Election called for Saturday 8 February

JohnnyFlash

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

FG are already softening on the pension age. They thought it wasn't an issue, yet on the doorstep it is.

It’s a bit of a non issue at the moment. There won’t be a state pension in 20 years time so it won’t matter a curse what age you set retirement for.

Plumbthedepths

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

It’s a bit of a non issue at the moment. There won’t be a state pension in 20 years time so it won’t matter a curse what age you set retirement for.

If it's a non issue it makes you wonder why FF/FG are scrambling to try and up come up with a coherent policy.

Phoebas

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

FG are already softening on the pension age. They thought it wasn't an issue, yet on the doorstep it is.

It's an issue alright.

The big question is will the electorate be bought off with their children's money.

JohnnyFlash

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

If it's a non issue it makes you wonder why FF/FG are scrambling to try and up come up with a coherent policy.

And SF. SF are saying they are going to let people retire at 65. Long term it doesn’t matter. People are living far too long and the pension pot is going to run dry. It’s also what’s causing the health service to collapse around us. So they can all promise what they want but it doesn’t change the reality - people who were dying at 75 one time are now living to 85 and 90. And that’s unsustainable.

2030 is touted as the year things finally breakdown.

is_that_so

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

If it's a non issue it makes you wonder why FF/FG are scrambling to try and up come up with a coherent policy.

Probably because SF are claiming they can reverse it! 2021 and an increase to 67 has also made everybody suddenly notice it. With 65 people could still have been potentially working part of that year up to 66, now there's a "gap" year.

Plumbthedepths

Phoebas wrote: »

It's an issue alright.

The big question is will the electorate be bought off with their children's money.

Just going to offer a reality check, no one who has worked for 40 plus years is going to entertain that comment, 'their children's money'.

Plumbthedepths

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

And SF. SF are saying they are going to let people retire at 65. Long term it doesn’t matter. People are living far too long and the pension pot is going to run dry. It’s also what’s causing the health service to collapse around us. So they can all promise what they want but it doesn’t change the reality - people who were dying at 75 one time are now living to 85 and 90. And that’s unsustainable.

2030 is touted as the year things finally breakdown.

There is no pension pot, it's all funded from day to day spending.

Geuze

cosybeach wrote: »

Does it matter when the high rate of tax is below the average industrial wage and none of the parties are not talking about this more focus on the welfare state that where the votes are

A good point.

Geuze

smurgen wrote: »

Also would love to see the pension age for politicians be brought in line with the public.

This has happened.

All TDs will get their State Pension the exact same time as you or me.

Also, the age they can receive their work pension has been increased.

It used to be 50.

Now 65, I think.

It will be 68.

Geuze

Yurt! wrote: »

I think a third tax bracket in between the higher and lower rate might ease the burden on those on the middle-income strata. people on 30-40k (or even as far as 50k) shouldn't be on the highest rate of PAYE.

Yes, the top rate of, say 50%, all-in, should not start until double or triple average earnings.

Maybe 90k or 120k?

Idbatterim

With the black holes of health , housing. Ff planned buy off off everything. Expect the marginal rate to kick in at twenty five k over the next few years. They’ll probably start branding the private sector workers on the forehead with a star!

Phoebas

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Just going to offer a reality check, no one who has worked for 40 plus years is going to entertain that comment, 'their children's money'.

Here's the reality check:
- In Ireland, life expectancy is currently 81.6; that's 16.6 years of pension to be paid from a retirement age of 65.
- Our current ratio of workers to pensioners is 5:1, and this is projected to fall to 2:1 by 2050

We fund pensions for old people out of the taxes paid by young people, so it's obvious that we will not be able to maintain the current levels indefinitely.

Obviously it's election time now, so populist parties will be tempted to promise the sun, moon and stars and leave this problem to the next generation, who'll be left in dire poverty in their old age.

Idbatterim

Phoebas wrote: »

Here's the reality check:
- In Ireland, life expectancy is currently 81.6; that's 16.6 years of pension to be paid from a retirement age of 65.
- Our current ratio of workers to pensioners is 5:1, and this is projected to fall to 2:1 by 2050

We fund pensions for old people out of the taxes paid by young people, so it's obvious that we will not be able to maintain the current levels indefinitely.

Obviously it's election time now, so populist parties will be tempted to promise the sun, moon and stars and leave this problem to the next generation, who'll be left in dire poverty in their old age.

Yeah and who’s to the forefront of it all? Ff , what a surprise. It’s the young they are fcuked in this country , not the old. This previous budget , there were no welfare increases or tax cuts. Coming into an election year with a booming economy. So take whatever these morons tell you , with a tanker load of salt !

I really think the people here need to be reminded of what ff are again , by bringing another crash on us ! The last few days have shown , that ff haven’t changed one iota ! Yeah let’s show fg , by bringing another crash onto ourselves. Except those rats will scurry off with the big pensions etc and it will be the actual vulnerable hit ! But yeah let’s stick it to fg , they may be ****. But they are the best we have in my opinion

pjohnson

Idbatterim wrote: »

Yeah and who’s to the forefront of it all? Ff , what a surprise. It’s the young they are fcuked in this country , not the old. This previous budget , there were no welfare increases or tax cuts. I’m an election year with a booming economy. So take whatever these morons tell you , with a tanker load of salt !

:pac:

Still gunna pretend you were ever gunna vote FF over FG?

Dwarf.Shortage

I think the ultimate solution to the pensions crisis is going to have to be along the lines of a universal 4% levy on all earnings no cut offs or exemptions which is matched by the employer and put into a ringfenced pension fund for the individual, not a communal pot the government can raid whenever they are short.

PRSI could be reduced to partially offset the burden as pensions would no longer come out of current spending (after a few years obviously). Investment funds which are made available on the national scheme should be straightforward low fee index funds and any individual with a pension arrangement that involves more than 8% going in should be exempt, it's about setting a floor and making sure everyone has some level of provision.

Someone earning the average industrial wage for life can expect a pot of €335,000 (in todays euros) under this regime, enough to provide more than the state pension for themselves.

Idbatterim

pjohnson wrote: »

:pac:

Still gunna pretend you were ever gunna vote FF over FG?

Pretend ? Who started the thread on this forum about fg poor performance which is still going string ? Banned from politics for one too many varadkar attacks. Yet I still think that party , which I berate and as bad as they are , are on another planet to ff. The last few days of ff talk has proven that ! Bring the economy down again, looking forward to years of cuts etc , the children emigrating , maybe not seeing their grandkids. Once ffg can try to win votes from the most comfortable in society , that’s all that matters. They should start paying them for their free trips with their travel card. Pay them to agend gp visors with their medical card

Idbatterim

Dwarf.Shortage wrote: »

I think the ultimate solution to the pensions crisis is going to have to be along the lines of a universal 4% levy on all earnings no cut offs or exemptions which is matched by the employer and put into a ringfenced pension fund for the individual, not a communal pot the government can raid whenever they are short.

PRSI could be reduced to partially offset the burden as pensions would no longer come out of current spending (after a few years obviously). Investment funds which are made available on the national scheme should be straightforward low fee index funds and any individual with a pension arrangement that involves more than 8% going in should be exempt, it's about setting a floor and making sure everyone has some level of provision.

Someone earning the average industrial wage for life can expect a pot of €335,000 (in todays euros) under this regime, enough to provide more than the state pension for themselves.

The pension paid out , should be based on what you paid in! Like in Germany , although when would we ever operate a system that well run countries do ?!

McMurphy

There are no words.


https://twitter.com/MHealyRae/status/1219524589686009856?s=09



:pac:

Plumbthedepths

Phoebas wrote: »

Here's the reality check:
- In Ireland, life expectancy is currently 81.6; that's 16.6 years of pension to be paid from a retirement age of 65.
- Our current ratio of workers to pensioners is 5:1, and this is projected to fall to 2:1 by 2050

We fund pensions for old people out of the taxes paid by young people, so it's obvious that we will not be able to maintain the current levels indefinitely.

Obviously it's election time now, so populist parties will be tempted to promise the sun, moon and stars and leave this problem to the next generation, who'll be left in dire poverty in their old age.

If you wish to use the word 'populist' I'm afraid in this case it applies to all parties including the incumbent.
If you think a political party or politician is willing to go head to head with the 'grey vote' I admire your optimism.

Plumbthedepths

pjohnson wrote: »

:pac:

Still gunna pretend you were ever gunna vote FF over FG?

You saw through his rants aswell? I don't even bother replying anymore.

Idbatterim

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

If you wish to use the word 'populist' I'm afraid in this case it applies to all parties including the incumbent.
If you think a political party or politician is willing to go head to head with the 'grey vote' I admire your optimism.

You don’t think ff are more populist than fg? You have to be somewhat populist in politics. Ff are on another planet

ninebeanrows

Surely it's a win win for a party to come out and say they're going to reduce high tax rate to 38% at next budget, would sweep up the votes, easy

Eric Cartman

Sleety_Rain wrote: »

Surely it's a win win for a party to come out and say they're going to reduce high tax rate to 38% at next budget, would sweep up the votes, easy

But its whether theyd actually deliver is the question, FG campaigned right and delivered left, cant trust it wont happen again

scrumqueen

mikemac2 wrote: »

I for one was very surprised to hear Mary Hanifan was still around and going for this election. I knew she lost out in the 2016 general election and I never heard or read a single line in the media about her since

I suppose I figured she was retired Well I was wrong on that

She topped the polls at LE 19, which I was also surprised at given I thought she had fecked off somewhere since hadn't heard a thing about her in years.

ricero wrote: »

Simon Harris on Claire Byrne live now looks worn out and tired.

Very much like Fine Gael.

I thought he came across quite well.

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Simon Harris is a such a weasel. Absolutely abhorrent at his job.

Laying into Stephen Donnelly who has worked professionally fixing health systems across the world for Accenture.

I think Stephen is clearly better placed to work through Slaintecare.

Actual LOL. Stephen Donnelly was an absolute car crash on CB last night. Had the absolute temerity to start promoting slaintecare plans as FF manifesto agenda and got absolutely caught out.

He came across as a complete joke and his constituents haven't forgotten about him jumping ship and will remind him of it very soon.

Snow Garden

is_that_so wrote: »

Probably because SF are claiming they can reverse it! 2021 and an increase to 67 has also made everybody suddenly notice it. With 65 people could still have been potentially working part of that year up to 66, now there's a "gap" year.

I was told that in 20 years time there will not be enough money to pay public service and state pensions so people will be means tested. Basically anyone with decent private pensions will not get the state pension.

christy c

Phoebas wrote: »

Here's the reality check:
- In Ireland, life expectancy is currently 81.6; that's 16.6 years of pension to be paid from a retirement age of 65.
- Our current ratio of workers to pensioners is 5:1, and this is projected to fall to 2:1 by 2050

We fund pensions for old people out of the taxes paid by young people, so it's obvious that we will not be able to maintain the current levels indefinitely.

Obviously it's election time now, so populist parties will be tempted to promise the sun, moon and stars and leave this problem to the next generation, who'll be left in dire poverty in their old age.

Great summation, should be printed out and handed to anyone that calls looking for a vote.

Cork Boy 53

Snow Garden wrote: »

I was told that in 20 years time there will not be enough money to pay public service and state pensions so people will be means tested. Basically anyone with decent private pensions will not get the state pension.

Told by whom?

LeinsterDub

Phoebas wrote: »

Here's the reality check:
- In Ireland, life expectancy is currently 81.6; that's 16.6 years of pension to be paid from a retirement age of 65.
- Our current ratio of workers to pensioners is 5:1, and this is projected to fall to 2:1 by 2050

We fund pensions for old people out of the taxes paid by young people, so it's obvious that we will not be able to maintain the current levels indefinitely.

Obviously it's election time now, so populist parties will be tempted to promise the sun, moon and stars and leave this problem to the next generation, who'll be left in dire poverty in their old age.

If only there was trillion dollar companies we could tax!

markodaly

Phoebas wrote: »

It's an issue alright.

The big question is will the electorate be bought off with their children's money.

The Irish electorate has always thrown their kids under the bus, so long as they get a few €€€ in return.

It seems FG is the only party holding firm over the rise of the pension age, which is classic FF, as they agreed to it and signed off on it now.
But they will sell their granny/kids if it means it gets them power.

Yet, some say it can't get worse than FG? LOL! They will learn.

Plumbthedepths

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

Told by whom?

Paschal.