Sinn Fein's Paddy Holohan and homophobia

FrancieBrady

Nift wrote: »

ah just get ****ed seriously. a rant? **** off

Is that not the definition of a 'rant'?

FrancieBrady

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Read to me that he thinks you need be an Irish, (by his standards) person and straight to understand what straight Irish people need/want. Ignorant.
I'd expect he thinks the same for the French in France etc.
This implies that you need be Irish, (by his standards) and straight to be a better leader, than Leo is. In that to understand something you need be it. Dumb.
Leo is a lesser politician than most but that's nothing to do with his lineage or orientation.

Exactly my take on it. Healy Rae level dumb.

garhjw

as paddy is a member of Sinn Fein, it shows his lack of character. He’s not the most intelligent lad so he probably didn’t choose his words well. However its difficult argue the words were taken out of context. There were racist and homophobic tones to them.

weldoninhio

Nift wrote: »

jaysis. there are no words. You are defending him, his comment was racist (as well as potentially homophobic - harder to say)

Just because my daughter has south african indian heritage makers her no less irish than you or i. No less passionate, no less enthusiastic about Ireland, no less gaelic, not seperated etc etc. And if somebody said that to her i'd break their face. She's 11, just like Leo and his siter was some time in the past. Both Irishmen and women.

I mean is Paddy so certain of his pure blood?

As i said the last weak the irony at least among much of Dublin's SF core is their British heritage, a leftover from the 18th century boomtime in building and dockers.

Racist my hole. And threatening violence, classy. I’m sure your daughter is very proud of her big man daddy.

Nift

I can accept he has come out and given a half assed apology. But like i said all it does is highlight how much of a complete mish mash SF is. I mean in way its laudable and progressive that a lad from Jobstown can be on the same side as a lass from rathgar/Notre Dame. thats the true SF socialist ideals right there. But its completely unworkable because what Paddy said is believed by loads of angry white males across Dublin who happen to support a pro immigration SF. And they definitely don't have Paddy's capacity to think nor the understanding of how pro-immigration policies effect their communities apart from non irish = bad. And middle class voters get scared of this stuff, no matter how many times Blackrock Eoin comes to your door.

Its the connundrum they will never ever solve.

Nift

weldoninhio wrote: »

Racist my hole. And threatening violence, classy. I’m sure your daughter is very proud of her big man daddy.

it is racist you clown. and your inability to see it as such paints you as a similar racist. which i'm sure your family is proud of as well.

Woke Hogan

Nevermind the alleged homophobia, there was no amnbiguity about his other comments about Varadkar's Irishness. Holohan is a racist thicko and he should be cast into the wilderness by Sinn Féin. If they hurry he'll be able to hold his hero McGregor's spit bucket on Saturday.

Lefty Bicek

weldoninhio wrote: »

Racist my hole. And threatening violence, classy. I’m sure your daughter is very proud of her big man daddy.

The odds of an internet hardman lasting three seconds in the octagon with Paddy Holohan...

Plumbthedepths

Fair play the gob****e made an apology for comments he shouldn't have said, cudos to Leo for accepting the apology. Now the story is put to bed, what next ....


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/varadkar-accepts-apology-from-sf-councillor-paddy-holohan-over-controversial-comments-38867738.html

Nift

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

The odds of an internet hardman lasting three seconds in the octagon with Paddy Holohan...

yeah of course but still i'd give it a lash. anyway he didn't say it to me directly did he. Like i said i doubt the man is racist but his comment is and will be misinterpreted by ignorant cnuts across the land.

Yeah fair enough look it seems to be done and dusted.

But lets be honest with what the reply was -

Mr Varadkar responded to the Sinn Féin councillor’s remarks saying: “I understand that he has apologised in the last few hours and you know that’s good enough for me.”

He added that there’s a “wider issue”.

Mr Varadkar said: “I think anyone in Ireland who is from a minority background - whether mixed race or gay or lesbian - has experienced some form of racism or homophobia in their lives.

“I am fortunate in that I haven’t received too much of that, I know it has been a lot worse for a lot many other people.”

Mr Varadkar said: “One of the things I would like to do if I am re-elected as Taoiseach is to run another cross-Government campaign against racism..

“We just need to raise awareness of the issue and make sure that we have a properly united country, whether you are a man or woman, no matter what background you come from, whether you are a member of the travelling community or not, or who you love.

“None of those things should matter in the kind of society I believe in.”

Mr Varadkar said parties should dump candidates if they engage in anti-immigrant retrorockets.

Fine Gael deselected Verona Murphy in Wexford after she made controversial remarks linking immigrants to Isil.

He said: “Every party has to have standards and we have learned from experience in that regard in my party and we have revised our party pledge on foot of that.”

Returning to Mr Holohan’s remarks he said: “But at the same time, I think if somebody makes a remark that they regret and they apologise and they withdraw it, I think that should be accepted.

“And I accept in this case the apology has been made.”

FrancieBrady

Nift wrote: »

I can accept he has come out and given a half assed apology. But like i said all it does is highlight how much of a complete mish mash SF is. I mean in way its laudable and progressive that a lad from Jobstown can be on the same side as a lass from rathgar/Notre Dame. thats the true SF socialist ideals right there. But its completely unworkable because what Paddy said is believed by loads of angry white males across Dublin who happen to support a pro immigration SF. And they definitely don't have Paddy's capacity to think nor the understanding of how pro-immigration policies effect their communities apart from non irish = bad. And middle class voters get scared of this stuff, no matter how many times Blackrock Eoin comes to your door.

Its the connundrum they will never ever solve.

Can't be arsed reading that rambling again, but I did notice a bit of pigeonholing and class conscious stuff. Who the hell is 'Blackrock Eoin'?

FrancieBrady

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Fair play the gob****e made an apology for comments he shouldn't have said, cudos to Leo for accepting the apology. Now the story is put to bed, what next ....


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/varadkar-accepts-apology-from-sf-councillor-paddy-holohan-over-controversial-comments-38867738.html

'Shergar Found In Mary Lou's Freezer'?

Nift

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Can't be arsed reading that rambling again, but I did notice a bit of pigeonholing and class conscious stuff. Who the hell is 'Blackrock Eoin'?

i think that's cause you can't read Francie, clearly.

Eoin Ó Broin, educated in Blackrock college, of a party that likes to call Fine Gael posh boys. Pot. Kettle.

There's no class bashing at all. Its just the reality of the coming election and its a clear weakness for Sinn Fein. I mean if they can ever sqaure that circle from Blackrock to Jobstown they are laughing. But they can't cause its all incompatible.

anyway Its alright for lads like yourself to bash Leo's backgrounds etc?

James Brown

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Exactly my take on it. Healy Rae level dumb.

I think the Healy Rae play that up, this lad ain't so smart.

Lefty Bicek

Nift wrote: »

yeah of course but still i'd give it a lash. Like i said i doubt the man is racist but his comment is and will be misinterpreted by ignorant cnuts across the land.

You see, I don't believe that is his responsibility.

If we don't wish to agitate all the ''ignorant cnuts across the land'', then a useful start could be made by not throwing out the 'racist' card every time 'they' say the politically incorrect thing.

You must surely agree with this, since you say yourself that you doubt he is racist. Yet you see him being called so by the usual suspects here ?

FrancieBrady

Nift wrote: »

i think that's cause you can't read Francie, clearly.

Eoin O'broinn, educated in Blackrock college, of a party that likes to call Fine Gael posh boys. Pot. Kettle.

I didn't know that's what O'Broin was nicknamed.

And I never called FG posh boys either. Remember I have 'Loadsa Money' Hughie to deal with here.

Nift

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

You see, I don't believe that is his responsibility.

If we don't wish to agitate all the ''ignorant cnuts across the land'', then a useful start could be made by not throwing out the 'racist' card every time 'they' say the politically incorrect thing.

You must surely agree with this, since you say yourself that you doubt he is racist. Yet you see him being called so by the usual suspects here ?

My daughter is mixed heritage. Indian South African Irish as it happens. As i said -

“Eamon Devalera's blood ­obviously runs to Spain. His great-grandfather is not part of the history of this ­country. Now Dev obviously is.

"He’s an Irish ­citizen but his ­passion doesn’t go back to the times when our passion goes back to"

Imagine he said that. Its clearly nonsense. And dangerous talk as Leo has indicated, even while accepting the apology.

It is his responsibility, ffs, he's an elected representative of a party hoping to get into power. One that is engaging in multiple double speak.

gmisk

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Fair play the gob****e made an apology for comments he shouldn't have said, cudos to Leo for accepting the apology. Now the story is put to bed, what next ....


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/varadkar-accepts-apology-from-sf-councillor-paddy-holohan-over-controversial-comments-38867738.html

Half assed apology...no way is that it put to bed imo

MayoAreMagic

blanch152 wrote: »

And what point was Holohan trying to make?

Only straight Irish people with children should be Taoiseach?

I am struggling to understand the point he was making, perhaps you might elaborate.

He never said they needed to be straight in fairness.
I believe he was trying to say that was in his opinion the person who is leading the country now and in the future, should ideally have some first hand experience of raising children.
I dont think anyone could deny that this would give him more insight into the views and concerns of parents, so obviously there is some logic to it.
Incidentally, if varadkar was a straight, married man with 2 kids, and hoolahan said he was doing a great job and that he really understood the daily issues parents face, would people be upset?

Plumbthedepths

gmisk wrote: »

Half assed apology...no way is that it put to bed imo

Well Leo has accepted the apology, but you carry on with the outrage on behalf of Leo. Hero.

Lefty Bicek

Nift wrote: »

My daughter is mixed heritage. Indian South African Irish as it happens. As i said -

“Eamon Devalera's blood ­obviously runs to Spain. His great-grandfather is not part of the history of this ­country. Now Dev obviously is.

"He’s an Irish ­citizen but his ­passion doesn’t go back to the times when our passion goes back to"

Imagine he said that. Its clearly nonsense. And dangerous talk as Leo has indicated, even while accepting the apology.

It is his responsibility, ffs, he's an elected representative of a party hoping to get into power. One that is engaging in multiple double speak.

We aren't going to agree about this.

He is responsible for what he says.

He is not responsible for how others choose to perceive/manipulate/exploit that.

Or at least, for myself, I don't accept his responsibility in that. I prefer to think for myself and take responsibility for my own actions. Rather than blame others.

What he has done is to shine a light on attitudes that are already there. I don't believe for one second that he has changed, or stimulated into action, one single person by what he said.

I'm not a bit surprised by what he said, re Leo being 'separate'. I hear it frequently in the workplace and socially.

All that ould ****e about bloodlines and all that, to me is just 'warrior-speak' gone wrong.

Immature, but nothing else.

ILoveYourVibes

Is this the same one who went on about Irish people having a background of stories about ireland and Varadkar not having that?

Lefty Bicek

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Is this the same one who went on about Irish people having a background of stories about ireland and Varadkar not having that?

Nift

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

We aren't going to agree about this.

He is responsible for what he says.

He is not responsible for how others choose to perceive/manipulate/exploit that.

Or at least, for myself, I don't accept his responsibility in that. I prefer to think for myself and take responsibility for my own actions. Rather than blame others.

What he has done is to shine a light on attitudes that are already there. I don't believe for one second that he has changed, or stimulated into action, one single person by what he said.

I'm not a bit surprised by what he said, re Leo being 'separate'. I hear it frequently in the workplace and socially.

All that ould ****e about bloodlines and all that, to me is just 'warrior-speak'.

Immature and inappropriate, but nothing else.

to you. Its obviously not to Leo as his actual reply before accepting the apology was - “We just need to raise awareness of the issue and make sure that we have a properly united country, whether you are a man or woman, no matter what background you come from, whether you are a member of the travelling community or not, or who you love. “None of those things should matter in the kind of society I believe in.”

So why bring it up at all. the fact that the intention wasn't racist doesn't make it not a racist comment. This is the reality of our world. I mean personally i'm for the Morgan Freeman idea of stop labels. But even that is seen as racist in some american circles. Look i get what your saying but if you said this stuff to certain people in certain places you'd be done. Say it in a meeting or a professional interview you're done etc. thats the reality no matter what you think. IF someone said that to my daughter i would construe that as racist, i'm sorry to say. the break face thing was my anger at some of the attitudes. I'd call them out on it though.

Of course we'll have people say Leo is milking it. People who have no clue about racism or homophobia in any way. Probably the first person to bring up...sure weren't the Irish slaves...its toxic thinking. And i hate PC molly coddling culture in many cases. But this isn't that. Again its framed by the bigger picture of Sinn Fein and their hypocrisies/clash of cultures. They'd be the first to jump on that wagon if the roles were reversed.

pjohnson

Ex-UFC fighter not the best at trying to communicate shocker.

James Brown

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Is this the same one who went on about Irish people having a background of stories about ireland and Varadkar not having that?

Varadkar and Flanagan have plenty of 'stories' about Irish history.

Nift

pjohnson wrote: »

Ex-UFC fighter not the best at trying to communicate shocker.

try elected representative...

walshb

Not sure how anyone can interpret Holohan’s comments any way, other than a disgrace, really. Racist, homophobic, or whatever label one wants to put on them.... SF really are stooping low...

He should be removed from the party if this is the type of volatile guff that he is liable to come out with.

gmisk

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Well Leo has accepted the apology, but you carry on with the outrage on behalf of Leo. Hero.

That's me, in fact this song was wrote about me!
https://youtu.be/kPZRb4_G7sc

KiKi III

walshb wrote: »

Not sure how anyone can interpret Holohan’s comments any way, other than a disgrace, really. Racist, homophobic, or whatever label one wants to put on them.... SF really are stooping low...

He should be removed from the party if this is the type of volatile guff that he is liable to come out with.

It’s mad to see people denying the clear racism and homophobia of the remarks. There really is no way to misinterpret what he said.