RIC and DMP to be commemorated this month

gormdubhgorm

Naggdefy wrote: »

Middle class Dub gets sent to gaelscoill and has superiority attitude vibe.

No gaelscoil required, nor am I middle class. I am just telling it as it is Ireland is a nation of hypocrites and the hypocrisy shows up on occasions like this.
It is piecemeal Irishness. Mock outrage.

Naggdefy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

It is not strawman as you well know - the organisations were inextricably linked.

You know and I know there are many so called republicans who do not speak the Irish language yet protest the likes of this commemoration.
Yet at the same time cheer on PL clubs and say 'we' without a hint of irony.
We all know the likes I am on about.
We have all met those type of 'republican' normally they are on a barstool watching sky sports.

A self congratulatory post. A person's national identity is identified in many ways, not solely language. Bhí an t-adh agat go rugadh do chlann saibhir go leor agus san ait ceart. Sin é.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

They are a continuance of the opression they claim to despise it is not that difficult to make an effort with a language.
It is completely hypocritical. It is not just you but many like you who claim to be Republican because as Pearse said -

Tír gan teanga, tír gan anam


--

Never mind all the cherry picking you do over who are terrorists on top of that - that is another layer of hypocrisy on top of the hypocrisy with the Irish language.

Put the gatling gun down and address the point.

Do you need to speak the language to call attention/or have an opinion on the oppression of the speakers of that language?

gormdubhgorm

KWAG2019 wrote: »

But Ireland does have its own language and it is still alive. Despite the best efforts of British colonialism, West Brit sneering hypocrisy, Irish govt neglect and the out workings of colonial economic impoverishment. Despite the efforts of the DUP/UDA we have an ILA in the north. So there is a lot done and more to do. Welcome to the revolution!

It wasn't because of your effort you can be damn sure of that.
But you keep spouting away and cherry picking bits here and there keeping up a pretense of showing how Irish you are - and how much you hate 'the Brits'.

It is comedy gold.

facehugger99

Funny to see the DUP getting official recognition for Ulster Scots in NI.

Makes the prospect of unification even more unappealing to ROI taxpayers, if that were possible.

Imagine the costs of having three official languages in a unified Ireland.:eek:

Well played DUP.

Shinners have shot themselves in the foot again and were outplayed politically as is usual.

KWAG2019

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

It wasn't because of your effort you can be damn sure of that.
But you keep spouting away and cherry picking bits here and there keeping up a pretense of showing how Irish you are - and how much you hate 'the Brits'.

It is comedy gold.

Lol. You’re amusing. You construct a version of a poster in your head and tilt away at it. Very quixotic posts.

You know where I got the details of the RIC don’t you?

FrancieBrady

facehugger99 wrote: »

Funny to see the DUP getting official recognition for Ulster Scots in NI.

Makes the prospect of unification even more unappealing to ROI taxpayers, if that were possible.

Is there any point asking for your data on this?

Naggdefy

At the end of the day I'm thrilled that Irishmen and Irish women united to stop this commemoration nonsense in such large numbers, voicing their opinion across many platforms.

They weren't fooled by the PC bs, or mention that they were postponing a UI.

A United Ireland at what cost? That we were to change everything about our identity to placate a sullen minority who have never treated an opposing tradition with any respect?

Our Constitution is democratic, no longer Home Rule is Rome rule. Join us as we are, a nation of equals, but don't try and change the fundamentals of our state.

KWAG2019

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Is there any point asking for your data on this?

You need to put it in Ulster Scots:
Is there any point asking for your data on this?

Naggdefy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

No gaelscoil required, nor am I middle class. I am just telling it as it is Ireland is a nation of hypocrites and the hypocrisy shows up on occasions like this.
It is piecemeal Irishness. Mock outrage.

You think you define Irishness? Because you've the Irish language.

The people said no to the black and tans 100 years ago and today. Call them what you want but to me not wanting to commemorate a foreign oppressor is a badge of nationhood. Every bit as equal as the teanga.

KWAG2019

And as we are talking about the RIC/DMP let’s, again no doubt, acknowledge all those who risked their lives to support the IRA and supplied information to advance our freedom. And all those who resigned and refused to serve.

The RIC had reached its own epiphany and many woke up to what the reality of their policing was.

FrancieBrady

KWAG2019 wrote: »

You need to put it in Ulster Scots:
Is there any point asking for your data on this?

The actual translation is funnier.


Is thair onie point axting fur yer data on this.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Put the gatling gun down and address the point.

Do you need to speak the language to call attention/or have an opinion on the oppression of the speakers of that language?

You need to make some sort of effort with it at least otherwise you are a hypocrite as many of those who focus only on one side of 'opression' have a certian view of what Irishness is. Which leads to this RIC/DMP protest

Yet many - have NOT -

Made any effort with the Irish language

AND -

Continue the cultural appropriation from Britain - sport PL league teams (say we) , follow British soaps and TV shows, music etc

They are doing more damage to Irish culture than the British ever did in my view.

Which leads me back to the irony of how in Solohedbeg 1919 there was an Irish speaking RIC man from Mayo (Constables James McDonnell) shot dead with his colleague (gloriously outnumbered 2 to 8 by the way)

The irony is not lost on me one iota as the present Irish people today have the hypocrisy to claim to be against the RIC as they were oppressors.

Yet they culturally oppress themselves today with neglect of the Irish language and immersion in British pastimes (soaps PL teams, UK reality tv shows and so on, UK newspapers).

Self cultural oppression is far, far worse than anything the British have done in the past. You only have to do a quick search on the Irish language on boards to find this out.

But it looks like no one sees the irony except me?

KWAG2019

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The actual translation is funnier.


Is thair onie point axting fur yer data on this.

I could apply for one of the translation jobs after unity. Not qualified in Irish though.:D

Bishop of hope

facehugger99 wrote: »

Funny to see the DUP getting official recognition for Ulster Scots in NI.

Makes the prospect of unification even more unappealing to ROI taxpayers, if that were possible.

Imagine the costs of having three official languages in a unified Ireland.:eek:

Well played DUP.

Shinners have shot themselves in the foot again and were outplayed politically as is usual.

They all shot themselves in the foot, the recent election showed that.
The people of NI of every community were sick and tired of both of them and their language spat, they wanted their Govt and and services being funded back.
Neither language was important to either community really, as they will still talk their version of English

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

You need to make some sort of effort with it at least otherwise you are a hypocrite as many of those who focus only on one side of 'opression' have a certian view of what Irishness is. Which leads to this RIC/DMP protest

Yet many - have NOT -

Made any effort with the Irish language

AND -

Continue the cultural appropriation from Britain - sport PL league teams (say we) , follow British soaps and TV shows, music etc

They are doing more damage to Irish culture than the British ever did in my view.

Which leads me back to the irony of how in Solohedbeg 1919 there was an Irish speaking RIC man from Mayo (Constables James McDonnell) shot dead with his colleague (gloriously outnumbered 2 to 8 by the way)

The irony is not lost on me one iota as the present Irish people today have the hypocrisy to claim to be against the RIC as they were oppressors.

Yet they culturally oppress themselves today with neglect of the Irish language and immersion in British pastimes (soaps PL teams, UK reality tv shows and so on, UK newspapers).

Self cultural oppression is far, far worse than anything the British have done in the past. You only have to do a quick search on the Irish language on boards to find this out.

But it looks like no one sees the irony except me?

Your definition of 'culture' is isolationist and confined and anti-modern.

A confident culture can take in things from outside and remain culturally distinct.

Britishness has lost it's confidence at the present time imo. Doing what you do and wanting to be isolationist. At it's most basic vulgar level expressed in the hate and bile at an American who dared to marry their prince.

gormdubhgorm

Naggdefy wrote: »

At the end of the day I'm thrilled that Irishmen and Irish women united to stop this commemoration nonsense in such large numbers, voicing their opinion across many platforms.

They weren't fooled by the PC bs, or mention that they were postponing a UI.

A United Ireland at what cost? That we were to change everything about our identity to placate a sullen minority who have never treated an opposing tradition with any respect?

Our Constitution is democratic, no longer Home Rule is Rome rule. Join us as we are, a nation of equals, but don't try and change the fundamentals of our state.

Yep many of the same Irish people who will go back to pub and say we for PL without any irony - meaning Liverpool/Man United/Arsenal/Man City.

And those who somehow have tricked themselves despite viewing themselves as proud Irishmen that it does not include Saoradh/Real IRA - just because.

Many will continue with thier attitude to the Irish language not attempting to improve it, not attempting to speak it.
But have convinced themsleves they are great Irishmen all the same.

Without realsiing it these Irish people are doing 'The tans' work for them that they claim to be against it is a cultural occupation of the mind.

Ireland will never be free until they are ready to face up to the nuance of history warts and all. And the people have to be willing to be immersed in real Irish culture not just talk of the gun and the bullet.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

They all shot themselves in the foot, the recent election showed that.
The people of NI of every community were sick and tired of both of them and their language spat, they wanted their Govt and and services being funded back.
Neither language was important to either community really, as they will still talk their version of English

It's unfair to either side to see the problems as solely Irish language related. The GFA as a process was stagnating for a long long time before the breakdown.

I think in time people will come to see the things posted in this list (on another thread) as being important achievements and advances.

Same sex marriage legalised
Abortion legislation.
Irish language recognised and protected.
The Good Friday Agreement protected from the worst of Brexit.
Majority of MPs are no longer Unionist (as a result of co-operation between the middleground Alliance Party and the nationalist/republican parties)

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Your definition of 'culture' is isolationist and confined and anti-modern.

A confident culture can take in things from outside and remain culturally distinct.

Britishness has lost it's confidence at the present time imo. Doing what you do and wanting to be isolationist. At it's most basic vulgar level expressed in the hate and bile at an American who dared to marry their prince.

Not true it is pure hypocrisy -

1) Speak the English language as the mother tongue

2) Complete Immersion in British culture

3) Odd attitude to the Irish language - it is dead etc no point in it, Brits fault etc

4) 'Protest' against the RIC/DMP commemorations

5) Imply that all RIC were scum etc so people can pretend to be nationalist/Irish

Yep it is a great country.... how exactly is Ireland culturally distinct by the way?

Tír gan teanga, tír gan anam....

Naggdefy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Yep many of the same Irish people who will go back to pub and say we for PL without any irony - meaning Liverpool/Man United/Arsenal/Man City.

And those who somehow have tricked themseives despite viewing them as Irishmen that it does not include Saoradh/Real IRA just because.

Many will continue with thier attitude to the Irish language not attempting to improve it, not attempting to speak it.
But have convinced themsleves they are great Irishmen all the same.

Without realsiing it these Irish people are doing 'The tans' work for them that they claim to be against it is a cultural occupation of the mind.

Ireland will never be free until they are ready to face up to the nuance of history warts and all. And the people have to be willing to be immersed in real Irish culture not just talk of the gun and the bullet.

Simplistic argument. 1.5 million Irish went through Liverpool between 1845 and 1865 alone. Huge Irish roots. In 1950 the 3rd most Irish city (Irish born) after Dublin and New York. Same with Manchester.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Not true it is pure hypocrisy -

1) Speak the English language as the mother tongue

2) Complete Immersion in British culture

3) Odd attitude to the Irish language - it is dead etc no point in it, Brits fault etc

4) 'Protest' against the RIC/DMP commemorations

5) Imply that all RIC were scum etc so people can pretend to be nationalist/Irish

Yep it is a great country....

I'm watching rugby here...am I not an Irish man?

gormdubhgorm

Naggdefy wrote: »

Simplistic argument. 1.5 million Irish went through Liverpool between 1845 and 1865 alone. Huge Irish roots. In 1950 the 3rd most Irish city (Irish born) after Dublin and New York. Same with Manchester.

So that is an excuse for some fella on barstool who claims to be a republican (giving out about this RIC/DMP to not see any irony in identifying with a foreign English team he has rarely set foot in - except at most once a month with Ryanair.
Many only recently because they started winning like Chelsea/Man City
I can see right through bollixology like your above post.

Naggdefy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Not true it is pure hypocrisy -

1) Speak the English language as the mother tongue

2) Complete Immersion in British culture

3) Odd attitude to the Irish language - it is dead etc no point in it, Brits fault etc

4) 'Protest' against the RIC/DMP commemorations

5) Imply that all RIC were scum etc so people can pretend to be nationalist/Irish

Yep it is a great country.... how exactly is Ireland culturally distinct by the way?

Tír gan teanga, tír gan anam....

And Britain's head of state is descended from a long line of German lineage, a Saxe Coburg, until WW1 name change in 1917. God Save the German queen... strange country.

Is the US not an independent country as she's gan teanga?

See it's easy make up rules and exceptions to suit your argument.

Naggdefy

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

So that is an excuse for some fella on barstool who claims to be a republican (giving out about this RIC/DMP to not see any irony in identifying with a foreign English team he has rarely set foot in - except at most once a month with Ryanair.
Many only recently because they started winning like Chelsea/Man City
I can see right through bollixology like your above post.

The matches are on tv and higher standard than LoI. We watched Italian football in the 90s. You have players from across the world.

Mr. More Irish than anyone else.

So you speak Irish, follow Dublin GAA and give lectures on how to be Irish? You're a pain in the (rhymes with roll)

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

So that is an excuse for some fella on barstool who claims to be a republican (giving out about this RIC/DMP to not see any irony in identifying with a foreign English team he has rarely set foot in - except at most once a month with Ryanair.
Many only recently because they started winning like Chelsea/Man City
I can see right through bollixology like your above post.

What has the enjoyment of sport got to do with definitions of republicanism or national culture?

Are all the Irish works of literature conceived in and written in English NOT a part of the Irish cultural canon?

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I'm watching rugby here...am I not an Irish man?

If are culturally oppressed your Irishness in your mind to levels of hypocrisy then you are not.

If you really immersed your self in Irish culture than you are improving your senses of self and Irishness.

Much like Dev who was great fan of Rugby - but also learnt/improved his Irish partly because he fancied his Irish teacher but still...

I cannot accept the contraction that many who are protesting this RIC/DMP are completely immersed in English/British culture, yet neglected thier own Irish culture.
It is a real colony mindset long after the so called 'oppressors' have gone.

Naggdefy

Get your DNA tested Dubhgorm. See what you are.

I'm 98% Irish and 2% Scot on ancestry. Fairly Irish.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

If are culturally oppressed your Irishness in your mind to levels of hypocrisy then you are not.

If you really immersed your self in Irish culture than you are improving your senses of self and Irishness.

Much like Dev who was great fan of Rugby - but also learnt/improved his Irish partly because he fancied his Irish teacher but still...

I cannot accept the contraction that many who are protesting this RIC/DMP are completely immersed in English/British culture, yet neglected thier own Irish culture.
It is a real colony mindset long after the so called 'oppressors' have gone.

So the only valid criticism of the RIC/DMP can come from those who are completely immersed in your version of Irishness?

Is that what you are saying?

KWAG2019

Naggdefy wrote: »

And Britain's head of state is descended from a long line of German lineage, a Saxe Coburg, until WW1 name change in 1917. God Save the German queen... strange country.

Is the US not an independent country as she's gan teanga?

See it's easy make up rules and exceptions to suit your argument.

It’s sad that they gave up Battenberg. Probably their greatest achievement having a very nice cake named after them. I’m not in the least conflicted having it with my tea.

FrancieBrady

I'd love to hear your answer to this question gormdubh.

Are all the Irish works of literature conceived in and written in English NOT a part of the Irish cultural canon?