People like SF candidates but won't vote for SF

Skylinehead

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I look at these figures and I wonder is anyone actually looking at tender documents and going through them.

A quarter of a million to build two bed houses in volume...seriously???

65 though? You're incredulous at random internet comment figures, but the actual Sinn Fein manifesto is far more extreme (in the other direction).

Quarter of a million is too much, it's about 120k-160k these days. Probably not going to get that in Dublin though.

FrancieBrady

Skylinehead wrote: »

65 though? You're incredulous at random internet comment figures, but the actual Sinn Fein manifesto is far more extreme (in the other direction).

Quarter of a million is too much, it's about 120k-160k these days. Probably not going to get that in Dublin though.

I've already said I think 65 is a bit low. I don't know how they are working out the figure, so, as I also said, maybe somebody will challenge them on it.

James Brown

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Dont bust a blood vessel Matt, you're preaching the very thing you're calling out.
They aren't unproven either, they are in Govt.

I ain't busting nothing. Sitting drinking tae.
The north is a different ball of wax the FG'ers up there are honest and go under the DUP
Look FF and FG need to go. Let's see what others have to offer.

James Brown

smurgen wrote: »

How many times have Finnerbots and their elected representatives blocked development in Dublin with NIMBYism?

Leo himself.

Bishop of hope

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I ain't busting nothing. Sitting drinking tae.
The north is a different ball of wax the FG'ers up there are honest and go under the DUP
Look FF and FG need to go. Let's see what others have to offer.

We need fresh something for sure.
I agree the bull**** needs to be called out BTW, but I don't think SF are the answer to our prayers.

Skylinehead

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I've already said I think 65 is a bit low. I don't know how they are working out the figure, so, as I also said, maybe somebody will challenge them on it.

I was thinking they added the 6.5 billion onto the existing ~2 billion for housing, that would be around 90k. Maybe possible down the country, but in Dublin, not a hope. And that's where the most houses need to be built.

James Brown

Bishop of hope wrote: »

We need fresh something for sure.
I agree the bull**** needs to be called out BTW, but I don't think SF are the answer to our prayers.

Neither do I but I'll take them over FF/FG.

gormdubhgorm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I ain't busting nothing. Sitting drinking tae.
The north is a different ball of wax the FG'ers up there are honest and go under the DUP
Look FF and FG need to go. Let's see what others have to offer.

Again all this 'they need to go talk'. If people really wanted them out they would vote them out as simple as that.
Or else another party would be founded which actually clicks with the disenchanted and they become the third party.

The problem is Labour have no clothes anymore went centrist and had thier clothes all stolen by a mix of the independents/SF/PBP.

The electorate in the ROI simply do not trust SF thier only hope is that time and distance with eventually lead them to getting into power. In other words the story of the troubles becomes forgotten. So it can be reconstituted in a more palatable manner - like 1916 - the WOI etc

The Greens are a wishy-washy but well meaning urban middle class crowd who have more chance of getting into government than SF. Because they are not only environmentally friendly in thier policies, they are squeaky clean as a party. They engage young voters.
SF in contrast are still seen as a sort of protest vote in the ROI, but a crowd you would not want to hand the reins to.

FG/FF have constantly been in government in one guise or another. They are other viewpoint(s) in the country besides those in the peripheral parties.
But with the way the internet and the likes of boards.ie is set up you would swear damn all vote FG/FF.

No matter who gets elected in government there is going to be some verbals paid to childcare, housing. health and the environment.
Then the other side will say it is not enough.

James Brown

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Again all this 'they need to go talk'. If people really wanted them out they would vote them out as simple as that.
Or else another party would be founded which actually clicks with the disenchanted and they become the third party.

The problem is Labour have no clothes anymore went centrist and had thier clothes all stolen by a mix of the independents/SF/PBP.

The electorate in the ROI simply do not trust SF thier only hope is that time and distance with eventually lead them to getting into power. In other words the story of the troubles becomes forgotten. So it can be reconstituted in a more palatable manner - like 1916 - the WOI etc

The Greens are a wishy-washy but well meaning urban middle class crowd who have more chance of getting into government than SF. Because they are not only environmentally friendly in thier policies, they are squeaky clean as a party. They engage young voters.
SF in contrast are still seen as a sort of protest vote in the ROI, but a crowd you would not want to hand the reins to.

FG/FF have constantly been in government in one guise or another. They are other viewpoint(s) in the country besides those in the peripheral parties.
But with the way the internet and the likes of boards.ie is set up you would swear damn all vote FG/FF.

No matter who gets elected in government there is going to be some verbals paid to childcare, housing and the environment.
Then the other side will say it is not enough.

Are you telling me if people want a party in government they vote for them? I'll need go have a think about this.
Can I still gave an opinion on who ever does get in?
Sorry I dont buy voting for the lesser of two waster parties proven not good enough because that's the way it is.

RandomName2

johnmcdnl wrote: »

But your right, maybe I should trust SF can solve it and we'll have 65k homes flying up in 12 months time.

Can you trust the expertise of a party that has never been in government? Can you even trust that the statement is in good faith when the party is known for being reticent on very important issues, and openly dishonest in other areas?

Its own finances are a murky affair where donations abroad (from Friends of Sinn Fein, set up by Donaldson, before they removed him in a very permanent fashion) form a large part of their backbone. They claim that their members only obtain the average industrial wage, but that excess is not donated back to the state, but rather given to the party's slush fund. The party has been seen to sponge off the state, from collecting millions from Westminster (despite never attending) to even trivial things like the print cartridges here (where €50 K was run up by one TD). Last year the Monaghan councilor with the highest expenses claimed was a Sinn Fein representative. In Europe, their MEPs expenses claims were on a par with other Irish MEPs at about half a million a head.

All the signs are that they have their hands as much in the greasy till as any other party, but are a little less transparent, and a lot less experienced in managing an economy.

The party has every incentive to underestimate costs. It is likely to win them more votes, yet not enough to put them in a position to have to make good on their promises. It is a win-win situation for them.

It is tempting to look at something like the Children's Hospital or the Dáil Printer and say ' surely.. surely nobody could do a worse job'. But that is not true. Incompetency is a bottomless pit, the depths of which can never be fully plumbed.

gormdubhgorm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Are you telling me if people want a party in government they vote for them? I'll need go have a think about this.
Can I still gave an opinion on who ever does get in?
Sorry I dont buy voting for the lesser of two waster parties proven not good enough because that's the way it is.

Well where are all the Matt Barrett's then why is there not a strong third party?
Let be honest it will be decades before SF are taken seriously in the ROI at the moment they are like rap music in the ROI. More of a novelty act if anything. Might listen to them for the craic occasionally and then go back to the normal music you would listen to.

James Brown

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Well where are all the Matt Barrett's then why is there not a strong third party?
Let be honest it will be decades before SF are taken seriously in the ROI at the moment they are like rap music in the ROI. More of a novelty act if anything. Might listen to them for the craic occasionally and then go back to the normal music you would listen to.

You can try be whimsical about how sad it is in your view that we must deal with FF/FG like a fait accompli, but I believe we deserve better and should work for better.
Your attitude is why 10, 20, 30, years ago we were in the same boat. It starts with one person and grows from there. Waiting in the bushes to see if a sure winner is coming along is nuts and has us where we are. Glad you're enjoying the FF/FG **** show.

Culann

machaseh wrote: »

Sadly I don't have voter rights in Ireland as I am Dutch, but I would 100% vote for sinn fein.

Better social policies
More attention for the environment
More investment in public transportation
More taxation of major corporations
More focus on reuniting Ireland and getting rid of Brits
More focus on the Irish language.

Sadly I'll never see Sinn Féin in power as long as I live here, if it would ever happen I'd probably already be long gone.

Shame you didn't check out your rights more closely...I'm one of the Brits they want to get rid of and I can vote. As far as I know, as long as you're an EU citizen you can vote in local and national elections, not referendums.

baldbear

Sf state they don't not want to increase tax of 12.5% for multinationals? I thought they did in the past? Or am I wrong?

cutelad

I'm voting for them this time. Only alternative. Pearse Doherty looks good.

marieholmfan

Culann wrote: »

Shame you didn't check out your rights more closely...I'm one of the Brits they want to get rid of and I can vote. As far as I know, as long as you're an EU citizen you can vote in local and national elections, not referendums.

UK citizens can vote in Local and national but not referenda or presidential elections

Other EU citizens can vote in Local only

FTA69

Culann wrote: »

Shame you didn't check out your rights more closely...I'm one of the Brits they want to get rid of and I can vote. As far as I know, as long as you're an EU citizen you can vote in local and national elections, not referendums.

British citizens have different voting rights in Ireland to EU citizens.

machaseh

Culann wrote: »

Shame you didn't check out your rights more closely...I'm one of the Brits they want to get rid of and I can vote. As far as I know, as long as you're an EU citizen you can vote in local and national elections, not referendums.

I am from the Netherlands, so I am pretty sure I can't vote here, because I CAN in fact vote in the Netherlands (by mail that is).

Phoebas

cutelad wrote: »

I'm voting for them this time. Only alternative. Pearse Doherty looks good.

An extra month child benefit in July.

Sinn Fein are feckin' great. They're the only party giving away money that nobody ever asked for.

ELM327

machaseh wrote: »

I am from the Netherlands, so I am pretty sure I can't vote here, because I CAN in fact vote in the Netherlands (by mail that is).

Well, considering the damage your vote could inflict on me, I'm glad you cant vote!

Bishop of hope

cutelad wrote: »

I'm voting for them this time. Only alternative. Pearse Doherty looks good.

He is another cutelad!

Irish_peppa

I dont agree with Sinn Fein Policies on a lot of things but the local SF councillor is very active locally sorting things out. Parish Pump Politics:o
All the other main stream candidates and independents I have not heard a peep from at all. Does voting for a local Sinn Fein Councillor have any bearing ultimately on government policy albeit in a tiny tiny way?

FrancieBrady

ELM327 wrote: »

Well, considering the damage your vote could inflict on me, I'm glad you cant vote!

Over exaggerating much?

The new government will be a coalition or confidence and supply.
The essence of a proper coalition/C&S is one where each keeps an eye on the other.
That is what we got wrong...far too many party's too happy to stay in coalitions where one component was doing damage. FF-FG, FF-Greens, FG-Lab, SF-DUP etc. because essentially the 'seats' were comfy.
You do your best to compromise and govern, if the coalition/C&S is failing - you walk and go back to the people.

If party's keep in mind their commitments to those who elected them and pull the plug on bad governance, then you and I will not be overly damaged.

What chances have we of getting a coalition/C&S like that? It's clear to me anyhow, that both main parties are afraid of that 'essence'. They will resist a coalition with a party that is not afraid to walk or be walked over. For them coalition is about dominance.

We need a change.

I see sheep

Indo seems to lead every day with an anti-SF story, it's getting as bad as the Daily Mail, terrified the status quo might be altered.

blanch152

Matt Barrett wrote: »

You can try be whimsical about how sad it is in your view that we must deal with FF/FG like a fait accompli, but I believe we deserve better and should work for better.
Your attitude is why 10, 20, 30, years ago we were in the same boat. It starts with one person and grows from there. Waiting in the bushes to see if a sure winner is coming along is nuts and has us where we are. Glad you're enjoying the FF/FG **** show.

I don't disagree with you suggesting that we deserve better than Fianna Fail or Fine Gael, but why would you aim for worse in Sinn Fein?

McMurphy

Culann wrote: »

Shame you didn't check out your rights more closely...I'm one of the Brits they want to get rid of and I can vote. As far as I know, as long as you're an EU citizen you can vote in local and national elections, not referendums.

Aspiring for a UI doesn't mean getting rid of British citizens, and I'd be shocked if you didn't fully understand that.

Also, some of your voting rights will change once the uk leaves the EU.

McMurphy

Phoebas wrote: »

An extra month child benefit in July.

Sinn Fein are feckin' great. They're the only party giving away money that nobody ever asked for.

€100 conservation grant for Irish water.

Didn't need to be a customer of Irish water to avail of it.
Didn't need to spend it on water conservation.
Those who claimed it didn't didn't need to pay it back regardless if they got full refunds from Irish water.

$$Kerching$$

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

€100 conservation grant for Irish water.

Didn't need to be a customer of Irish water to avail of it.
Didn't need to spend it on water conservation.
Those who claimed it didn't didn't need to pay it back regardless if they got full refunds from Irish water.

$$Kerching$$

Is someone promising a €100 conservation grant for Irish Water in this election?

If not, the point stands that Sinn Fein are the only party giving away money that nobody asked for.

piplip87

Jaysus they want to raise to dole to 245 a week ? Looking after the key demographic right there

Bishop of hope

blanch152 wrote: »

Is someone promising a €100 conservation grant for Irish Water in this election?

If not, the point stands that Sinn Fein are the only party giving away money that nobody asked for.

But it's been done before, auction politics.