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Snide remarks from parent
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College educated in agriculture is what I mean, they’d be hard pressed to get an alternative line of work, not impossible but extremely difficult as they would have no alternative work experience. Perhaps nowadays it wouldn’t be regarded as third level but when they qualified it would have been. I hope that explains it a little better.
Also v difficult to challenge a man who has a significant amount of control over things and has my mother in a big predicament - she can’t please everyone.
We’re between a rock and a hard place.
If your siblings want independence, they can upskill. They can do a night course. They can work on other farms. They can go for other jobs within the agriculture industry. There are jobs out there that don't require college education, nothing stopping them going for something in that line. It's up to them if they want to change their situation.
He doesn't appear to have a significant amount of control. Your mother determines how things are split for inheritance, you said that earlier. The family allow him to control by not challenging him. What would he do if your siblings upped sticks in the morning and got jobs elsewhere? Very little he could do about it.
You are living at home and all you need to do is save enough money to get into a house share and you can leave. There's no such thing as lack of choice.0 -
I don’t see why it’s relevant but they’re all married and we all are college educated. No one would stay over it’s not that it’s a problem but the need for it would never have arisen. As for same rooms, that would be weird! Well for me it would be anyways.
Oh I thought ye were early 20s or something
They presumably have their own houses then and can switch off from him at 5 or 6 pm so
I wouldn't worry too much then,other than encouraging the 2 non favourites to be thinking of doing this business on their own at some point
If it's a farm,maybe go over to the farming forum here and ask for opinions
The situation ye are in is not unique
You've lots of good advice
Personally I think your father does need a right toe up the hole
Your brothers need to be always looking at their options because your parents won't be around forever and if your mum goes before your Dad,there could be big changes and none that ye might like0 -
rainbowtrout wrote: »If your siblings want independence, they can upskill. They can do a night course. They can work on other farms. They can go for other jobs within the agriculture industry. There are jobs out there that don't require college education, nothing stopping them going for something in that line. It's up to them if they want to change their situation.
He doesn't appear to have a significant amount of control. Your mother determines how things are split for inheritance, you said that earlier. The family allow him to control by not challenging him. What would he do if your siblings upped sticks in the morning and got jobs elsewhere? Very little he could do about it.
You are living at home and all you need to do is save enough money to get into a house share and you can leave. There's no such thing as lack of choice.
I know all this but unfortunately life isn’t always as clear cut when you are in the midst of it all.
Of course we could all upskill and get different jobs but that’s not the problem the problem is the lousey comments. I didn’t ever seek advice on how to change a man that won’t change, I came looking for advice on how to best to verbally respond to his comments and attitude.
There’s to too much at stake for people to just up and leave, that’s madness and coming from a hugely rural background would never in a million years happen.
And yes it all down to my mother but imagine having to try and fairly divide something that can’t be fairly divided, imagine having to live with a man for the next 20 years having made decisions that don’t suit his thinking, you actually can’t imagine the huge strain it brings. It’s on us all and yes we could all walk away but I wasn’t brought up to abandon people despite the relief it might bring, I’d never have it on my own conscience.
Look all I sought was advice on the comments not on changing things that I know won’t change.0 -
Sorry OP, have you not posted about spending very very extensive amounts on your wedding? Would you not invest this money into moving out of your parents house, and away from your father’s direct control?
Ah yes working non that. As for paying for wedding there’s a reason I still reside there!0 -
I know all this but unfortunately life isn’t always as clear cut when you are in the midst of it all.
Of course we could all upskill and get different jobs but that’s not the problem the problem is the lousey comments. I didn’t ever seek advice on how to change a man that won’t change, I came looking for advice on how to best to verbally respond to his comments and attitude.
There’s to too much at stake for people to just up and leave, that’s madness and coming from a hugely rural background would never in a million years happen.
And yes it all down to my mother but imagine having to try and fairly divide something that can’t be fairly divided, imagine having to live with a man for the next 20 years having made decisions that don’t suit his thinking, you actually can’t imagine the huge strain it brings. It’s on us all and yes we could all walk away but I wasn’t brought up to abandon people despite the relief it might bring, I’d never have it on my own conscience.
Look all I sought was advice on the comments not on changing things that I know won’t change.
Theres a few things advised that you could say to him in walking away but not engaging
You absolutely must ignore him otherwise
As for not being able to change things that won't change,that's actually a self imposed constraint
The only thing ,the absolute only thing lacking is the courage to steer away
I am a farmer btw
Being able to flick the switch turning on the absolute 'I dont give a fuck' attitude to a sh1t inheritance situation is rare but you need it or 3 out of the 4 of ye are going to end up with a life wasted,waiting for what you'll never get
Anyway I'll shut up now0 -
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Theres a few things advised that you could say to him in walking away but not engaging
You absolutely must ignore him otherwise
As for not being able to change things that won't change,that's actually a self imposed constraint
The only thing ,the absolute only thing lacking is the courage to steer away
I am a farmer btw
Being able to flick the switch turning on the absolute 'I dont give a fuck' attitude to a sh1t inheritance situation is rare but you need it or 3 out of the 4 of ye are going to end up with a life wasted,waiting for what you'll never get
Anyway I'll shut up now
Thanks, completely agree but I suppose the situation is more unusual than what I’ve already outlined And I don’t want to really get into it other than we will all get something but it can’t be fairly divided. hence one parent favouring one child above all others as it his easy option. While the other can’t sleep because she will have to choose and she can’t.
total minefield but appreciate your knowledge and advice.0 -
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your father provided their education, houses, work and dinner everyday. They are arguing over who gets the farm when he's dead. I think your father may be angry and disappointed.0
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Is it that your parents are paying for your wedding? Is that why you choose not to rock the boat?
I live there because I’m saving to build and I like the fact I can save more this way. As for rocking the boat I don’t feel the need to. I just wanted some advice on how to deal with sarky comments not on how to change the situation.
The others work there so see him every day. I’m the one who doesn’t like his little comments and wanted suggestion on replies back, not sure if the others pay much heed tbh.0 -
Alrigghtythen wrote: »your father provided their education, houses, work and dinner everyday. They are arguing over who gets the farm when he's dead. I think your father may be angry and disappointed.
Your probably right but I’ve yet to see him cook a dinner! He has his inheritance sorted it’s not as clear cut as that. Why favour one when you have more than that btw? Also no ones arguing at all other than the parents. we’ve been asked what way we’d like it to work out and he’s just very one sided as he likes an easy life.0 -
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Alrigghtythen wrote: »your father provided their education, houses, work and dinner everyday. They are arguing over who gets the farm when he's dead. I think your father may be angry and disappointed.
Its normal in farming so I doubt it
If 3 sons are working the farm,we can assume its large enough to support a proper strategy of setting the sons up as independent farmers within the farm,putting them in a position to branch out more on their own by renting or buying land of their own
Rather than no proper planning for the future at all
Anyhow,I'm imposing my gag order on myself now,I've too many opinions on this and the OP is only really looking for general anti toxic environment advice
That's done I think0 -
I'm a firm believer in the old saying "if you've something to say, say it". You probably won't get any support from your siblings but I've never regretted letting loose on the few occasions I felt it was required. I'd also be interested to hear the opinion of the favoured sibling. As others have said, make a plan to get out and move on, you've only 1 life so make the most of it.
Good luck....0 -
I live there because I’m saving to build and I like the fact I can save more this way. As for rocking the boat I don’t feel the need to. I just wanted some advice on how to deal with sarky comments not on how to change the situation.
The others work there so see him every day. I’m the one who doesn’t like his little comments and wanted suggestion on replies back, not sure if the others pay much heed tbh.
Ok, but you’ve posted about spending 5k on a photographer for your wedding. Actually you posted about booking it, but not paying for it. So something isn’t adding up for me.
Of course you don’t have to answer, but are you building on your parents land, and they’re paying for the wedding, and you’re now getting a hard time with the comments from your father because he now feels that he has more of a ‘say’ in your life than before?
Short answer is that it seems to be in his eyes that if you or your siblings accept money / assets, then he can speak as he chooses. I highly doubt someone like him is going to change, either through the voice of reason or a zinger retort. That’s why I’m asking what you can do about moving out of your family home and away from him.0 -
Ok, but you’ve posted about spending 5k on a photographer for your wedding. Actually you posted about booking it, but not paying for it. So something isn’t adding up for me.
Of course you don’t have to answer, but are you building on your parents land, and they’re paying for the wedding, and you’re now getting a hard time with the comments from your father because he now feels that he has more of a ‘say’ in your life than before?
Short answer is that it seems to be in his eyes that if you or your siblings accept money / assets, then he can speak as he chooses. I highly doubt someone like him is going to change, either through the voice of reason or a zinger retort. That’s why I’m asking what you can do about moving out of your family home and away from him.
Just to point out the comments aren’t made about me theyre about my siblings, the less favoured one. I’ll be gone eventually but I’ll still have to listen to the drama going on. Hope that clears that up for you. The assets arnt solely his either which we know really irritates him so not very fair for him to favour one over others when he doesn’t have final say. So he plays the ass to my mother and the rest of us when he’s not getting his own way.
As for photographer yes booked And not paid for but then there two of us getting married so we can figure that together, but that’s not really relevant to the matter here.0 -
As for photographer yes booked And not paid for but then there two of us getting married so we can figure that together, but that’s not really relevant to the matter here.
But it is symptomatic of the situation whether or not you can see it. You are benefitting from living under his roof for free / lower rent than you would be paying if you were renting independently.
So while you might not have been handed a bundle of cash to pay for your wedding, you are able to pay for it because you live with your parents and your reduced living costs. So your father probably does feel he can say what he likes as you all are beholden to him. You all financially benefit one way or the other and so he sticks his oar in, and you are all putting up with it for those benefits. Sometimes you have to go your own way even if it costs you more.0 -
rainbowtrout wrote: »But it is symptomatic of the situation whether or not you can see it. You are benefitting from living under his roof for free / lower rent than you would be paying if you were renting independently.
So while you might not have been handed a bundle of cash to pay for your wedding, you are able to pay for it because you live with your parents and your reduced living costs. So your father probably does feel he can say what he likes as you all are beholden to him. You all financially benefit one way or the other and so he sticks his oar in, and you are all putting up with it for those benefits. Sometimes you have to go your own way even if it costs you more.
Never really thought about it like that for us it’s the norm to just be at home as it helps to save for future. Too late now for me to wind that clock back anyways and I may as well stick it out for the time being.
It’s really not as simple as “going your own way” and I know many will disagree with me but there’s a lot involved in it. Anyways thanks all the same.0 -
well if you insist that all ye have is tied to the man's favour, then the only advice is to suck it up tbh0
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Ok, but you’ve posted about spending 5k on a photographer for your wedding. Actually you posted about booking it, but not paying for it. So something isn’t adding up for me.
Of course you don’t have to answer, but are you building on your parents land, and they’re paying for the wedding, and you’re now getting a hard time with the comments from your father because he now feels that he has more of a ‘say’ in your life than before?
Short answer is that it seems to be in his eyes that if you or your siblings accept money / assets, then he can speak as he chooses. I highly doubt someone like him is going to change, either through the voice of reason or a zinger retort. That’s why I’m asking what you can do about moving out of your family home and away from him.
It stuck in my head so I checked. You have a budget of 5k for a photographer, 5k for a dress, and 8 to 10k for a ring. What are on earth are you doing living under your Father’s doorstep?
If you genuinely have 20k to spare, could you share your pics/ring/dress money, to save your siblings day to day life as in they can have a life, without your father’s voice. As you’ve said that you don’t get criticised.
And this is without ‘saving’ to build your house, and also perhaps (unanswered question) you building on your parents land, and them paying for your wedding.
Of course you’re not obliged to furnish any details. But I do think it’s very pertinent as to who is funding your lifestyle, and how that relates to comments that your father makes. It doesn’t excuse his comments - but I think you could at least make a stand and remove yourself from his ‘exchange’ of views re providing money/assets = his control.0 -
It stuck in my head so I checked. You have a budget of 5k for a photographer, 5k for a dress, and 8 to 10k for a ring. What are on earth are you doing living under your Father’s doorstep?
If you genuinely have 20k to spare, could you share your pics/ring/dress money, to save your siblings day to day life as in they can have a life, without your father’s voice. As you’ve said that you don’t get criticised.
And this without ‘saving’ to build your house, and also perhaps (unanswered question) you building on your parents land, and them paying for your wedding.
Of course you’re not obliged to furnish any details. But I do think it’s very pertinent as to who is funding your lifestyle, and how that relates to comments that your father makes. It doesn’t excuse his comments - but I think you could at least make a stand and remove yourself from his ‘exchange’ of money/assets = his control.
I never said I had 20k to spare? I don’t and indeed had I started saving earlier perhaps I could move out but for the time being I won’t be. V traditional family and I’m not funding the wedding. Bit late now for me to backtrack. I might as well stick it out for the time being.
His comments/attitude are related to the fact he is upset that all his money can’t go to one child. My costs don’t really come into it as a problem for anyone.
He’ll be rid of me soon enough so I might as well stick it out now so that he can’t give everything to one person if that makes sense.0 -
I never said I had 20k to spare? I don’t and indeed had I started saving earlier perhaps I could move out but for the time being I won’t be. V traditional family and I’m not funding the wedding. Bit late now for me to backtrack. I might as well stick it out for the time being.
His comments/attitude are related to the fact he is upset that all his money can’t go to one child. My costs don’t really come into it as a problem for anyone.
He’ll be rid of me soon enough so I might as well stick it out now so that he can’t give everything to one person if that makes sense.
I think the point, which you are missing again is that you are spending well above what the average person spends on those items for a wedding. You can spend what you like, but the vast majority only spend a fraction of the 20k you are budgeting for a photographer, ring and dress. I'd say the majority probably not spend more than 7-8k on all three of those and with 12k to spare you would have more than enough to spare to live out of home/ have deposit for house.0 -
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I never said I had 20k to spare? I don’t and indeed had I started saving earlier perhaps I could move out but for the time being I won’t be. V traditional family and I’m not funding the wedding. Bit late now for me to backtrack. I might as well stick it out for the time being.
His comments/attitude are related to the fact he is upset that all his money can’t go to one child. My costs don’t really come into it as a problem for anyone.
He’ll be rid of me soon enough so I might as well stick it out now so that he can’t give everything to one person if that makes sense.
We’ll have to agree to disagree there, I’d very much say you've 20k to spare if you’re spending that amount of money on non—essential wedding stuff. Especially as it’s not your money.
Maybe that’s your ‘share’ of money from your father, as opposed to you siblings who work for him. In some ways you’re actually very lucky compared to your siblings - you get a sizeable amount of money without it being an endless part of your day to day life.
I know you’re saying that’s different from your father’s attitude re money, but you seem to be blithely accepting a large amount of money from him, and believing that there’s no consequences. He’s proven time and again that there are consequences to accepting money from him - not just the massive amount for your wedding day, but also you can be sure that he’ll contrast and compare that to your siblings. I think you’re being very naive in thinking that accepting money, from a man who sounds very old school and all about money, is a ‘free gift’.
I can’t see any way to reduce his comments until you and your siblings stop accepting him funding your lifestyle. All I can see is take the money and tune out his comments, or stand on your own two feet and don’t take his money and call him on his comments/attitude.0 -
rainbowtrout wrote: »I think the point, which you are missing again is that you are spending well above what the average person spends on those items for a wedding. You can spend what you like, but the vast majority only spend a fraction of the 20k you are budgeting for a photographer, ring and dress. I'd say the majority probably not spend more than 7-8k on all three of those and with 12k to spare you would have more than enough to spare to live out of home/ have deposit for house.
I’m not missing the point at all, you don’t seem to understand that I won’t be given that sort of money to live out of home unless I am married. Of course I could move out but I might as well make the most of it now.
The cost isn’t really relevant to the problem as much as you might think it is. 20k is nothing in the grand scheme of things.0 -
So you have to get married to get your ‘cut’, which you’re trying to maximise, of which 20k is nothing.
I’m out.0 -
We’ll have to agree to disagree there, I’d very much say you've 20k to spare if you’re spending that amount of money on non—essential wedding stuff. Especially as it’s not your money.
Maybe that’s your ‘share’ of money from your father, as opposed to you siblings who work for him. In some ways you’re actually very lucky compared to your siblings - you get a sizeable amount of money without it being an endless part of your day to day life.
I know you’re saying that’s different from your father’s attitude re money, but you seem to be blithely accepting a large amount of money from him, and believing that there’s no consequences. He’s proven time and again that there are consequences to accepting money from him - not just the massive amount for your wedding day, but also you can be sure that he’ll contrast and compare that to your siblings. I think you’re being very naive in thinking that accepting money, from a man who sounds very old school and all about money, is a ‘free gift’.
I can’t see any way to reduce his comments until you and your siblings stop accepting him funding your lifestyle. All I can see is take the money and tune out his comments, or stand on your own two feet and don’t take his money and call him on his comments/attitude.
You’ve lost me tbh. If you really want me to complicate the situation it’s actually my siblings who are paying for the wedding not him. See complicated! Perhaps that’s why he is so sour all the time that we are wasting away the money he wants one child to have. Of course I’ll accept what I can I’d be silly not to but I won’t get anything if I don’t live there and get married.
His comments are aimed at siblings who all work equally as hard for him but he still wants only one to have everything!
So yea I’ll put up with it while I have to.0 -
I've followed this thread from the start but am finding it very difficult to follow/understand, basically it appears most if not all siblings are living at home, I would like to know what age ranges they are, seems odd in this day and age, you haven't moved out, you can't change old habits, i.e. your dad's behaviour but you can change how you deal with it either by moving out and living independently or else learning to ignore his comments.You’ve lost me tbh. If you really want me to complicate the situation it’s actually my siblings who are paying for the wedding not him. See complicated! Perhaps that’s why he is so sour all the time that we are wasting away the money he wants one child to have. Of course I’ll accept what I can I’d be silly not to but I won’t get anything if I don’t live there and get married.
His comments are aimed at siblings who all work equally as hard for him but he still wants only one to have everything!
So yea I’ll put up with it while I have to.0 -
I’m not missing the point at all, you don’t seem to understand that I won’t be given that sort of money to live out of home unless I am married. Of course I could move out but I might as well make the most of it now.
The cost isn’t really relevant to the problem as much as you might think it is. 20k is nothing in the grand scheme of things.
20k is a massive amount of money. If you had to pay it yourself you'd know that. It's a deposit for a house in pretty much any part of the country outside Dublin.
You've made your trade. You're willing to put up with snide remarks in exchange for money. Other people would prefer to have a healthier living environment and forego the money which comes with conditions.0 -
OP this sounds like such a sad and toxic home environment. You've acknowledged that you've chosen to stay until after after the wedding and that you are not the one who is subjected to the snide remarks. You are lucky therefore and can choose to ignore or respond. This is saddening that for money or land or whatever, no one seems to be defending " the least preferred one". I agree that usually ignoring a toxic persons behaviour can be the wisest course of action but not if it becomes relentless and at the expense of others. Also OP consider when you have children and they observe this behaviour... this is not normal. Considering the impact on my own children was the biggest motivation to move away from a toxic parent and a codependent enabling one. Sorry that you are planning a wedding in such a toxic home setting... nothing is worth living in such a setting and no matter how bulletproof we think we are, it does affect us. Chat to your siblings, support each other and decide to make a stand on the bullying.0
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I've followed this thread from the start but am finding it very difficult to follow/understand, basically it appears most if not all siblings are living at home, I would like to know what age ranges they are, seems odd in this day and age, you haven't moved out, you can't change old habits, i.e. your dad's behaviour but you can change how you deal with it either by moving out and living independently or else learning to ignore his comments.
I’m the only one living at home, the others work at home/have meals there but are married with children and live elsewhere in homes provided for them.
I know people won’t understand the situation and will think it’s strange I didn’t come looking for advice on that.
Bottom line is yes I will move out eventually but the comments and negative atmosphere will still remain. I just wanted advice on how to deal with that and help my mother and others who are treated badly because she is unable to fairly divide her assets.
For the most part it’s fine and I’ll willingly put up with it for another while.0 -
Fleetwoodmac wrote: »OP this sounds like such a sad and toxic home environment. You've acknowledged that you've chosen to stay until after after the wedding and that you are not the one who is subjected to the snide remarks. You are lucky therefore and can choose to ignore or respond. This is saddening that for money or land or whatever, no one seems to be defending " the least preferred one". I agree that usually ignoring a toxic persons behaviour can be the wisest course of action but not if it becomes relentless and at the expense of others. Also OP consider when you have children and they observe this behaviour... this is not normal. Considering the impact on my own children was the biggest motivation to move away from a toxic parent and a codependent enabling one. Sorry that you are planning a wedding in such a toxic home setting... nothing is worth living in such a setting and no matter how bulletproof we think we are, it does affect us. Chat to your siblings, support each other and decide to make a stand on the bullying.
Thanks you for being understanding and non judgemental. Appreciate it greatly.0 -
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I never said I had 20k to spare? I don’t and indeed had I started saving earlier perhaps I could move out but for the time being I won’t be. V traditional family and I’m not funding the wedding. Bit late now for me to backtrack. I might as well stick it out for the time being.
His comments/attitude are related to the fact he is upset that all his money can’t go to one child. My costs don’t really come into it as a problem for anyone.
He’ll be rid of me soon enough so I might as well stick it out now so that he can’t give everything to one person if that makes sense.
All his money is not going to one child. You are getting your cut too.0
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