because he got such grief from teammates as it wasn't a redtop...

Even here, it took Leo's Patricks Day speech for many to realize just how serious this really is...and there are still folks who claim he was just fear mongering

Disagree completely.

Anyway, it was in the context of points on whether or footballers, who are much better looked after than the majority medically speaking, would have a Corona risk from playing each other behind closed doors.

Hodors Appletart

look what happened in Paris when PSG played behind closed doors, people still congregated.

Look at poxy JD sports in dublin this morning.


You can't, in any concscience, put on events like this. Even behind closed doors. You are creating a place where people will want to be, and then creating the possibility of a flashpoint, or the need for frontline services (police, ambulance) to be deployed where they could be better utilised elsewhere.

It's incredibly selfish and short-sighted to be even suggesting anything like this.

Hodors Appletart

Hodors Appletart wrote: »

It's incredibly selfish and short-sighted to be even suggesting anything like this.

The people need 'bread and circuses' to help maintain order.



If the likes of Klopp (who has a cult like status) told fans to stay away they would. There are/will be no pubs open. It will be viewing at home. There's a good chance they will finish behind closed doors to help entertain the masses.

Cantona's Collars

MD1990 wrote: »

bit from the Atletic piece.

Fair play to Woodward.

Another bit.

How realistic is it that English football will resume on April 30?

Sources say there was an acceptance in the room that the date announced would “probably not” see a return of Premier League action, but a line had to be drawn to provide some kind of structure for clubs.

April 30 is far enough in the future whereby a semblance of planning can take place. “You can now give players a set three weeks off,” said one executive. “If you push it back a week at a time everyone is in no-man’s land.
Uniting all those dialling in was the prospect of a massive financial penalty for failing to complete the season. As The Athletic revealed on Friday, executives were told that broadcasters such as Sky and BT Sport could demand a total of £762 million be returned if the campaign was curtailed, to cover the games still due to be shown on TV. It would be considered breach of contract.

There would be the prospect of negotiation on that figure, sources argue, given the Premier League’s importance to both channels — but it remains enough of a concern to bring a common consensus.

“There was a togetherness that we need to sort this out,” said a source. “Finance was the big motivator.”

This is not about greed, however. “Ultimately, we’re just businesses that make tiny profits,” said one Premier League executive. “If the cashflow dries up we’re no different to hotel groups or anything else. If we don’t put on the show we don’t get paid. If we don’t finish the season it’s a massive, massive problem.

Chuck Noland

A fella from the NHS management was on the news earlier saying that no emergency services would be spared to attend any sporting events until the virus is under control. So be it behind closed doors or open to the public no football will be played until this is resolved. The UK is approx 10/12 weeks from the peak. God only knows how long after that it will take yo be “under control”

brinty

Chuck Noland wrote:

A fella from the NHS management was on the news earlier saying that no emergency services would be spared to attend any sporting events until the virus is under control. So be it behind closed doors or open to the public no football will be played until this is resolved. The UK is approx 10/12 weeks from the peak. God only knows how long after that it will take yo be “under controlâ€

But but but it'll back by the start of May, Liverpool fans told me so!!!

At the rate the UK are doing things about this the peak will be a long ways off s and could take a year or longer to recover and even get back to normal

brinty

brinty wrote: »

But but but it'll back by the start of May, Liverpool fans told me so!!!

Any Liverpool fans on boards.ie tell you that other than quoting what's been stated on the likes of the BBC?

Or are these Liverpool fans you conveniently only know in RL that cant be quoted?

noodler

brinty wrote: »

But but but it'll back by the start of May, Liverpool fans told me so!!!

At the rate the UK are doing things about this the peak will be a long ways off s and could take a year or longer to recover and even get back to normal

What an absolute ****post

Cantona's Collars

Even behind closed doors games won't work as people in the UK can't even be trusted to stay away from Sunday markets,never mind the streets around stadiums.

noodler

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Even behind closed doors games won't work as people in the UK can't even be trusted to stay away from Sunday markets,never mind the streets around stadiums.

Teams have had to play behind closed doors plenty of times before, does it typically lead to a build up of people outside the stadium?

Chuck Noland

Chuck Noland wrote: »

A fella from the NHS management was on the news earlier saying that no emergency services would be spared to attend any sporting events until the virus is under control.

Those emergency staff are usually first responder types for the crowds, who wont be attending. Be assured Premier league clubs and most if not all EFL teams will have doctors to hand, enough to cover the relatively small number of staff in the stadium.

brinty

noodler wrote:

What an absolute ****post

It's great to know I can trigger you like this, you do know I'd be more upset if you didn't reply

noodler wrote:

Teams have had to play behind closed doors plenty of times before, does it typically lead to a build up of people outside the stadium?

Have you seen the scenes in the UK today, markets, supermarkets, fast food outlets, pubs absolutely packed out. Beaches full, and you really think they'll control people being in and around grounds for matches.

They can't do social distancing with exploding numbers of cases and warnings.

The stupidity of some is startling that they think things will be back to normal in no time

8-10

There is no going back. There will be a new normal

brinty

brinty wrote: »

They can't do social distancing with exploding numbers of cases and warnings.

The stupidity of some is startling that they think things will be back to normal in no time

The UK (as are we all) are in for some rough months, but a premier league match a day (not shown in closed pubs) could get those not employed to stay at home.

dogbert27

brinty wrote: »

But but but it'll back by the start of May, Liverpool fans told me so!!!

At the rate the UK are doing things about this the peak will be a long ways off s and could take a year or longer to recover and even get back to normal

This is the most ignorant post I've seen in a long time.

Seriously grow up.

Liverpool fans accept that this season is not restarting any time soon but feel that it should not be voided as there is no guarantee of next season starting any time soon either.

Right now the world has to get through a pandemic and that's what everyone is focusing on.

dogbert27

The problem with playing games behind closed doors is not so much people gathering outside the stadiums as I think the population is more aware of that now.

With the pubs closed and games on sky sports, BT, virgin, etc. people will start going to each others houses to watch the games.

pjohnson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The UK (as are we all) are in for some rough months, but a premier league match a day (not shown in closed pubs) could get those not employed to stay at home.

More likely they'll have large house parties and just get black out drunk.

pjohnson

pjohnson wrote: »

More likely they'll have large house parties and just get black out drunk.

And you think the people that would do this would need such an excuse?

noodler

brinty wrote: »

Have you seen the scenes in the UK today, markets, supermarkets, fast food outlets, pubs absolutely packed out. Beaches full, and you really think they'll control people being in and around grounds for matches.

They can't do social distancing with exploding numbers of cases and warnings.

The stupidity of some is startling that they think things will be back to normal in no time

I don't understand how this relates to my question?

Is it common for behind closed door matchs to attract people to the outsides of the stadium?

Surely not?

dogbert27

noodler wrote: »

I don't understand how this relates to my question?

Is it common for behind closed door matchs to attract people to the outsides of the stadium?

Surely not?

Atalanta fans were outside their stadium for the game against Valenica. You could hear them on the tv.

Chuck Noland

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Those emergency staff are usually first responder types for the crowds, who wont be attending. Be assured Premier league clubs and most if not all EFL teams will have doctors to hand, enough to cover the relatively small number of staff in the stadium.

Under UEFA regs all premier league match’s must have , A stretcher team & doctor, not affiliated too either club. They care for an injured player/official to the point of the ambulance and then return to their seats as the player is taken away. There is a requirement for an ambulance for players/officials only also with minimum 2 paramedics on board. The home club must also insure should the first ambulance be needed that a second is on standby waiting to cover in the event of the first been used and this cannot take longer then 10 minutes to reach the ground.

So even behind closed doors you’d need on a full PL match day
10 doctors
10 Strecher teams. (60 people as it’s teams of 6)
20 x Ambulances (10 of those on standby)
40 x paramedics (20 on sites, 20 on standby)

With how stretched the NHS will be this won’t happen until “they get on top of things”
They won’t be next month

Chuck Noland

Chuck Noland wrote: »

Under UEFA regs all premier league match’s must have , A stretcher team & doctor, not affiliated too either club. They care for an injured player/official to the point of the ambulance and then return to their seats as the player is taken away. There is also a requirement for an ambulance for players only also with minimum 2 paramedics on board. The home club must also insure should the first ambulance be needed that a second is on standby waiting to cover in the event of the first been used and this cannot take longer then 10 minutes to reach the ground.

So even behind closed doors you’d need on match days
10 doctors
10 Strecher teams.
20 x Ambulances (10 of those on standby)
40 x paramedics (20 on sites, 20 on standby)

With how stretched the NHS will be this won’t happen until “they get on top of things”
They won’t be next month

It's a match a day proposed (not all 10 on one day). I'm sure the Premier league could resource a private ambulance crew or two and staff. As for the independence rule... rules can be changed, especially in dire circumstances.

BTW, this was a Premier League proposal - I'm sure they've considered the logistics.

Chuck Noland

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's a match a day proposed (not all 10 on one day). I'm sure the Premier league could resource a private ambulance crew or two and staff. As for the independence rule... rules can be changed, especially in dire circumstances.

Did you read what I said? This is a UEFA directive, not the PL. would you risk killing someone so a match can be played for your entertainment?
Actually do ya know what, don’t answer that.....