When does the work party stop?

So given the much publicised issue at a Christmas party recently I've been wondering.



Work parties are co sidered an extension of the work place, so behaviour there can be used as reasons for disciplinary action.

When does is stop being a work event though? When the dinner is over, free bar ends, venue changes from private function facility?



I mean if the party is in a public venue and the work drinks are finished, what's considered the end of the party?

Alrigghtythen

When you go home

punisher5112

Don't go, then you don't have to worry about him much of an arse you would be....

Hercule Poirot

My opinion is when you leave the venue, even if you roll onto another pub/club, you are no longer at a work function

I don't think there's a legal definition though

punisher5112

punisher5112 wrote: »

Don't go, then you don't have to worry about him much of an arse you would be....

I don't, generally. Previous role it was part of the job description (literally)

punisher5112

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't, generally. Previous role it was part of the job description (literally)

Best advice would be if one can't handle drink or they become a little too chatty, go on the 0% alcohol drinks or lucozade .

Hercule Poirot

Hercule Poirot wrote: »

My opinion is when you leave the venue, even if you roll onto another pub/club, you are no longer at a work function

I don't think there's a legal definition though

Then
you've issue where someone stays in a public venue with an unrelated group

punisher5112

punisher5112 wrote: »

Best advice would be if one can't handle drink or they become a little too chatty, go on the 0% alcohol drinks or lucozade .

Yeah but that's not what I'm wondering, rather the blurred line between a work event and when it's personal time.

Alrigghtythen

Alrigghtythen wrote: »

When you go home

Makes no sense if I join a private grouping of non work related friends though

Pauliedragon

It seems like a legal minefield. I remember some lawyer a while back (I could be remembering wrong) saying put an end time on the the invite. So if it says party is from 7-11pm anything that happens after that is no longer the companies issue liability wise. Maybe the same goes if an employee acts the fool after 11. There was a thread on this recently some guy got in trouble after his party.

Alrigghtythen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Makes no sense if I join a private grouping of non work related friends though

In that case all your colleagues have gone home so I would say the party is over if you're the only one left.

Addle

They put an end time on work functions where I am, say 1o pm or midnight.
The party doesn’t stop at those times, but it stops being a work party.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Addle wrote: »

They put an end time on work functions where I am, say 1o pm or midnight.
The party doesn’t stop at those times, but it stops being a work party.

If you get hammered and punch your boss in the face it's a work event and you can be fired no matter what the time is.

Mrs OBumble

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

If you get hammered and punch your boss in the face it's a work event and you can be fired no matter what the time is.

This.

Any time you are with work colleagues is a work event - no matter where or when or who organised it.

Manach

One could argue that unless there is specific mention in the party invite, then the event ends once the various people leave the venue. This is based on my reading of Honeyball's employment text, which indicates taht outside the normal duties, hours and location of work, there needs to be an elementment of reasonableness as well as clarity as to when a work event ends. Hence the onus is on the employer to make this known.

Dayo93

My job schedules us for party with a start and end time in mail

NUTLEY BOY

FYI another Christmas Party thread
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058038911

u140acro3xs7dm

I would say it is when you leave the venue. Often you will have colleagues staying out all night and heading on to a late bar, this would be a grey area.

Personally, once the food is over, I'm looking for a way out. While I trust myself not to go around causing trouble, I can't trust anybody else that's consumed alcohol, and if I'm not there, I can't be involved, or even be a witness to any altercation.

NUTLEY BOY

Offhand, I know of no case law that brings an office Christmas party within the scope of being a place of employment with it's concomitant duties of care.

That is no surprise given that there is legal uncertainty as to what actually constitutes the existence of a master-servant relationship.
Each case actually turns on specific circumstances.
Generalisations to the effect that an employer is presumed liable for any adverse event at work are a bit glib and lazy.

There are several headings of liability under which an employer may be liable to an employee.
One of these headings is vicarious liability for the acts of fellow employees.
I focus on that specific point as it is the usual source of trouble in the context of this thread.

Can an employer be held vicariously liable for the assault of one employee by another within the place of work ? That is an open question.
In principle, an employer could be held vicariously liable if the wrongful act was simply a wrongful mode of doing an authorised act e.g. an assault based on mistaken apprehension.

Curiously enough two cases might open the way to argue that vicarious liability might visit an employer for an assault by an employee. See

1. Bazley -v- Curry 1999 Canadian Supreme Court
https://www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc/doc/1999/1999canlii692/1999canlii692.html?searchUrlHash=AAAAAQAGQkFaTEVZAAAAAAE&resultIndex=1

2. Lister and Others v. Hesley Hall Limited [2001] UK House of Lords.
http://www.bailii.org/uk/cases/UKHL/2001/22.html

Generally, I would think that employers are at risk of a vicarious liability for some of what goes on at office Christmas parties not least of all because of our old friend namely the concept of reasonable foreseeability and the associated concept of the nature and degree of a duty of care. Against, that there has to be some point at which the employers' involvement ends and with it any exposure on account of an individual employee's acts. I would have thought that a definitive end to a party would assist in setting the border on this issue.

BattleCorp

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Any time you are with work colleagues is a work event - no matter where or when or who organised it.

So, if I go for a few pints with my work colleagues on Friday night to celebrate my birthday, I'm at a work event?

Addle

BattleCorp wrote: »

So, if I go for a few pints with my work colleagues on Friday night to celebrate my birthday, I'm at a work event?

Only if something goes wrong.

BattleCorp

Addle wrote: »

Only if something goes wrong.

Nah, I can understand that a Christmas party might be considered a work event but a few buddies who happen to work together going for a few drinks certainly isn't a work event as it's not being organised by work. It's organised informally between a few mates.

Hercule Poirot

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

This.

Any time you are with work colleagues is a work event - no matter where or when or who organised it.

So if I bump into one of my colleagues in Tesco it's now a work event?

28064212

Hercule Poirot wrote: »

So if I bump into one of my colleagues in Tesco it's now a work event?

Different scenario: you bump into your boss on a night out, get drunk, and sucker punch him. Is your job affected?

tayto lover

If you’re paying for your own food and drink is it a “works party” at all?
I’d say it’s only a works party if the company is paying.
Personally I’d only be staying for the food and then leaving.

Addle

tayto lover wrote: »

If you’re paying for your own food and drink is it a “works party” at all?
I’d say it’s only a works party if the company is paying.

If that’s the case, I’ve never attended a ‘works party’.

_Brian

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

This.

Any time you are with work colleagues is a work event - no matter where or when or who organised it.

Agree totally with this.
It’s a minefield.

tayto lover

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

This.

Any time you are with work colleagues is a work event - no matter where or when or who organised it.

No way.
I’ve often gone out with workmates and it had absolutely nothing to do with the company. A few drinks among friends.

Marcusm

28064212 wrote: »

Different scenario: you bump into your boss on a night out, get drunk, and sucker punch him. Is your job affected?

Yes, because your employer knows that you are a thug by personal experience. He has to fire you to protect other employees from your random violent outbursts (“sucker punch”).