FE1 Exam Thread (Read 1st post!) NOTE: YOU MAY SWAP EXAM GRIDS

Fe1student1234

Law20213 wrote: »

Law degrees should come with a warning on the CAO that you aren’t actually eligible to enter the law society until you resist all 8 exams you studied for in college again....If I knew that at the time I may have studied something else in college and be an actual qualified professional by now!!

Same I probably would have gone down the accounting route tbh

EM11

IgoPAP wrote: »

Isn't the best and most obvious rationale for giving automatic passes to candidates in light of their abject failures in facilitating the exams is that the student already passed the exam at undergraduate level anyways, so there's proof that they're competent at the subject, and that the exceptional nature of what's happening justifies it?

It's a perfectly rational reasoning that's sitting right before them! They can even keep the damn money I don't care.

I doubt they would be able to do that given the fact that there was a Supreme Court ruling against it in the 90s. The best way would be to make things as simple as possible for us now, and get the new timetable to us as soon as possible. Maybe they could provide an exemption to everyone who had signed up, regardless of their undergraduate degree, but that seems unlikely

RaffRiff01

Hello all, it seems like this thread is the best route for me to ask my question as I have been ringing and emailing the LSI now for the past 5 days and no luck at all.

When I heard that the new deadline for the Nov. sitting was 30. Sept. I immediately applied to sit 2 subjects. I was then approved and paid via the payment link and was given a receipt/confirmation.. have the order # and the shipping status, now shipped etc.

would anyone advice me what would happen next? cause i have been waiting for 2 and a half weeks now for a exam number? or just any general exam details? or even something to let me know that i WILL be sitting it for sure..

if anyone can reply to me about their past experience as to how it went... as this covid thing and this news about the november sitting just added to my extra level of stress and one more day of being on hold with the LSI will just push me off the edge!!!!!

Ianmc97

EM11 wrote: »

I doubt they would be able to do that given the fact that there was a Supreme Court ruling against it in the 90s. The best way would be to make things as simple as possible for us now, and get the new timetable to us as soon as possible. Maybe they could provide an exemption to everyone who had signed up, regardless of their undergraduate degree, but that seems unlikely

not exactly. as far as I know the supreme court, whilst being very sympathetic to the students ruled that they could not compel the law society to make its rules a certain way. absolutely nothing legally preventing the law society from reintroducing those rules for a single sitting

Fe1student1234

RaffRiff01 wrote: »

Hello all, it seems like this thread is the best route for me to ask my question as I have been ringing and emailing the LSI now for the past 5 days and no luck at all.

When I heard that the new deadline for the Nov. sitting was 30. Sept. I immediately applied to sit 2 subjects. I was then approved and paid via the payment link and was given a receipt/confirmation.. have the order # and the shipping status, now shipped etc.

would anyone advice me what would happen next? cause i have been waiting for 2 and a half weeks now for a exam number? or just any general exam details? or even something to let me know that i WILL be sitting it for sure..

if anyone can reply to me about their past experience as to how it went... as this covid thing and this news about the november sitting just added to my extra level of stress and one more day of being on hold with the LSI will just push me off the edge!!!!!

You don’t get your exam number until two weeks before the exam

No confirmed sitting of the November exam they’re looking at holding online ones but won’t confirm until next week

We don’t know the dates or anything as of yet

neon123

If the exams are going to be held online is it likely the dates will be pushed further into November or will the LS still try and maintain the start of the month?

EmmaO94

It's in the Law Soc's interests to have these online exams open book (less work for them) so I really really hope this happens.

But agree with everything said on this thread - their response has absolutely not been good enough. Would it kill them to email everyone instead of us having to stumble upon updates online by chance?? I really hope someone's got in touch with the journalist on here. These exams are horrendously stressful at the best of times never mind putting Covid and all this (preventable) uncertainty in the mix.

Fe1student1234

Yep you’re in the same boat as me! Once the application says approved and you’ve paid you’re registered and they will send out a letter or email with the exam details in the week or so before the exam (that’s what they usually do )

RaffRiff01

Fe1student1234 wrote: »

You don’t get your exam number until two weeks before the exam

No confirmed sitting of the November exam they’re looking at holding online ones but won’t confirm until next week

We don’t know the dates or anything as of yet

Would they send me my exam number by email? or post?

right but if ever the exams go on at the first week of november (online or whatnot) will i be absolutely be eligible to sit that? given that i have been approved and already paid and confirmed and everything

thank you so much for replying! it is my first sitting as I havent a clue if this is normal or what.

sarahlawless

neon123 wrote: »

If the exams are going to be held online is it likely the dates will be pushed further into November or will the LS still try and maintain the start of the month?

They are refusing to tell us until next week - 3 weeks out.

Lawlaw12

RaffRiff01 wrote: »

Would they send me my exam number by email? or post?

right but if ever the exams go on at the first week of november (online or whatnot) will i be absolutely be eligible to sit that? given that i have been approved and already paid and confirmed and everything

thank you so much for replying! it is my first sitting as I havent a clue if this is normal or what.

They post out a letter with your exam number and details of the exams and the rules around a week beforehand, this is posted to your address.

It sounds like you're approved, especially since you got a payment link, and tbh if anything were to go wrong (which is unlikely) they would still accommodate you... people have been accepted after the application deadlines before. It's normal not to have any communication from them between applying and getting your exam letter in the post, don't worry

Mooseman12

Qualified accountant here, unfortunately we have 3 years of professional exams as well

I appreciate that we can only look for solutions inside a level 3 setting, but is anyone else questioning being on level 3 to begin with? The value judgement between suffocating the economy, causing decades long disaster for families and preventing the spread doesn't seem to add up for a virus with a less than 5% mortality rate (far lower among people under 50). I am happy to wear the mask and give up the more social side of life ,but people are acting like we don't make societal value judgements on life everyday. By way of example, we could completely eradicate road deaths if we wanted. The simple act of banning cars to protect the lives lost would be fully effective, but we don't because we as a society deem the benefits of modern transport outweigh those lives lost in the process. We don't lockdown cigarette sales despite the high number of deaths (6,000 per year in Ireland) as we deem personal sovereignty (lol money) more valuable then all those people passing away. So to act like we aren't capable of accepting a value on life is disingenuous and i'd hope to see that reality accepted at some point.

I can even see it lately in Leo's rhetoric, creeping into his interviews is the reality that Ireland can't sustain stricter lockdowns and expect people to have a way of feeding themselves. If you are vulnerable isolate yourself, if you live with someone vulnerable then isolate with them or take whatever precaution necessary. But what do I know, i'm just a bean counter after all

dobby896

Mooseman12 wrote: »

Qualified accountant here, unfortunately we have 3 years of professional exams as well

I appreciate that we can only look for solutions inside a level 3 setting, but is anyone else questioning being on level 3 to begin with? The value judgement between suffocating the economy, causing decades long disaster for families and preventing the spread doesn't seem to add up for a virus with a less than 5% mortality rate (far lower among people under 50). I am happy to wear the mask and give up the more social side of life ,but people are acting like we don't make societal value judgements on life everyday. By way of example, we could completely eradicate road deaths if we wanted. The simple act of banning cars to protect the lives lost would be fully effective, but we don't because we as a society deem the benefits of modern transport outweigh those lives lost in the process. We don't lockdown cigarette sales despite the high number of deaths (6,000 per year in Ireland) as we deem personal sovereignty (lol money) more valuable then all those people passing away. So to act like we aren't capable of accepting a value on life is disingenuous and i'd hope to see that reality accepted at some point.

I can even see it lately in Leo's rhetoric, creeping into his interviews is the reality that Ireland can't sustain stricter lockdowns and expect people to have a way of feeding themselves. If you are vulnerable isolate yourself, if you live with someone vulnerable then isolate with them or take whatever precaution necessary. But what do I know, i'm just a bean counter after all

Sorry but I honestly don't even have the headspace for discussions surrounding this now, I just want a timetable hahah

Mooseman12

hahaha I had to vent, my apologies.

dobby896

Mooseman12 wrote: »

hahaha I had to vent, my apologies.

Venting is always good haha, but just feel like we could all go down a wormhole with discussions around the general logistics of the lockdown etc, Twitter is currently a cesspit for it lol

IgoPAP

Mooseman12 wrote: »

Qualified accountant here, unfortunately we have 3 years of professional exams as well

I appreciate that we can only look for solutions inside a level 3 setting, but is anyone else questioning being on level 3 to begin with? The value judgement between suffocating the economy, causing decades long disaster for families and preventing the spread doesn't seem to add up for a virus with a less than 5% mortality rate (far lower among people under 50). I am happy to wear the mask and give up the more social side of life ,but people are acting like we don't make societal value judgements on life everyday. By way of example, we could completely eradicate road deaths if we wanted. The simple act of banning cars to protect the lives lost would be fully effective, but we don't because we as a society deem the benefits of modern transport outweigh those lives lost in the process. We don't lockdown cigarette sales despite the high number of deaths (6,000 per year in Ireland) as we deem personal sovereignty (lol money) more valuable then all those people passing away. So to act like we aren't capable of accepting a value on life is disingenuous and i'd hope to see that reality accepted at some point.

I can even see it lately in Leo's rhetoric, creeping into his interviews is the reality that Ireland can't sustain stricter lockdowns and expect people to have a way of feeding themselves. If you are vulnerable isolate yourself, if you live with someone vulnerable then isolate with them or take whatever precaution necessary. But what do I know, i'm just a bean counter after all

What does this have to do with the Fe1 discussion board?

Mod
Indeed! Pls get back to topic
Mooseman12 PLS do not post again on this forum

melodrama

nicolesd wrote: »

Has people been replying to the jornalist? maybe if we get them involved in our concerns and suggestions might put more pressure on the society! as it seems to have done. Agreed it is odd we are just hearing from them now on this after their comment!

If anyone wants to get in contact for the piece they are welcome to, I'm eager to hear all perspectives. As I'm freelance I'm in the process of pitching it to media. I'm just as surprised to see the Law Society comment on this thread, I haven't been in touch with them.

ScatmanWhack

Mooseman12 wrote: »

Qualified accountant here, unfortunately we have 3 years of professional exams as well

I appreciate that we can only look for solutions inside a level 3 setting, but is anyone else questioning being on level 3 to begin with? The value judgement between suffocating the economy, causing decades long disaster for families and preventing the spread doesn't seem to add up for a virus with a less than 5% mortality rate (far lower among people under 50). I am happy to wear the mask and give up the more social side of life ,but people are acting like we don't make societal value judgements on life everyday. By way of example, we could completely eradicate road deaths if we wanted. The simple act of banning cars to protect the lives lost would be fully effective, but we don't because we as a society deem the benefits of modern transport outweigh those lives lost in the process. We don't lockdown cigarette sales despite the high number of deaths (6,000 per year in Ireland) as we deem personal sovereignty (lol money) more valuable then all those people passing away. So to act like we aren't capable of accepting a value on life is disingenuous and i'd hope to see that reality accepted at some point.

I can even see it lately in Leo's rhetoric, creeping into his interviews is the reality that Ireland can't sustain stricter lockdowns and expect people to have a way of feeding themselves. If you are vulnerable isolate yourself, if you live with someone vulnerable then isolate with them or take whatever precaution necessary. But what do I know, i'm just a bean counter after all

This isn't the forum for this kind of discussion and the arguments you're making here are seriously insulting to anybody who has lost somebody to Covid. I'm almost getting the feeling you're trying to provoke a reaction by comparing a deadly infectious disease to cars and cigarettes. Get a grip. Even if the mortality rate was 1%, you'd be talking about up to 40,000 deaths if everyone got it.

lsheehaneire

Do you really think there will be any interest from the public ? I don't mean this in condescending way but the country is on its knees , economically and emotionally right now.

Probably a stupid q but how would open book exams work if we don’t all have the same book/manual?

Hazel774

Deleted User wrote: »

Probably a stupid q but how would open book exams work if we don’t all have the same book/manual?

I sat open book law exams before and you could just use any materials you have, so we could bring in hand written notes, books etc. It's more so a case that you can just use your notes in the exam as opposed to everyone having a copy of the same books, and therefore it's up to you to prepare good concise notes.
Tbh it was just as hard as traditional exams as you genuinely don't have time to be flipping through books and notes so you still have to know your notes inside out.

That's just my experience, I'm sure there are other ways too

TheLawGuy

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Probably a stupid q but how would open book exams work if we don’t all have the same book/manual?

I imagine that won't matter. At the end of the day most candidates sitting these exams will know the main topics and cases inside out. The tricky part is identifying the problem in the question and applying our knowledge to that. The examiners won't care where we get our information from as long as it is accurate and we show that we can apply that correctly to a particular situation. You could have the best notes in the world but if you don't know how to apply them to the question its game over.

Philodendron

Considering that the Law Society has already set a precedent of unequal/arguably unfair treatment by holding some exams in August, therefore giving extra time for some people to study, I think it is only fair to consider some of these propositions:

1) If the issue of holding online exams is the high number of students sitting the exams: disqualify just for this ONE sitting those who are still completing their degrees and/or allow for exemptions/automatic pass for those who have registered for the October sitting but have already passed the subjects in college.

2) Whether or not the above is implemented, if the online option is available, make it open book as in reality no solicitor will know 100+ cases off the bat anyway. No amount of books/materials will actually substantially help you in an exam if you did not properly prepare.

It is shocking how this specific professional body is acting so unprofessionally. No communication, no updates, no planned solutions to foreseeable complications. These exams are stressful to the extreme as is and to add such uncertainty is beyond disgraceful. No consideration has been made as to how students have to plan their studies, work, time off, etc. Absolute mess without any clarity or hope.

LawSocIreland

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

In the meantime, we have set up a helpline to deal with any queries. If you wish to avail of this service, please contact Danielle Greene at 01 881 5762.

ScatmanWhack

I was told that the PPC2 exams were held online and that they were held over 5 hours instead of the usual 3 to accommodate for the format change. Anybody hear anything else about this?

If our exams are going to be 5 hours long there's no way I'll be able to do 2 or 3 in a row. 3 hours is exhausting enough. Hope there's at least a day in between each exam.

ScatmanWhack

LawSocIreland wrote: »

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

In the meantime, we have set up a helpline to deal with any queries. If you wish to avail of this service, please contact Marie Henry at 01 881 5762.

Can you please start updating candidates via email instead of just updating the Law Society website and posting on boards.ie.

rebuke

LawSocIreland wrote: »

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

In the meantime, we have set up a helpline to deal with any queries. If you wish to avail of this service, please contact Marie Henry at 01 881 5762.

Perhaps you need to accept the fact that given the current situation, it may not be possible to 'preserve the integrity of the exam.' This was quite clearly the case with the Leaving Cert where alternative arrangements had to be made.

Law20213

ScatmanWhack wrote: »

I was told that the PPC2 exams were held online and that they were held over 5 hours instead of the usual 3 to accommodate for the format change. Anybody hear anything else about this?

If our exams are going to be 5 hours long there's no way I'll be able to do 2 or 3 in a row. 3 hours is exhausting enough. Hope there's at least a day in between each exam.

5 hour exams will be gruelling then trying to revise after it for the following days exams...With 3/4 exams back to back...nightmare ....let’s hope they factor this into the new timetable.....online is now starting to sound like massive disadvantage...they better give us more time to prepare and get our technology in place before hand.....timetable will have to be moved to end nov beginning dec to accommodate all this change....of course people joining the hybrid should have there papers corrected first like august....but again I don’t hold much hope!

SKLaw

ScatmanWhack wrote: »

Can you please start updating candidates via email instead of just updating the Law Society website and posting on boards.ie.

I don’t ever get emails from them regarding updates but my email with them is correct so I always go by boards and the LS website. I contacted them about this already but I still don’t really get emails like that so who knows what’s wrong

lsheehaneire

Can we please please get a provisional date for the proposed online exams.

Jenosul

Law20213 wrote: »

5 hour exams will be gruelling then trying to revise after it for the following days exams...With 3/4 exams back to back...nightmare ....let’s hope they factor this into the new timetable.....online is now starting to sound like massive disadvantage...they better give us more time to prepare and get our technology in place before hand.....timetable will have to be moved to end nov beginning dec to accommodate all this change....of course people joining the hybrid should have there papers corrected first like august....but again I don’t hold much hope!

I agree with this I know I would be completely burned out. I am a loss at this stage. I could not even sleep.

mayolaw

lsheehaneire wrote: »

Can we please please get a provisional date for the proposed online exams.

Agreed. This would be very helpful.

SKLaw

lsheehaneire wrote: »

Can we please please get a provisional date for the proposed online exams.

This would definitely take some stress away. Just something to go by for the studying

ruby1998

Even a simple confirmation that they will not take place the 1st week of November but later in the month.

mayolaw

ruby1998 wrote: »

Even a simple confirmation that they will not take place the 1st week of November but later in the month.

Exactly. Since they are not giving us any news until next week they should give us at least another extra week (if not more).

Law20213

ruby1998 wrote: »

Even a simple confirmation that they will not take place the 1st week of November but later in the month.

Kings Inn students got timetable nearly 9 weeks before the start of there online exams in August!!......imagine having that vital knowledge before our exams......would ease so much stress and anxiety!!


But nah guys we got wait till next week

Fe1student1234

ruby1998 wrote: »

Even a simple confirmation that they will not take place the 1st week of November but later in the month.

Do you think they’ll be later in the month ?

I have a feeling they’ll still be the first week of November for some reason If they even go ahead

lsheehaneire

All we need is a date, even a provisional date.

SKLaw

Fe1student1234 wrote: »

Do you think they’ll be later in the month ?

I have a feeling they’ll still be the first week of November for some reason If they even go ahead

The thought of it scares me especially when I’ve done little revision for it since my motivation has been so low

Fe1student1234

SKLaw wrote: »

The thought of it scares me especially when I’ve done little revision for it since my motivation has been so low

Same it’s terrible

I’m just going to go in the assumption for now that they’re the first week in November because it’s the only way I’ll get anything done

SKLaw

Fe1student1234 wrote: »

Same it’s terrible

I’m just going to go in the assumption for now that they’re the first week in November because it’s the only way I’ll get anything done

I’m going by that at the moment too since they can’t give more info until next week

Fingers crossed we’ll all be okay!

ruby1998

No idea.. announcing three weeks out that they’ll be online after weeks of uncertainty wouldn’t be ideal from my pov anyway

shaunadennyham

LawSocIreland wrote: »

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

Sorry but does the Law Society have any appreciation for the level of stress this is putting students under? It’s callous and unnecessary. This pandemic has been ongoing for 7 months. Level 3 restrictions for Dublin were announced weeks ago. The fact that students were told there would be no online exams only now to be told that there ‘may’ be online exams is only adding to the confusion. People need to arrange study leave with work, need to source laptops and stable internet connections. Have you any regard for students with visual impairments or any other requirements for sitting exams?

It’s really not that difficult. Tell us if there will be an online sitting. Tell us if this sitting will happen in the first week of November or not. Tell us whether the exams will be written or typed. Tell us if they’ll be open book or closed book.

And please - don’t be so condescending. ‘Preserve the integrity of the exams’ - give me strength.

TCPIP

LawSocIreland wrote: »

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

Hello,

Can you please provide some clarification on what exactly this entails, specifically if the exams are still on course to begin in the first week of November? It is incredibly important as you know that we can develop a study time frame.

Meg!

LawSocIreland wrote: »

We fully understand that the current pandemic is causing a great deal of stress to candidates.

We had hoped to provide a physical examination in November but the government restrictions announced this week have made this impossible.

We are working to provide an online examination that will preserve the integrity of the examination and will have further information early next week.

Law Society - I have a few simple questions you might be able to address:
1. If you were unable to arrange an online exam before now what has changed that you might be able?

2. Why is there no wiggle room where this is concerned, I have 1 exam left, a legal degree and trainee-ship organised and I have completed a professional preparation course for these exams, I can provide proof of skill and knowledge from numerous sources. But this is not good enough for you, you want me to sit an exam you do not know when or how you are going to hold. COVID is nobodies fault but work with us so that we can progress in these difficult times.

3.Why put up a helpline?? (when I called I reached a mail-voice that said the person over the phone is out of the office till the 29th???

An assignment based exam could even be possible. Like in university set out a number of topics candidates register for one and because we are preparing for exams now have one week to complete and use a preferred method of reference as the examiner would like etc.

Meg!

100% agree with you. I honest dont think I own enough technology to support and online exam and typing the FE1 exam wold be incredible difficult.

sarahlawless

ruby1998 wrote: »

Even a simple confirmation that they will not take place the 1st week of November but later in the month.

Please please LS if you care at all about the mental health and well-being of the candidates can you confirm the above by the end of the week?

If you only tell us this next week I won't have time to arrange leave and will have to quit my job to sit these exams.

ruby1998

Going to try and get back into study tonight seeing as I’ve been staring into space all week. This is really destroying me haha it’s fine LS take your time x

rebuke

Meg! wrote: »

Law Society - I have a few simple questions you might be able to address:
1. If you were unable to arrange an online exam before now what has changed that you might be able?

2. Why is there no wiggle room where this is concerned, I have 1 exam left, a legal degree and trainee-ship organised and I have completed a professional preparation course for these exams, I can provide proof of skill and knowledge from numerous sources. But this is not good enough for you, you want me to sit an exam you do not know when or how you are going to hold. COVID is nobodies fault but work with us so that we can progress in these difficult times.

3.Why put up a helpline?? (when I called I reached a mail-voice that said the person over the phone is out of the office till the 29th???

An assignment based exam could even be possible. Like in university set out a number of topics candidates register for one and because we are preparing for exams now have one week to complete and use a preferred method of reference as the examiner would like etc.

I feel that changing the structure of the exam would unfairly prejudice students.

Students have paid hundreds up to thousands on prep courses for the specific format of the exam. Moreover, they have been preparing for the classic format for months now, to change the style of the exam 3 weeks out would be unacceptable.

Unless the exam can be held in the traditional format with an online provider, students should be passed on their merits from their Undergrad due to the circumstances.

vid36

Meg! wrote: »

100% agree with you. I honest dont think I own enough technology to support and online exam and typing the FE1 exam wold be incredible difficult.

You won't have to type, only the access to the paper and invigilation will be online. You scan in your exam script with a smart phone and post it afterwards. At least that is what they are doing with the PPC Hybrid and PPC ! repeat exams.