US take out Suleimani - mod warning in OP

Cheerful Spring2

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I might suppose that the proxy attacks might still take place.

But at least a nation to nation war is defused for now.

Good work on the leadership of both nations.

Both sides backed off starting an all out war. This is not over, the sames problems are not dealt with. We don't know if the proxies will decide to act out,  as there was Iraq/ Iran militia leader killed too. Strikes from Iran is definitely over for now though.
We should not be celebrating Trump for backing off. The Iranians could have done much worse, but acted out properly. Trump forget murdered their top general., it could be a lot worse if the Iranian leadership was similar to ISIS.

igCorcaigh

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Yes. Many Iranian people live in Canada?

Yeah. I think the number of Iranis given by Iran on the flight pretty much matches the Irani+Canadian number by others.

kildare lad

partyguinness wrote: »

The elephant in the room here and the underlying puppet master is Saudi Arabia.

Saudi Arabia is pushing the US to remove Iran as the regional power and of course the Saudi's have plenty of clout to put the squeeze on.

I don't think Russia or China would allow that as they're allies with the Iranians . The last thing anyone's needs is regime change in Iran or any other middle eastern country, I can't name one that hasn't ended in mass bloodshed since Iraq and Arab springs . The last thing Europe needs is millions of Iranian refugees pouring over our borders, yes their regime is hardline but is it any different than the Saudis.

igCorcaigh

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Both sides backed off starting an all out war. This is not over, the sames problems are not dealt with. We don't know if the proxies will decide to act out,  as there was Iraq/ Iran militia leader killed too. Strikes from Iran is definitely over for now though.
We should not be celebrating Trump for backing off. The Iranians could have done much worse, but acted out properly. Trump forget murdered their top general., it could be a lot worse if the Iranian leadership was similar to ISIS.

I think it's done for now.
The focus is still about Iranian power in the region, and the nuclear program.

igCorcaigh

For right now, I treat this incident as a victory of common sense over raw power.

Thankfully, this is 1914.

partyguinness

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Both sides backed off starting an all out war. This is not over, the sames problems are not dealt with. We don't know if the proxies will decide to act out, as there was Iraq/ Iran militia leader killed too. Strikes from Iran is definitely over for now though.
We should not be celebrating Trump for backing off. The Iranians could have done much worse, but acted out properly. Trump forget murdered their top general., it could be a lot worse if the Iranian leadership was similar to ISIS.

You see not everyone acts out like the US. If the roles where reversed, sure as hell the US would come out punch drunk launching missiles left right and centre.

People expected Iran to act like the US. As I said earlier, Iran do not have to do anything. They have other doing the donkey work. Sure hurl a few token gesture missiles into Iraq with pre warnings but they are playing the long game which the US are not so good at with its instant boom boom results now mentality.

notobtuse

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Yes. Many Iranian people live in Canada?

Not as many as in the US. There are approximately 1.5 million US citizens who are of Iranian ancestry or who hold Iranian citizenship living here. I have one temporarily living with me until I take her and my daughter back to university on Sunday.

(Come Monday I can eat bacon again... yeah! )

kildare lad

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Both sides backed off starting an all out war. This is not over, the sames problems are not dealt with. We don't know if the proxies will decide to act out,  as there was Iraq/ Iran militia leader killed too. Strikes from Iran is definitely over for now though.
We should not be celebrating Trump for backing off. The Iranians could have done much worse, but acted out properly. Trump forget murdered their top general., it could be a lot worse if the Iranian leadership was similar to ISIS.

I read the the Iranians told the Iraq about the incoming airstrikes , the Iraqis then told the yanks , who probably got into their bunkers. Both sides save a bit of face. Iran looked like it struck and no casualties for trump . I can't see this being the end of it tho. If I was Trump or his kids I'd be looking over my shoulder for the rest of my life. They might just wait till he's out of office and go after them . I seriously can't see them letting it go

igCorcaigh

Although, I must say that the words from UK and even EU were terrible.

igCorcaigh

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Although, I must say that the words from UK and even EU were terrible.

UK telling Iran to take no action, without condemning the assassination, and then condemning the measured reaction.

Idiot UK.

kildare lad

partyguinness wrote: »

You see not everyone acts out like the US. If the roles where reversed, sure as hell the US would come out punch drunk launching missiles left right and centre.

People expected Iran to act like the US. As I said earlier, Iran do not have to do anything. They have other doing the donkey work. Sure hurl a few token gesture missiles into Iraq with pre warnings but they are playing the long game which the US are not so good at with its instant boom boom results now mentality.

Sure they invaded the wrong country after 9/11 , that was organised by a Saudi and carried out by mainly Saudi hijackers .

ArchXStanton

igCorcaigh wrote: »

UK telling Iran to take no action, without condemning the assassination, and then condemning the measured reaction.

Idiot UK.

Glad I wasn't the only one to notice that, the UK, France and Germany are mere poodles of the US, they all parrot the same ****e..

partyguinness

kildare lad wrote: »

I don't think Russia or China would allow that as they're allies with the Iranians . The last thing anyone's needs is regime change in Iran or any other middle eastern country, I can't name one that hasn't ended in mass bloodshed since Iraq and Arab springs . The last thing Europe needs is millions of Iranian refugees pouring over our borders, yes their regime is hardline but is it any different than the Saudis.

The looming presence of China and Russia did not stop the US blowing up Suleimani?

If Russia and China would not allow it as you (not in their powers anyway) then what is the end game for the US?

This China/Russia narrative is greatly over blown. Russia and China will sit back, watch and act in its vested interests. Period. They will throw anyone under the bus so long as their asses are covered- no loyalty.

I wouldn't like to be on a sinking ship with the Russians and Chinese that's for sure.

BloodBath

kildare lad wrote: »

I read the the Iranians told the Iraq about the incoming airstrikes , the Iraqis then told the yanks , who probably got into their bunkers. Both sides save a bit of face. Iran looked like it struck and no casualties for trump . I can't see this being the end of it tho. If I was Trump or his kids I'd be looking over my shoulder for the rest of my life. They might just wait till he's out of office and go after them . I seriously can't see them letting it go

Except it has almost nothing to do with Trump. This is part of a long term plan that was laid out in 2003 as detailed by general Wesley Clarke. 7 countries in 10 years was the plan ending with Iran. They have invaded or regime changed 6 of the 7 with Iran left.

This happened under 3 presidents including lord Obama. The presidents have almost no say in US foreign policy.

partyguinness

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Glad I wasn't the only one to notice that, the UK, France and Germany are mere poodles of the US, they all parrot the same ****e..

I live in the UK now and I noticed it first thing and promptly gagged- they have no shame. But then again the UK will do anything for a special 'deal.'

alastair

partyguinness wrote: »

The looming presence of China and Russia did not stop the US blowing up Suleimani?

If Russia and China would not allow it as you (not in their powers anyway) then what is the end game for the US?

This China/Russia narrative is greatly over blown. Russia and China will sit back, watch and act in its vested interests. Period. They will throw anyone under the bus so long as their asses are covered- no loyalty.

I wouldn't like to be on a sinking ship with the Russians and Chinese that's for sure.

I reckon the Kurds have a view on US loyalty.

kildare lad

partyguinness wrote: »

The looming presence of China and Russia did not stop the US blowing up Suleimani?

If Russia and China would not allow it as you (not in their powers anyway) then what is the end game for the US?

This China/Russia narrative is greatly over blown. Russia and China will sit back, watch and act in its vested interests. Period. They will throw anyone under the bus so long as their asses are covered- no loyalty.

I wouldn't like to be on a sinking ship with the Russians and Chinese that's for sure.

The Russians had no problem sticking their noses in Syria with USA on the other side . I know they weren't attacking each other directly but if Iran offered them enough resources like Syria did , I'm sure they'd have no problem doing it for Iran .

is_that_so

https://www.newsweek.com/army-says-fake-text-messages-sent-americans-military-draft-iran-war-1480967

kildare lad

BloodBath wrote: »

Except it has almost nothing to do with Trump. This is part of a long term plan that was laid out in 2003 as detailed by general Wesley Clarke. 7 countries in 10 years was the plan ending with Iran. They have invaded or regime changed 6 of the 7 with Iran left.

This happened under 3 presidents including lord Obama. The presidents have almost no say in US foreign policy.

And people wonder why they want a nuke ?

partyguinness

kildare lad wrote: »

The Russians had no problem sticking their noses in Syria with USA on the other side . I know they weren't attacking each other directly but if Iran offered them enough resources like Syria did , I'm sure they'd have no problem doing it for Iran .

I think it suits the Russians down to the ground to have everyone else fighting each other with perhaps a gentle prod here and there. Keeps the spotlight shining elsewhere.

partyguinness

kildare lad wrote: »

And people wonder why they want a nuke ?

A nuke is guaranteed safety and the only sure fire way you will not be invaded or attacked.

Like all bullies, the US doesn't pick fights or attack countries that can actually fight back.

seamus

is_that_so wrote: »

https://www.newsweek.com/army-says-fake-text-messages-sent-americans-military-draft-iran-war-1480967

This would be both genius and hilarious if it wasn't so serious.

The "who" depends just on how widespread these things are, but it would be a modern form of leaflet bombing and spreading confusion and anger within the US.

ArchXStanton

partyguinness wrote: »

A nuke is guaranteed safety and the only sure fire way you will not be invaded or attacked.

Like all bullies, the US doesn't pick fights or attack countries that can actually fight back.

The US wants a weakened Iran that's why they walked out of the deal over irans ballistic missiles, they want to renegotiate the deal but to limit Irans capability

GM228

charlie14 wrote: »

You may be correct, but from memory there was a Boeing in around the mid 80`s that came close at Manchester Airport due to an engine fire on an aborted take-off that resulted in loss of life. Fire crews on scene along with the engine fire had to contend with a running fuel fire.
I would not like to be in the air in that scenario hoping the fuel tanks do not ignite.

That was BAF28M, a Boeing 737-200 (August 1985), yes there was an uncontained engine failure, a fuel leak and fire, but the fuel tank did not explode, it didn't even rupture per say, rather the combustor can of the Pratt and Whitney engine broke and hit the fuel tank access point creating the leak and most of the deaths were smoke inhalation related, it was actually the accident which brought about modern safely evacuation standards in the airline industry.

charlie14

partyguinness wrote: »

The elephant in the room here and the underlying puppet master is Saudi Arabia.

Saudi Arabia is pushing the US to remove Iran as the regional power and of course the Saudi's have plenty of clout to put the squeeze on.

Just in relation to this,


There has been a lot of noise here about the number of Iranian missiles that hit or missed, but I haven`t seen anything claiming the US shot any down.
Some of our resident military/civil aviation authority experts were at great pains prior to this attack by the Iranians to explain to us all the defensive capabilities the US possessed.


Especially with ample warning I find it curious as to there being no mention, (unless I missed it), of any of these missiles being intercepted.


If I was living in the UAE or Saudi where US warplanes are based, when Iran has said they will attack any state that facilitates strikes against them, then I would be more than just a little curious as to why it appears none of those missiles were intercepted last night.

markodaly

alastair wrote: »

The odds would be no different than on any other night.

And it happened to crash on this particular night?

partyguinness

ArchXStanton wrote: »

The US wants a weakened Iran that's why they walked out of the deal over irans ballistic missiles, they want to renegotiate the deal but to limit Irans capability

Absolutely. Saudi Arabia and Israel more specifically want a weakened Iran.

Trump has no foreign policy agenda (or any agenda for that matter except his own vanity). He doesn't give a crap about Iran or the Middle East. In fact his campaign focused on bringing troops home and not engaging in foreign wars- he is being pressed into doing the opposite.

Of course Trump is being played because it is being sold to him as an easy way to keep trashing Obama's legacy some more- everyone is happy.

notobtuse

Thank God Trump is in the White House and not the warmonger Hillary Clinton... Ms "We came, we saw, he died."

NIMAN

Well the mighty Iranian military war machine really showed them Americans, didn't they?

pearcider

ArchXStanton wrote: »

Glad I wasn't the only one to notice that, the UK, France and Germany are mere poodles of the US, they all parrot the same ****e..

Says the lad posting from the safety and stability of Western Europe all bought and paid for by the US military. Why don’t you head off to Iran and see how you get on? People vote with their feet. Which is why millions try to get into the west every year despite the numerous barriers to doing so. Clearly the evil Americans and their poodles must be doing something right!