Women Only Professorships

mvl

Found this report from TCD Annual Equality Monitoring Support 2017/2018.
(Interesting data for who has time to browse -e.g. the most gender imbalanced faculty is not Mathematics but Physics - having 87% male staff )
Quoting table below on percentages for female professors.

AlekSmart

KiKi III wrote: »

It takes an astonishing level of self-belief to be able to decide that something that has been proven over and over again doesn't exist based on a google search.

As for my former CEO, the point i was trying to get across is that many of those men who (allegedly) patronised her in her 20s are still in their roles and at very senior levels - and I find it highly unlikely that their (supposed) attitudes have changed dramatically with age.

I believe feminism doesn't have to and shouldn't choose between opposing FGM and the other atrocities you mentioned, and advancing equality issues for Western women.

CEO's are human too,and when stripped of the trappings,can be dreadfully.....`normal`,as in mischevious,inventive or just plain attention seeking ?

All I get from your description is yet more of the "Dúirt bean liom,go ndúirt bean léi`school of information technology.

Right now I'm unsure whether I'm biased.....unconciously biased...or just plain unconcious

Charles Babbage

Mitchel-O'COnnor will be able to apply to be a professor now, her expertise will no doubt be valued.

CageWager

This election has shown that gender quotas have utterly failed and the usual vested interests are already doubling down. Women only professorships today, women only Dail seats tomorrow.

Calhoun

CageWager wrote: »

This election has shown that gender quotas have utterly failed and the usual vested interests are already doubling down. Women only professorships today, women only Dail seats tomorrow.

Are they lol?

For my vote I only voted for women, not a conscious decision. I voted along lines of politics and not was between the legs.

I think allot of the politicians that would be pushing this agenda have been taken out. Coppinger, Mitchell and hopefully Zappone.

CageWager

Calhoun wrote: »

Are they lol?

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/a-disappointing-day-for-women-female-candidates-take-just-19-of-first-80-seats-38942444.html


This article featuring the "Women for Election" interest group and many comments on twitter lamenting the loss of sub-par TD's purely based on their gender.

Calhoun wrote: »

For my vote I only voted for women, not a conscious decision. I voted along lines of politics and not was between the legs.

Good for you. I voted for a Women 1 and a Man 2. Competency based decision.

Calhoun wrote: »

I think allot of the politicians that would be pushing this agenda have been taken out. Coppinger, Mitchell and hopefully Zappone.

So you think the Womens Council, "Women for Election" et al. are just going to sit back and take this on the chin? Somehow I highly doubt it. If the existing efforts to gerrymander their way to 50-50 female representation haven't delivered the outcome they wanted, what will happen next. Double down time.

Huntergonzo

Calhoun wrote: »

Are they lol?

For my vote I only voted for women, not a conscious decision. I voted along lines of politics and not was between the legs.

I think allot of the politicians that would be pushing this agenda have been taken out. Coppinger, Mitchell and hopefully Zappone.

Their campaigning is pretty outrageous in my view, I mean people like Coppinger openly advertising the fact that she's 'working for women'.

So bascially you're alienating half your own electorate by telling them that you're not interested in them because they have the wrong sex organs, and then they seem surprised when they're not elected!!

Pressure groups like Women For Election will kick into high gear now and will do even more damage to people's careers going forward and not just politicians, they tend to have knock on effects to other industries as well sadly.

Ps, I gave both my number 1 and 2 to women, and left it there because they were the 2 candidates I wanted elected for various reasons such as policy, record in the area and of course I wasn't a fan of the other options.

I didn't chose them for what they have between their legs though......that wasn't especially relevant in my decision.

Huntergonzo

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Mitchel-O'COnnor will be able to apply to be a professor now, her expertise will no doubt be valued.

Haha very good, she was obviously thinking ahead!

Calhoun

CageWager wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/a-disappointing-day-for-women-female-candidates-take-just-19-of-first-80-seats-38942444.html


This article featuring the "Women for Election" interest group and many comments on twitter lamenting the loss of sub-par TD's purely based on their gender.





Good for you. I voted for a Women 1 and a Man 2. Competency based decision.





So you think the Womens Council, "Women for Election" et al. are just going to sit back and take this on the chin? Somehow I highly doubt it. If the existing efforts to gerrymander their way to 50-50 female representation haven't delivered the outcome they wanted, what will happen next. Double down time.

You would be mistaken to think that twitter has any impact on the decisions of many Irish folks. Twitter Ireland is a circle jerk/echo chamber and has started to loose allot of its power over the past year or so.

They can double down all they want but who is going to listen to them? You cannot get more woke than Coppinger and Zappone and both are gone. I don't blame these organizations for trying to push for more power but how would you suggest stopping them?

The best way to do that is keep rational heads and don't engage in the same identity political ****e. Maybe after we have solved housing, education and health as a nation we will take politics like this a bit more serious but right now im not so sure.

Caquas

The champions of this woeful scheme (MMO’C and Zappone) have been dispatched by the electorate but I doubt anyone in the next Dail will have the gumption to oppose it. Those who stand to benefit (female academics in Ireland) will insist on its implementation but its obvious absurdity and lack of political champions means it will be a weird anomaly confined to the obscure reaches of academia (much like the “Professors” it will create).

Calhoun

Caquas wrote: »

The champions of this woeful scheme (MMO’C and Zappone) have been dispatched by the electorate but I doubt anyone in the next Dail will have the gumption to oppose it. Those who stand to benefit (female academics in Ireland) will insist on its implementation but its obvious absurdity and lack of political champions means it will be a weird anomaly confined to the obscure reaches of academia (much like the “Professors” it will create).

Not much will come of it until the first legal case, and i would suspect it will be an eventuality.

Yellow_Fern

Our university promotions system is designed by men for men
Opinion: We need gender-competent leaders to ensure more women move upwards
The purpose of the 20 posts approved under the Senior Academic Leadership Initiative created by Minister of State for Higher Education Mary Mitchell O’Connor was to improve the representation of women in senior positions in the Irish higher educational system.

This is an important objective both symbolically and practically. Universities, where 74 per cent of senior academic positions (professorships) are held by men, give an implicit message to women students and early career women that they have no future in these organisations. The practical implications are that there are few women in key decision-making fora. This in turn perpetuates a male-dominated system since people tend to appoint those like themselves. Such a system is unhelpful in terms of innovation and research output and is particularly unacceptable in publicly funded universities.

Figures just released by the Higher Education Authority show that women’s “chances” of accessing a professorship in Irish universities remain much lower than men’s (1:13 for women as compared to 1:5 for men). Assumptions that this simply reflects women’s maternity leave, caring activities, lack of ambition etc are difficult to sustain in the face of variation between different Irish universities in such chances: from 1:9 to 1:27 for women.

This variation between universities has been a consistent pattern since 2013. Change is happening in women’s chances, but very slowly – improving from 1:16 in 2013-2015 to 1:13 in 2018.

Women’s chances of a professorship have been consistently lowest in NUI Galway – where it is 1:27, according to the most recent data. This is surprising given the flurry of activity there in the wake of the decision by the Equality Tribunal to award Micheline Sheehy Skeffington €75,000 following her successful case in 2014 and the settling of the remaining four cases by the university in 2018.

Men’s average chances of a professorship show very little variation between universities and have changed little since 2013.

Underlying systemic consensus
This is very different to the much lower and much wider range of variation in women’s chances of a professorship. It is almost as if there is some underlying systemic consensus that men are more entitled to a professorship.

Increases in the number of professorships in the recent data have facilitated slight improvements in women’s chances, while men’s chances have remained the same. Men’s chances (at 1:4) have been consistently highest in University College Dublin.

The pace of change is clearly important and since 2013 this has also varied between universities. It has been fastest in Trinity College Dublin, where women’s chances of a professorship increased from 1:21 in 2013-2015 to 1:12 in 2018.

The “new” universities, particularly Maynooth University and the University of Limerick, had an initial advantage and this was reflected in their proportion of women at full professorial level.

However, the pace of change in these universities has been slow since 2013. Indeed, the University of Limerick, which led the field before 2013, has shown very little improvement in women’s chances since then, while men’s chances actually improved in 2018.

This shows that progress is not inevitable and that constant vigilance is necessary if back-sliding is to be avoided.

Since the 2016 Expert Report on Gender Equality in Irish Higher Education, there has been an increasing awareness that the under-representation of women in senior academic positions reflects an organisational culture that favours men, a lack of gender competence among managerial leaders, as well as structures, criteria and practices that facilitate men’s successful application to these positions.

Tiny minority
Of course, a tiny minority of women have always accessed these positions: it was 5 per cent in mid 1970s; fell to 1 per cent in the early 1980s; rose to 4 per cent in the early 1990s; to 10 per cent in the early 2000s. By 2013-2015, it had risen to 19 per cent – and it is now 26 per cent.

The Senior Leadership Academic Initiative is a way of speeding up this process by targeting posts at those areas where women are particularly under-represented. It is an attempt to deal with a system which has– and indeed still is – designed by men for men. That system needs to be tackled by gender-competent leaders.

In the meantime, the Senior Leadership Initiative involving 45 posts (less than 10 per cent of the total number of professorial posts) will at least symbolically change the gender profile of those in senior academic positions. Whether or not this will change the system depends partly on the extent to which those appointed are committed to wider systemic change, and on the extent to which the men in power co-operate with that change.

Pat O’Connor is emeritus professor of sociology and social policy at University of Limerick and visiting professor, Geary Institute, University College Dublin.

Mad stuff! No mention of how such proposed discrimination might exist.

Caquas

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

Mad stuff! No mention of how such proposed discrimination might exist.

This is typical:

Since the 2016 Expert Report on Gender Equality in Irish Higher Education, there has been an increasing awareness that the under-representation of women in senior academic positions reflects an organisational culture that favours men, a lack of gender competence among managerial leaders, as well as structures, criteria and practices that facilitate men’s successful application to these positions.

Translation: we won't do a rigorous analysis of the factors which might account for the gender gap - it is enough that we just know collectively ("here has been an increasing awareness") that it's all men's fault. They lack "gender competence", they create the organisational culture and just fix the game in their favour ("structures, critieria and practices"). There is one explanation which can never be mentioned, let alone considered seriously - that the best candidate was appointed.

Even if you accept their reasoning, surely the answer is to fix these problems and not just award Professorships to disappointed female candidates.