General Premier League Thread 2019-20

Father Hernandez

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1259892740156018688?s=20

Interesting take from the broadcasters point of view if true.

~Rebel~

Father Hernandez wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1259892740156018688?s=20

Interesting take from the broadcasters point of view if true.

Seems a bit weird... Yes, the product isn't as attractive without a crowd as it is with one, but at the same time the market itself has changed, and the demand for distraction has dramatically increased.

Especially with the talk of showing a higher % of these games live, I would have said the broadcasters would be making out of this pretty well if the games go ahead behind closed doors.

Father Hernandez

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Seems a bit weird... Yes, the product isn't as attractive without a crowd as it is with one, but at the same time the market itself has changed, and the demand for distraction has dramatically increased.

Especially with the talk of showing a higher % of these games live, I would have said the broadcasters would be making out of this pretty well if the games go ahead behind closed doors.

As would I, unless it's something to do with some games going FTA as was previously rumored.

Then that would counter more people getting on board. Or the fact they've missed out on certain revenue for past 2 months too. Strange one.

Mitch Connor

Father Hernandez wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1259892740156018688?s=20

Interesting take from the broadcasters point of view if true.

that broadcaster threat is very interesting.

Wonder if it is a power play.

Maybe there is something in their contract that can call for a rebate but....the tv contract based on spectators at the stadium? Seems odd. Also, if the Behind Closed Doors (Fook it, I'm going with the dutch SpookDuels!), if the SPOOKDUELS go ahead, there will be a call for all the games to be televised, so BT and Sky will have more games to show (and a captive audience!) so how can they demand a rebate when getting to show the matches they would have, and more.

Probably something around competitiveness, and I can imagine a spookduel season is of less entertainment value than they would have banked on when agreeing the deal... but tough? If the games are played, the games are played.

So could it be a power play to threaten it, and then 'compromise' to not demand a rebate as long as they do play the matches.

Agent Coulson

Probably a threat to stop the premier league offering non contracted games to the BBC, ITV or any free to air station if every game is going to air.

.G.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

the problem as I see it is the PL is in control of its own fate, really.

In France the FA control the top two leagues, and also it is part of their rules that if the season cannot finish as normal, the standings will be declared as per the table as it stood.

In the PL there is no such rule, and I don't think the FA has the ability to force a solution on the clubs either.

I think in Holland there is more control over the top league as well.

The PL being a seperate institution is a problem, as far as I can see.

Whatever the final decision, the PL need to find a way to get all the clubs to agree to it, and I don't see how they can.

I do wonder what legal legs the PL have to stand on. The case a few years back would show them to be quite strong. West Ham guilty of playing an ineligible player for 26 matches, who's goals kept them up at the expense of Sheff United, and the PL were still able to relegate Sheffield United and get away with it.

I didn't know this until recently but the FA does hold a special share of the Premier league which means it must approve changes to relegation or the numbers of teams in the league. Can't happen without their say so.

So basically UEFA have forced theirs hand into deciding the outcome at the top of the table and the FA have forced their hands into deciding the outcomes at the bottom, either on the pitch or by a vote.

Mitch Connor

Father Hernandez wrote: »

As would I, unless it's something to do with some games going FTA as was previously rumored.

Then that would counter more people getting on board. Or the fact they've missed out on certain revenue for past 2 months too. Strange one.

The FTA angel looks like it would be through BT and Sky though (via YouTube for BT?) so even if some of the extra games have to be shown FTA, they'd stand to make more money from advertising, for example. So again, the money argument doesn't seem to wash for a rebate.

But obviously we have no idea what the contract says, or the clauses may allow for. You could point to the simple fact of the season was supposed to be finished by now, so the games have not taken place in the agreed upon time-frame. a very easy contract call on that I would think.

Mitch Connor

.G. wrote: »

I didn't know this until recently but the FA does hold a special share of the Premier league which means it must approve changes to relegation or the numbers of teams in the league. Can't happen without their say so.

So basically UEFA have forced theirs hand into deciding the outcome at the top of the table and the FA have forced their hands into deciding the outcomes at the bottom, either on the pitch or by a vote.

Yep, they control the numbers up and down. But I don't think they can call the how of it ending.

smelly sock

https://www.the42.ie/premier-league-8-5095434-May2020/

Yeh. Fire away and play matches though. Deadly.

ricero

smelly sock wrote: »

https://www.the42.ie/premier-league-8-5095434-May2020/

Yeh. Fire away and play matches though. Deadly.

Old news.

Can't wait for June after today's confirmation. Normality must resume. Peoples spirits need a much needed lift.

theoneeyedman

Mitch Connor wrote: »

The FTA angel looks like it would be through BT and Sky though (via YouTube for BT?) so even if some of the extra games have to be shown FTA, they'd stand to make more money from advertising, for example. So again, the money argument doesn't seem to wash for a rebate.

But obviously we have no idea what the contract says, or the clauses may allow for. You could point to the simple fact of the season was supposed to be finished by now, so the games have not taken place in the agreed upon time-frame. a very easy contract call on that I would think.

I'll eat my hat if Sky in particular show or or allow their games to be broadcast FTA.

Mitch Connor

theoneeyedman wrote: »

I'll eat my hat if Sky in particular show or or allow their games to be broadcast FTA.

the games they had picked out? Nah, don't see it.

But the 'extra' games? Yeah, I can see it.

TitianGerm

Father Hernandez wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sistoney67/status/1259892740156018688?s=20

Interesting take from the broadcasters point of view if true.

That seems strange especially if they'll be showing more games?

Father Hernandez

theoneeyedman wrote: »

I'll eat my hat if Sky in particular show or or allow their games to be broadcast FTA.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure they have previously had live games on Sky Mix. Obviously would be a dead rubber but it'd be like giving the fans something 'back'.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

the games they had picked out? Nah, don't see it.

But the 'extra' games? Yeah, I can see it.

I think the PL has plenty of leverage over sky to be honest. Sky needs EPL coverage more then EPL needs sky, a huge portion of their subscriptions are aboit the football..

Also, once sky get the pick of the top games and get to put them on at times that aren’t the same as FTA do they really care? It’s a once off and will promote the league possibly even net them a few new subscribers.

Drumpot

Father Hernandez wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure they have previously had live games on Sky Mix. Obviously would be a dead rubber but it'd be like giving the fans something 'back'.

Oh I didn’t think of that, that could be part of the broadcasters threat.

Maybe sky and BT are looking for all games and they will air the FTA ones aswell?

Mitch Connor

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Probably a threat to stop the premier league offering non contracted games to the BBC, ITV or any free to air station if every game is going to air.

I doubt the PL were going to offer to the BBC etc. Contracts with Sky and BT would absolutely lock out BBC etc of live games. they ain't paying billions for soneone else to get it for free.

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

I think the PL has plenty of leverage over sky to be honest. Sky needs EPL coverage more then EPL needs sky, a huge portion of their subscriptions are aboit the football..

Also, once sky get the pick of the top games and get to put them on at times that aren’t the same as FTA do they really care? It’s a once off and will promote the league possibly even net them a few new subscribers.

Sky could just demand its hundres of millions back and put clubs out of business.

.G.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Yep, they control the numbers up and down. But I don't think they can call the how of it ending.

Yeah not the specifics of it but they can and have called for *an* ending of it whatever way the clubs can figure out to do as long as three clubs go down and European places are decided, its them who send clubs forward to Europe too, not the league itself.

sideswipe

If premiership football doesn't return soon or continues to face problems when it does return into next season it could be the beginning of the end for the league as we know it. It could end up ripe for a take over from investment funds if they run into financial difficulty or else the big clubs could end up doing what has been threatened before and move towards a break away european super league to protect their future revenue streams.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Sky could just demand its hundres of millions back and put clubs out of business.

That would be cutting off their nose to spite their face. Their subs base might collapse without EPL. It’s really the only thing they can offer of value that Netflix/amazon subs can’t provide.

A small part of me was a bit excited at the thought of a European super league

But yea obviously the caveat of clubs and leagues going under is not good at all

Ignore coronavirus: Imagine having a league with the top 6 from the PL, La Liga, Serie A & the Bundesliga for arguments sake

LuckyLloyd

A European Super League would be immense. Much rather watch knockout stage CL type ties every weekend than smaller English clubs. Apart from the fans of those clubs specifically, who wouldn’t?

There could be huge opportunities here the longer football is not being played.

Speak Now

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A small part of me was a bit excited at the thought of a European super league

But yea obviously the caveat of clubs and leagues going under is not good at all

Ignore coronavirus: Imagine having a league with the top 6 from the PL, La Liga, Serie A & the Bundesliga for arguments sake

46 game season like the Championship, fans would want some deep pockets to cover the 18 away "European" games.

Drumpot

I don’t know about a European super league. Unless it had a roster system like in American football you could see one or two clubs dominate with nothing else to play for most seasons.

I appreciate fans of smaller clubs will say “welcome to our world” but a team can win the EPL and a team that has an awful EPL season can win the CL. A team who wins the league cup can get into Europe and potentially CL if they win that. It’s not perfect but there are more ways of smaller clubs rising up as there would be under a super league. But not just that there are different tournaments that make things more interesting.

I actually like the traditional league setup and the old rivalries and stories that I remember when we play them. Probably nostalgia.

ShamoBuc

Deleted User wrote: »

A small part of me was a bit excited at the thought of a European super league

But yea obviously the caveat of clubs and leagues going under is not good at all

Ignore coronavirus: Imagine having a league with the top 6 from the PL, La Liga, Serie A & the Bundesliga for arguments sake

A European Super League would be great, but tough on supporters for away games, fairly costly I would imagine but fantastic at the same time.
Also, would that mean an end to the Champions league?
Relegation from such a league would be a financial disaster.
Non top teams would suffer enormously financially and this would trickle down to the lower cubs.
Won't happen, but it would be a great watch nonetheless.

theoneeyedman

Father Hernandez wrote: »

Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure they have previously had live games on Sky Mix. Obviously would be a dead rubber but it'd be like giving the fans something 'back'.

Maybe, but Sky Mix isn't FTA, you still need a Sky Subscription.

Yea I mean 6 was a ballpark figure. Maybe a 20 team league or whatever. It was just a number really.

Had not thought of the CL either but maybe lower tier clubs leagues would consolidate also. They could turn it into some FA cup format instead.

Iused2likebusts

It seems the neutral ground thing is now getting reconsidered. Think the crowds outside a stadium is been overplayed myself. Maybe a threat that if crowds gather a team has to play the rest of their games at a neutral venue would help ensure it doesnt happen. Are english more likely than german fans to gather outside a stadium.

Agent Coulson

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Premier League clubs told 2019/20 season must be decided ‘on sporting merit’


https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/pl-project-restart-coronavirus-latest-sporting-merit-relegation-a9508601.html?utm_source=reddit.com

Great to hear. As mentioned it'll be interesting to see how relegation teams vote now.

TitianGerm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yea I mean 6 was a ballpark figure. Maybe a 20 team league or whatever. It was just a number really.

Had not thought of the CL either but maybe lower tier clubs leagues would consolidate also. They could turn it into some FA cup format instead.

Liverpool and United from the PL. And one of City or Chelsea?

R Madrid, A Madrid and Barca from Spain.

Bayern and Dortmund from Germany. One more maybe?

Juventus and Napoli or Inter from Italy. Would you give the three of them a spot?

PSG, Celtic, Porto, Ajax and a few more from the smaller leagues?

TitianGerm

TitianGerm wrote: »

Liverpool and United from the PL. And one of City or Chelsea?

R Madrid, A Madrid and Barca from Spain.

Bayern and Dortmund from Germany. One more maybe?

Juventus and Napoli or Inter from Italy. Would you give the three of them a spot?

PSG, Celtic, Porto, Ajax and a few more from the smaller leagues?

Whatever way you want to cut it really. Just discussing the concept.

It does sound awesome in theory

As someone posted earlier If it were ever to happen, something like this current pandemic could eventually push it to being considered in the future when ultimately clubs that can't cope will go into receivership.

TitianGerm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Whatever way you want to cut it really. Just discussing the concept.

It does sound awesome in theory

As someone posted earlier If it were ever to happen, something like this current pandemic could eventually push it to being considered in the future when ultimately clubs that can't cope will go into receivership.

Yea I'd say viewing numbers would be massive. Let clubs sell rights themselves then as well !!

TitianGerm

TitianGerm wrote: »

Yea I'd say viewing numbers would be massive. Let clubs sell rights themselves then as well !!

Move to a streaming format too. Let amazon or someone lead it

And it might force sky to get with the times

8-10

Nah let's stick to the Premier League. 20 teams home and away, the best in the English league system

Girly Gal

A European super league sounds good in theory; there would need to be promotion or relegation to it other wise there would be an awful lot of matches with nothing to play for, plus the strength of the premier league and other domestic leagues are based on the decades old intense local rivalries which would be missing from alot of the European fixtures.
Also a pandemic like we have now makes travel across international borders much more difficult, much easier for a national league to restart than a pan European league.

theoneeyedman

Girly Gal wrote: »

A European super league sounds good in theory; there would need to be promotion or relegation to it other wise there would be an awful lot of matches with nothing to play for, plus the strength of the premier league and other domestic leagues are based on the decades old intense local rivalries which would be missing from alot of the European fixtures.
Also a pandemic like we have now makes travel across international borders much more difficult, much easier for a national league to restart than a pan European league.

Exactly.

Many Champions League games are sh1t, just because it's 2 'traditional' clubs like say Inter v Real doesn't mean much to neutrals if it's a dead rubber or potentially a mid table game with nothing riding on it.
Also, the idea being mooted 6 months ago was about keeping the likes of Porto/Benfica, Celtic and Ajax/PSV out of a Super League, and at best at a second teir. The clubs around the trough now are keen to keep their noses in it, rather than share the gravy.
The EPL is a jog brand across much of the world, including Asia and increasingly Africa. English clubs should be wary of falling between 2 stools and chasing the European Super League pot of Gold, especially in the new, post Covid World.

Panrich

Drumpot wrote: »

I don’t know about a European super league. Unless it had a roster system like in American football you could see one or two clubs dominate with nothing else to play for most seasons.

I appreciate fans of smaller clubs will say “welcome to our world” but a team can win the EPL and a team that has an awful EPL season can win the CL. A team who wins the league cup can get into Europe and potentially CL if they win that. It’s not perfect but there are more ways of smaller clubs rising up as there would be under a super league. But not just that there are different tournaments that make things more interesting.

I actually like the traditional league setup and the old rivalries and stories that I remember when we play them. Probably nostalgia.

I think this crisis will push a European super league further away. Leaving aside the fact that a big recession is on the way taking money out of all economies, we are looking at a different landscape in air travel. It is going to be more expensive to hop on a plane once this works it's way through the airline industry.

citytillidie

Premier League statement

https://www.premierleague.com/news/1667256

Following today's meeting of Shareholders, Premier League Chief Executive Richard Masters has said the 20 clubs are united in their desire to get the 2019/20 season back up and running and that players and managers will have an important role in that return.

"In today's meeting, it was reiterated the Premier League and clubs absolutely recognise the COVID-19 pandemic puts football into context," Masters said. "So many lives have been lost and so many others deeply affected.

"We are proud at the response to the pandemic that the Premier League, our clubs and our players have provided with vital support to communities and to the NHS and hopefully will continue to do so after matches recommence."

During today's meeting the UK Government signalled the possibility of a return of live sports from 1 June, following on from its announcement on the easing of the lockdown in England.

Safety comes first
Masters said the League will follow Government advice as well as that of others in planning a return of the competition.

"We welcome these first steps and are ready to play our part," he said. "We are working flat out with clubs and stakeholders - Government, our broadcast partners, The FA, the EFL, PFA and the LMA - to create a responsible, safe and deliverable model to complete the season.

"Of course, safety comes first. We must listen to Government, the authorities and the medical experts and continue to follow their advice.

"That is exactly what we are doing. We are getting ourselves in the best position to resume the season, but only when the conditions are right."

Collective way forward
Masters said today's meeting of clubs showed all 20 were united in looking to complete the season.

"There was a strong desire to discuss everything in the round and to agree a collective way forward," he said. "A really strong collective will to complete the season remains."

In so doing, Masters reiterated that consulting the players and managers is vital and that a meeting is planned with them later this week.

"Our priority will always be the safety of players, coaches and managers, staff, supporters, and the wider community," he said.

"Nothing will be agreed until we have spoken to both the managers and players."

"Our priority will always be the safety of players, managers, staff, supporters, and the wider community"

Richard Masters, Premier League CEO

Masters said that only after consultation with the players and managers would there be the next step of clubs returning to training, but with social-distancing measures put in place. For that, he added, a company had been appointed to conduct testing at club training grounds.

The issue of where the remaining Premier League matches would be played was also discussed, with the possibility of using neutral venues raised. But Masters stressed that the Shareholders’ desire was to complete the season playing matches at their originally scheduled venues.

"Obviously it is the preference of all our clubs to play at home if at all possible," Masters said. "It is an ongoing dialogue and we've been talking to the authorities about the conditions in which we could get the Premier League back up and running and are taking all that advice on board."

New Premier League Chair
Masters also spoke about the recent appointment of Gary Hoffman as the new Premier League Chair, taking over from Claudia Arney, who had been holding the position on an interim basis.

"I am looking forward to working with Gary," Masters said. "He has a tough act to follow in Claudia, who I have worked with so closely over the last 18 months.

"I know Claudia has the respect of everyone at the Premier League and all the players.

"We are looking forward to that new team emerging."

jayo26

Sounds positive hopefully they can work out all the problems and get ot back on.

ShamoBuc

Sounds as if they are all in in together and that alone is a good sign.

Mitch Connor

They have to present a plan/decision to Uefa next Friday.

THe fact they are still to discuss a possible return with players is insane.

They have wasted so much time not discussing how to actually return to football.

jayo26

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They have to present a plan/decision to Uefa next Friday.

THe fact they are still to discuss a possible return with players is insane.

They have wasted so much time not discussing how to actually return to football.

How do you know what they havebt discussed? Maybe they just aint publicly anouncing things until they have ho ahead from the government and then the likes of euefa.

They can't present a plan to players to decide on until they have dates themselves.

ebbsy

I would suggest this course of action .


Relegate Utd and Everton to the Scottish Premier League.

And...err..... that's it.

Shanotheslayer

ebbsy wrote: »

I would suggest this course of action .


Relegate Utd and Everton to the Scottish Premier League.

And...err..... that's it.

We'd still finish between 7th-10th

jayo26

ebbsy wrote: »

I would suggest this course of action .


Relegate Utd and Everton to the Scottish Premier League.

And...err..... that's it.

Harsh on sheffield united they having a great season.

Fr Tod Umptious

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Seems a bit weird... Yes, the product isn't as attractive without a crowd as it is with one, but at the same time the market itself has changed, and the demand for distraction has dramatically increased.

Especially with the talk of showing a higher % of these games live, I would have said the broadcasters would be making out of this pretty well if the games go ahead behind closed doors.

They want a rebate because what they have been sold is not what is being delivered.

The EPL are already 2 months late with delivery of the product.

There is no guarantee when it will be delivered

And if it is delivered it will look very different to what was ordered (i.e behind closed doors)

TV companies have invested heavily in selling on this product but now their customers have gone and cancelled their orders, many will not bother ordering again because the replacement product will not be the same quality.

Why won't the TV companies want some money back.

.G.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

They have to present a plan/decision to Uefa next Friday.

THe fact they are still to discuss a possible return with players is insane.

They have wasted so much time not discussing how to actually return to football.

Whatever about what they've discussed, the teams are going to need a good few weeks training to get back up to speed so if they hope to play early in June they need to get a move on.

Even at that the first few games might be rubbish cos they'll all have zero match fitness!

Drumpot

.G. wrote: »

Whatever about what they've discussed, the teams are going to need a good few weeks training to get back up to speed so if they hope to play early in June they need to get a move on.

Even at that the first few games might be rubbish cos they'll all have zero match fitness!

I wonder if the restart goes well will they just use that as pre season and go straight into next season (if possible). No friendlies have been arranged because they can’t and Euros are next summer so it’s not like there’s a lot of room to wait about.

Mitch Connor

jayo26 wrote: »

How do you know what they havebt discussed? Maybe they just aint publicly anouncing things until they have ho ahead from the government and then the likes of euefa.

They can't present a plan to players to decide on until they have dates themselves.

I'm going by the reports of the PL meetings we have seen. That protocols, procedures etc have not been discussed at them. That player meetings are going to be this week, and haven't happened previous to this week.

You say they can't present a plan without a date.... so why the fook have they not discussed dates? Reports from the last meetings were no date was brought up for discussion. They couldn't present a firm one until Govt. guidance and advice, but they could have discussed and planned for different dates. Or discussed they were planning for June in the hope of Govt. allowance. Or even without a date what are the player concerns and how do the players feel football could return, what are the circumstances they would accept?

Like seriously... why would you not have a discussion with players and the PFA until this week? Why would you not lay the ground work, get an understanding.