Billie eilish - Major Grammy winner

nullzero

The notion that being culturally illiterate is fine once you're under a certain age is ridiculous.

For decades band's/artists praised the people who influenced them, not just their peers, and that enriched the experience of the young people listening to their music as they understood where what they were producing was coming from.

Jesus it's not as if this is a golden age of music or cinema that is distracting young people from looking a little further back at what came before.

There's a lot of people here who would like to be thought of as hip regardless of how ignorant or stupid the qualifying criteria might be.

jiltloop

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The music is typical manufactured pop trash. The performer seems manufactured also, something very fake and unsettling about them.

Whatever about subjective opinions which means we'll never have universal agreement on any music act no matter how popular or palletable you're clearly wrong when you say this is manufactured pop. This is a brother and sister duo who make music in the bedroom studios.

Offer an opinion sure but at least get your facts straight.

P.s I'm not a fan personally but it's better than most of the absolute muck played on the radio these days.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

nullzero wrote: »

The notion that being culturally illiterate is fine once you're under a certain age is ridiculous.

For decades band's/artists praised the people who influenced them, not just their peers, and that enriched the experience of the young people listening to their music as they understood where what they were producing was coming from.

Jesus it's not as if this is a golden age of music or cinema that is distracting young people from looking a little further back at what came before.

There's a lot of people here who would like to be thought of as hip regardless of how ignorant or stupid the qualifying criteria might be.

She's hardly culturally illiterate because she doesn't know who Val Halen are. :rolleyes:

Why are people sooooo obsessed with this nonsense?

sbsquarepants

nullzero wrote: »

The notion that being culturally illiterate is fine once you're under a certain age is ridiculous.

For decades band's/artists praised the people who influenced them, not just their peers, and that enriched the experience of the young people listening to their music as they understood where what they were producing was coming from.

Jesus it's not as if this is a golden age of music or cinema that is distracting young people from looking a little further back at what came before.

There's a lot of people here who would like to be thought of a hip regardless of how ignorant or stupid the qualifying criteria might be.

Jesus, this is some top level music snob shít!

Nobody owes it to anyone to listen to anything, or to learn the history of any genre.

If the girl has never heard of a band who were last popular when her parents where in school, who really gives a rats arse - what difference does it make.

It has appeared to come as a major shock to some people to learn that different people may actually have actually accrued different knowledge!

What is the world coming to, how dare teenage girls not learn to love the music their parents first made out to!

nullzero

Nathan Rapid Snobbishness wrote: »

She's hardly culturally illiterate because she doesn't know who Val Halen are. :rolleyes:

Why are people sooooo obsessed with this nonsense?

I'm hardly obsessed, I was a kid in the 80's and I had at least heard of most musical acts from the previous three decades by the time I was her age.

This whole thing is almost straying into the territory of anything that came before today isn't relevant. My take on it is that its a studied affectation, being aloof when questioned about old music / artists because what's being created now is so much better than what came before,that would be fine if the music stood up to the scrutiny that invites, unfortunately for Billie Eilish her music just isn't that interesting.

Cienciano

topper75 wrote: »

Forgetting about who she doesn't and does know for a sec...

... what is the merit in her output? I listened with an open mind to Bad Guy and heard nothing new and nothing special. Any of her fans care to point out what I'm missing?

The 'singing' is breathy double-tracked whispering. The muffled bass/percussion is like a dance music track from 2005 playing loudly in a room next door. There is absolutely nothing sophisticated going on by way of melody or counterpoint. It is not something I would dance to. It doesn't seem to have any emotional colour. I don't hear a statement in the lyrics. I don't know what to do with it. It is quite poor in fact, and I have no idea how the Grammys were awarded.

Is there anything I need to pay attention to or is it all just a record industry emperor's new clothes thing and everyone is afraid to call out?

I think you and a few others are missing something. No one listens to music and has to be able to pinpoint why they like it. It's very simple, you listen to something and you either like it, or you don't. People don't spend time listening to music they don't like because the "record industry" told them. People listen to it because they like what they hear.
As for her voice, or the way she sings, don't even go there, there's been hundreds of great singers that you could describe as having terrible voices or not traditional ways of singing, it doesn't matter if the music is good.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

nullzero wrote: »

I'm hardly obsessed, I was a kid in the 80's and I had at least heard of most musical acts from the previous three decades by the time I was her age.

It's inconsequential. The information is absolutely irrelevant. It does not matter who she knows or does not know.

nullzero wrote: »

This whole thing is almost straying into the territory of anything that came before today isn't relevant. My take on it is that its a studied affectation, being aloof when questioned about old music / artists because what's being created now is so much better than what came before,that would be fine if the music stood up to the scrutiny that invites, unfortunately for Billie Eilish her music just isn't that interesting.

Way to go on twisting everything to your agenda :rolleyes:

At no point did anybody mention what you insinuate.

It's not interesting to YOU, that doesn't mean it's not interesting. Obviously it's very interesting to a LOT of people. Music is subjective, which is great, because it doesn't matter what some music snob on boards has to say about it. Your opinion is irrelevant

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

There's a kind of amusing level of frustration and irritation and frankly what comes as anger here. I don't like it and I don't know why people like it and I don't like that she gets acclaim and why aren't the kids mad about Van Halen, the idiots :mad:

I had a birthday recently, had the usual pang of feeling old. Cured now.

Arghus

buried wrote: »

Nah I don't like it. There is no energy, life or soul to anything this crew are making.
Whatever about the mumble aspect of her lyrical style. Yeah whatever, that's her thing, shes trying to do her version of Trip hop lyrical style that was going on back in the 90's so there is nothing new or groundbreaking there. But this production work done supposedly by her brother that is being lauded as well? Its just basic generic safe pop house. And its bad pop house because there is zero energy put into it. No life. No action. No lifts. No arpeggios. Nothing. Its just very bland stuttering and not very interesting to me. Somebody said earlier here all the mainstream radio stations are pushing this work and telling everyone how great it is, so in the style of the young wan herself I'll just say...

that's...

why..




she..




is..

hip.

You really think it's as bland as that? Obviously she is a bit overhyped, clearly, but, I dunno, I think the production and arrangement on a lot of the songs is pretty interesting to my ears.

Great use of space and little sonic details. Feels very deliberate and precise. It is pop music, it isn't wildly experimental, but I was surprised about how out there it was in many ways. There's plenty of dark and ominous stuff in there as well as the hooks. Like I've said: it isn't groundbreaking stuff, but it's definitely interesting and it's combined with undeniable pop hooks. I think the music is better than what you are giving it credit for.

Some of the more piano balladly numbers on the album are a bit predictable alright.

sbsquarepants

Cienciano wrote: »

As for her voice, or the way she sings, don't even go there, there's been hundreds of great singers that you could describe as having terrible voices or not traditional ways of singing, it doesn't matter if the music is good.

Bob Dylan - Nobel prize winner, sold a gazillion albums and not a fúcking note in his head!

Or our own Shane Macgowan - hardly a voice for the ages now!

nullzero

Nathan Rapid Snobbishness wrote: »

It's inconsequential. The information is absolutely irrelevant. It does not matter who she knows or does not know.



Way to go on twisting everything to your agenda :rolleyes:

At no point did anybody mention what you insinuate.

It's not interesting to YOU, that doesn't mean it's not interesting. Obviously it's very interesting to a LOT of people. Music is subjective, which is great, because it doesn't matter what some music snob on boards has to say about it. Your opinion is irrelevant

I haven't twisted anything here at all.

The idea that being ignorant of even extremely mainstream things is cool is just preposterous.

I'm sure plenty of people are delighted to be listening to her music, I never said they shouldn't, I merely have (as most people do) a broad range of references for evaluating what her music represents and how it compares to other music and it just isn't the ground breaking thing of brilliance it is being made out to be.

You enjoy listening to her, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, have fun and stop appropriating every opinion contrary to yours as some sort of attack on your values.

The Phantom Jipper

Nathan Rapid Snobbishness wrote: »

What is with your unhealthy obsession with this girls influences? Why does it matter so much to you? It's music, you enjoy it or you do not. Who actually cares who she knows and why? Such a pathetic point to focus on.



People like her music, shock horror. Does there have to be some hidden message or the likes. It's catchy to some, the reasoning behind that doesn't need to be justified at any level. It's music.



So? What point are you trying to convey here exactly?

Eh? The point was fairly clear surely. It's somewhat odd that a musician hasn't heard of some relatively famous people in the same profession, when Joe Soap on the street has a decent chance of having heard of them. Personally I'm not too pushed either way, but it's almost being suggested that it's outlandish for her to have heard of these acts, which I don't think is the case. An intellectual curiosity about popular music gives you a good chance of hearing of them, let alone actually being a fellow chart topping musician.

Deebles McBeebles

Maliyah Large Scabby wrote: »

There's a kind of amusing level of frustration and irritation and frankly what comes as anger here. I don't like it and I don't know why people like it and I don't like that she gets acclaim and why aren't the kids mad about Van Halen, the idiots :mad:

I had a birthday recently, had the usual pang of feeling old. Cured now.

I can't speak for everyone here but I certianly feel no anger toward her or her fans. Its not for me and I just think her comment was an attempt to be edgy but comes across as ignorant. Fair play to her like but lets not go overboard when praising her.

Skylinehead

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

lets not go overboard when praising her.

Likewise Van bleedin' Halen :pac:

buried

Arghus wrote: »

You really think it's as bland as that? Obviously she is a bit overhyped, clearly, but, I dunno, I think the production and arrangement on a lot of the songs is pretty interesting to my ears.

Great use of space and little sonic details. Feels very deliberate and precise. It is pop music, it isn't wildly experimental, but I was surprised about how out there it was in many ways. There's plenty of dark and ominous stuff in there as well as the hooks. Like I've said: it isn't groundbreaking stuff, but it's definitely interesting and it's combined with undeniable pop hooks. I think the music is better than what you are giving it credit for.

Some of the more piano balladly numbers on the album are a bit predictable alright.

It's bland as feic to me A, like far play to anyone that wants to create any sort of music or art, more power to them, and its great she and her brother are enjoying success to go with it. For me, its just so, uninteresting. I like my experimental music and I know this work isn't in any way shape or form, but the whole craft of it is just so lifeless. The production I mean, nothing grabs me to make me go or feel "yes this is going somewhere and I want to go back to get there again as soon as possible". I would just like to see way, way more life and energy put into the tracks she is using her lyrical style over. The stuttering heavy beats and the ominous melodies don't seem to ascend or descend in any way shape or form, this does not mix well with her vocal style which does the exact same thing. And all the tracks seem to have this exact same method of style within them so they all just become generic and not very interesting to my ears.

It would be interesting to see if the production aspect could be changed in any future works they do. Maybe the two of them might have a listen to some of the earlier works by the likes of Underworld, another half rap/half song electronic pop act and try to catch some of that energy but I don't think they would have the scope for that. Her lyrical style actually reminds me a bit of the vocals Karl Hyde used to great effect back in the mid 90's on their tracks. He had the perfect blend of half rap/half singing stuttering words, but that lyrical style was backed up with a full frontal assault of ascending and descending electronically made melodies and beats that were a fantastic blend. But then again, that's the sort of 'house pop' what I like, the kids these days may not be into the likes of that so much.

LirW

And from today on I know that a sizeable portion of middle-aged people get their knickers twisted if you have never heard of Van Halen.

TheMilkyPirate

Seems as though a lot of people here have a hard time grasping the concept that music is entirely subjective. "Why?" "Why do you like it?" "There's nothing to it" Yes, maybe for you.

I like her album but her EP 'Don't smile at me' is much much better.

I think her and Finneas will do an amazing job with the bond tune think she will suit it perfectly.

EDIT: Van Halen are absolute trash so who cares if she knows them or not, such a bizarre turn for the thread to take.

Deebles McBeebles

Skylinehead wrote: »

Likewise Van bleedin' Halen :pac:

Influential guitarist who changed how a generation of players used the instrument, thats all I've said about VH!

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

I can't speak for everyone here but I certianly feel no anger toward her or her fans. Its not for me and I just think her comment was an attempt to be edgy but comes across as ignorant. Fair play to her like but lets not go overboard when praising her.

I don't think she's a genius or the saviour of music or anything, she's talented and precocious and I think and believe she could have longevity. She makes music which really connects to young people and is imo distinct from and superior to a lot of the stuff that's very popular with them. I really like her, and it's actually a bit scary to think how much I would have adored her and been obsessed with her if were right in rather than adjacent to her demographic.

She's also a homeschooled 18 year old who makes electronic music, I don't see what's so incredible in her not knowing who Van Halen are, and it's not some horrendous reflection on her as a musician or a person if she's telling the truth.

And if she's not...I usually went down the road of lying that I HAD seen/heard/read things at that age but Jesus, teenager fibs to seem cool, man the escape pods, the world is ending...

Yes, she won a load of Grammys. Like basically every big new act that's had the kind of year she has in terms of exposure and popularity. It's not like they specially created the Billie Eilish Nobel Prize for the Cleverest Music Ever for her.

Quick, someone go make sure Lizzo knows who Randy Newman and Sharon Von Etton and Gerry Rafferty are :pac:

PsychoPete

Effects wrote: »

Like I said, most people in their 20s. Most people in their 20s these days aren't metalheads. You're deluded if you think they are.

Most of them are into the lads that mumble with scribbles on their face but if that's what they are happy listening to. When I was at Metallica most of the people around me where at least 20 years older than me. Todays youth hasn't time all these old bands

silverharp

never heard of her, clicked on a video without the sound, looks like a miserable sort. is she going for some Avril Lavigne vibe?

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

nullzero wrote: »

I haven't twisted anything here at all.

Funny you say that...

nullzero wrote: »

The idea that being ignorant of even extremely mainstream things is cool is just preposterous.

Not twisting anything??? :rolleyes:

I'm sure plenty of people are delighted to be listening to her music, I never said they shouldn't, I merely have (as most people do) a broad range of references for evaluating what her music represents and how it compares to other music and it just isn't the ground breaking thing of brilliance it is being made out to be.

Her broad range does not match your broad range ergo she has not got a broad range... She doesn't have to know every single act you deem acceptable for her to know. Why is it soooo important for her to know Van Halen? Why are so many people fixated on that one point?

You enjoy listening to her, it doesn't bother me in the slightest, have fun and stop appropriating every opinion contrary to yours as some sort of attack on your values.

I haven't given my opinion on her music, on her or her brother, her clothes or looks or style of singing or anything else for that matter. My main gripe with this topic is people giving other people (absolute strangers) crap about what they do and do not know. As if they are some sort of authority on the subject? Is it spite? Envy?

The following doesn't make an ounce of sense, what are you trying to say?

stop appropriating every opinion contrary to yours

The Phantom Jipper wrote: »

Eh? The point was fairly clear surely. It's somewhat odd that a musician hasn't heard of some relatively famous people in the same profession, when Joe Soap on the street has a decent chance of having heard of them. Personally I'm not too pushed either way... An intellectual curiosity about popular music gives you a good chance of hearing of them, let alone actually being a fellow chart topping musician.

Is there a list of artists one should know before getting into the music industry? Regardless of genre of course. She hasn't heard of one band/act and somehow that means she doesn't have intellectual curiosity? How dare she not know of a band which I know of... :rolleyes:

The Phantom Jipper wrote: »

it's almost being suggested that it's outlandish for her to have heard of these acts.

No, no it's not. People are simply saying that it's ok to not know a band or act or somebody famous...

LirW

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

Seems as though a lot of people here have a hard time grasping the concept that music is entirely subjective. "Why?" "Why do you like it?" "There's nothing to it" Yes, maybe for you.

I like her album but her EP 'Don't smile at me' is much much better.

I think her and Finneas will do an amazing job with the bond tune think she will suit it perfectly.

EDIT: Van Halen are absolute trash so who cares if she knows them or not, such a bizarre turn for the thread to take.

I think sh1tting on some other generation's music is one of the great disciplines of mankind and the older we get, the less accepting we are, it seems.

Deebles McBeebles

Maliyah Large Scabby wrote: »

She's also a homeschooled 18 year old who makes electronic music, I don't see what's so incredible in her not knowing who Van Halen are, and it's not some horrendous reflection on her as a musician or a person if she's telling the truth.

And if she's not...I usually went down the road of lying that I HAD seen/heard/read things at that age but Jesus, teenager fibs to seem cool, man the escape pods, the world is ending...

Yes but no one has said those things. Not that I've seen anyway. I'd imagine the vast majority who aren't fans are like me, typing with a smile. Not mashing the keyboard with hatred for this girl, which is what some posters are implying. That's the weirdest part about this thread, you can't just not be bothered with her, you have to hate her apparently.

Cienciano

On Van Halen selling 50m albums

https://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2017/10/17/riaa-best-selling-artists-of-all-time/

George Strait sold 70 million albums. Number 11 of top selling albums of all time. According to Wikipedia, George Strait is considered one of the most influential and popular recording artists of all time. I honestly never heard of him.

nullzero

Nathan Rapid Snobbishness wrote: »

Funny you say that...



Not twisting anything??? :rolleyes:



Her broad range does not match your broad range ergo she has not got a broad range... She doesn't have to know every single act you deem acceptable for her to know. Why is it soooo important for her to know Van Halen? Why are so many people fixated on that one point?



I haven't given my opinion on her music, on her or her brother, her clothes or looks or style of singing or anything else for that matter. My main gripe with this topic is people giving other people (absolute strangers) crap about what they do and do not know. As if they are some sort of authority on the subject? Is it spite? Envy?

The following doesn't make an ounce of sense, what are you trying to say?

stop appropriating every opinion contrary to yours





Is there a list of artists one should know before getting into the music industry? Regardless of genre of course. She hasn't heard of one band/act and somehow that means she doesn't have intellectual curiosity? How dare she not know of a band which I know of... :rolleyes:



No, no it's not. People are simply saying that it's ok to not know a band or act or somebody famous...

The rolleyes and the quote towers are getting tiresome.

I'm not sure how I'm twisting things, if you could give me an example it would be helpful.

You seem to be getting pretty worked up about this topic, hence why I said you are appropriating opinions contrary to yours as an attack on you and or your values.

I'm having a hard time understanding what your point is.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

Deebles McBeebles wrote: »

Yes but no one has said those things. Not that I've seen anyway. I'd imagine the vast majority who aren't fans are like me, typing with a smile. Not mashing the keyboard with hatred for this girl, which is what some posters are implying. That's the weirdest part about this thread.

I dunno man a few people seem very invested in explaining to people what poor form it is that she hasn't heard of people. Specifically Van Halen, personally I got more of an eyebrow raise from Run DMC. The fact that about 30% of the posts in the whole thread are about Van Halen kind of suggests to me people think it's important, to the point where there's a definite implication that it reflects badly on her.

She's been called demonic, talentless, a terrible influence, a fraud, her fans only like her because they're told to or they know nothing, etc etc. I know it's hard to judge tone over text but I'm not picturing many smiling faces in front of those particular monitors.

SnazzyPig

It's not the sales people object to, it's the awards.

According to Wikipedia on the Grammys-

'It is considered one of the four major annual American entertainment awards along with the Academy Awards (film), the Emmy Awards (television), and the Tony Awards (theater and Broadway)'.

nullzero

TheMilkyPirate wrote: »

Seems as though a lot of people here have a hard time grasping the concept that music is entirely subjective. "Why?" "Why do you like it?" "There's nothing to it" Yes, maybe for you.

I like her album but her EP 'Don't smile at me' is much much better.

I think her and Finneas will do an amazing job with the bond tune think she will suit it perfectly.

EDIT: Van Halen are absolute trash so who cares if she knows them or not, such a bizarre turn for the thread to take.

Music is subjective, each to their own but Van Halen are trash. Nice.

Deebles McBeebles

Cienciano wrote: »

George Strait sold 70 million albums. Number 11 of top selling albums of all time. According to Wikipedia, George Strait is considered one of the most influential and popular recording artists of all time. I honestly never heard of him.

Thats yer man from Dire Straits