General Premier League Thread 2019-20

Mitch Connor

Quazzie wrote: »

How is VAR affected by Social distancing?

It can literally be done from home

The people in the VAR control room in Stockly Park, or whatever it is called, is the reason.

Quazzie

Mitch Connor wrote: »

The people in the VAR control room in Stockly Park, or whatever it is called, is the reason.

It's people looking a computer screen, It can be done anywhere

j8wk2feszrnpao

Quazzie wrote: »

It's people looking a computer screen, It can be done anywhere

Exactly. And even if they have to be at Stockly Park, no reason they couldn't have the 2-3 officials get tested and then bunker down at the place at a month, earn a good payday.

citytillidie

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Exactly. And even if they have to be at Stockly Park, no reason they couldn't have the 2-3 officials get tested and then bunker down at the place at a month, earn a good payday.

Same as commentary no need for them to be at the ground its not the same but it can be all done off the box.

No need for build up and anyalsis either just go sttraight into the game and leave again.

razorblunt

That excuse for no VAR makes no sense. People in a room? Sit them a few feet apart from each other. Job done.

8-10

razorblunt wrote: »

That excuse for no VAR makes no sense. People in a room? Sit them a few feet apart from each other. Job done.

Easier to scrap it completely. Less people involved overall and football before VAR worked, nothing's going to fall over if you don't do it.

stesaurus

Quazzie wrote: »

How is VAR affected by Social distancing?

It can literally be done from home

I actually thought that was a joke about social distancing between players and VAR not being required as a result

y0ssar1an22

razorblunt wrote: »

That excuse for no VAR makes no sense. People in a room? Sit them a few feet apart from each other. Job done.

so there's 1 var, and then a few technicians to pull up various angles and such?

citytillidie

Don't think VAR can be done from home since it can't even be done at PL grounds they have the one system just at stockly park

Guy:Incognito

citytillidie wrote: »

Don't think VAR can be done from home since it can't even be done at PL grounds they have the one system just at stockly park

It could be done at the grounds, they just chose not too. They decided it was all going to be done at stockly park.

yourdeadwright

So are Newcastle the new Man city, or how do you guys think that take over will play out ,

gstack166

yourdeadwright wrote: »

So are Newcastle the new Man city, or how do you guys think that take over will play out ,

Newcastle won’t be able spend a more than a few bob extra on top of what they’re already spending due to FFP. The drawbridge is closed, they’re too late to the party.

TitianGerm

gstack166 wrote: »

Newcastle won’t be able spend a more than a few bob extra on top of what they’re already spending due to FFP. The drawbridge is closed, they’re too late to the party.

Sure the Government companies will just give Newcastle massively inflated sponsorship deals and pay £5B for the stadium naming rights.

Fitz*

gstack166 wrote: »

Newcastle won’t be able spend a more than a few bob extra on top of what they’re already spending due to FFP. The drawbridge is closed, they’re too late to the party.

Unless the new owners magic up some impressive new sponsorship deals, stadium naming rights etc

gstack166

TitianGerm wrote: »

Sure the Government companies will just give Newcastle massively inflated sponsorship deals and pay £5B for the stadium naming rights.

Hopefully. Be great to see a new team challenging.

~Rebel~

yourdeadwright wrote: »

So are Newcastle the new Man city, or how do you guys think that take over will play out ,

Might find it hard to pump in money in extreme amounts for a while, though like City they'll find a way to do it over time with inflated sponsorships etc (presumably learning from City's lesson in how they do it though, to skirt the lines of feasibility and transparency).

Still really hoping this doesn't go through though... I've always had a soft spot for Newcastle, but the Saudi regime is so utterly despicable it'll be hard (if not impossible) to separate that from the club they'll own, and control, and will be using to try to improve their image.

Guy:Incognito

Id imagine Newcastle fans will hold off on the champagne. How many times has Ashley nearly sold the club at this stage?

Soooo, Prince Andrew's ex knits together a deal involving the club that sought to furlough non playing staff and the Saudi royal family, whose exploits range from genocides in Yemen to the murder of Jamal Khashoggi?

We may see a lot more of NUFC on TV, I'm thinking Panorama, Newsnight, Question Time etc.

Thjs is an opportunity to fix football. Salary caps. Bonus limits. Transfer caps.

c.p.w.g.w

Deleted User wrote: »

Thjs is an opportunity to fix football. Salary caps. Bonus limits. Transfer caps.

Its also an opportunity to fix to economy too...it seems way too many business' are heavily leveraged and running off credit with high amounts of debt.

Just look at Oasis/Warehouse & Debenhams, they look to be gone completely.

I know a butcher who is owed 5 figures from a couple of big hotels and pubs combined. Thankfully he owns his premises and is still very busy with his high street retail business, but his wholesale is 100% gone and fears his not going to see any of what's owed from the wholesale business. I have heard similar stories from other business', i know this is very anecdotal...

dogbert27

Salary caps would only work if it was a global agreement. Footballers will follow the money.

There are salary caps in MLS but they have the designated player rule or "Beckham Rule" that allows them to break the salary caps for 3 players. These are usually players at the end of their career who join clubs for marketing reasons.

I don't see football changing that much just because it pauses for a few months.

~Rebel~

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Thjs is an opportunity to fix football. Salary caps. Bonus limits. Transfer caps.

Alas what we’re actually getting is a(nother) genocidal hereditary dictatorship joining the ranks of premier league club owners.

smelly sock

https://www.the42.ie/premier-league-end-date-5075837-Apr2020/

This summit will be critical. Its hard to see games getting the go ahead in the next few months.

A really legitimate argument by clubs as to why it should end by end of June.

Keep an eye here. If the majority of clubs want it to end by then its hard to see it could be extended tbh.

Rock77

smelly sock wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/premier-league-end-date-5075837-Apr2020/

This summit will be critical. Its hard to see games getting the go ahead in the next few months.

A really legitimate argument by clubs as to why it should end by end of June.

Keep an eye here. If the majority of clubs want it to end by then its hard to see it could be extended tbh.

Am I missing something, why can’t clubs offer players a short term contract (say 3 months) surely the club would want to keep the player to finish the season and surely the player would want to finish the season..?

Fitz*

Rock77 wrote: »

Am I missing something, why can’t clubs offer players a short term contract (say 3 months) surely the club would want to keep the player to finish the season and surely the player would want to finish the season..?

They will be allowed to. FIFA have recommended clubs to do it to.

Rock77

FitzShane wrote: »

They will be allowed to. FIFA have recommended clubs to do it to.

Yeah so it’s really a non issue?

There can’t be that many players out of contract anyway.. if every club had two players out of contract in July it’s hardly a big deal to draw up an identical contract for a further 3 months or so.

So resume the season in October or whenever it’s safe..

Mitch Connor

Rock77 wrote: »

Yeah so it’s really a non issue?

There can’t be that many players out of contract anyway.. if every club had two players out of contract in July it’s hardly a big deal to draw up an identical contract for a further 3 months or so.

So resume the season in October or whenever it’s safe..

less of an issue, but you probably have clauses that kick in on specific dates, as opposed to vague 'end of season' terms.

Wages increases, bonuses, release clauses etc. They could be under the microscope too.

Player loans would also need to be looked at. Guidance from Fifa is that the intention of the deals is to the end of the season and that should be respected, but it is just guidance. Fifa can't force clubs to extend loan contacts if they don't want to.

United could take Henderson from Sheffield United June 1st if that is the date in the loan contact. The FA could look at stopping him playing for United by not transfering registration, but that would be seperate to him no longer being available for Sheffield United. Not saying United will do that, or there is talk of it even, but its a scenario.

The Ajax lad becomes a Chelsea employee on whatever date the contracts state - if that is before the end of the Dutch season what happens there?

Rock77

Mitch Connor wrote: »

less of an issue, but you probably have clauses that kick in on specific dates, as opposed to vague 'end of season' terms.

Wages increases, bonuses, release clauses etc. They could be under the microscope too.

Player loans would also need to be looked at. Guidance from Fifa is that the intention of the deals is to the end of the season and that should be respected, but it is just guidance. Fifa can't force clubs to extend loan contacts if they don't want to.

United could take Henderson from Sheffield United June 1st if that is the date in the loan contact. The FA could look at stopping him playing for United by not transfering registration, but that would be seperate to him no longer being available for Sheffield United. Not saying United will do that, or there is talk of it even, but its a scenario.

The Ajax lad becomes a Chelsea employee on whatever date the contracts state - if that is before the end of the Dutch season what happens there?

To be honest I think it’s just hard luck on Ajax and Sheffield Utd.. the contract was agreed to end or start on a particular date.. that’s it, full stop.

In the Ajax case it would be good if the 2 clubs involved and the player could come up with some agreement to let him finish the season but if not he signed a contract to join Chelsea on a particular date.

That would be my view anyway.

the whole year inn

Rock77 wrote: »

To be honest I think it’s just hard luck on Ajax and Sheffield Utd.. the contract was agreed to end or start on a particular date.. that’s it, full stop.

In the Ajax case it would be good if the 2 clubs involved and the player could come up with some agreement to let him finish the season but if not he signed a contract to join Chelsea on a particular date.

That would be my view anyway.

No its not hard luck to them , they can stir the porridge aswell and to right they should.

smelly sock

Rock77 wrote: »

Am I missing something, why can’t clubs offer players a short term contract (say 3 months) surely the club would want to keep the player to finish the season and surely the player would want to finish the season..?

Why would clubs want to keep players on huge money a second longer than they have to? Especially if they have nothing to gain in terms of promotion or European qualification. Some clubs will be so financially burdened with no income it makes sense for them to start to strip assets and remove them from the payroll. Any good chairman and board will be looking at that now.

smelly sock

the whole year inn wrote: »

No its not hard luck to them , they can stir the porridge aswell and to right they should.

Absolutely. The whole things is a cluster fxxk and the feeling you get is that clubs will want to consolidate as soon as possible and trim down on the pay bill.

Also as you say you can't have a season finishing late this year or early next year whereby loan deals finish , contracts are run out already and free agents have left to join new clubs. It's crazy and there is no continuity to it at all. Will new signings be eligible to play etc?

Clubs won't want to extend contracts short term .Tale Jeff Hendrick for example who is on a reported 70k a week at Burnley. Why would they want to extend that by 3 months resulting in a further loss for very little gain.

Talk of finishing this season any later than the end of June is madness and only serves the interests of the elite few and possibly Sky / BT.

Rock77

the whole year inn wrote: »

No its not hard luck to them , they can stir the porridge aswell and to right they should.

They can stir whatever they like, The player signed a contract to join Chelsea on July 1st or whatever date it is. On that date he is a Chelsea player. What happens with the Dutch league is totally irrelevant.

Rock77

If clubs don’t want to offer players short term contracts and they are looking to offload these players why would the ‘stir the porridge’ ???

smelly sock

Rock77 wrote: »

If clubs don’t want to offer players short term contracts and they are looking to offload these players why would the ‘stir the porridge’ ???

If the season was long fingered and say the like of Watford or Bournemouth for example had let go of 5 or 6 players they would be at a disadvantage wouldn't they? Same goes if they have to offer them short term contracts without knowing when they might have an income stream again. That wouldn't be financially prudent.

Rock77

smelly sock wrote: »

If the season was long fingered and say the like of Watford or Bournemouth for example had let go of 5 or 6 players they would be at a disadvantage wouldn't they? Same goes if they have to offer them short term contracts without knowing when they might have an income stream again. That wouldn't be financially prudent.

They would be at a disadvantage if they let them go in football terms. Financially they may have to let them go. The choice is theirs. Their contracts don’t say ‘expires on July 1st, but only if the season is finished’

What’s the alternative? Cancel a season that’s almost finished which means they have paid these guys for the last 6 months for nothing....

Mitch Connor

Rock77 wrote: »

What’s the alternative? Cancel a season that’s almost finished which means they have paid these guys for the last 6 months for nothing....

well, yes.

You can then let players go without worry if they will be needed to complete this season.
You then have a downtime between seasons which has a lower cost than during the season.
You can then start planning budgets for next season - where the costs for this season are known and completed.

In terms of trophies it would mean the season was for nothing, maybe, but the Gate Reciepts and TV money would still have been earned for the most part (Sky and BT not clawing back, others might).

Questions would remain on merit payments due for finishing league positions.

Whether Null and Void (highly unlikely) or Cancel, they could still pay out on current league positions.

Biggest question on ending the season now.
How qualifies for the CL
Who qualifies for the EL.
Does any club get relegated.
- if so, who?
Do clubs get promoted
- if so, who?
- and to what structure of league.

Just ending the season now, is not an easy choice to take or implement.
Continuing the season indefinitely also has huge impacts.

As Scotland have shown. As Holland and Belgium have shown. As Spain have shown (they are looking into how they would end the season now) - there is an understanding that not completing the season is a very real possibility and ignorning it is just burying your head in the sand.

Finishing the season is what all would want to do (for footballing, financial and legal reasons), and it is clear that is the ideal plan. But people have to understand that the further time drags on, the more just ending the season as it is now becomes a real scenario.

Fitz*

smelly sock wrote: »

Also as you say you can't have a season finishing late this year or early next year whereby loan deals finish , contracts are run out already and free agents have left to join new clubs. It's crazy and there is no continuity to it at all. Will new signings be eligible to play etc?

Clubs won't want to extend contracts short term .Tale Jeff Hendrick for example who is on a reported 70k a week at Burnley. Why would they want to extend that by 3 months resulting in a further loss for very little gain.

Talk of finishing this season any later than the end of June is madness and only serves the interests of the elite few and possibly Sky / BT.

And what will Burnley and the other clubs do on July 1st when the next year of their contract kicks in and they still have to pay these players for July, August, September etc and they can't train and play football? Will every club just release all the players instead? Is that what you want?

June 30th is only a realistic date if clubs go into quarantine together soon, and begin to self isolate as a team in large and regularly get tested. Before the 2 month 'festival of football' at a few select locations.

If this season does not finish before October, then there is a strong possibility next season might not happen at all and a lot of clubs go bust. Clubs rely on sponsorship money, league finishing money, TV money etc. They can't afford to have to give back the final payment of TV money. If this season is not completed and next season doesn't happen, then there is no hope for a lot of clubs. The only way clubs will survive is if this season is completed and next season starts.

Mitch Connor

FitzShane wrote: »

And what will Burnley and the other clubs do on July 1st when the next year of their contract kicks in and they still have to pay these players for July, August, September etc and they can't train and play football? Will every club just release all the players instead? Is that what you want?

June 30th is only a realistic date if clubs go into quarantine together soon, and begin to self isolate as a team in large and regularly get tested. Before the 2 month 'festival of football' at a few select locations.

If this season does not finish before October, then there is a strong possibility next season might not happen at all and a lot of clubs go bust. Clubs rely on sponsorship money, league finishing money, TV money etc. They can't afford to have to give back the final payment of TV money. If this season is not completed and next season doesn't happen, then there is no hope for a lot of clubs. The only way clubs will survive is if this season is completed and next season starts.

BT and Sky have said they won't look for a clawback on this seasons money. So that part is fairly safe. But if next season is delayed massively then so is next seasons TV money. And they need that money just as much as they needed to keep this seasons'.

I think there is zero chance of this season being played in September or October. If this season isn't restarted or gearing up to restarted by the end of June, it won't happen (personal opinion)

gstack166

Doesn’t matter a toss now anyways Cos the UK have extended the lockdown by a further 3 weeks minimum.

The final nail in this years seasons coffin I think.

Fitz*

Mitch Connor wrote: »

BT and Sky have said they won't look for a clawback on this seasons money. So that part is fairly safe. But if next season is delayed massively then so is next seasons TV money. And they need that money just as much as they needed to keep this seasons'.

I think there is zero chance of this season being played in September or October. If this season isn't restarted or gearing up to restarted by the end of June, it won't happen (personal opinion)

Yeah I think June 1st could be a viable starting point for the remaining 9 games. Start pre-season training in May after the new 3 week lockdown. Play the league off in June and July and as I said the other day, there are some games that might not even have to be played based on previous results. It shouldn't throw next season out of kilter a whole pile. If next season starts in later September and finishes in June, it's not the worst thing in the world. Clubs will have their summer plans already torn up as it is, and they will be in 2 years time also for the Qatar World Cup.

Players are basically having their summer break now, so when a pre-season takes place in May for a June start, as a more out-there extreme idea we could even see the two seasons semi merged in terms of playing time. June & July to finish this season, a quick break with no usual summer tours and then into August to start next season behind closed doors.

All of the above is probably more applicable to the Premier League than to other leagues to be fair, as clubs rely on TV money and not gate receipts. Clubs would rather TV money and an empty ground rather than a full house and no TV money.

gstack166 wrote: »

Doesn’t matter a toss now anyways Cos the UK have extended the lockdown by a further 3 weeks minimum.

The final nail in this years seasons coffin I think.

Which brings us up until May and clubs could be able to train together again.

~Rebel~

gstack166 wrote: »

Doesn’t matter a toss now anyways Cos the UK have extended the lockdown by a further 3 weeks minimum.

I'm not sure that changes much.. think that was very universally expected and assumed to happen for at least the past 2 or 3 weeks.

8-10

Whatever about this season, I cant see a scenario where 2020/21 goes ahead in August as planned. I think it's definitely going to be disrupted.

I'm increasingly having the feeling that we won't see EPL soccer again this calendar year.

~Rebel~

8-10 wrote: »

Whatever about this season, I cant see a scenario where 2020/21 goes ahead in August as planned. I think it's definitely going to be disrupted.

I'm increasingly having the feeling that we won't see EPL soccer again this calendar year.

Yeah, all eyes will be on Germany, and how they go about the practicalities of behind-closed-doors football, and if it works.

Was reading about the prospective guidelines for a return to film production back in LA (what i work in), and there's a lot of parallels to draw, but with football having even more moving parts. A big part of their approach is the total isolation of the actors. Like the players, they're the one irreplaceable commodity, so they're to have zero contact with anyone else who isn't wearing gloves, mask etc etc, and to have minimal contact full stop. Being directed through screens, or just via phonecalls, rather than in-person chats. Could see something like that in football, where the players, and perhaps a small group of coaching staff are isolated together, and have zero contact with the wider setup going on.

This all being the case, it almost makes more sense to change the structure of a behind-closed-doors season... doing bursts of games together, and then a gap, and then another burst, as it would be next to impossible to enforce that sort of rigid no-contact structure for a full season. Treating it almost more like a film production, where you dig in and give your whole life over to it for an intense period of time, and then back off for a while before the next gig.

MD1990

8-10 wrote: »

Whatever about this season, I cant see a scenario where 2020/21 goes ahead in August as planned. I think it's definitely going to be disrupted.

I'm increasingly having the feeling that we won't see EPL soccer again this calendar year.

if this happens
The transfer window will need to be open the whole year,
So some clubs can sell players to stay afloat.

niallo27

8-10 wrote: »

Whatever about this season, I cant see a scenario where 2020/21 goes ahead in August as planned. I think it's definitely going to be disrupted.

I'm increasingly having the feeling that we won't see EPL soccer again this calendar year.

Depends if you mean football behind closed doors or not. November or December is so far away though. It seems like an eternity ago since schools closed but it's only just over a month. Things will have developed a lot in 5 or 6 months from now.

8-10

niallo27 wrote: »

Depends if you mean football behind closed doors or not. November or December is so far away though. It seems like an eternity ago since schools closed but it's only just over a month. Things will have developed a lot in 5 or 6 months from now.

I'm including behind closed doors games. I think 5 or 6 months is going to be more likely than June for sure.

I think we'll be playing this 'wait and see' game for quite some time yet.

y0ssar1an22

the best 11 from ~85 is doing my head in so much :pac: and looking at other peoples teams kinda ruins it. everyone has maldini as LB, and Lahm as RB. it biases me, plus my knowledge is lacking.

my 1st draft 11 utd/liverpool from the PL era (for the most of their career, so no bryan robson/john barnes/etc )(4 2 3 1):


schmeichel

TAA think with the awesome defence + keane, his strengths in attack outweigh neville's defensive prowess (and thats debatable i believe?)
VVD & Stam going with the dutch CB paring. Prob the toughest call with rio and vidic.
Evra

Keane
Gerard I do think Gerard would have been a killer (more so than he was) with a competent back 4

Ronaldo
Cantona I think the best in the 10 slot. Rooney, solid argument for.
Salah

Ruud The best natural finisher. I didn’t weigh in in the Utd thread, but he should be in that IMHO

ETA: barnes and cantona both left in 97. i included cantona because he was a few years younger and retired too early. barnes was towards the end of his career.

MD1990

i do get the feeling this season wont be finished now.
they wont void it but interesting what happens with releagtion.

Foolish decision as next season wont be finished with 38 games to be played no chance. Easier to fininsh this season but looking more unlikely now.

Rock77

MD1990 wrote: »

i do get the feeling this season wont be finished now.
they wont void it but interesting what happens with releagtion.

Foolish decision as next season wont be finished with 38 games to be played no chance. Easier to fininsh this season but looking more unlikely now.

Why do u think it won’t be finished now? Has something been announced?

Anything official has said they will try to finish the season when safe to do so.

MD1990

Rock77 wrote: »

Why do u think it won’t be finished now? Has something been announced?

Anything official has said they will try to finish the season when safe to do so.

no.

just the leaks all saying clubs wanting to finish before June 30.

I cant see that happening.
also the virus has stagnated in Italy & Spain but not a huge drop. Going to be a big problem for a long time.