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Three children found dead mod note in post 1

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    #272
    Ash.J.Williams
    Registered Users Posts: 21,056 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    perhaps he's a practicing catholic?


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    #273
    Be right back
    Registered Users Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭Be right back


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    Why is it odd? He drew comfort from it.


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    #274
    Lonesomerhodes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 515 ✭✭✭Lonesomerhodes


    Fakediamond wrote: »
    I thought that too....


    Why?. :confused::confused:

    The man is unbelievably brave to go in the wake of is 3 kids being murdered.

    Takes such strength to do so.


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    #275
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users Posts: 43,028 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    his community was all around him

    just what's needed at a time like this


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    #276
    Be right back
    Registered Users Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭Be right back


    SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »
    his community was all around him

    just what's needed at a time like this

    Absolutely and maybe he's a practising Catholic like someone already suggested.


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    #277
    TheValeyard
    Registered Users Posts: 12,526 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    The guy literally had his entire life destroyed. He is probably trying to find comfort and support wherever that could be found.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



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    #278
    Marcos
    Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭Marcos


    iamwhoiam wrote: »
    Why is it odd ? People seek comfort where they are comfortable .

    Exactly, how anybody can think it's odd is beyond me. This poor man's life has been destroyed and turned upside down in an instant. He is obviously suffering and is seeking support wherever he can find it.

    Personally I find anybody questioning this odd. Unless they're being an edgy keyboard warrior, and in that case they are showing an extreme lack of empathy and their actions are despicable.

    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



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    #279
    givyjoe
    Registered Users Posts: 3,287 ✭✭✭givyjoe


    Fakediamond wrote: »
    I thought that too....

    Would either of you like to elaborate on precisely what is odd about this?


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    #280
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Cant stop crying thinking about those poor little angels. Snip


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    #281
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭nthclare


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    There's something odd about your post.

    That man has lost the most important part of his life, and his world is in shatters.

    No doubt he's never going to be the same again, my sons 18 and I don't see much of him because he's hanging out with his friends more at weekends and I miss him staying at mine every second weekend.
    I live a bit away from him and I feel a void every second weekend now.
    And a touch of loneliness, ill adapt.

    But this poor man must be in some state.

    Nothing more heart felt than loosing a child or children.

    That sheer loss and uncontrollable sobbing and crying, confusion and emotional turmoil.


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    #282
    Fakediamond
    Registered Users Posts: 1,055 ✭✭✭Fakediamond


    I can only look at it from my own perspective. If I had suffered a tragedy of such immense proportions, I would not be able to face a crowd of people staring at me 14 hours later. I would be in lockdown with a very small and trusted group of family and friends.
    I am not intending to be disrespectful in any way, I am devastated at the loss of those beautiful, innocent children, it’s bewildering and incomprehensible that their short lives ended so tragically.


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    #283
    retro:electro
    Registered Users Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    Fakediamond wrote: »
    I can only look at it from my own perspective. If I had suffered a tragedy of such immense proportions, I would not be able to face a crowd of people staring at me 14 hours later. I would be in lockdown with a very small and trusted group of family and friends.
    I am not intending to be disrespectful in any way, I am devastated at the loss of those beautiful, innocent children, it’s bewildering and incomprehensible that their short lives ended so tragically.

    You have no idea how you would react. It’s outside the bounds of human comprehension to even try and speculate how you would react. The man has lost his whole family and is in limbo land where nothing makes sense and he’s trying to find some comfort. Even if he is not religious I understand his intentions. Maybe he went to pray, maybe he has no idea what he’s doing; either way I don’t think we should judge the innocent actions of a man whose entire life blew up only four days ago.

    There’s something very strange about someone who can read an article like that and have these as their first thoughts. “Well I wouldn’t have done that if it was me”.. it’s not about you or what you would or would not have done.


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    #284
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    Fakediamond wrote: »
    I can only look at it from my own perspective. If I had suffered a tragedy of such immense proportions, I would not be able to face a crowd of people staring at me 14 hours later. I would be in lockdown with a very small and trusted group of family and friends.
    I am not intending to be disrespectful in any way, I am devastated at the loss of those beautiful, innocent children, it’s bewildering and incomprehensible that their short lives ended so tragically.

    That’s you. It might not be this poor man. Maybe being surrounded by people is how he finds comfort. Or maybe it’s being in a church.

    Regardless you can’t judge him based how you think you’d react in the same situation. Not least because you have absolutely no idea how you would react. None of us do.

    The poor man has just lost his three beautiful children in the most horrific way. He’s entitled to seek comfort as he sees fit.


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    #285
    nthclare
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,315 ✭✭✭nthclare


    Fakediamond wrote: »
    I can only look at it from my own perspective. If I had suffered a tragedy of such immense proportions, I would not be able to face a crowd of people staring at me 14 hours later. I would be in lockdown with a very small and trusted group of family and friends.
    I am not intending to be disrespectful in any way, I am devastated at the loss of those beautiful, innocent children, it’s bewildering and incomprehensible that their short lives ended so tragically.

    Im sure you meant well by your post and have your own way of dealing with a loss.

    We all say things which can be interpreted from variable angles.
    You meant no harm so ill take back my saying your post is odd.

    There's one thing I've learnt in life and it's very valuable.

    I can't do other people's thinking for them, I only have my own thoughts and responsibility.

    No point in judging your post after you explained why you found it odd...


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    #286
    KathleenGrant
    Registered Users Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭KathleenGrant


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    Having lost a child myself and seeing my brother lose one too the one thing I learned is that no two people act the same way. Everyone should be given the space to act the way they need to and not he judged.


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    #287
    joe40
    Registered Users Posts: 3,811 ✭✭✭joe40


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    I feel compassion for anyone suffering from mental health issues up to a certain point.

    Taking innocent lives especially those of children cannot and should not ever be condoned nor excused as a result of someone being unwell.

    When a man commits such an act he is rightfully hated and demonized. Why is it different when it’s a woman?

    It's not

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/man-found-not-guilty-of-murder-of-girlfriend-by-reason-of-insanity-1.3146684

    This is an awful tragedy to use to promote a gender issue.


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    #288
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,385 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Mod note - lads leave out the gender stuff. This is neither the time or place. See mod warning post 1.


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    #289
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    joe40 wrote: »
    It's not

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/man-found-not-guilty-of-murder-of-girlfriend-by-reason-of-insanity-1.3146684

    This is an awful tragedy to use to promote a gender issue.

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/father-who-battered-his-son-to-death-found-guilty-but-insane-1.471685

    another tradegy, but maybe we can all agree now that males & females are not treated differently


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    #290
    ToddDameron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 381 ✭✭ToddDameron


    bubblypop wrote: »
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/father-who-battered-his-son-to-death-found-guilty-but-insane-1.471685

    another tradegy, but maybe we can all agree now that males & females are not treated differently

    It was the same with Hawe case, it became a political point scoring exercise on social media and for whatever reason it became unacceptable to propose metal illness of a factor, despite considerable evidence to contrary. To do so was seen to excuse a man of violence, to not do so was seen a discrimation against men. No one seemingly able to draw the conclusion that perhaps bad people can become mentally ill. An utterly futile exercise by idiots on both sides of the fence.


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    #291
    Kieran_M
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9 ✭Kieran_M


    Poor kids, hopefully they did not suffer. RIP.


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    #292
    Lollipops23
    Registered Users Posts: 5,420 ✭✭✭Lollipops23


    The difference between this and the Hawe family is that the killer had waged an campaign of control and possessiveness over his family. He knew he was about to be exposed and decided his family couldn't live with the shame. So he butchered them. No gently falling asleep for any of the Hawes.

    Until more information comes to light we have no reason to think this woman was severely mentally ill and possibly thought she was doing right by her kids. Until we know different we can assume she was a 'normal' mother who loved her kids. Maybe it will come out that she was every bit the psycho that Hawe was, in which case we can all recalibrate our opinions on her.

    Mental illness is terrifying. Maybe she heard voices saying that this was the only way to protect her kids. Maybe she had vivid hallucinations.


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    #293
    ToddDameron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 381 ✭✭ToddDameron


    Lollipops23 wrote: »
    The difference between this and the Hawe family is that the killer had waged an campaign of control and possessiveness over his family. He knew he was about to be exposed and decided his family couldn't live with the shame. So he butchered them. No gently falling asleep for any of the Hawes..
    To be fair there is no evidence that he was about "to be exposed." His school have denied there was any suspicions or investigations around him after the Prime Time documentary. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that these rumours were delusions that he created himself. People speaking in certainties around that case are either misinformed or deliberately being misleading.


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    #294
    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,474 ✭✭✭Obvious Desperate Breakfasts


    ToddDameron wrote: »
    To be fair there is no evidence that he was about "to be exposed." His school have denied there was any suspicions or investigations around him after the Prime Time documentary. It's not beyond the realms of possibility that these rumours were delusions that he created himself. People speaking in certainties around that case are either misinformed or deliberately being misleading.

    But what her family says shouldn’t be dismissed readily either. They know a lot more than any casual observer.


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    #295
    ToddDameron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 381 ✭✭ToddDameron


    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »
    But what her family says shouldn’t be dismissed readily either. They know a lot more than any casual observer.

    No it should not be dismissed. But the findings of the inquest should take precedence I believe. As I said before, often the signs are very well hidden from even the closest of family. Otherwise we'd always intervene in time. My point is we can't say he wasn't mentally ill with any kind of certainty, and that's an unfortunate fact. One thing is for certain, it's an extremely complex case, so people speaking about it in definite terms are misinformed.


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    #296
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,401 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    smelly sock wrote: »
    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/father-of-beautiful-children-bravely-attends-mass-as-newcastle-grieves-38896859.html

    I'm sorry but to me that's a bit odd.

    It's probably been asked already but what's odd?


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    #297
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,401 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Can't even imagine that man's grief


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    #298
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »
    But what her family says shouldn’t be dismissed readily either. They know a lot more than any casual observer.


    I wouldn't dismiss it either but I would also take it with a grain of salt. They have a fair enough motive for bad mouthing him.


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    #299
    jackboy
    Registered Users Posts: 4,598 ✭✭✭jackboy


    ToddDameron wrote: »
    No it should not be dismissed. But the findings of the inquest should take precedence I believe..

    It shouldn’t take precedence. Very often in Ireland inquests give an easy answer rather than a correct answer. They are not dependable.

    Ultimately we can’t be sure what happened in the Hawe case as we likely still don’t have the info. With regard to the current case we know very little so far and again we may never get the full picture.


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    #300
    ToddDameron
    Closed Accounts Posts: 381 ✭✭ToddDameron


    jackboy wrote: »
    It shouldn’t take precedence. Very often in Ireland inquests give an easy answer rather than a correct answer. They are not dependable.

    Ultimately we can’t be sure what happened in the Hawe case as we likely still don’t have the info. With regard to the current case we know very little so far and again we may never get the full picture.
    I agree with all of your post except the first sentence. In this case, it's the best possible point of reference as the conclusion was reached by people who had access to material that none of us will every had access to. Is it undoubtedly not certain, but against all of the rumours and worth of mouth floating around it is he most reliable source.


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    #301
    jackboy
    Registered Users Posts: 4,598 ✭✭✭jackboy


    ToddDameron wrote: »
    I agree with all of your post except the first sentence. In this case, it's the best possible point of reference as the conclusion was reached by people who had access to material that none of us will every had access to. Is it undoubtedly not certain, but against all of the rumours and worth of mouth floating around it is he most reliable source.

    Fair enough. I have just seen in the past inquests which gave a certain result for reasons other than an honest evaluation.


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