No right wing alternative= No alternative

freshpopcorn

I think some people are a little right wing but right wing parties come across as a little over the top.

super_furry

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

They aren't right wing at all!. They would admit that themselves!.

Think people are clutching at straws here what right is and isn't.

People do vote right,

National Rally party France
Victor Orban in Hungary

Trump will easily sleepwalk through the next election as the American economy is flying

So when you say right wing, what you really mean is the fundamentalist right-wing of the American Republican party, and the democracy dismantling of Victor Orban.

You don't want a 'right-wing party', you're looking for an ultra-nationalistic anti-foreigner group of which we already have one - the National Party. They're standing candidates in the upcoming election.

Thing is, no-one votes for them because there is no desire for politics like that in this country. You're on your own.

CrankyHaus

Right-wing and left-wing meanings are topsy-turvy in Ireland.

The basic tax on wealth, the property tax, was imposed by our leading right-wing party.
This tax on wealth has been opposed vociferously by our left-wing parties, particularly our Marxist and Trotkskyist ones. You could power the country with the energy from Trotsky and Marx spinning in their graves at this.

As mentioned the slumbering ethnonationalist vote is monopolised by our largest left-wing party (which to its credit goes out of its way to purge racism within its ranks).

Social conservatism was for most of the state's history the province of both our main centre-left and centre-right party. The second it stopped being a vote winner both abandoned it and scrambled to embrace social liberalism.

Banner2theend

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

They aren't right wing at all!. They would admit that themselves!.

Think people are clutching at straws here what right is and isn't.

People do vote right,

National Rally party France
Victor Orban in Hungary

Trump will easily sleepwalk through the next election as the American economy is flying

Don't forget the "Law and Justice party" in Poland and the make-up of Italy's govt, re "right-wing nationalist agendas".

I would love to discuss about the realities, of what really is going on in Irish politics as it not as black and white, as some are suggesting not just by posters but what some in media would like us to think.

However I fear that some individuals would take my comments "the wrong way". It's for that reason, I never touch this forum, with today being a exception, for fear of libel. I'm not mentioning any names of anyone, or any institution, for that matter, so hopefully all this post will not be deleted. But imo I want to mention this important issue, as I have grave concerns about whether I or anyone could be warned, if a post crossed "that red line".

I have real sympathy for the mods here, in particular in this forum and judging what acceptable and what's not. I just want clarity on this whole libel thing, not just for me but other boards members and posters too. Regardless though I will focus on the GAA forums instead, but I have a passion for politics too and that will never be taken away from me, no matter what.

jimgoose

super_furry wrote: »

...fundamentalist right-wing of the American Republican party...

The fundamentalist "right-wing" crowd are a small but loud confederacy of nutters that most of the mainstream GOP find somewhat embarrassing.

facehugger99

I'd like to see an fiscally conservative but socially liberal party.

The PDs were the closest we got but they got wiped out so it seems the appetite isn't there.

FG tired to portray themselves as the Party for 'People who get up early', but they have overseen huge increases in tax revenue and spent almost all of it on current spending - Paschal Donohoe has splurged every euro he's taken in and the people paying for everything have gotten fcuk all back.

And this is the most 'right-wing' party we can come up with in this country.

marieholmfan

facehugger99 wrote: »

I'd like to see an fiscally conservative but socially liberal party.

The PDs were the closest we got but they got wiped out so it seems the appetite isn't there.

FG tired to portray themselves as the Party for 'People who get up early', but they have overseen huge increases in tax revenue and spent almost all of it on current spending - Paschal Donohoe has splurged every euro he's taken in and the people paying for everything have gotten fcuk all back.

And this is the most 'right-wing' party we can come up with in this country.

I'd like the opposite - a high tax , no dole scrounging, hammer the rich, council houses for everyone, law and order, assimilate and integrate, great health service, no private healthcare, shoot the tax dodgers, hang the drug dealers, clean up our waterways, zero carbon economy , no private schools party.

FTA69

marieholmfan wrote: »

I'd like the opposite - a high tax , no dole scrounging, hammer the rich, council houses for everyone, law and order, assimilate and integrate, great health service, no private healthcare, shoot the tax dodgers, hang the drug dealers, clean up our waterways, zero carbon economy , no private schools party.

Sounds like a laugh to be honest

Lonesomerhodes

super_furry wrote: »

So when you say right wing, what you really mean is the fundamentalist right-wing of the American Republican party, and the democracy dismantling of Victor Orban.

You don't want a 'right-wing party', you're looking for an ultra-nationalistic anti-foreigner group of which we already have one - the National Party. They're standing candidates in the upcoming election.

Thing is, no-one votes for them because there is no desire for politics like that in this country. You're on your own.

Foreigners like my partner of several years?.

Thing is I could be married to a black woman with 10 black kids and people like you come out with the same braindead reactionary rhetoric.

The comedian Leo Kearse has a great line on the left on this

'They are all for diversity, except diversity of opinion!'.


Shows how well the old brainwashing works when people can't even discuss a topic without someone coming out with such nonsense and slander like yourself.

It's like an allergic reaction to any question not discussed in the media.

How much does direct provision cost?.

Nazi!!!!.

May I ask you are you in Antifa by any chance?. :rolleyes:

Cordell

marieholmfan wrote: »

I'd like the opposite - a high tax , no dole scrounging, hammer the rich, council houses for everyone, law and order, assimilate and integrate, great health service, no private healthcare, shoot the tax dodgers, hang the drug dealers, clean up our waterways, zero carbon economy , no private schools party.

Don't forget about unicorns.

carq

We have the free-market/libertarian right, which sees high taxes, an enormous welfare state, and numerous government monopolies as holding back individual potential and economic progress. Then we have those who are labeled right-wing for ridiculing so-called "woke" thinking around speech codes, safe spaces, preferred pronouns, gender-neutral bathrooms, etc.

This is where my views would lie (reducing welfare state), while rejecting anti immigration rhetoric and religious doctrine.
these would be easy for a center party to adopt without getting accusations of racism by the current batch of left leaning parties and media.

FTA69

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

Foreigners like my partner of several years?.

Thing is I could be married to a black woman with 10 black kids and people like you come out with the same braindead reactionary rhetoric.

The comedian Leo Kearse has a great line on the left on this

'They are all for diversity, except diversity of opinion!'.


Shows how well the old brainwashing works when people can't even discuss a topic without someone coming out with such nonsense and slander like yourself.

It's like an allergic reaction to any question not discussed in the media.

How much does direct provision cost?.

Nazi!!!!.

May I ask you are you in Antifa by any chance?. :rolleyes:

The reality is though, is that parties like Orban’s lot in Hungary or the Front Nationale in France are hostile to foreigners - it’s a major part of who they are. There’s no point in lamenting the lack of such a party in Ireland and then having a tantrum about ‘Antifa’ or whatever when someone puts two and two together.

victor8600

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

They aren't right wing at all!....

Do explain: what is the definition of a "right wing" party for you?

Because I consider both FF/FG to be center-right parties. Ireland is one of the most capitalist countries in the EU, only with strangely lax unemployment policies. Ireland has fifth largest number of billionaires per capita in the world. Business regulation is very lax, with banks allowed to charge the highest interest for mortgages in the Western Europe. Childcare "subsidy" is a joke, with families in Dublin paying a €1000 or more per month per child in creche (compared to €150-200 in Germany).

Hardly a left wing socialist country, and the result of the FF/FG tandem in power.

super_furry

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

Foreigners like my partner of several years?.

Thing is I could be married to a black woman with 10 black kids and people like you come out with the same braindead reactionary rhetoric.

The comedian Leo Kearse has a great line on the left on this

'They are all for diversity, except diversity of opinion!'.


Shows how well the old brainwashing works when people can't even discuss a topic without someone coming out with such nonsense and slander like yourself.

It's like an allergic reaction to any question not discussed in the media.

How much does direct provision cost?.

Nazi!!!!.

May I ask you are you in Antifa by any chance?. :rolleyes:

Hahah, u okay hun?

That’s quiet the mad rant, you’re very touchy about the whole ‘anti-foreigner’ angle. Are you seriously trying to argue that Orban or the National Rally aren’t anti-immigrant?

You're citing them as examples of the kind of right-wing party you want to see then come over all snowflakey when someone actually articulates that to you.

marieholmfan

Cordell wrote: »

Don't forget about unicorns.

What's unrealistic about it?


The spending side would be paid for by the higher taxes.

Idbatterim

THERe would be nothing to fear with a new centrist or “right “ party. We are going to have a mix of **** loption options all to the left of the spectrum , in ff certainly and Fg to a lesser extent. Even a new party further to the right of what we have , would only pull things more back to the centre. The analysis here is laughable , like we can only have one party as a majority government. The notion of a good centre, centre right Party is laughable and I am meant to believe , such a part will win enough seats to actually fully implement their policies. Best conspiracy theory I’ve heard yet ! That’s how absurd the notion is

Loafing Oaf

carq wrote: »

This is where my views would lie (reducing welfare state), while rejecting anti immigration rhetoric and religious doctrine.
these would be easy for a center party to adopt without getting accusations of racism by the current batch of left leaning parties and media.

No, but they would certainly be labeled as 'Thatcherite', 'neoliberal' etc., which, according to conventional wisdom, is nearly as toxic in the Irish context...

Clarence Boddiker

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

One thing that strikes me about this election is the idea people are voting for change well their really isn't any!.

All left left left and more left parties.


Not one mainstream party in Ireland is even remotely right so how can you have choice if what you vote for is all the same?.

Not a cigarette papers worth of difference between

Fine Gael/ Fianna Fail/ Greens/People before profit/Sinn Fein/Labour etc etc
For example
They all support the EU
they all support abortion,
all support mass immigration into Ireland (in fact won't discuss it at all under any circumstances)
Not one will ask for public referendum on issues
Refuse to acknowledge billions so far has been spent on direct provision centres while the downtrodden poor Irish people die on the streets
Refuse to question the money doctors get from pharmaceutical firms,
refuse to acknowledge the billions Ireland has in oil and gas etc etc etc


They are all basically the same, left leaning gombeens lining their own pockets making fools of the general public.

Worst is them hardcore Marxist parties that come out with stupid names like People before profit or Anti Austerity alliance, amazed such newspeak buzzword simplicity works on people.
All mindless leftie nonsense.


The only right wing party in Ireland I can think of is the National party and they are tiny and will never ever get media coverage. Not that I agree with them on everything a few bits.

(sigh waits for the mindless screaming of racist this and that)

I like some right wing policies ie

Small accountable government.

Pro life- Believe it or not some people believe life is still sacred

Look after our own citizens first, if we can't look after our own how can we possibly look after tens of thousands of other people?.

A return to our own heritage. This is something often over looked in Ireland, we need to value our history culture and language. Easier said than done in a country where the vast majority of people don't speak the native tongue in fact openly desipise and dismiss it but we can make a start.


Hate to see Ireland become a meaningless vassel state to the EU which all mainstream parties support as they will not question the EU on anything!.


So with no right wing alternative how is this General Election offering ANY alternative?.

Bit of a joke if you ask me.

The National Party are an alternative, they're running ten candidates I believe.
https://nationalparty.ie

Cordell

marieholmfan wrote: »

What's unrealistic about it?


The spending side would be paid for by the higher taxes.

How much will you need to "hammer the rich" in order to provide "council houses for everyone"? What do you do after you run out of rich to hammer? Who are the rich?

marieholmfan

Cordell wrote: »

How much will you need to "hammer the rich" in order to provide "council houses for everyone"? What do you do after you run out of rich to hammer? Who are the rich?

I' would hammer them alot. The council houses would be built long before we ran out of rich people's money.

SaintLeibowitz

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

The National Party are an alternative, they're running ten candidates I believe.
https://nationalparty.ie

This gave me a good laugh this afternoon. Haha..alternative haha.

marieholmfan

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

The National Party are an alternative, they're running ten candidates I believe.
https://nationalparty.ie

Unless you tell me how you'll hammer the rich I assume that you're on the grift and squeaky little Justin is 100% a crooked grifter.

marieholmfan

Looked up the national party


The National Party believes strongly in the principle of a Constitutional Republic, founded on individual personal freedoms, rights and responsibilities. We reject and resist a totalitarianism whose essence is found in the totality of State power and the exercise of State authority, and not the ideological direction of that totality.
To me this is weird code for no social services

The National Party believes in an aristocracy of achievement within a democracy of opportunity, practised and established economically by the strong advocacy of Free Productive Enterprise. Consequently we endorse the inalienable right to the ownership of Private Property, and shall defend that right against the equally dangerous encroachment of both State Socialism and Monopoly Capitalism.
There's the grift

Sir Guy who smiles

marieholmfan wrote: »

That's what it means. You're mixing it up with conservative an liberal.

As do most people who spend a lot of time on American websites.

Lonesomerhodes

victor8600 wrote: »

Do explain: what is the definition of a "right wing" party for you?

Because I consider both FF/FG to be center-right parties. Ireland is one of the most capitalist countries in the EU, only with strangely lax unemployment policies. Ireland has fifth largest number of billionaires per capita in the world. Business regulation is very lax, with banks allowed to charge the highest interest for mortgages in the Western Europe. Childcare "subsidy" is a joke, with families in Dublin paying a €1000 or more per month per child in creche (compared to €150-200 in Germany).

Hardly a left wing socialist country, and the result of the FF/FG tandem in power.

For me generally speaking right wing parties are

Pro life
Pro Nationalism
Pro their own language/Identity
For stronger borders (you know spend the billions of taxpayers money that goes on direct provision spend it on their own citizens, many of whom are homeless etc)
Small government
Opposes EU dictating to their country
Supports small business
Has MUCH tougher penalties on crime.

marieholmfan

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

For me generally speaking right wing parties are

Pro life
Pro Nationalism
Pro their own language/Identity
For stronger borders (you know spend the billions of taxpayers money that goes on direct provision spend it on their own citizens, many of whom are homeless etc)
Small government
Opposes EU dictating to their country
Supports small business
Has MUCH tougher penalties on crime.

That's conservatism more or less - except small government which is for grifters.


You wouldn't be on the grift yourself lonesomerhodes?

pjohnson

Are the 9 candidates real people or are they using stock images again?

Lonesomerhodes

Clarence Boddiker wrote: »

The National Party are an alternative, they're running ten candidates I believe.
https://nationalparty.ie

I know of them; they are tiny however only going 2 year and aren't a viable alternative to the mainstream.

Agree on some things disagree on others.

You'll have the layabout leftie lunatic loola's accusing you of being Hitler's ghost or some other such nonsense for even mentioning them.

Somedaythefire

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

For me generally speaking right wing parties are

Pro life
Pro Nationalism
Pro their own language/Identity
For stronger borders (you know spend the billions of taxpayers money that goes on direct provision spend it on their own citizens, many of whom are homeless etc)
Small government
Opposes EU dictating to their country
Supports small business
Has MUCH tougher penalties on crime.

You want a libertarian party.



A question though, how is a "small government" interfering in women's choice ok? Shouldn't a "small government" have minimal involvement in that?

Dyr

Is there not some hard right party running candidates, Justin Barret and them headers?