No right wing alternative= No alternative

Tony EH

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Zero hours contracts are gone, which is a shame as they were a great tool for small businesses and those starting out their careers , ok safeguarding makes sense as workers already have almost every right under the sun

No they're not and short term contracting work is the norm for a lot of people these days.

What's GONE is what was once a normal situation where you got a permanent job with a company that offered a benefits package.

Zero hours and endless rolling contracts only benefit the business owner. They don't really benefit the worker in the largest amount of cases, who are under the whim of the employer.

Loafing Oaf

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Suffocating media air tight consensus

Irish Times circulation now down near 50K. And it's still setting the agenda?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I give you, the intolerant left of today

I am intolerant of ignorant lies from people who have no idea how to debate politics, yes, now are you going to make a relevant point or just ad homeinems?

Tony EH

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Ireland isn't the USA, we don't have anything like the inequality they have

Indeed it isn't.

However, I didn't specifically mention the USA.

You really do just live in your own little mind don't ya.

Eric Cartman

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Ireland isn't the USA, we don't have anything like the inequality they have

The same people who bemoan right wingers calling left candidates communists or hard left are usually the ones that think anyone a smidge to the right in europe is **** themselves silly trying to shut down all public medicine and scrap the dole.

America is its own deal but better off not badmouthing it, they pay for all of the medicine R&D we benefit from, invest optimistically in unproven future technologies and its considered by many illegal immigrants to be a great country to have to even live in under the radar.

The lefts spooky spectre is america , a place most of us would happily live, the rights spooky spectre is communist russia 1981 which is a genuinely terrifying prospect

Eric Cartman

Tony EH wrote: »

No they're not and short term contracting work is the norm for a lot of people these days.

What's GONE is what was once a normal situation where you got a permanent job with a company that offered a benefits package.

Zero hours and endless rolling contracts only benefit the business owner. They don't really benefit the worker in the largest amount of cases, who are under the whim of the employer.

I didnt realise employees were physically chained to ine employer and cannot move work at a time of full employment....

Tony EH

Eric Cartman wrote: »

I didnt realise employees were physically chained to ine employer and cannot move work at a time of full employment....

Nobody said they were.

I do wish you nouveaux internet right wing hardshaws would stop making up stuff.

biko

Tony EH wrote: »

Indeed it isn't.

However, I didn't specifically mention the USA.

You really do just live in your own little mind don't ya.

You did mention "Western politics", doesn't that include the US?
Are we not allowed to assume it is, when it's the biggest western global powerhouse in politics?

Huntergonzo

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I give you, the intolerant left of today

Can tell the odd lie or just flat out make things up to when they're in the mood as well.

The left can get very tetchy when their views are challenged you knoe, but that's ok, it just proves our point :-)

Idbatterim

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Ireland isn't the USA, we don't have anything like the inequality they have

"equality" is a funny word, thieve from one group, so that in irelands case, in many cases, the non workers have a better living standard than low to mid income workers. That "equality" ?

I Am The Law

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Ireland isn't the USA, we don't have anything like the inequality they have

Creeping in that direction mind you.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Can tell the odd lie or just flat out make things up to when they're in the mood.

Eh - you do realsie this is exactly what I caught Max doing?

Or is lying in a debate fair game now and the blaming the other person when you get caught out?

Tony EH

biko wrote: »

You did mention "Western politics", doesn't that include the US?
Are we not allowed to assume it is?

Perhaps.

But why post elicited the response from that poster singling out America as the only comparative was strange, to say the least.

In any case, we would probably all agree that the US is a large consumerist nation with many issues. But that wasn't the point being made.

Idbatterim

Deleted User wrote: »

We need a centre right government to solve the countries problems. It's such a pity the debate is allowed to be dragged down by the twitterati spouting nonsense of racism, xenophobia and without fail always end an argument talking about trump and Brexit and how the US and UK public are morons (and therefore anyone who dares veer past the political centre is a moron too).

Here are the most important issues I see which can be solved by immigration controls:

Housing shortage
Rent crisis
Mortgage crisis (which funnily enough has now been accepted as the new normal)
Healthcare crisis
Homelessness

I fond it hilarious when people talk about needing a change in government. Change to what?? OP is 100% spot on.

we have now had a boom for years and stable government. The last budget, which they knew would be the last before an election, had no welfare increases or income tax cuts! IN IRELAND! DURING A BOOM! WITH A PRE ELECTION BUDGET! just give it a few more years, the narrative will seriously change, when people find, they arent going to get in all any more. Because many immigrants are coming in, masses of money has to spend on housing etc. When it becomes obvious to them, that the gravy train is over, with the current set up, wait till you see how attitudes will change. Health and housing are now black holes, the pension issue is a black hole! I cant wait to see how this cl**ter**** pans out over the next few years!

We have politicians who are spineless cowards, wont make anything but the easiest , most populist decisions. Well try squaring this circle you morons!

Huntergonzo

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

... eh, this is exactly what I caught Max doing - are you dillusional?!

Well you lied about me claiming I said 'I hated political labels', when I didn't and failed to address the point when I called you on it.

So yes I'm afraid you do tell the odd lie and are prone to the odd out burst.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Well you lied about me claiming I said 'I hated political labels', when I didn't and failed to address the point when I called you on it.

So yes I'm afraid you do tell the odd lie and are prone to the odd out burst.

Nice strawman.

I pointed out what I believed to be a contradcition in your post.

You never stated a fact, so I couldn't have claimed it was a lie.

Huntergonzo

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Nice strawman.

I pointed out what I believed to be a contradcition in your post.

You never stated a fact, so I couldn't have claimed it was a lie.

Don't try to hide behind 'strawman' accusations, it looks desperate to be honest.

You made something up to try and strenghten your own argument and got caught out. But it shows a real lack of integrity to then double down rather than acknowledge your dishonesty.

But hey look, that's the modern left, I expect nothing less.

Tony EH

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Don't try to hide behind 'strawman' accusations, it looks desperate to be honest.

You made something up to try and strenghten your own argument and got caught out. But it shows a real lack of integrity to then double down rather than acknowledge your dishonesty.

But hey look, that's the modern left, I expect nothing less.

The irony is delicious.

:pac:

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Huntergonzo wrote: »

Don't try to hide behind 'strawman' accusations, it looks desperate to be honest.

You made something up to try and strenghten your own argument and got caught out. But it shows a real lack of integrity to then double down rather than acknowledge your dishonesty.

But hey look, that's the modern left, I expect nothing less.

I presented an opinion, I presented my evidence. You can disagree all you like - fine - but neither of us ever stated a statistical fact (and if I did, please quote me).

Ahwell

Idbatterim wrote: »

in many cases, the non workers have a better living standard than low to mid income workers. That "equality" ?

That's not true. There has been research done on this. There are anomalies in the system, but only 3.8% of those on the live register would "better off on the dole". That would be people with 2 or more children, who also receive Rent Supplement. The other 96.2% would be considerably better off working.

We are also reaching nearly record low levels of the long term unemployment rates. The current rate is only 1.4%. When there is a choice people choose to work.

Mad_maxx

I Am The Law wrote: »

Creeping in that direction mind you.

Data says otherwise

Huntergonzo

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I presented an opinion, I presented my evidence. You can disagree all you like - fine - but neither of us ever stated a statistical fact (and if I did, please quote me).

I'm not sure what 'statistical facts' have to do with anything here.

Anyway you know what they say about stats ;-)

Dishonesty comes in many forms, some people tell lies for personal gain, some people tell lies for the craic etc

Huntergonzo

Tony EH wrote: »

The irony is delicious.

:pac:

Prefer steak meself :-)

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Huntergonzo wrote: »

I'm not sure what 'statistical facts' have to do with anything here.

Anyway you know what they say about stats ;-)

Dishonesty comes in many forms, some people tell lies for personal gain, some people tell lies for the craic etc

You never claimed I was dishonest, you claimed I lied. Straman again.

And as you can not tell the difference between a lie and an opinion (this is an opinion, by the way), can not present a fact I claimed was true (this is a fact - you can't) and have moved the goalposts twice (opinion, with evidence presented in my last few posts), we're done here.

Huntergonzo

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

You never claimed I was dishonest, you claimed I lied. Straman again.

And as you can not tell the difference between a lie and an opinion (this is an opinion, by the way), can not present a fact I claimed was true (this is a fact - you can't) and have moved the goalposts twice (opinion, with evidence presented in my last few posts), we're done here.

A good portion of the above makes literally no sense I'm afraid, all diversion tactics.

Look you told lies, you don't like being called on it, now you're upset, but these things will happen when you tell lies Princess.

That's my final word on it, all the best.

Iscreamkone

JFK once said “ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country”

Irish people just want stuff for free - no personal responsibility here. People complain about public services but contribute nothing towards them.
They want free houses, medicine, education, water etc
Don’t worry, someone else will pay.
Get off your arse and contribute.

We need to construct a society that rewards work and economic endeavour.
The present system just enables a large proportion of beggars.

marieholmfan

Iscreamkone wrote: »

JFK once said “ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country”


We need to construct a society that rewards work and economic endeavour.
The present system just enables a large proportion of beggars.

What we need to do this for this country is fight. Fight for a United Ireland .
We need to bring the gun back into Irish politics.

Iscreamkone

marieholmfan wrote: »

What we need to do this for this country is fight. Fight for a United Ireland .
We need to bring the gun back into Irish politics.

No we certainly do not!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Iscreamkone wrote: »

JFK once said “ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country”

Irish people just want stuff for free - no personal responsibility here. People complain about public services but contribute nothing towards them.
They want free houses, medicine, education, water etc
Don’t worry, someone else will pay.
Get off your arse and contribute.

We need to construct a society that rewards work and economic endeavour.
The present system just enables a large proportion of beggars.

marieholmfan wrote: »

What we need to do this for this country is fight. Fight for a United Ireland .
We need to bring the gun back into Irish politics.

While I agree with the "no freebies" bit, this sounds like a lot more government and a lot less freedom than I would have thought the right would like.

Idbatterim

Iscreamkone wrote: »

JFK once said “ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country”

Irish people just want stuff for free - no personal responsibility here. People complain about public services but contribute nothing towards them.
They want free houses, medicine, education, water etc
Don’t worry, someone else will pay.
Get off your arse and contribute.

We need to construct a society that rewards work and economic endeavour.
The present system just enables a large proportion of beggars.

Yeah. What a surprise that some people, want more services and more money to be paid for , by other people !