N+?

fat bloke

Or "buying a bike when you don't need a bike".

My btw scheme is available to me again this year. Last time around I bought a fantastic mtb but I didn't really use it all. I'm wondering what to do this time around. I have a really really good bike and a very good bike and when I build my bowman Palace R up that'll be another very (or maybe even really) good bike .
So I don't need or want a 1000 euro entry level road machine and history has taught me that mtb'ing really isn't my thing. Is there a cx or gravel bike actually worth buying for a grand? 10kg of sora doesn't excite me particularly.. Unless maybe I went around the shops hoping to get lucky in the sales?

smacl

For me the big plus for a CX or gravel bike is exploring all the tiny l-roads and bohereens that would be passable on a road bike but uncomfortable to the extent it would be joyless. West and South of Ireland are great in this respect and you can join up circuits that wouldn't be otherwise accessible. I tend to use a combination of open streetmaps, and Google maps in satellite view (e.g. sat, streetview), sketch a route, chuck into onto the Garmin and go from there. Had a great weekend in Loop head over the summer doing this which wouldn't have been a runner on a road bike, 29er hard tail would have been grand too but for me the CX bike hit the sweet spot.

Not so great in Wicklow as most of the Coilte stuff is quite repetitive with lots of dead ends, making it hard to get a decent route. Alek on this forum would be the man to talk to on this with the Weevil 200.

magicbastarder

speaking of which, Alek has not been around in ages?

Plastik

I'm on that same horse with a BTW available to me again since the start of the year. I've a purchase order raised from Canyon for a Grail AL6.0 but haven't pushed it through yet. Looking at about €1,360 delivered. I was hoping to pick up a 2019 Nukeproof Digger somewhere on discount but they're hard to find. The 2020 bikes are out and I'm just not bothered dropping the guts of €2k on another bike that I don't actually need.

fat bloke

I just had a mooch around today at a couple of shops. Was surprised at how nice both a giant tcx and a giant revolt looked in reality. I saw the revolts on line and thought they were awful looking, but they look great on the showroom floor. You are talking more like 1599 - 1799 though which is a whole other spend-commitment.

fat bloke

How does a grail 6 compare to this Plastik?

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/ie/tcx-slr-2

2019 tcx for 1279

bikedude

+1 for a gravel bike. Got one this year and is a fun bike.
Done some of the Ticknock official trails on it and is grand.
Got a Road Plus wheelset with 27.5 47cc tires and is a capable little bike.

Plastik

fat bloke wrote: »

How does a grail 6 compare to this Plastik?

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/ie/tcx-slr-2

2019 tcx for 1279

Comparable and not really at the same time. The cx equivalent to that TCX is the Canyon Infinite AL and comes with the exact same groupset at the exact same pre-discount Giant RRP. The Grail is gravel bike, which yep, is very much like a CX bike, but will come with slacker "mtb" geometry compared to a CX "road" geometry, and the gravel frames generally have a little extra tyre clearance - but that differs brand to brand.

You can use a CX bike to go off road rambling and you can use a gravel bike to go CX racing but they're better at what they're designed for, mostly because of the geometry. The slacker gravel geo lends itself to better off road stability at the expense of being a bit more ponderous to race on because the steering is slower. Much as I love watching VDP racing CX I've yet to have the urge to bother, and living where we are there's plenty off road exploring that could be done!

8valve

I'm going to throw a curveball here...

Speaking from experience, if you are happy with the bikes you have, why not use his years btw to upgrade some components or wheels on your current bikes?

magicbastarder

that's not permitted. the BTW scheme can only be used to buy a bike and accessories - accessories are optional but buying a bike is mandatory to qualify.

OP, i would suggest a recumbent.

Macy0161

fat bloke wrote: »

How does a grail 6 compare to this Plastik?

https://www.giant-bicycles.com/ie/tcx-slr-2

2019 tcx for 1279

The Revolt is the Giant gravel bike.

Topstone Tiagra isn't much more than the Grail 6.0 once you add in delivery, and you can get it in a shop. It's the new Tiagra Hydraulic levers (FSA Crankset, same as the 105 Topstone) v GRX 10 Speed of the Grail 6.0.

Personally, I'm loving the Gravel spins, but I don't have to do much road to get off road, and then only hit back roads. And that's been with my heavy as f*ck, over geared Kona Rove AL! Can't wait to get going on the Topstone.

btw I was bit like that regarding btw. I definitely needed a new gravel bike, but the carbon one's didn't really float my boat, so decided not to stretch too far over the grand.

iwillhtfu

I'll most likely be picking up a gravel bike myself this year. Ever since I built up a genesis on 26" rims and 2.3" tyres they make absolutely perfect sense for pretty much everything unless speed on tarmac is your aim then obviously ou'd use a road bike.

I love the look of this ribble with the tan walls

https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/ribble-cgr-al-orange-sram-apex-1x/

Macy0161

The cgr 725 was my top pick, but they don't do Irish bike two work.

bingobars

Ribble on BTW?

iwillhtfu

Macy0161 wrote: »

The cgr 725 was my top pick, but they don't do Irish bike two work.

Ah crap really. Are you sure it's not just vouchers they don't accept? I do recall something about them having to be registered for Irish VAT or something along those lines.

bingobars

Also for BTW can you not buy a frame set and add your own parts?

Is there some kind of rolling rule?

I’ve been bringing my own cup recently when buying coffee...

bingobars

Ribble on BTW?

Plastik

Macy0161 wrote: »

The cgr 725 was my top pick, but they don't do Irish bike two work.

That's a pity, they did previously, I bought an R872 mkI from them through the BTW in 2015.

secman

magicbastarder wrote: »

speaking of which, Alek has not been around in ages?

I messaged him a few months back when i realized he wasn't out... alls well with him..just on a different path.

fat bloke

Jeez planet x do full carbon and sram 1x for 1299 (£)! Weight is still the 9.3 though which is similar to the Canyon grail Al.

ReReg Numpty

Once your core needs are met - racer, tourer, singlespeed/ fixed for knocking about on....then next up is a fat bike or perhaps at a pinch, a gravel bike.

Fat bikes truly are a wonder. The sound of their tyres on the road would be enough to want one. When the apocalypse comes, the last men standing will those who own one...

Oberkon

fat bloke wrote: »

Jeez planet x do full carbon and sram 1x for 1299 (£)! Weight is still the 9.3 though which is similar to the Canyon grail Al.

They do some nice titanium ones too - tempest or pickenflick are tasty
Canyon grail AL is also sweet .

Actually would be nice to have a few gravel type races here .
Dirty Kanza Irish style !

CramCycle

iwillhtfu wrote: »

they make absolutely perfect sense for pretty much everything unless speed on tarmac is your aim then obviously ou'd use a road bike.

I just put slicks on mine and there isn't a huge amount of difference over my road bike for speed. I can't hold the max speed as long but it isn't a bad option, just swap the tyres out depending on the occasion, truly a versatile choice.

bingobars wrote: »

Ribble on BTW?

No shop is on the BTW, it is your employers choice who they buy from, technically any shop that will sell a bike is an option.

bingobars wrote: »

Also for BTW can you not buy a frame set and add your own parts?

Is there some kind of rolling rule?

I’ve been bringing my own cup recently when buying coffee...

Nope, has to be a complete bike

magicbastarder

i would assume that if you buy a frame and parts within the one purchase - enough to build a complete bike - that this would count.
you can't buy the parts separately from the BTW purchase though.

Macy0161

Oberkon wrote: »

They do some nice titanium ones too - tempest or pickenflick are tasty
Canyon grail AL is also sweet .

Actually would be nice to have a few gravel type races here .
Dirty Kanza Irish style !

Yep, tempest was also on the list, but they also wouldn't do the Irish bike to work.

There was the Lakelander Gravel Grinder last year, and back again this year. There's also a Galway one (3G's) on the CI calendar but I haven't seen further details.

fat bloke

ReReg Numpty wrote: »

When the apocalypse comes, the last men standing will those who own one...

Jaysus, I reckon if I ever need to escape something apocalyptic, I'd be quicker on foot than on a fat bike!

CramCycle

Macy0161 wrote: »

Yep, tempest was also on the list, but they also wouldn't do the Irish bike to work..

Just to be clear, it is not that any shop doesn't do the BTW scheme, all shops do it in that from their perspective, it is just another sale. it could be your employer won't but from a certain shop or deals with a middle man who won't but no shop "does the BTW scheme".

Plastik

fat bloke wrote: »

Jeez planet x do full carbon and sram 1x for 1299 (£)! Weight is still the 9.3 though which is similar to the Canyon grail Al.

It's all the bits and pieces though isn't it, heavy tyres, heavy wheels, disc groupsets.

Macy0161

CramCycle wrote: »

Just to be clear, it is not that any shop doesn't do the BTW scheme, all shops do it in that from their perspective, it is just another sale. it could be your employer won't but from a certain shop or deals with a middle man who won't but no shop "does the BTW scheme".

Well both planet x and Ribble told me I couldn't purchase through the Irish bike to work - they wouldn't facilitate it. They were both listed on my employers list of suppliers, my employer pays by bank transfer, but they would not allow me to purchase from them. I have (several) emails and live chat histories from both of them to that effect! No idea why, as no voucher or anything that would cost them anything.

If a supplier/ shop won't provide the necessary paperwork, won't bill an employer, won't accept a two part payment, how do they accept bike to work?

CramCycle

Macy0161 wrote: »

Well both planet x and Ribble told me I couldn't purchase through the Irish bike to work - they wouldn't facilitate it. They were both listed on my employers list of suppliers, my employer pays by bank transfer, but they would not allow me to purchase from them. I have (several) emails and live chat histories from both of them to that effect! No idea why, as no voucher or anything that would cost them anything.

If a supplier/ shop won't provide the necessary paperwork, won't bill an employer, won't accept a two part payment, how do they accept bike to work?

That's not them not accepting the bike to work, that's them not accepting your employees form of payment. That's it. Bike shops do not operate the Irish Bike to work scheme, to them it is simply a purchase, nothing else. If your employer paid by Credit Card, problem solved. The necessary paperwork is a quote, you can get that off their website, your employer just has to pay for it. Alot of middlemen operate on the basis that a bike shop has to accept the bike to work scheme, it's simply not true. If a bike shop in the US accepted cash for a bike as the only form of payment and your employer was willing to facilitate that, then you could buy from them, simple as that.

They never have to have heard of the scheme, they just have to take payment from your employer.

Macy0161

I think this is getting a bit pedantic. Whatever way you want to say it, they wouldn't facilitate what I needed - invoice, VAT details, split payment (as over €1000), bank details etc., so I couldn't use the bike to work scheme as operated by my (substantially sized) employer which is a direct payment model. Others, apparently, will be grand.