No right wing alternative= No alternative

Mad_maxx

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Your salary is payment for services rendered. You've already provide your skills, expertise and experience to the company with the outcome of increasing their profits. That's a separate thing to a company paying their taxes and contributing to society. They need to pay taxes for the priveledge of operating in ireland. To suggest they wouldn't be here if we do that. were just a nation of fools that has nothing to offer is exactly what they want you to think.

We have an open, globalised, english speaking economy that allows them to operate at a level not on offer in any other country. They should pay for the privelidge of running their businesses here.

You think our workforce are extra special and it's this that keeps the mega corporates here?

I Am The Law

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The kind of foreigners who are employed by FB and Google etc are no strain on the tax payer

And it's time to address the type of foreigner that is a strain, how many are here? How do they earn a living? Do they 'Western Union' money out of country without paying tax?

Eric Cartman

I Am The Law wrote: »

And it's time to address the type of foreigner that is a strain, how many are here? How do they earn a living? Do they 'Western Union' money out of country without paying tax?

The countries of origin of the high income foreign tech worker and the non income welfare recipient who western unions money home bare little crossover, it is possible also to welcome foreigners who pay tax on their high skilled income while also wanting the border closed to those who cannot contribute more than they take

Tony EH

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The elderly dole ( state pension) is far too high

You'll be refusing it when the time comes then I'm sure, mr internet bigshot. :pac:

Tony EH

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Private pension

For now you do. That may change.

From the content of your drivel on here, I'd take a guess that you are quite young and have a lot to learn about how the real world works.

If that's not the case, then you're in deeper trouble.

Either way, life is not static. What you have currently, you may not have in the future and if the shit does hit the fan for you, all of your big talk on here won't help you then.

And that goes for all the rest of the internet hardshaws out there.

Tony EH

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Our success in becoming the European HQ for many of the world's largest companies is our greatest economic achievement, without this, we are nothing special, there is no good reason why this country should be as wealthy as it is

That doesn't stop any business paying their, already EXTREMELY LOW, tax contributions.

Eric Cartman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The countries of origin of the high income foreign tech worker and the non income welfare recipient who western unions money home bare little crossover, it is possible also to welcome foreigners who pay tax on their high skilled income while also wanting the border closed to those who cannot contribute more than they take

Some recognition needs to be made to see that some nationalities just aren't prepared to live in a first world nation. A variety of skills are needed, not just those for employment, but also language skills (or at least the proven ability to acquire a language) which are useful for social integration. I'm not a fan of unplanned and unrestrained multiculturalism. Not demanding a level requirement in language encourages the creation of Ghetto style residential areas where particular nationalities live separately to others and promote their own language/culture to replace the domestic/local language. (Consider Frankfurt with the Turks)

I'd say that there is little logic in allowing immigration for groups of people who are lacking in education, and the language of their desired country. If they come here for work, then they should be able to speak an adequate amount of that language, but also have some minimum skills to ensure that they are employable. Ireland (and other European countries) doesn't need more people who can only do the jobs most likely to be replaced by automation...

Mad_maxx

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The kind of foreigners who are employed by FB and Google etc are no strain on the tax payer

Rent crisis
Housing crisis
Infrastructure and services

The country literally cannot cope with the level of immigration.

And btw, I never mentioned a "kind" that was actually you trying to drag the debate down to a level where you can avoid the real issues.

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

The welfare state is also too fat

In comparison to what? Just because you say something is so doesn't mean it is? Of the 36 OECD counties social welfare spending as a percentage of GDP, we come in 5th last. Multinationals having their headquarters here does tend to inflate our GDP, so if you look at social spending per capita instead we come in about half way, just behind the US.

The elderly dole ( state pension) is far too high

Again, in comparison to other countries that's not true. Pensions are compared across counties by the using Net pension replacement rates. In the OECD we come 3rd last.

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

In comparison to what? Just because you say something is so doesn't mean it is? Of the 36 OECD counties social welfare spending as a percentage of GDP, we come in 5th last. Multinationals having their headquarters here does tend to inflate our GDP, so if you look at social spending per capita instead we come in about half way, just behind the US.



Again, in comparison to other countries that's not true. Pensions are compared across counties by the using Net pension replacement rates. In the OECD we come 3rd last.

you think we spend the third least on pensions of any country in the OECD ?

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

you think we spend the third least on pensions of any country in the OECD ?

I know we have the 3rd lowest Net pension replacement rate .

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

I know we have the 3rd lowest Net pension replacement rate .

are you saying the state pension in this country is the 3rd lowest in the OECD ?

maybe i misunderstood ?

Idbatterim

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Rent crisis
Housing crisis
Infrastructure and services

The country literally cannot cope with the level of immigration.

And btw, I never mentioned a "kind" that was actually you trying to drag the debate down to a level where you can avoid the real issues.

These immigrants mostly come here to work and contribute. The housing crisis ? How many wasters here are occupying tax payer funded houses , who have never worked ?

Idbatterim

Ahwell wrote: »

In comparison to what? Just because you say something is so doesn't mean it is? Of the 36 OECD counties social welfare spending as a percentage of GDP, we come in 5th last. Multinationals having their headquarters here does tend to inflate our GDP, so if you look at social spending per capita instead we come in about half way, just behind the US.



Again, in comparison to other countries that's not true. Pensions are compared across counties by the using Net pension replacement rates. In the OECD we come 3rd last.

That welfare Spend is pretty impressive, given huge amounts pay virtually nothing into the system, which is not the case in other countries

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

are you saying the state pension in this country is the 3rd lowest in the OECD ?

maybe i misunderstood ?

The Net pension replacement rate is the percentage of a worker's current income that a particular pension plan can be expected to produce, i.e. how your pension compares to the income you had before you retired. So pensioners here are relatively worse off than most other OECD counties.

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

you think we spend the third least on pensions of any country in the OECD ?

To answer this question, our pension spending is the 5th lowest in the OECD.

https://data.oecd.org/socialexp/pension-spending.htm

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

The Net pension replacement rate is the percentage of a worker's current income that a particular pension plan can be expected to produce, i.e. how your pension compares to the income you had before you retired. So pensioners here are relatively worse off than most other OECD counties.

So the state pension in Ireland is not particularly generous?

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

So the state pension in Ireland is not particularly generous?

Relative to other countries, it isn't.

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

Relative to other countries, it isn't.

Far as I know, in the case of Germany, what you receive post retirement is determined by what you put in

Not so here where even you never paid a red cent in PRSI contributions, you are entitled to a mere tenner per week less than those on the contributory pension

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

Far as I know, in the case of Germany, what you receive post retirement is determined by what you put in

Not so here where even you never paid a red cent in PRSI contributions, you are entitled to a mere tenner per week less than those on the contributory pension

There would be all different kinds of pension systems across the OECD, it's a complex thing to compare. The Net pension replacement rate is a way of doing it.

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

There would be all different kinds of pension systems across the OECD, it's a complex thing to compare. The Net pension replacement rate is a way of doing it.

A selective way of doing it

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

A selective way of doing it

It's the way the OECD does it, it's not selective. You would struggle to select a way of showing that the Irish OAP is generous.

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

It's the way the OECD does it, it's not selective. You would struggle to select a way of showing that the Irish OAP is generous.

I did earlier, you could have never worked a day in your life and still only be a tenner short of the contributory pension

Idbatterim

Ahwell wrote: »

Relative to other countries, it isn't.

DO the other countries throw free tv license, travel , medical card at them ? The other countries also have a meaningful property tax

Idbatterim

Idbatterim wrote: »

These immigrants mostly come here to work and contribute. The housing crisis ? How many wasters here are occupying tax payer funded houses , who have never worked ?

I have no problem with immigration where it is needed. But it should be controlled, this is key to solving many of our problems. Hard working immigrants are not to blame, it's so frustrating that people turn this into a personal attack on immigrants. It's simply an imbalanced broken system. Immigrants need somewhere to live, they need buses, trains and roads to travel on. They need hospitals, the list goes on and on. The country literally cannot cope. If a company needs to hire externally then by all means, but only if they can demonstrate that it is necessary and only if it is for a skill which is on a predetermined list of skill shortages.

Iscreamkone

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I have no problem with immigration where it is needed. But it should be controlled, this is key to solving many of our problems. Hard working immigrants are not to blame, it's so frustrating that people turn this into a personal attack on immigrants. It's simply an imbalanced broken system. Immigrants need somewhere to live, they need buses, trains and roads to travel on. They need hospitals, the list goes on and on. The country literally cannot cope. If a company needs to hire externally then by all means, but only if they can demonstrate that it is necessary and only if it is for a skill which is on a predetermined list of skill shortages.

Let’s make more rules and more government departments to implement these rules. Ffs.

What we need to be doing is reducing the size of government and the public service.

Iscreamkone

Iscreamkone wrote: »

Let’s make more rules and more government departments to implement these rules. Ffs.

Or genuine efforts to make the existing rules and departments more efficient... Those rules need to be examined in an unemotional and practical sense to determine what is beneficial to the nation, as a whole. In terms of immigrants, those who are unable to contribute should be an extreme minority.

What we need to be doing is reducing the size of government and the public service.

Agreed... however both will increase as immigrants unable to directly support themselves are allowed into the country, in addition to the natives who are unable to support themselves without State interference or welfare. A welfare state tends to breed further generations who are dependent on welfare, and therefore increased supports are needed within the government itself to administer such.

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

I did earlier, you could have never worked a day in your life and still only be a tenner short of the contributory pension

And how people have never worked a day in their lives?

Mad_maxx

Ahwell wrote: »

And how people have never worked a day in their lives?

?

Ahwell

Mad_maxx wrote: »

?

you could have never worked a day in your life

How many people does this apply to?