Dublin City Council rent arrears

Gatling

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Aah, I can't keep up.
One minute people are moaning about homelessness. The next minute, people are shouting for mass evictions.

Being Saying it for a while it's a total piss take we have homelessness but yet thousands appear to be living rent free on forever homes,

How do fix this ?

Ignore it ?
Send a few letters that will be dumped on some green space along with the rest of their household rubbish (don't pay for that to be disposed)?
Evict one in the hope estates suddenly want to pay ?

Can't take it at source because there welfare payments are protected and it can only be reduced by relatively small amount

noodler

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Aah, I can't keep up.
One minute people are moaning about homelessness. The next minute, people are shouting for mass evictions.

Think that is hyperbole tbh.

Social housing tenants should pay a fairer rent and should pay it on time.

This would help councils in their homeless challenge.

Idbatterim

You can analyze it to death. It’s scum taking advantage of the worlds weakest government, while struggling workers are screwed! Serve the ban !

You don’t need a thesis to work this one out! Varadkar has actually played a blinder on extortionate property prices again though , so his leadership , will have been anything but a total joke for him !

A worker on 34k two budgets ago , got less than a euro a week back in usc cuts. Lads how much is your rent increasing by ? Of course the welfare warriors got their weekly fiver. Great investment! Can’t imagine any areas it would be spent better !

ted1

The Student wrote: »

LPT is supposed to fund the local amenities. Everybody ues local amenities eg parks, street lights etc.

Hence on the UK they call it a council tax and the occupant pays.

Diceicle

Am I understanding this correctly?

"The average weekly rent is €69.41 with the highest weekly rent charge registered as €265.87. The weekly rent is .....calculated at 15% of the household’s biggest earner."

This highest registered rent of €265 - in order for that payment to be 15% of the highest salary in the household, one of the occupants has to be earning €1,774 a week, or ~ €92,500 per annum.

Is that correct?

Graham

Mod Note

Idbatterim do not post in this thread again. Do not reply to this post on thread.

Several posts have been deleted.

Folks, if you're looking for a place for general government/council/social-housing-tenant bashing, this isn't it.

If you would like to discuss DCC rent arrears and specific government/council policy/action/inaction in a level headed manner, go for it. We look forward to the debate.

Geuze

Diceicle wrote: »

Am I understanding this correctly?

"The average weekly rent is €69.41 with the highest weekly rent charge registered as €265.87. The weekly rent is .....calculated at 15% of the household’s biggest earner."

This highest registered rent of €265 - in order for that payment to be 15% of the highest salary in the household, one of the occupants has to be earning €1,774 a week, or ~ €92,500 per annum.

Is that correct?

Based on the info we have, yes.

There is a TD living in social housing. Somewhere in Dublin/Wicklow?

It's not surprising that somebody, out of the thousands of tenants, earns 92k.

Diceicle

Geuze wrote: »

Based on the info we have, yes.

There is a TD living in social housing. Somewhere in Dublin/Wicklow?

It's not surprising that somebody, out of the thousands of tenants, earns 92k.

A SF TD if I'm not mistaken. Whoever they are, surely a letter from the council telling them they have 1-3 years to get their affairs in order and sort their own, non-state-subsidised accommodation would be in order?
I mean, from my reading of the article, one could reasonably assume there might be another earner in the house, and if they have a reasonable wage, the earnings for the family could be in excess of €125,000 per year gross - while living in council accommodation.
Somethings not right with that.

Klonker

Diceicle wrote: »

Am I understanding this correctly?

"The average weekly rent is €69.41 with the highest weekly rent charge registered as €265.87. The weekly rent is .....calculated at 15% of the household’s biggest earner."

This highest registered rent of €265 - in order for that payment to be 15% of the highest salary in the household, one of the occupants has to be earning €1,774 a week, or ~ €92,500 per annum.

Is that correct?

Yeah I find that whole part of the article confusion. Here in states that it's 15% of highest earner but I always assumed it was a % of total earners of household. If its true as is wrote that makes it a bigger joke again and the whole social housing rent calculation and collection needs an overhaul.

Sweet.Science

How long before the whole thing becomes private? The government have taken big steps towards this already. Cant come soon enough

Fiftyfilthy

I think , whilst there should be some focus on social housing , equally there should be more investment and upkeep of hostels

A clean, safe hostel is then a viable alternative for people who are homeless, have never and will never work , not rewarding them with free houses to pay or not pay their rent.

cosybeach

states in bed with this allowing similar exist in the private rental sector under the rtb process and delayed mortgage re-processions to banks. council tenants are empowered by left politicians and many homeless charities in dublin advocating a zero eviction policies.
I agree a policy of deduct at source and review under utilized accommodation would be a start.
lpt should have been on the house holder not the owner.

X111111111111

The Student wrote: »

Hold on 60% are in arrears so you suggest we tackle a token number of those with the highest arrears. We can we tackle all of them. Agree reasonable repayment schedule not years and years. If the tenant does not adhere to the agreement then move them out of Dublin. Tough if they work in Dublin, if they don't adhere to the repayment schedule then all bets are off.

Yeah move them out of Dublin by all means but don't then turn around and complain when there is nobody to wipe your parents arses in the nursing homes, clean the sewers of fatbergs, mind your kids in creche, deliver your packages and pack your supermarket shelves. Or maybe businesses could pay a better wage so these people could afford a mortgage (hold on we haven't enough houses opps)

Geuze

Geuze wrote: »

Based on the info we have, yes.

There is a TD living in social housing. Somewhere in Dublin/Wicklow?

It's not surprising that somebody, out of the thousands of tenants, earns 92k.

I think that a Socialist /Solidarity /AAA TD lives in a social property.

The Student

X111111111111 wrote: »

Yeah move them out of Dublin by all means but don't then turn around and complain when there is nobody to wipe your parents arses in the nursing homes, clean the sewers of fatbergs, mind your kids in creche, deliver your packages and pack your supermarket shelves. Or maybe businesses could pay a better wage so these people could afford a mortgage (hold on we haven't enough houses opps)

Their rent is based on their income and yet they don't pay their full rent which has been assessed on their income. This issue is not what they are being paid it is what they are not paying which is based on their income.

These people as you describe them are those who are availing of social housing specifically because they would never earn enough to house themselves.

If they get a higher wage do you think they would suddenly have a moral ephipony and start paying their way when they can't or wont on a much lower rent than any mortgage would cost!

X111111111111

The Student wrote: »

Their rent is based on their income and yet they don't pay their full rent which has been assessed on their income. This issue is not what they are being paid it is what they are not paying which is based on their income.

These people as you describe them are those who are availing of social housing specifically because they would never earn enough to house themselves.

If they get a higher wage do you think they would suddenly have a moral ephipony and start paying their way when they can't or wont on a much lower rent than any mortgage would cost!

I've no idea but i'd imagine the better one gets paid the more chance they can make rent payments. It's all well and good saying let them move out of Dublin but to where and do you think someone on minimum wage is going to commute from let's say Athlone to Dundrum daily?

enricoh

enricoh wrote: »

Average weekly rent for a council house in Dublin is e69 a week!
If I've any kids turning 18 stick them on the housing list, best pressy ever!

Just to get more of a handle on the numbers:

Total households = 24,574
60% in arrears = 14,745
Number over 7k in arrears (5%) = 1,229
Remainder owing less than 7k = 13,516 households

total owed = €33,000,000
Top amount owed = €38,000
Next 6 (at least 27k each) = €162,000
1,229 who owe at least 7k = €8,600,900
remainder owed = €24,199,100

So just over 13,500 houesholds owe just over €24 million
That works out at €1,790 owed, on average.
If the €69 per week figure you say is true, then there are 13 and a half thousand households in Dublin which owe about 26 week's rent.

That's exactly half a year.......55% of social housing tenants are 6 months in arrears. Pretty mindblowing.

Old diesel

Was looking at articles on this exact 33 million arrears thing.

40 percent of arrears was in the under 500 euro category. You only need to miss ONE week to end up in that category.

About a further quarter are something like 2 k or less.

DCC have got 4 procession orders recently....

2 of the tenants settled the arrears in full.

A third - agreed a plan with DCC.

The fourth was evicted but "not made homeless" - no idea how that works.

There's going to be another 3 procession orders this month apparently.

Law changed recently to allow DCC seek procession orders.

Old diesel

Do we have any figures for what the arrears rate is for private rental.....

How many private tenants are in arrears and the total amount.

And re fair rent - how might we define fair rent for private tenants.

Seems odd that fair rent only becomes an issue when too little is paid.

Is there such a thing at all as too much rent or rent being unfair because it's stupidly high cost.

The Student

X111111111111 wrote: »

I've no idea but i'd imagine the better one gets paid the more chance they can make rent payments. It's all well and good saying let them move out of Dublin but to where and do you think someone on minimum wage is going to commute from let's say Athlone to Dundrum daily?

if you read my previous post you will see I said that the council make an arrangement with those tenants in arrears and once the tenant adheres to the arrangement then that would be okay.

What I also said that if the tenant does not adhere to the arrangement then all bets are off and they are moved out of Dublin.

If they don't adhere to the arrangement then there should be consequences otherwise why make an arrangement.

AndrewJRenko

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Sweet.Science

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The Student

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The Student

Old diesel wrote: »

Do we have any figures for what the arrears rate is for private rental.....

How many private tenants are in arrears and the total amount.

And re fair rent - how might we define fair rent for private tenants.

Seems odd that fair rent only becomes an issue when too little is paid.

Is there such a thing at all as too much rent or rent being unfair because it's stupidly high cost.

With respect this is thread is about social tenants who are given a subsidized rent based on their ability to pay and yet they still go into arrears.

This non payment of rent is affecting everybody who has to pay local property tax in Dublin City Council and also the wider tax payer.

If you want to discuss the issues of private rent then by all means start a thread accordingly.

The Student

Old diesel wrote: »

Was looking at articles on this exact 33 million arrears thing.

40 percent of arrears was in the under 500 euro category. You only need to miss ONE week to end up in that category.

About a further quarter are something like 2 k or less.

DCC have got 4 procession orders recently....

2 of the tenants settled the arrears in full.

A third - agreed a plan with DCC.

The fourth was evicted but "not made homeless" - no idea how that works.

There's going to be another 3 procession orders this month apparently.

Law changed recently to allow DCC seek procession orders.

Which means that 60% are in arrears of over 500 and of that 60% 45% are therefore in arrears of over €2k (by your own figs).

Based on these figs where the max that someone previous quoted of rent was €269 a week this means that some tenants are at least 8 weeks in arrears? or longer if they were only part paying.

X111111111111

Deleted User wrote: »

Just to get more of a handle on the numbers:

Total households = 24,574
60% in arrears = 14,745
Number over 7k in arrears (5%) = 1,229
Remainder owing less than 7k = 13,516 households

total owed = €33,000,000
Top amount owed = €38,000
Next 6 (at least 27k each) = €162,000
1,229 who owe at least 7k = €8,600,900
remainder owed = €24,199,100

So just over 13,500 houesholds owe just over €24 million
That works out at €1,790 owed, on average.
If the €69 per week figure you say is true, then there are 13 and a half thousand households in Dublin which owe about 26 week's rent.

That's exactly half a year.......55% of social housing tenants are 6 months in arrears. Pretty mindblowing.

People on low wages can't afford to make rent shocker.

X111111111111

The Student wrote: »

if you read my previous post you will see I said that the council make an arrangement with those tenants in arrears and once the tenant adheres to the arrangement then that would be okay.

What I also said that if the tenant does not adhere to the arrangement then all bets are off and they are moved out of Dublin.

If they don't adhere to the arrangement then there should be consequences otherwise why make an arrangement.

Moved out of Dublin to where?

Seth Brundle

X111111111111 wrote: »

People on low wages can't afford to make rent shocker.

Is there actual evidence that they can't afford to pay?

X111111111111

X111111111111 wrote: »

People on low wages can't afford to make rent shocker.

The rent is directly tied to earnings.......the lower the the wages, the lower the rent due. Who says they can't afford it, anyway?

splinter65

noodler wrote: »

Need to start charging based on ability to pay.

It is charged on ability to pay. Tenants are means tested and it’s reviewed every year. It’s the willingness to pay that’s the problem.