Donald Trump Presidency discussion Thread VII (threadbanned users listed in OP)

amdublin

What's the story with Arizona? I'd worry about the spread of coronavirus amongst all those clapping seals

TomOnBoard

fullstop wrote: »

I’ve seen a few quips about his Ferrari and mansion, but what’s the story here? Is he thought to be swindling funds?

Here's one of the press reports on Brad's good fortunes...

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-campaign-manager-parscales-companies-got-nearly-40-million-2020-5?r=US&IR=T

RobertKK

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1275567239517868033?s=20

It is nearly as bad as Simon Harris's they never found a vaccine for the other 18. There are a lot of politicians who don't understand some basic stuff. No wonder these people move from one crisis to another.
If Trump doesn't understand the 19 at this stage...

TomOnBoard

RobertKK wrote: »

https://twitter.com/Acyn/status/1275567239517868033?s=20

Interestingly, one of the co-founders of that Students for Trump outfit was arrested last week for wire fraud. He is charged with setting himself up as a high powered lawyer and defrauding putative clients out of fees.

"According to the federal government, at the same time he was building a nationwide political network and serving as one of the most visible young faces of Trump’s populist movement, Lambert was also posing online as a high-powered New York lawyer, eventually making off with tens of thousands of dollars in fees he stole from unwitting clients seeking legal services."

Sounds like kindred spirits to me...

https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2019/05/09/trump-john-lambert-students-lawsuit-jail-226802

aloyisious

amdublin wrote: »

What's the story with Arizona? I'd worry about the spread of coronavirus amongst all those clapping seals

It'll be like the Tulsa rally, you KNOWINGLY attend at your own risk and of those whom you mingle with there and at home and work on later dates.

From MSN. The Mayor of Phoenix urged President Donald Trump and attendees at his Tuesday campaign rally in the city to wear face masks in accordance with her new ordinance requiring the facial coverings in public places as the state's coronavirus infections surge. The president did not wear a mask. Mayor Kate Gallego said on Sunday that she wasn't planning to enforce the $250 fine for not wearing a mask at the rally. But she argued that the event will also violate the Center for Disease Control and Prevention guidelines advising social distancing and mask-wearing.

"While I do not believe an event of this magnitude can be held safely, particularly as Arizona sees rising COVID cases, the President has decided to continue with this rally," Gallego said in a Monday statement to Business Insider. "Everyone attending tomorrow's event, particularly any elected official, should set an example to residents by wearing a mask. This includes the President."

Gallego added that city authorities had contacted Trump's campaign and the church to inform them of the city's mask-wearing policy.

"The goal of this policy is not to hand out citations but to educate the public on the virus and its transmission," she said.

Aloyisious quote: there's also some doubt about the capability of the air-filtration system being touted as a safety measure by the church owners where the event is being run to clean the air inside - they claim it can kill 99% of Covid-19 in the air there.

@RobertKK: at this stage, it's probably more should one take Trump's supposed question seriously as to what the 19 mean at face value given his record in posing such questions of the crowd he's addressing? It's likely a speech-rhetorical device.

sydthebeat

Biden as short as 8/13 now with the bookies.
Trump far out as 6/4


In a two horse race that's a massive gap, and trump can't fall back on his "wadda ya got to lose" that got him over the line last time. Voters have had nearly four years to see exactly what kind of person he is.

Itssoeasy

The opening testimony of a federal prosecutor who is testifying today before congress about the roger stone case has been released and Jesus h Christ if it was a movie script you might not believe it. William Barr should have some explaining to do but I doubt he will because the trump administration don't like having to answer questions so the AG will probably ignore it. The opening statement also neatly reminds people of the mueller report.

Billy Mays

Someone doesn't like people discussing President Donald Trump in the President Donald Trump discussion thread

Igotadose

A different tGOP'er, one that the #IMPOTUS did not endorse, has won the primary in North Carolina. So, some rejection from within the ranks.

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/23/politics/north-carolina-primary-madison-cawthorn/index.html

Professor Moriarty

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

They were "whataboutery" 10 mins ago. Glad that we have moved on from the buzzwords and into the realm of reality.

Having previously quoted Terminator 2 and the lord of the rings in his recent speeches I shouldn't have been surprised to hear him quote mean girls and as part of a bet. My bad. That's the accepted level of politician here.

Never forget Orange man bad. Its very important.

If you'd like to draw comparisons, 82% of Irish people thought Leo did a good job in responding to the pandemic. Do you happen to know what do US citizens think of The Donald's response to the pandemic?

ancapailldorcha

Mod: Trolling posts and responses deleted. The thread is about Donald Trump. A user has been banned. No more nicknames please.

Midlife

Just listening to Luke O'Neil on the radio who was saying that one of the big successes in this country was the clear concise guidance given by the Taoiseach in conjunction with the health services. That's a big factor with regard to how well we're doing.

Trump was doubting and complaining about restrictions before restrictions were even introduced. He's pretty much abdicated all responsibility regarding control of the virus.

That's your comparison. Not who quoted what.

It's not orange man bad. It's that the US have messed up this crisis.

I don't like Leo, I don't like FG. But they handled this pretty well. That's all that matters.

Trump prioritised the economy so maybe in a few months you may be able to argue that a roaring US economy makes all the additional deaths worth it.

It doesn't look that way.

Unless your in private health care where you're charging people over a million for a month in ICU, it's hard to see how anyone could claim that this has been handled well in the states.

Penn

Midlife wrote: »

Just listening to Luke O'Neil on the radio who was saying that one of the big successes in this country was the clear concise guidance given by the Taoiseach in conjunction with the health services. That's a big factor with regard to how well we're doing.

Trump was doubting and complaining about restrictions before restrictions were even introduced. He's pretty much abdicated all responsibility regarding control of the virus.

That's your comparison. Not who quoted what.

It's not orange man bad. It's that the US have messed up this crisis.

I don't like Leo, I don't like FG. But they handled this pretty well. That's all that matters.

Trump prioritised the economy so maybe in a few months you may be able to argue that a roaring US economy makes all the additional deaths worth it.

It doesn't look that way.

Unless your in private health care where you're charging people over a million for a month in ICU, it's hard to see how anyone could claim that this has been handled well in the states.

Agreed. I certainly didn't vote for FG in the last or even previous election. No love for them at all. But regardless of Harris not knowing why Covid-19 was named that, or Leo quoting films in his speeches to the public, their actual handling of the response to the pandemic has been pretty good. Not perfect, probably not even "great", but pretty good.

Compare it to other countries (UK, Sweden) and particularly the US, and there is a huge difference. The US has abjectly failed in their response at the Federal level. Some states did reasonably well (or as well as they likely could have), but at the Federal level, Trump disasterously and hopelessly failed at almost every step because his concern was the numbers and the stock market instead of human lives, and now many states (and particularly red states) are starting to see huge spikes in cases because the virus was not contained when they had the chance to do so, and people in those states are likely not going to agree to another lockdown.

Leo quoting Lord of the Rings does not matter. I'd also argue that there's a difference between Simon Harris not knowing why Covid-19 was named that and Donald Trump being wilfully ignorant of why it's called that since he's just trying to throw out names like "China Virus" and "Kung Flu", but it's a moot point anyway and nothing more than distraction.

More lives have been and will continue to be lost and destroyed due to Trump's failure to deal with the virus.

Igotadose

Midlife wrote: »

Just listening to Luke O'Neil on the radio who was saying that one of the big successes in this country was the clear concise guidance given by the Taoiseach in conjunction with the health services. That's a big factor with regard to how well we're doing.

Trump was doubting and complaining about restrictions before restrictions were even introduced. He's pretty much abdicated all responsibility regarding control of the virus.

That's your comparison. Not who quoted what.

It's not orange man bad. It's that the US have messed up this crisis.

I don't like Leo, I don't like FG. But they handled this pretty well. That's all that matters.

Trump prioritised the economy so maybe in a few months you may be able to argue that a roaring US economy makes all the additional deaths worth it.

It doesn't look that way.

Unless your in private health care where you're charging people over a million for a month in ICU, it's hard to see how anyone could claim that this has been handled well in the states.

I think it was Christy42 that said had Trump handled the Covid-19 crisis well, November would have been a slam dunk for him. I agree. Frankly, handling the crisis didn't have to be as bad as it was done. For one, there were plenty of ventilators in storage: https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/trump-inherited-more-ventilators-than-have-been-distributed/

He had the Defense Authorization act available for ensuring PPE was created in a timely way and distributed.

There was loads of Intel available starting in 2019 about this illness. No action.

It's likely the way the 'border closure' with Europe was handled actually made it worse; huge crowds at NYC airports likely spiked the NYC outbreak; when you're in a queue for hours in an enclosed area with other people, some of whom are carriers, what do you expect? Perhaps a more gradual lockdown would have eased things. It's no coincidence the worst early outbreak was in NYC, that's where the immigrants returned to, and the bulk of them settled locally.

Then there was all the uncertainty stoked by Trump on a daily basis at his farcical press conferences. When a reporter asks a softball question like "What can you say to people concerned about the virus," instead of some simple platitudes like "Stay indoors, we've mobilized the best medical system in the world yadda yadda", he said, "That's a nasty question."

It was over then imo. Oh, and the virus is making a return in the US as the statistics on cases show. For the record US has 3rd highest deaths per capita after Belgium and the UK. Sad, really. All that money in such a big economy and all that power, and a complete fumbling.

listermint

Igotadose wrote: »

I think it was Christy42 that said had Trump handled the Covid-19 crisis well, November would have been a slam dunk for him. I agree. Frankly, handling the crisis didn't have to be as bad as it was done. For one, there were plenty of ventilators in storage: https://www.factcheck.org/2020/06/trump-inherited-more-ventilators-than-have-been-distributed/

He had the Defense Authorization act available for ensuring PPE was created in a timely way and distributed.

There was loads of Intel available starting in 2019 about this illness. No action.

It's likely the way the 'border closure' with Europe was handled actually made it worse; huge crowds at NYC airports likely spiked the NYC outbreak; when you're in a queue for hours in an enclosed area with other people, some of whom are carriers, what do you expect? Perhaps a more gradual lockdown would have eased things. It's no coincidence the worst early outbreak was in NYC, that's where the immigrants returned to, and the bulk of them settled locally.

Then there was all the uncertainty stoked by Trump on a daily basis at his farcical press conferences. When a reporter asks a softball question like "What can you say to people concerned about the virus," instead of some simple platitudes like "Stay indoors, we've mobilized the best medical system in the world yadda yadda", he said, "That's a nasty question."

It was over then imo. Oh, and the virus is making a return in the US as the statistics on cases show. For the record US has 3rd highest deaths per capita after Belgium and the UK. Sad, really. All that money in such a big economy and all that power, and a complete fumbling.

Taking science seriously and actioning what 'smart' people were saying was all seen as a leftist conspiracy. The whole thing was a roadshow of the push against intellect. nothing more.

Thats the reality of it.

Leroy42

What I don't understand is why Trump is continuing on the path or trying to ignore the problem.

I understood his drive to reopen the economy, been if I didn't agreed with it, I could at least understand the political calculations. Get people back working, economy was his, in his won head at least, strong suit, and hope that any 2nd wave was held back until too late in the election cycle or is early to bluff a way through it.

But the numbers of terrible. The cases are shooting up. the only saving grace is that it seems that death rate of those newly infected has dropped (many theories on this, IMO its that many younger people are getting infected so less likely to die).

But whatever, what can he possibly think will be the outcome of this strategy to pretend it is over? He can see the numbers, he can see the trends. It is becoming increasingly likely that certain states, or at least counties, will have to lock down again. That is going t really even worse than if they had waited.

Surely he can't be thinking that this will all just go away? I mean even if he does, surely those around him, even those in the GOP, must be able to see the craziness of that strategy.

abff

Leroy42 wrote: »

What I don't understand is why Trump is continuing on the path or trying to ignore the problem.

I understood his drive to reopen the economy, been if I didn't agreed with it, I could at least understand the political calculations. Get people back working, economy was his, in his won head at least, strong suit, and hope that any 2nd wave was held back until too late in the election cycle or is early to bluff a way through it.

But the numbers of terrible. The cases are shooting up. the only saving grace is that it seems that death rate of those newly infected has dropped (many theories on this, IMO its that many younger people are getting infected so less likely to die).

But whatever, what can he possibly think will be the outcome of this strategy to pretend it is over? He can see the numbers, he can see the trends. It is becoming increasingly likely that certain states, or at least counties, will have to lock down again. That is going t really even worse than if they had waited.

Surely he can't be thinking that this will all just go away? I mean even if he does, surely those around him, even those in the GOP, must be able to see the craziness of that strategy.

I think Trump's current strategy could be described as a "Hail Mary pass". His only chance of winning the election is for some 'miracle cure' to be found that will resolve the problem and he is putting all his eggs in that particular basket.

The fact that this strategy could cost thousands upon thousands of lives is irrelevant to him. it's 'win at all costs' and nothing else matters to him.

Penn

abff wrote: »

I think Trump's current strategy could be described as a "Hail Mary pass". His only chance of winning the election is for some 'miracle cure' to be found that will resolve the problem and he is putting all his eggs in that particular basket.

The fact that this strategy could cost thousands upon thousands of lives is irrelevant to him. it's 'win at all costs' and nothing else matters to him.

I think he knows he can't fix the virus without significant impact to the economy, so instead he's going to do whatever he can to boost the economy's numbers (stock market, jobs) and campaign on that while blaming the numbers related the virus (cases, deaths) on China and probably governors of Dem states where applicable.

Quin_Dub

Leroy42 wrote: »

What I don't understand is why Trump is continuing on the path or trying to ignore the problem.

I understood his drive to reopen the economy, been if I didn't agreed with it, I could at least understand the political calculations. Get people back working, economy was his, in his won head at least, strong suit, and hope that any 2nd wave was held back until too late in the election cycle or is early to bluff a way through it.

But the numbers of terrible. The cases are shooting up. the only saving grace is that it seems that death rate of those newly infected has dropped (many theories on this, IMO its that many younger people are getting infected so less likely to die).

But whatever, what can he possibly think will be the outcome of this strategy to pretend it is over? He can see the numbers, he can see the trends. It is becoming increasingly likely that certain states, or at least counties, will have to lock down again. That is going t really even worse than if they had waited.

Surely he can't be thinking that this will all just go away? I mean even if he does, surely those around him, even those in the GOP, must be able to see the craziness of that strategy.

That's exactly what he thinks - Or at least he thinks he can make it look like it's gone away , hence the "slow down the testing" stuff.

I think that's part of why the crappy attendance at the week-end will hurt him so much - It's evidence that his "powers of persuasion" aren't enough.

People are still (rightly) concerned about Covid-19 and mass gatherings and even Trump telling them that everything was fine wasn't enough.

All he's ever had was braggadocio and "showmanship" . He doesn't have policies , he doesn't have plans he just has a list of petty grievances that he used to be able to appeal to people with, which all essentially boiled down to blaming "the other" for everything.

Now however the two biggest things that people are worried about are Getting Sick and losing their job.

He and his administration are wholly responsible for the success or failure of both of those things so his ability to blame "the other" has been taken away from him.

He's a one trick pony and his trick is totally broken.

amandstu

Leroy42 wrote: »

But the numbers of terrible. The cases are shooting up. the only saving grace is that it seems that death rate of those newly infected has dropped (many theories on this, IMO its that many younger people are getting infected so less likely to die).

.

I have heard that , but also that the overall the daily death numbers will inevitably go up again to reflect the increase in new daily infections since it lags behind by a good few weeks (I think the hospitalisation rate is increasing all the while in those states)

Call me Al

Penn wrote: »

I think he knows he can't fix the virus without significant impact to the economy, so instead he's going to do whatever he can to boost the economy's numbers (stock market, jobs) and campaign on that while blaming the numbers related the virus (cases, deaths) on China and probably governors of Dem states where applicable.

Completely agree.
He's going to brazen this out and attempt to divert blame for the virus on to others. I think he believes that his only hope at election success is an economic recovery.

He doesn't have the intelligence to understand that the two will go hand in hand until well past November. Sure it's hard for his supporters to identify a surge when their country is permanently half way up that trajectory of new cases... qed you shouldn't be diagnosing them.

duploelabs

Quin_Dub wrote: »

That's exactly what he thinks - Or at least he thinks he can make it look like it's gone away , hence the "slow down the testing" stuff.


He's a one trick pony and his trick is totally broken.

It's this logic that baffles me, it's like you can't get pregnant if you don't take a pregnancy test

salmocab

amandstu wrote: »

I have heard that , but also that the overall the daily death numbers will inevitably go up again to reflect the increase in new daily infections since it lags behind by a good few weeks (I think the hospitalisation rate is increasing all the while in those states)

Unless the way deaths are reported changes, if they stop reporting the deaths as Covid related then that number will slow right down. Numbers aren’t people to this administration.

Quin_Dub

Call me Al wrote: »

Completely agree.
He's going to brazen this out and attempt to divert blame for the virus on to others. I think he believes that his only hope at election success is an economic recovery.

He doesn't have the intelligence to understand that the two will go hand in hand until well past November. Sure it's hard for his supporters to identify a surge when their country is permanently half way up that trajectory of new cases... qed you shouldn't be diagnosing them.

Absolutely - The 2 Biggest issues are inherently interconnected and his only plan right now is to break one in a vain attempt to fix the other.

But it's consistent with his entire World-view.

Money is the most (only) important thing , so he'll break anything to "make" more money , he cannot comprehend how or why some people would place things like health ahead of making money.

serfboard

Quin_Dub wrote: »

he cannot comprehend how or why some people would place things like health ahead of making money.

Yeah, what was that thing again about him being a germophobe? :rolleyes:

Call me Al

salmocab wrote: »

Unless the way deaths are reported changes, if they stop reporting the deaths as Covid related then that number will slow right down. Numbers aren’t people to this administration.

I think I saw it reported elsewhere (maybe here?) that Florida were now reporting Covid ICU cases as ICU cases only if they required ventilators.

This will be the tip of the iceberg when it comes to the politically expedient massaging of hospital numbers.. itll be interesting to see how this develops.

moon2

Call me Al wrote: »

I think I saw it reported elsewhere (maybe here?) that Florida were now reporting Covid ICU cases as ICU cases only if they required ventilators.

And this is one of the reasons why Americans won't be allowed enter Europe. If you're failing to adequately test and report covid infection rates then you won't be on the "allow" list.

The current non-binding guidance which will be distributed will contain a list of countries considered to be "low risk" due to how well they are handling the pandemic. Low risk countries would be allowed enter Europe.

The US is not a low risk country.

Leroy42

moon2 wrote: »

And this is one of the reasons why Americans won't be allowed enter Europe. If you're failing to adequately test and report covid infection rates then you won't be on the "allow" list.

The current non-binding guidance which will be distributed will contain a list of countries considered to be "low risk" due to how well they are handling the pandemic. Low risk countries would be allowed enter Europe.

The US is not a low risk country.

Trump is going to go ballistic.

He has too. He can't simply accept it as natural consequence of the numbers, as he did when he stopped China and then EU entry, but to accept would mean he accepts that things should be better.

He will have to rail against the EU elite, "we saved them in two wars and simply because they hate how I have MAGA and stopped them from ripping us off in NATO, climate change and of course the totally unfair trade deficit, so the EU are the new enemy of the American people" or something similar

pixelburp

moon2 wrote: »

And this is one of the reasons why Americans won't be allowed enter Europe. If you're failing to adequately test and report covid infection rates then you won't be on the "allow" list.

The current non-binding guidance which will be distributed will contain a list of countries considered to be "low risk" due to how well they are handling the pandemic. Low risk countries would be allowed enter Europe.

The US is not a low risk country.

Is this actually happening though? I'd heard tell the EU might be banning travel from US, Brazil and Russia, but hadn't heard confirmation it'd happen for real. Seems like a potentially incendiary move politically. That'd be the first time in history America would become a "don't go there" country, right?

aloyisious

Re the U.S economy, Steve Mnuchin [Sec Treasury] was on TV [think it was the Bloomberg Finance channel] yesterday saying it was possible that the US economy would be out of recession before the year ended.

Also from Bloomberg & MSN: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-e2-80-99s-2020-path-gets-trickier-with-us-formally-in-recession/ar-BB15g4YP

Just imagine the what-if if Trump had promoted the mask for production in the U.S of washable re-usable masks, instead of panning it daily.