People like SF candidates but won't vote for SF

mossie

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Eoin O’Duffy, co-founder of Fine Gael, sent troops to the Spanish Civil war to fight on the same side as Nazis and wanted to send troops to fight alongside the nazis against the Soviet Union but people won’t vote Sinn Féin because of their history?

Just on this O'Duffy left Fine Gael in September 1934, Spanish civil war was 1936-39, WW2 1939-45. He had no association with Fine Gael at the time of either conflict.

Granny15

mossie wrote: »

Just on this O'Duffy left Fine Gael in September 1934, Spanish civil war was 1936-39, WW2 1939-45. He had no association with Fine Gael at the time of either conflict.

He was a lifelong blue shirt and despite his extreme right wing persona he put out was a renowned gay( much like many of the extreme right wingers)

ricero

Just had a Finna Fail canvessar at my door.

He nearly had a heart attack when i told him i was voting Sinn Fein and that his party destroyed most hope and aspirations for my generation (18-35).

Whelo79

ricero wrote: »

Just had a Finna Fail canvessar at my door.

He nearly had a heart attack when i told him i was voting Sinn Fein and that his party destroyed most hope and aspirations for my generation (18-35).

Good man Ricero, I'd have loved to see that reaction.

ressem

Snow Garden wrote: »

At the same time I am always puzzled with how much FFG supporters attack SF with every opportunity. They really fear them. The usual suspects are falling over themselves on Boards to continually highlight their IRA links. It's a bit creepy to be honest. I doubt any one of them have any real empathy for victims like Jean McConville.

In more recent times I will always recall that it was FFG governments that continually ignored massive Garda corruption and tried to bury honest men like Maurice McCabe.

As I keep saying, FF and FG need to merge. SF would remain a smaller fringe party and maybe we could get some more viable alternative parties to emerge.

Isn't that careless stereotyping of SF opponents?
They must all be FFG or DUP or Tory or Labour (Irish)?
You believe there's no possibility that SF has made their own opponents by their own bad actions, falsehoods and associations?

Ideal would be FF, FG, SF all disbanding and allowing parties that are about today and the future rather than trading on historical party and family name recognition.
e.g. leftist parties rather than a dictatorship in waiting. Center conservative or progressive parties vs the current lot trading on historical reputations of their predecessors' vote buying from pensioners or farmers.

James Brown

Hamsterchops wrote: »

This is the problem with all Sinn Fein threads.....

Unsavoury baggage & all that goes with it, from the PIRA being the enemy of this State to being the enemy of the vast majority of the people of NI, to being the enemy of the people of Great Britain .... and yet you get the PIRA fan boys on here justifying their own brand of terrorism "call it a war" then you can kill who you like (Warrington) raid as many post offices, do loads of Bank jobs, kidnappings, disappearances + kill a few Garda too, all with impunity.

This is the underlying problem with SF and their supporters who have their own take on history, and their own corrupt & twisted version of events, in a universe where Seamus Mallon & the SDLP accounted for nothing while Gerry & the boys were the heroes of the AK-47 & Semtex :mad:

For the day that's in it, and the of memory of Seamus Mallon, I really hope Sinn Fein lose lots of seats in this election.

I agree. People supporting parties with a poor record in government need bring up the IRA everytime, which I get.
You've your idea about SF supporters and it's that attitude feeds the way these threads go.
The only ones attempting to re-write history are FG.
Having opinions on historical fact is not the same thing as re-writing it.
Mallon wouldn't have achieved what he did being so biased and dismissive of others.
For most of us it's simply tired and boring.

gormdubhgorm

endainoz wrote: »

Cash for ash caused Stormont to fall, have had an abstentionist policy for over 100 years, their voters know that.

Economic policy is always the go to one here, would it be any worse than austerity?

Rubbish that cash for ash v Irish language act is just a silly game both sides are playing in NI. It is a joke really.
Also if SF did not have an abstentionist policy in Westminster they would have more votes in the ROI. Particularly in light of how they could have changed the game with Brexit.

Also most SF voters demographic in the ROI at the moment are those with links to NI in the ROI - and/or the tattoo wearing working class who enjoy the mystic of being associated with the edgy mystic of SF past.

But SF has tried to widen it's appeal away from this hardcore demographic, trying to get more middle class and educated people to vote for them. It is part of the reason we have seen a femininisation SF.
A softer look less threatening and a move away from the beards of old.

Most of the electorate in the ROI just would not trust SF in government. But SF have a definite strategy trying to make people think they are a viable alternative to FG/FF.
When in reality more would vote for independents/Labour/PBP etc before SF, as SF still has that murky image. It is tarnished and sullied.

It places SF in a difficult position because the more they move away from the murky past. The more they will alienate thier 'hardcore' support.
Plus Mary Lou was clearly made leader to 'Southernise' the party after Gerry's departure. But then there is the problem that the electorate in NI do not identify with a Southern former FF member. Which is why they have to adopt the stronger 'republican' credentials of Michelle O'Neill in NI.

Basically all this causes SF to be all over the place as they are playing too different games -in two different political landscapes.
I figure SF need another 50 years of stability before those in the ROI can take them seriously without fear.

piplip87

Good article by Maria Cahill. Although I would expect not one Shunner to actually constructively take the article apart and give valid reasons as to why it's wrong.


Remember the email from HQ guys.....

1) Don't bother with the facts just attack the person and scream anti media bias

https://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/mairia-cahill-want-to-see-what-sf-would-do-look-north-38895734.html

Whelo79

piplip87 wrote: »

Good article by Maria Cahill. Although I would expect not one Shunner to actually constructively take the article apart and give valid reasons as to why it's wrong.


Remember the email from HQ guys.....

1) Don't bother with the facts just attack the person and scream anti media bias

Link?

piplip87

Whelo79 wrote: »

Link?

Apologies

https://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/mairia-cahill-want-to-see-what-sf-would-do-look-north-38895734.html

Bishop of hope

Interesting reading here!
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/20000-northern-ireland-households-are-now-homeless-37719853.html

woohoo!!!

SF are going to hoover up a lot of the centre left vote because that is what their policies reflect, a standard position by european social democrat norms. GFA was over 20 years ago, former IRA people are dead or retiring, and in my view this reason not to vote for them just does not stack up anymore.

What people remember is the recent past. They're not happy with FG and their efforts of the past 9 years. FF wrecked the place before that, and they've a large very conservative rump. Labour are not trusted.

I'm not a SF member or anything like that, a floating voter really. SF and greens will top my voting list.

RTE getting in the DUP leader during the GE campaign, is a cynical move and I don't appreciate it. Too many Of RTEs top people have family connections to FF or FG.

Del.Monte

frillyleaf wrote: »

I’ve heard people saying multiple times that they like certain SF candidates but they won’t vote for them as they are Sinn Fein. Trying to understand why there is such opposite to Sinn Fein? Have looked up online but not getting good info. Surely if someone likes a candidate and what they stand for they should vote for them? Please explain

I'm sure that this has probably been posted already but I haven't the stomach to read through pages of ****e from SF apologists to check. Below is why I and thousands from my tribe will never vote SF - they haven't gone away you know.

joe40

Del.Monte wrote: »

I'm sure that this has probably been posted already but I haven't the stomach to read through pages of ****e from SF apologists to check. Below is why I and thousands from my tribe will never vote SF - they haven't gone away you know.

You're like the English football fans still going on about the second world war. Things move on.
FF and FG were involved in bloody conflict including civil war. The rose tinted glasses don't see that far back.

McMurphy

Del.Monte wrote: »

I'm sure that this has probably been posted already but I haven't the stomach to read through pages of ****e from SF apologists to check. Below is why I and thousands from my tribe will never vote SF - they haven't gone away you know.

You have said in previous posts - loads of times that you're a Protestant and unionist living in Wexford, so I don't think the policies of a republican political party would ever appeal to you or your tribe to be honest.

smurgen

joe40 wrote: »

You're like the English football fans still going on about the second world war. Things move on.
FF and FG were involved in bloody conflict including civil war. The rose tinted glasses don't see that far back.

Leave them bang on about ancient history.the polls looking very good for SF again today.
The do nothing government of FG are falling apart.

Eric Cartman

Were sinn fein to get power , would their supporters here turn their backs if SF cut funding for or abolished the special criminal court, which they have said they wanted to do before.

FrancieBrady

piplip87 wrote: »

Apologies

https://m.independent.ie/opinion/comment/mairia-cahill-want-to-see-what-sf-would-do-look-north-38895734.html

The key line in that article is the lie about SF collapsing the executive.

They demanded Arlene Foster 'step aside' to allow an inquiry to take place. When she would not do that they effectively 'stood her aside' by shutting down the executive.
The inquiry happened.

And Maria doesn't quite understand democracy and how it works. The people deliver the mandates to govern. And if they put a party on a par or near a par with another they are indicating they want those main parties to negotiate a programme for government.

cutelad

To be honest I'm voting for them this time. Pearse Doherty should be finance minister as he's most competent person in Dail Eireann.
He wants to tax banks who don't pay any tax....
That makes sense to me..... Oh and he's after the insurance industry.... By god people open your eyes...
If your thinking about the troubles well just cast your mind back to both FF and FG past to put things in perspective

Edgware

woohoo!!! wrote: »

SF are going to hoover up a lot of the centre left vote because that is what their policies reflect, a standard position by european social democrat norms. GFA was over 20 years ago, former IRA people are dead or retiring, and in my view this reason not to vote for them just does not stack up anymore.

What people remember is the recent past. They're not happy with FG and their efforts of the past 9 years. FF wrecked the place before that, and they've a large very conservative rump. Labour are not trusted.

I'm not a SF member or anything like that, a floating voter really. SF and greens will top my voting list.

RTE getting in the DUP leader during the GE campaign, is a cynical move and I don't appreciate it. Too many Of RTEs top people have family connections to FF or FG.

Vote SF or Greens. But the Greens are not in favour of dumping the remains of diesel laundering in ditches so straight away a disagreement on policy

ressem

joe40 wrote: »

You're like the English football fans still going on about the second world war. Things move on.
FF and FG were involved in bloody conflict including civil war. The rose tinted glasses don't see that far back.

More recent then.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/sinn-f%C3%A9in-reveals-true-self-again-with-venezuela-infatuation-1.3768126

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/sinn-f%C3%A9in-reveals-true-self-again-with-venezuela-infatuation-1.3768126 wrote:

At the inquiry conducted by former judge Sir Patrick Coughlin, texts and emails from late January 2017 have emerged which show the Sinn Féin minister for finance at Stormont, Máirtín Ó Muilleoir, had to get approval for key decisions from unelected senior republican Ted Howell, a confidant of Gerry Adams.
...
Despite being urged by officials to accept the curbs, Ó Muilleoir also consulted with senior former IRA members such as Padraic Wilson and Martin Lynch, who have no elected role and are largely unknown to the public.

woohoo!!!

Edgware wrote: »

Vote SF or Greens. But the Greens are not in favour of dumping the remains of diesel laundering in ditches so straight away a disagreement on policy

If you have an actual point, by all means make it.

FrancieBrady

ressem wrote: »

More recent then.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/sinn-f%C3%A9in-reveals-true-self-again-with-venezuela-infatuation-1.3768126

Are these 'emails' published anywhere?

Edgware

woohoo!!! wrote: »

If you have an actual point, by all means make it.

O.K. Mary Lou comes out Friday praising the late Seamus Mallon. A few years ago the S.F. goons on Drogheda Council voted against Mallon getting an award for his work in the Peace Process. Hypocrisy isnt confined to FF or FG

NoviGlitzko

eagle eye wrote: »

A vote for a SF candidate you like is also a vote for Mary Lou and for more money for the wasters on social welfare and less for the ordinary hard working person who earns a decent wage. It's also a vote for a UI and that'll mean even less money in your pocket.

Financial prudence is the reason you don't vote SF.

Can you (or someone in here) elaborate on this point?

dekbhoy

If opinion polls are to be believed then Sinn Fein could and should be in government. The people are beginning to awaken . They are sick to the back teeth with FFG. All main parties have a past connected somehow to armies of the Republic. Sinn Fein are no different except it’s just more recent. The standard of representatives are putting forward seem very competent within their respective briefs . I will be Sinn Fein voting No. 1 as will most of my family that have traditionally voted Labour and Independent.

FrancieBrady

Edgware wrote: »

O.K. Mary Lou comes out Friday praising the late Seamus Mallon. A few years ago the S.F. goons on Drogheda Council voted against Mallon getting an award for his work in the Peace Process. Hypocrisy isnt confined to FF or FG

Mallon forced Hume to do a solo run on the 'Peace Process' to avoid damage to the SDLP...then was happy to jump on the bandwagon.

Old age or death doesn't diminish that fact.

woohoo!!!

Edgware wrote: »

O.K. Mary Lou comes out Friday praising the late Seamus Mallon. A few years ago the S.F. goons on Drogheda Council voted against Mallon getting an award for his work in the Peace Process. Hypocrisy isnt confined to FF or FG

Absolutely. I seen Jeffrey Donaldson praising Mallon yesterday.

efanton

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Rubbish that cash for ash v Irish language act is just a silly game both sides are playing in NI. It is a joke really.
Also if SF did not have an abstentionist policy in Westminster they would have more votes in the ROI. Particularly in light of how they could have changed the game with Brexit.

Also most SF voters demographic in the ROI at the moment are those with links to NI in the ROI - and/or the tattoo wearing working class who enjoy the mystic of being associated with the edgy mystic of SF past.

But SF has tried to widen it's appeal away from this hardcore demographic, trying to get more middle class and educated people to vote for them. It is part of the reason we have seen a femininisation SF.
A softer look less threatening and a move away from the beards of old.

Most of the electorate in the ROI just would not trust SF in government. But SF have a definite strategy trying to make people think they are a viable alternative to FG/FF.
When in reality more would vote for independents/Labour/PBP etc before SF, as SF still has that murky image. It is tarnished and sullied.

It places SF in a difficult position because the more they move away from the murky past. The more they will alienate thier 'hardcore' support.
Plus Mary Lou was clearly made leader to 'Southernise' the party after Gerry's departure. But then there is the problem that the electorate in NI do not identify with a Southern former FF member. Which is why they have to adopt the stronger 'republican' credentials of Michelle O'Neill in NI.

Basically all this causes SF to be all over the place as they are playing too different games -in two different political landscapes.
I figure SF need another 50 years of stability before those in the ROI can take them seriously without fear.

Very true, but don't you think that SF also know that.

Unlike FG/FF they dont throw away principles every time there is an election if there is the sniff of extra votes, they have a position that they actual stick to and even if you don't agree with it its something to be admired in modern politics

Polls this weekend are seriously bad news for FF/FG. SF are sucking up the young vote with their housing policy.
The young people that are the future of this country see rent freezing or rent control and the atrocious lack of publicly owned housing stock as far more important than whether SF take their seats in Westminster. They are interested in real issues, the ones that affect them.
Rent increases are crippling the younger voters, and FF FG are going to pay hte price for their inaction and failed policies.


The younger voters can see whats happening to this country, even with full employment, they are being told by FF or FG governments that there not enough money to deal with the housing crisis in an effective way. If it cant be done now it never will be, and these young voter realise that.

Jinglejangle69

100,000 social houses over 5 years is approx 25 billion euro.

I'd be genuinely interested in where we will get this money from?

If SF pull it off and don't bankrupt the country then they could be credible.