Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

hotmail.com

rossie1977 wrote: »

CNN are nowhere within the same stratosphere as bad as Fox News. Fox News are entertainment posing as news. Their presenters outright either lie to cover up Trump's failings or shower him with praise for the same things they crucified his predecessor for. Not to mention they are a platform for some of the most insane conspiracy theories, most with zero merit.

CNN at least has some journalistic integrity. Yes they are obsessed with covering Trump which is their biggest flaw. However for all the talk of their supposed left wing bias I haven't seen any left wing ideologies that CNN are pushing. Certainly not health care, transportation, environment, worker rights.

And it would have been downright crazy for CNN not to cover the biggest public trial in history. Every major news outlet in the US had some representation at the OJ hearings.

CNN also runs its programmes for entertainment! They are the same as Fox. The graphics take up a large section of the screen at times. This has nothing to do with journalism. Large panels with divided opinion, argument for the sake of it. No in depth reports and hardly any international stories.

There was zero justification for the OJ coverage and CNN was the worst culprit in that circus. They led with it from the start. I think they even cringe a bit when they look back at it. The reason why it was the biggest public trial was because the media gave it so much attention but it had no effect on anyone outside of the families involved. CNN damaged itself during that affair.

listermint

hotmail.com wrote: »

CNN also runs its programmes for entertainment! They are the same as Fox. The graphics take up a large section of the screen at times. This has nothing to do with journalism. Large panels with divided opinion, argument for the sake of it. No in depth reports and hardly any international stories.

There was zero justification for the OJ coverage and CNN was the worst culprit in that circus. They led with it from the start. I think they even cringe a bit when they look back at it. The reason why it was the biggest public trial was because the media gave it so much attention but it had no effect on anyone outside of the families involved. CNN damaged itself during that affair.

1995? Really!?

Carfacemandog

The FBI have issued a warrant and seized documents from Senator Richard Burr for his role in dumping stocks while the republicans were furiously downplaying coronavirus earlier this year.

On one hand, in isolation, this is obviously a good thing. However, when you dig a little deeper it gets quite a bit darker and points to why Trump is so adamant that Obama committed a crime but will not even vaguely state which, at the same time as William Barr is working hard to claim a man who literally confessed his guilt should not have been investigated at all.

The reason for this is that Burr, a Republican, was part of the bipartisan committee that a few weeks ago unanimously concluded Russia did interfere in the US election and did so to help Donald Trump win. Other senators who were not part of this committee but also sold off stocks, such as Jim Inhofe and Kelly Loeffler (who also bought millions of stocks in teleworking related companies) while downplaying coronavirus, have not been investigated.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-seizes-sen-richard-burrs-cellphone-after-serving-search-warrant-report-says

Federal agents on Wednesday served a search warrant to Sen. Richard Burr, R-N.C., at his Washington-area home in part of the government’s investigation into his stock sales that were made early in the coronavirus outbreak, according to a report.

The exclusive report by the Los Angeles Times, citing unnamed officials, said agents seized a cellphone. A second official said agents served an earlier warrant to obtain information from the senator’s iCloud account. A law enforcement source told the paper that the Justice Department was reviewing communication between Burr and his broker.

It can't be much of a coincidence, Burr had changed his Twitter profile picture to a cartoon of him and senator Loeffler - https://mobile.twitter.com/senatorburr

And this only days after the Senate voted to allow anyone in the country's entire web browsing history to be searched in full detail without a warrant - https://www.vice.com/amp/en_us/article/jgxxvk/senate-votes-to-allow-fbi-to-look-at-your-web-browsing-history-without-a-warrant

hotmail.com

listermint wrote: »

1995? Really!?

The Trump coverage reminds me of their OJ coverage - a circus.

looksee

hotmail.com wrote: »

The Trump coverage reminds me of their OJ coverage - a circus.

Why wouldn't the coverage be a circus? The entire government, presidency, voting and legal system is a circus, how else can it be covered?

spacecoyote

Quite a good piece in the FT today around the Trump Whitehouse reaction and actions throughout the Covid-19 crisis

https://www.ft.com/content/97dc7de6-940b-11ea-abcd-371e24b679ed

Its well worth a read and lays out the last couple of months pretty clearly and starkly

PropJoe10

I must say, I am finding the attempts by Trump and Fox News to discredit and belittle Fauci to be very disturbing and shameful. Things are going to get very bad over there if someone doesn't start listening to science.

abff

BonnieSituation wrote: »

So, this is from today:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1260735992727769096?s=19

I'm assuming it's about Flynn and the judge's investigation?

So, is Trump just going to continue tweeting OBAMAGATE over and over again on the premise that the more often he says this, the more people are going to believe that there’s a huge scandal about Obama that’s bubbling under the surface and is just about to break?

Billy Mays

PropJoe10 wrote: »

I must say, I am finding the attempts by Trump and Fox News to discredit and belittle Fauci to be very disturbing and shameful. Things are going to get very bad over there if someone doesn't start listening to science.

People are tired of experts

valoren

abff wrote: »

So, is Trump just going to continue tweeting OBAMAGATE over and over again on the premise that the more often he says this, the more people are going to believe that there’s a huge scandal about Obama that’s bubbling under the surface and is just about to break?

It's done deliberately.

Have you ever watched a reality TV program? Ever notice how just before the commercial break there is typically a “dramatic” snippet from an upcoming scene? Or at the end of every episode there is a preview containing similar scenes for the next episode? This could be a snippet from an argument, of participants exchanging concerned looks between each other, or a seemingly insurmountable (but scripted) obstacle cropping up…etc. You don’t get shown the full context of the situation as only a snippet is shown. The reason such scenes are placed where they are is very deliberate. When shown before the break it is to hook you, to tease you, and assuming it works, to have you finish the episode. Your staying tuned increases the ratings and these ratings drive the supply and demand advertising dollar. When shown at the tail end of episodes, it is to commit you into watching the next episode. It is all a technique done to pique your curiosity and draw you in.

Trump tweeting “Obamagate” and inferring that this is the biggest political crime in American history is a primary example of this technique in action within the political sphere. His refusal to elaborate is the tease alluded to earlier. People will naturally have questions. They will likely want some semblance of an answer to their questions. Trump’s first term, by analogy his first episode is coming to an end. It’s been an abysmal hit and miss episode but by flouting conspiracy theories he is teasing his base support. It’s his way of saying ignore the virus, the fallout, the deaths. You better vote for me to find out the truth about this “biggest political crime in American history” as to have your questions pertaining to that answered and for justice to be served, it will all be revealed in the next episode, his second term. The truth as it turns out will be completely baseless obviously but when, judging by polling data, your re-election chances are dwindling then you’ll understandably grasp for the best tricks of the TV trade to convince people to stay tuned.

hotmail.com

looksee wrote: »

Why wouldn't the coverage be a circus? The entire government, presidency, voting and legal system is a circus, how else can it be covered?

Perhaps but then why do people here give CNN such authority?

Caegan

hotmail.com wrote: »

Perhaps but then why do people here give CNN such authority?

CNN might be part of the circus but Fox, OANN, Brietbart, etc are the freakshow side of things.

hotmail.com

Caegan wrote: »

CNN might be part of the circus but Fox, OANN, Brietbart, etc are the freakshow side of things.

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

Quin_Dub

hotmail.com wrote: »

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

Except the people that watch it , which is the problem.

Loads of evidence to show that people that exclusively get their news from Fox are the least likely to know the facts or to accept information given to them from authorities.

Christy42

hotmail.com wrote: »

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

People absolutely take Fox seriously. It is a primary source of news for millions. Certainly they put little effort in disguising their lies but that is just because they know they can get away with it (my favourite is when they flipped the y axis on a gun violence graph to make it look like it was decreasing). Fox isn't actually meant to be satire and neither is breitbart. They are claiming to be serious sources for news.

Add to that all the little "local" channels (very few are in fact local) which pretend to be focusing on local issues but are controlled by a small number of entities trying to push a certain message but hide it up as "local".

Leroy42

hotmail.com wrote: »

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

This is the same argument used to excuse Trump. Others should have far higher standards because they are supposed to be better, but Fox/Trump or whatever aren't really serious anyway so they shouldn't be held to the same standards.

If you have an issue with CNN, then you must also have serious issues with Fox and also Trump himself. Trump is the leading fake news purveyor in the US right now, which a reach far in excess of CNN. He creates headlines out of thin air (Obamagate being the latest example).

Itssoeasy

hotmail.com wrote: »

Perhaps but then why do people here give CNN such authority?

How do you know that people here give CNN such authority ? Your posts are filled with statements of what you believe are facts yet you decided to single out CNN for its coverage of OJ Simpson for some bizarre reason. What about the Reagan assassination attempt, the challenger disaster, the gulf wars both times, the Columbia disaster. It seems they've gotten praise for their coverage of all these big events and no TV network worth its salt wasn't going to not cover both the arrest or trial.

Btw nbc interrupted the NBA finals to broadcast the chase yet I don't see you complaining about NBC or ABC, or CBS who did cover the chase and trial.

Also, you said that CNN has little international stories ? The channel outside of the USA is literally called CNN international.

aloyisious

hotmail.com wrote: »

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

Unless I'm mistaken, Don does and so do a large part of the Trump supporters clan given the weird beliefs a large portion of them have.

duploelabs

hotmail.com wrote: »

But they openly don't take themselves seriously.

CNN regards itself as a serious journalistic broadcaster. A broadcaster that is a cut above everyone else.

I don't think even Fox, as bad as that is, uses such elaborate and distracting graphics on their screen as CNN does.

No one quite rightly takes Fox seriously, but yet they don't see any issue with CNN? Odd.

Where exactly do Fox say that they 'shouldn't take themselves seriously'?

fullstop

Good to see he’s becoming less self-centered anyway :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/gelles/status/1260896022676541440?s=21

Penn

fullstop wrote: »

Good to see he’s becoming less self-centered anyway :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/gelles/status/1260896022676541440?s=21

Christ, he sounds like the kind of guy who'd brag about having the tallest building in New York because of 9/11....

Quin_Dub

fullstop wrote: »

Good to see he’s becoming less self-centered anyway :rolleyes:

https://twitter.com/gelles/status/1260896022676541440?s=21

I continue to be amazed at how massively inarticulate he is..

Setting aside the obvious awfulness of the narcissistic message he's trying to convey , the way he mangles the English language is incredible.

Foxtrol

Like the rest of his life, he has been put in such an easy position to succeed and has completely blown it and blames everyone else for it.

For all the impact on the economy, the virus should have made winning the election much easier. Around the US and the world, leaders that weren't like are seeing huge improvements in their polls for doing simply a competent job and deferring to experts.

If you look throughout his presidency you could argue he has made nearly every move possible to make it more difficult for himself.

trashcan

salmocab wrote: »

I really hate the use of ‘gate’ after words to denote a scandal. It’s lost all meaning as it’s used for any little thing and watergate wasn’t about water anyway. It’s lazy journalism (I know in this case it’s not a journalist but still)

There was a terrific sketch on Mitchell and Webb a few years ago about the use of "gate" The argument was that the correct term for Watergate was "Watergategate" I agree, the use of "gate" to denote a scandal should be banned.

Quin_Dub

Foxtrol wrote: »

Like the rest of his life, he has been put in such an easy position to succeed and has completely blown it and blames everyone else for it.

For all the impact on the economy, the virus should have made winning the election much easier. Around the US and the world, leaders that weren't like are seeing huge improvements in their polls for doing simply a competent job and deferring to experts.

If you look throughout his presidency you could argue he has made nearly every move possible to make it more difficult for himself.

Absolutely - In times like this a politicians job is basically to close their mouth and open the cheque book.

We only need to look here at home - FG literally just lost an Election , but by simply listening to experts and making funding available to do the right things as advised by those experts their standing has increased significantly.

salmocab

trashcan wrote: »

There was a terrific sketch on Mitchell and Webb a few years ago about the use of "gate" The argument was that the correct term for Watergate was "Watergategate" I agree, the use of "gate" to denote a scandal should be banned.

I’m going to look that up later. It really grates on my nerves and it’s so overused that it’s lost any meaning anyway.

pixelburp

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Absolutely - In times like this a politicians job is basically to close their mouth and open the cheque book.

We only need to look here at home - FG literally just lost an Election , but by simply listening to experts and making funding available to do the right things as advised by those experts their standing has increased significantly.

A big difference here though isn't so much Trump IMO, it's that the American political landscape is skewed by its inherently "sports fan" tribalism: Trump continues to exist as a political force because of Fox News boosting his behaviour, while the endemic partisanship ensures he still polls at 85% with Republicans. On balance he's deeply unpopular sure, but at this stage the only thing that might nuke his support with Conservative America would be a leak of an abortion - and even then, would it?

As was said way back at his election, Trump is merely the symptom - the 2 party system is the disease.

Manic Moran

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Absolutely - In times like this a politicians job is basically to close their mouth and open the cheque book.

We only need to look here at home - FG literally just lost an Election , but by simply listening to experts and making funding available to do the right things as advised by those experts their standing has increased significantly.

Trump is running a strange mixed course. He's making a fool of himself in the press conferences which is, of course where the visibility is, but neither has he ever put anything in the way of requests or solid advice. Two of his biggest detractors are the Governors of New York and California, but both are on record as saying that as far as Coronavirus goes, they have received everything that they asked for from the Federal Government. Fauci and Brix have confirmed that he has never said no to their recommendations either.

However, the bar in the US seems low. The various mis-steps by the Trump administration such as folding the pandemic response team into another department are equally mirrored at State levels. If you move from national level media and look at more local media, you'll see that they are investigating their own governments as well. California never restocked its PPE and also cut its pandemic response budget, for example. Texas' testing response seemed unconscionably slow. New York City's Public Health team in February were telling people not to worry about coronavirus, there wass low risk of casual transmission, go support the Asian community by attending the Lunar New Year events and parades. Florida letting Spring Break happen unfettered was a disaster, and in the American system, the front line are the States, not the Feds.

Getting off to a dodgy start and then recovering seems to be an American tradition. Anything from wars to the Space Race. In this case, we know the curve was successfully flattened. There was no ventilator shortage, nobody had to be triaged. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2020/04/28/coronavirus-hospitals-avoid-ventilator-shortage-curve-new-york-flattens/3036008001/

If you want to talk about opening up the chequebook, here's an example.

Like other countries, the US military built field hospitals. And we had the two hospital ships. One was returned from New York after treating 350 people.
https://www.npr.org/2020/05/07/851712311/u-s-field-hospitals-stand-down-most-without-treating-any-covid-19-patients

"Chicago pared back plans for a 3,000-bed temporary hospital at McCormick Place, the nation’s largest convention center, as infection numbers decreased. Opened April 3 instead with 500 beds, the $64 million facility treated just 12 people as of last week, with six of them being released."

$64mn for 12 people? It gets better, $270mn for two hospitals in New York which treated nobody at all. Now, better to have built them and see the other measures like physical distancing and improved testing result in them being unused than to have saved the money and not built them only to find they were needed, but the chequebooks are open and the US at both Federal and State levels has poured dollars into the problem to recover. Which is also a bit of an American tradition.

As for daily life, meat is being rationed in our shops here in Texas courtesy of the packing problems. Everyone's wearing masks. Testing is accessible and the State is doing the estimated required number of tests per day for effectiveness. My 23-month-old (who was tested after getting a fever somehow) probably thinks that there's no world outside the garden fence. I think my hobby shop is open, I need to go get paint. Apparently the old hobby of scale modelling is experiencing a resurgence as people are stuck in the house, but it's limited by the fact that the shop was closed under the restrictions. It's not a high-profit-margin industry to begin with, I hope the guy manages to stay in business. I have a house I rent out in California, my tenants were all laid off in the shutdown, so I am on the hook for an extra mortgage payment.

hetuzozaho

Manic Moran wrote: »

Trump is running a strange mixed course. He's making a fool of himself in the press conferences which is, of course where the visibility is, but neither has he ever put anything in the way of requests or solid advice. Two of his biggest detractors are the Governors of New York and California, but both are on record as saying that as far as Coronavirus goes, they have received everything that they asked for from the Federal Government. Fauci and Brix have confirmed that he has never said no to their recommendations either.

I think Fauci and them have to say that do they? I dunno, I would not be shocked if Fauci thought Tump was a fool, even in situations away from the press conferences, a dangerous fool at that.

abff

valoren wrote: »

Have you ever watched a reality TV program? Ever notice how just before the commercial break there is typically a “dramatic” snippet from an upcoming scene? Or at the end of every episode there is a preview containing similar scenes for the next episode? This could be a snippet from an argument, of participants exchanging concerned looks between each other, or a seemingly insurmountable (but scripted) obstacle cropping up…etc. You don’t get shown the full context of the situation as only a snippet is shown. The reason such scenes are placed where they are is very deliberate. When shown before the break it is to hook you, to tease you, and assuming it works, to have you finish the episode. You’re staying tuned increases the ratings and these ratings drive the supply and demand advertising dollar. When shown at the tail end of episodes, it is to commit you into watching the next episode. It is all a technique done to pique your curiosity and draw you in.

Trump tweeting “Obamagate” and inferring that this is the biggest political crime in American history is a primary example of this technique in action within the political sphere. His refusal to elaborate is the tease alluded to earlier. People will naturally have questions. They will likely want some semblance of an answer to their questions. Trump’s first term, by analogy his first episode is coming to an end. It’s been an abysmal hit and miss episode but by flouting conspiracy theories he is teasing his base support. It’s his way of saying that you better vote for me to find out the truth about this “biggest political crime in American history” as to have your questions pertaining to that answered and for justice to be served, it will all be revealed in the next episode, his second term. The truth as it turns out will be completely baseless obviously but when, judging by polling data, your re-election chances are dwindling then you’ll understandably grasp for the best tricks of the trade to convince people to stay tuned.

Thanks for the detailed response.

I kind of figured that’s what he’s doing, but it’s mind boggling that such a blatant ploy might actually work. It just shows how low things have sunk during Trump’s reign of idiocracy.