RIC and DMP to be commemorated this month

Edgware

Bambi wrote: »

FG don't really understand humans, they never have.

Only their own crew

irishgrover

I really don't understand the majority of people anymore.
The RIC and DMP were full of Irish catholic police officers. At the time they were a normal mainly unarmed police force supported by 90+ percent of the population.
I really can't understand how people can't differentiate between bland and tans/auxi's and the normal police force.

irishgrover

irishgrover wrote: »

I really don't understand the majority of people anymore.
The RIC and DMP were full of Irish catholic police officers. At the time they were a normal mainly unarmed police force supported by 90+ percent of the population.
I really can't understand how people can't differentiate between bland and tans/auxi's and the normal police force.

You probably don’t understand people because you haven’t a clue judging by that.

is_that_so

irishgrover wrote: »

I really don't understand the majority of people anymore.
The RIC and DMP were full of Irish catholic police officers. At the time they were a normal mainly unarmed police force supported by 90+ percent of the population.
I really can't understand how people can't differentiate between bland and tans/auxi's and the normal police force.

When it comes to Irish history people will recall as they choose. It's all wrapped up in that awkward and complex historical relationship we have with our neighbour and our inability to see that history is ultimately just stories. There were always going to be events and dates marked in this decade, that people would choose to be offended by. There will be more of them before it comes to an end.

Hamsterchops

irishgrover wrote: »

I really don't understand the majority of people anymore.
The RIC and DMP were full of Irish catholic police officers. At the time they were a normal mainly unarmed police force supported by 90+ percent of the population.
I really can't understand how people can't differentiate between bland and tans/auxi's and the normal police force.

Yes or course they were by & large a good force with many Catholics in their ranks, but that logic doesn't apply anymore. Nowadays we must look back and recognise the the RIC & DMP as Nazi like, terrible people who sought the genocide of the Irish people!

Or at least that's how several posters here would have you believe.

irishgrover

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

You probably don’t understand people because you haven’t a clue judging by that.

feel free to correct/educate me with actual facts .....

is_that_so

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

You probably don’t understand people because you haven’t a clue judging by that.

You mean knowing that people use history to be outraged by? Hey, it's an Irish thing.

Sean.3516

Sir Oxman wrote: »

Bruton, a former Taoiseach of this country no less actually called the WoI a civil war last night

"...when we talk of the two civil wars..."
That shows the level of revisionist West Britishness of the laughing donkey and his party.

We should commemorate and celebrate the dissolution of those colonial paramilitary forces in a few years time, not commemorate them as if they were some benign organisation "just following orders"

WoI was a civil war for all intents and purposes. Most wars of independence are. Considering the amount of Irish on Irish violence that took place in this time, how could it not be thought of as a civil war as opposed to simply a war fought against an external power.

Is it even correct to call Britain an external power? I mean we were an integrated part of Great Britain at the time.

is_that_so

The last 3-4 years of the decade were always going to be the most contentious, given the how riven the country was at that time. Everyone will be jostling for their version of the truth.

FrancieBrady

Sean.3516 wrote: »

WoI was a civil war for all intents and purposes. Most wars of independence are. Considering the amount of Irish on Irish violence that took place in this time, how could it not be thought of as a civil war as opposed to simply a war fought against an external power.

Is it even correct to call Britain an external power? I mean we were an integrated part of Great Britain at the time.

Sure Sean, the people voted again and again to be 'integrated' with GB in fair and democratic elections. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

gormdubhgorm

Professor Genius wrote: »

I was born on a Dublin street where the royal drums did beat,
And those loving English feet they tramped all over us,
And each and every night when me father came home tight
He'd invite the neighbors outside with this chorus:
Come out ye Black and Tans, come out and fight me like a man,
Show your wife how you won medals down in Flanders,
Tell them how the IRA made you run like hell away
From the green and lovely lanes of Killashandra.

Nice tune and that written by the Behan's auld fella.
Now Celtic supporters sing it a British football team.

These these confused small minded people who said no to 'foreign games' in Croke Park in Celtic jerseys-

Not the brightest lamps on the street, who possess a narrow minded form of republicanism.

Sean.3516

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Sure Sean, the people voted again and again to be 'integrated' with GB in fair and democratic elections. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Yeah. I get the sarcasm. The obviously didn’t. But they didn’t vote to separate from them either. Electing Sinn Fein to Westminster doesn’t compel the British to acknowledge you or give you independence.

My point is that the WoI was a war of secession. One part of Great Britain attempting to leave the whole and be independent. All this “occupation” rubbish is just Fenian mythology.

whisky_galore

irishgrover wrote: »

I really don't understand the majority of people anymore.
The RIC and DMP were full of Irish catholic police officers. At the time they were a normal mainly unarmed police force supported by 90+ percent of the population.
I really can't understand how people can't differentiate between bland and tans/auxi's and the normal police force.

Shhh! Most people can only understand a black hat/white hat cowboy movie version of history.

Fann Linn

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Yeah. I get the sarcasm. The obviously didn’t. But they didn’t vote to separate from them either. Electing Sinn Fein to Westminster doesn’t compel the British to acknowledge you or give you independence.

My point is that the WoI was a war of secession. One part of Great Britain attempting to leave the whole and be independent. All this “occupation” rubbish is just Fenian mythology.

So it never happened. Right?

FrancieBrady

whisky_galore wrote: »

Shhh! Most people can only understand a black hat/white hat cowboy movie version of history.

And FG's attempt to do it is currently going sour on them. As did their attempt to airbrush what actually happened in 1916 in their disappeared video.

markodaly

Junkyard Tom wrote: »

It's generously benign.

So they should be airbrushed out of history so, as we have done with everything on this Island that is not endorsing Irish Republicanism.

That's just counterfactual shite. If and buts.

Its countering your point. The RIC were on the losing side so they are to be airbrushed from all commemorations.

I guess all IRA men during the civil war should have the treatment given that they were anti-democratic in taking up arms against the Free State and killed Irish men who were upholding the wishes of the Irish people.

Or is it different?

FrancieBrady

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Yeah. I get the sarcasm. The obviously didn’t. But they didn’t vote to separate from them either. Electing Sinn Fein to Westminster doesn’t compel the British to acknowledge you or give you independence.

My point is that the WoI was a war of secession. One part of Great Britain attempting to leave the whole and be independent. All this “occupation” rubbish is just Fenian mythology.

Wow. Just wow.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

So they should be airbrushed out of history so, as we have done on this Island that is not endorsing Irish Republicanism.



Its countering your point. The RIC were on the losing side so they are to be airbrushed from all commemorations.

I guess all IRA men during the civil war should have the treatment given that they were anti-democratic in taking up arms against the Free State and killed Irish men who were upholding the wishes of the Irish people.

Or is it different?

Who is airbrushing them out of history? Their part in our history is well documented and acknowledged.
Not in the misty eyed way you want, but to say they are being airbrushed out is just entirely wrong.

whisky_galore

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And FG's attempt to do it is currently going sour on them. As did their attempt to airbrush what actually happened in 1916 in their disappeared video.

We shall see if it's an election issue when an election comes up or just all wind and piss.

markodaly

jmcc wrote: »

It is as simple as this: Varadkar and Flanagan are traitors to the memory of those who fought for Irish freedom.

Even though this is a recommendation from an all-party committee?

The rest of your post is a reminder of why we won't have a UI within our lifetimes.

is_that_so

markodaly wrote: »

Even though this is a recommendation from an all-party committee?

The rest of your post is a reminder of why we won't have a UI within our lifetimes.

Backed up by this impressive non-partisan lineup.

https://www.decadeofcentenaries.com/expert-group/

markodaly

weldoninhio wrote: »

A zionist taking the side of the land grabbers. Well I never!! :eek:

Say what?

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Even though this is a recommendation from an all-party committee?

The rest of your post is a reminder of why we won't have a UI within our lifetimes.

It is not in FG's gift to deny a UI or unionists or you. The 'people' will decide that one.
And we have seen, the people gave Leo and FG a bounce when they stood up for Irish people north and south and are getting pilloried by elected councils and ordinary people right across the political spectrum when they veer towards the John Bruton wing.

is_that_so

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It is not in FG's gift to deny a UI or unionists or you. The 'people' will decide that one.
And we have seen, the people gave Leo and FG a bounce when they stood up for Irish people north and south and are getting pilloried by elected councils and ordinary people right across the political spectrum when they veer towards the John Bruton wing.

Only if the government of the day agrees on an initial vote and the people could still turn it down.

markodaly

jmcc wrote: »

Rubbish! 50% + 1. That's what it takes.

Yes, and a lovely UI we will have if that happens.... :rolleyes::D:D

The Rape of Lucretia

buried wrote: »

Gway ta f**k with that noise saab, ordinary RIC men stood with those terrorist murderers on those occasions and plenty other ones too. The only people who have "misunderstood" anything is the boot licking self loathing $hitheels in FG who assume we should all do what they want us to do and how we view our actual history. Sorry bluebells, not going to happen.

That is a biased view of history though. Being fully serious, it's indeed true that the winners write the history, but that becomes dangerous if they start truly believing that it is an unbiased truth.
The RIC were the state. The IRA and revolutionaries of 1916 and after were the murderous, terrorist, outlaws. This is indisputable. From a revisionist particular viewpoint its suits to see the reverse. But it does not mean its is the only viewpoint, or even, that its the most accurate reading of the events.

markodaly

mariaalice wrote: »

It would be intersting to see what soemone one like Dermot Ferriter has to say on the matter.

He was on the expert group that recommended this commemoration.

Sean.3516

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Wow. Just wow.

I’m simply stating that the actual facts don’t quite align with the grandiose mythology. Britain didn’t occupy Ireland militarily during this time and hadn’t occupied it for quite some time. There was no martial law in place in the time leading up to the WoI. Yea, there were some military bases but it wasn’t like you had an army marching around suppressing a recently conquered people. The British takeover of Ireland had already taken place centuries ago. Ireland was a politically integrated part of Great Britain with representation at Westminster and all the works.

Therefore the War of Independence was a war of secession and could accurately be described as a civil war.

jmcc

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Yeah. I get the sarcasm. The obviously didn’t. But they didn’t vote to separate from them either. Electing Sinn Fein to Westminster doesn’t compel the British to acknowledge you or give you independence.

My point is that the WoI was a war of secession. One part of Great Britain attempting to leave the whole and be independent. All this “occupation” rubbish is just Fenian mythology.

That's so cluelessly f*cktarded that it isn't in the same universe as "wrong". Ireland was not part of Great Britain. Thinking that Ireland was part of Great Britain is the kind of thing that morons who have no idea of history and geography do. The Irish people had no vote on the Union that created the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. Ireland was occupied. That's why millions of Irish people died from starvation and murder over the centuries. The Unionist John Bruton has been pushing this crap about the WoI being a civil warfor years. He is an idiot. Go learn some Irish history rather than listening to gobsh!tes like Bruton.

Regards...jmcc

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

He was on the expert group that recommended this commemoration.

They didn't 'recommend' this commemoration.

They recommended that 'consideration should be given to the organisation of specific initiatives to commemorate the RIC and DMP'.

That allowed them to also turn down the idea.