Why I'm Voting for FG

Idbatterim

storker wrote: »

FG won't care how reluctantly you give them your vote, or how hard you hold your nose. Politicians don't pick up on that kind of nuance. If FG are voted back in, they won't read say "Well we got back in, but we'd better get our act together or people like Idbatterim might be super annoyed with us next time" - they'll say "The electorate approves of how we do things!" High fives all round and keep doing everything the same way.

I'm prepared to sacrifice a little to put a stop to that kind of thinking.

they will have lost a good few seats. they may think some of that is down to not "rewarding the early risers" there will be nothing between them and FF I expect. You want me to go further to the left, to teach FG, by screwing myself ultimately?

Alternatively I do a simple analysis like most of the population do, "FG didnt do much for me, Ill punish them" and what? think that they will figure out, its mainly to do with not rewarding the early risers and that they remember them the next time. Its a rock and a hard place. Amazing being in a country, where you can basically vote for one centre party, if not left of centre now. In a country where there chance of a party winning a majority again is cloud cuckoo land stuff and the alternative options, are to the left of this centre left party! INSANE!

Idbatterim

storker wrote: »

FG won't care how reluctantly you give them your vote, or how hard you hold your nose. Politicians don't pick up on that kind of nuance. If FG are voted back in, they won't read say "Well we got back in, but we'd better get our act together or people like Idbatterim might be super annoyed with us next time" - they'll say "The electorate approves of how we do things!" High fives all round and keep doing everything the same way.

I'm prepared to sacrifice a little to put a stop to that kind of thinking.

interesting points. I dont think though that "The electorate approves of how we do things!" High fives all round and keep doing everything the same way." I mean they will lose a good few seats and not after coming out of a recession and "unpopular choices" they are losing seats during a "boom"!!!

Mortelaro

Idbatterim wrote: »

I mean they will lose a good few seats and not after coming out of a recession and "unpopular choices" they are losing seats during a "boom"!!!

Seems stupid to me
Very brexit referendy

joe swanson

As far as i can see that haven’t done too badly. Not a big Varadkar fan but they had some mess to clean up after Fianna Fáil- that’s why I won’t be voting for them.

I could never vote Sinn Fein. Murder apologists and more. Some people have v short memories .

And the rest are a collection of loonies and nutcases with no realistic alternative. Fine Gael will probably get my vote. Not out of any loyalty or love or anything like that . They have done a solid enough job and the rest are no go

uck51js9zml2yt

Voted FG all my life. Don't know who to vote for now. I just know it won't be FG.

James Brown

Jasmine Gigantic Schwa wrote: »

Voted FG all my life. Don't know who to vote for now. I just know it won't be FG.

I'd high hopes in 2011.

Mortelaro

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I'd high hopes in 2011.

Perfection?

Idbatterim

Jasmine Gigantic Schwa wrote: »

Voted FG all my life. Don't know who to vote for now. I just know it won't be FG.

why not?

squawker

lol

Fine Gael have always ridden coat tales, they were completely complicite with the Fianna Fail government before the world crash of the 2000s

they just slithered in when it all went to sh1t, the only thing they ever did was bowed down to their German overlords when they came calling for their debts

then just held on while the America overcame their Financial woes and then have ridden in on those coat tales

they are a Party of shopkeepers and born from their Fascist roots

El Tarangu

Yurt! wrote: »

The Troika put Ireland's economy back on track, not FG. We were essentially and economic protectorate for a large part of the Kenny years.

This FG government is an out and out failure.

Yurt! wrote: »

The Greek's tried to buck the Troika off their back more than once, we didn't.

I don't agree with everything that was done during those years, but we sure as sh*t weren't being guided by the brains trust in Fine Gael.

The troika haven't been calling the shots for a few years now, and yet we have been the fastest growing economy in the eurozone several years in a row - how do you account for that?

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Just on the Brexit issue. FG enjoyed unity from the Dail and whilst politicians change its the permanent civil servants who do the talking on the nitty gritty. The outcome for Ireland would be no different no matter who occupied the government benches, although maybe the Brits might have not been as intensively insulted as they were by Leo. Even his own party told him to dial it back.

Are you thinking of Timmy Dooley's solo run criticising the government's Brexit strategy? I agree that the government did not have much domestic political opposition to contend with on Brexit, and Michael Martin did rebuke Dooley afterwards, but the fact that MM could not even keep his frontbench TDs on message does not convince me that FF would have done as good a job on the Brexit issue.

I'd agree with the OP - FG seem the lesser of two evils at the minute.

Plumbthedepths

El Tarangu wrote: »

The troika haven't been calling the shots for a few years now, and yet we have been the fastest growing economy in the eurozone several years in a row - how do you account for that?



Are you thinking of Timmy Dooley's solo run criticising the government's Brexit strategy? I agree that the government did not have much domestic political opposition to contend with on Brexit, and Michael Martin did rebuke Dooley afterwards, but the fact that MM could not even keep his frontbench TDs on message does not convince me that FF would have done as good a job on the Brexit issue.

I'd agree with the OP - FG seem the lesser of two evils at the minute.

No not thinking of Dooley at all. If I were I would have said Dooley and not referenced Leo. Again the negotiations are carried out the senior civil servants and there was no opposition to the Irish states position on Brexit. Politicians change all the time trying to suggest that continuity is needed to ensure a favourable outcome is to be honest clutching at straws seeking only electoral gain.

El Tarangu

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

No not thinking of Dooley at all. If I were I would have said Dooley and not referenced Leo.

Sorry for taking you up the wrong way. I'm not familiar with the incident you are referring to - when did someone in FG suggest that he should dial it back on the Brexit negotiations?

Plumbthedepths

El Tarangu wrote: »

Sorry for taking you up the wrong way. I'm not familiar with the incident you are referring to - who in FG suggested that he should dial it back on the Brexit negotiations?

My post is there not been edited at all, why are you still behaving as if I said something I didn't. I said Leo was told by his own party to dial back the insulting behaviour. With all articles in the papers party sources are quoted but no names attached. You think FG are the best of a bad lot to vote for? Fair play but based on the last 9 years I disagree and have no interest in helping them achieve another 5 years.

James Brown

Mortelaro wrote: »

Perfection?

Only baby jesus is perfect.
Trying to have a straight discussion here pal.
No quangos, change the way we do business, no cronyism. You know, the opposite of what we got and are getting.
Its pathetic the way all you boys go right to smart arse attacks. Is it because FG are...well FG?
Kenny was a disappointment and Varadkar wasn't the young bright light the parliamentary party had hoped. Record breaking crises and a snotty attitude when quizzed.

tobsey

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

My post is there not been edited at all, why are you still behaving as if I said something I didn't. I said Leo was told by his own party to dial back the insulting behaviour. With all articles in the papers party sources are quoted but no names attached. You think FG are the best of a bad lot to vote for? Fair play but based on the last 9 years I disagree and have no interest in helping them achieve another 5 years.

Can you link to an article that said his party told him to roll back on the insults. I’ve genuinely searched and the only article that matches what you said is from the Belfast telegraph. The only other article mentions Arlene Foster saying he should stop the insults.

I Am The Law

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

My post is there not been edited at all, why are you still behaving as if I said something I didn't. I said Leo was told by his own party to dial back the insulting behaviour. With all articles in the papers party sources are quoted but no names attached. You think FG are the best of a bad lot to vote for? Fair play but based on the last 9 years I disagree and have no interest in helping them achieve another 5 years.

Correct. I think the majority of people are gone past 'best of a bad lot' and it's over for FG, no matter how much boards mods try to influence.

Irish citizens are steadily refusing to be spoken down to by those who decide to put themselves in positions of power.

It's slow progress, but seeing FF and FG hovering around the 20% mark is sure sign that people won't accept their nonsense anymore.

McMurphy

I Am The Law wrote: »

Correct. I think the majority of people are gone past 'best of a bad lot' and it's over for FG, no matter how much boards mods try to influence.

Irish citizens are steadily refusing to be spoken down to by those who decide to put themselves in positions of power.

It's slow progress, but seeing FF and FG hovering around the 20% mark is sure sign that people won't accept their nonsense anymore.

JohnnyFlash

FF and SF in coalition after the election. Time for FG to do a spell on the opposition benches. Let the other lads and ladies practice what they preach.

Martin is even more tetchy and waspish than usual as he knows SF are going to take those 3rd and 4th seats in constituencies that FF need to be able to form a coalition with the Greens, Labour, SD and independents. So he has to do a deal with a party who he genuinely hates (He hates Adams in particular - the psychopath ).

Time for a small bit of county hurling for SF.

Asitis2019

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

FF and SF in coalition after the election. Time for FG to do a spell on the opposition benches. Let the other lads and ladies practice what they preach.

Martin is even more tetchy and waspish than usual as he knows SF are going to take those 3rd and 4th seats in constituencies that FF need to be able to form a coalition with the Greens, Labour, SD and independents. So he has to do a deal with a party who he genuinely hates (He hates Adams in particular - the psychopath ).

Time for a small bit of county hurling for SF.

Very, very unlikely - I don't think most FF members would countenance this. But I do agree Martin is tetchy, and we are getting an insight into what he would be like as PM. I don't like what I see. I hope voters will see through Martin, and FF for their lack of economic policies, and no real solutions.

I think we will have a rainbow coalition led by FG, including labour, greens, soc dems, and a few independents.

Idbatterim

its so intriguing. what would FF and SF actually do if they get into power. In a way, I would like to see it, to have the question answered once and for all. We know what we get now if its FG main party. if they ruin the place again, that answers that, when they cant solve all the issues, well that is obvious.

building way more housing, is the only issue they might do better on, its also the most critical issue in my opinion. Given none of them will ever tackle issues like crime, health, public service etc... infrastructure is also a very easy one to solve too, they just need to now fund the bigger projects, DU, DM and M20, to hell with the rest of the mickey mouse stuff...

Asitis2019

Idbatterim wrote: »

its so intriguing. what would FF and SF actually do if they get into power. In a way, I would like to see it, to have the question answered once and for all. We know what we get now if its FG main party. if they ruin the place again, that answers that, when they cant solve all the issues, well that is obvious.

building way more housing, is the only issue they might do better on, its also the most critical issue in my opinion. Given none of them will ever tackle issues like crime, health, public service etc... infrastructure is also a very easy one to solve too, they just need to now fund the bigger projects, DU, DM and M20, to hell with the rest of the mickey mouse stuff...

What they would do is bring this country back to 2008. FF will do this anyway, but FF + SF will do it quicker.

People need to realize that we have a good government that has been fairly responsive to the issues of the day. I have voted FF in the past - I did so in 2011 when the tide was out, and again in 2016.

However, while I have no great love for FG, my vote is based on the fact that FG, on average, has smarter and experienced politicians than FF. I have no time for my local FG politician, but I will vote for her on party grounds. Those suggesting a change from the regime are really naïve in my opinion because although they may make different choices, the options available are the same.

FF will spend more money, but I don't see it managing the economy in a way that will generate the necessary resources to support this. The result will be increased taxes in 2-3 years.

Voting for independents and fringe parties is a wasted vote.

Idbatterim

Asitis2019 wrote: »

What they would do is bring this country back to 2008. FF will do this anyway, but FF + SF will do it quicker.

People need to realize that we have a good government that has been fairly responsive to the issues of the day. I have voted FF in the past - I did so in 2011 when the tide was out, and again in 2016.

However, while I have no great love for FG, my vote is based on the fact that FG, on average, has smarter and experienced politicians than FF. I have no time for my local FG politician, but I will vote for her on party grounds. Those suggesting a change from the regime are really naïve in my opinion because although they may make different choices, the options available are the same.

FF will spend more money, but I don't see it managing the economy in a way that will generate the necessary resources to support this. The result will be increased taxes in 2-3 years.

yeah valid points. One area that FG can certainly be attacked on, is the glacial response to addressing primarily housing... They may pay the price and maybe they should. It will be fascinating to see what happens over the next few weeks and if FG isnt in government, over the next few years...

Idbatterim

the analysis here is way too in the media , rte etc for people to make informed decisions and then you have the fact that most of the electorate are totally clueless on most issues...

Mortelaro

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Only baby jesus is perfect.
Trying to have a straight discussion here pal.
No quangos, change the way we do business, no cronyism. You know, the opposite of what we got and are getting.
Its pathetic the way all you boys go right to smart arse attacks. Is it because FG are...well FG?

But shur you do what you're accusing me of all the time here
I'm not astounded that the game book you use is the it's not me its you retort
It's only possible on the internet
It wouldn't get past Bryan Dobson

Loafing Oaf

McMurphy wrote: »

Replying to Lindsey:

The tweet is not aimed at potential SF voters; it's aimed at SF-phobic voters hovering between FG and FF...

McMurphy

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Replying to Lindsey:

The tweet is not aimed at potential SF voters; it's aimed at SF-phobic voters hovering between FG and FF...

All these tweets seem to be doing is costing FG points in opinion polls by the looks of things, people don't like being pissed on their necks and being told it's raining.

The one thing I'm sceptical about though is that the polls show that the losses in fg % are the exact same as the gains SF are showing in theirs.

I was talking to a few people in work this week, north Dublin areas who are all adamant that they're giving the shinners a first preference this year for the first time (I suspect from labour or FF, but I didn't ask)

Also was having a chin wag with the neighbour the other evening, let's just say he's a job enforcing the law.

Yep, shinners for the first time he said.

I've a few bob on a FF minority govt myself, but if these polls come to fruition, SF are looking like the main opposition party at least.

Interesting times ahead.

Mortelaro

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Replying to Lindsey:

The tweet is not aimed at potential SF voters; it's aimed at SF-phobic voters hovering between FG and FF...

The fact that peeps think it's to stop Sinn Féin is actually ignorance
But then one person's ignorance is another's idea of intelligence these days
I've voted FG in the last 3 elections and will continue to do so based on what I think is best for the economy
I will give a useful preference to a soc Dem after that because I agree with a lot of their services agenda but doubt they'd wreck the economy
I can't vote green because theyre a 1 trick pony in my view and turned a blind eye in their FF coalition to a lot of messing.

Calhoun

Asitis2019 wrote: »

What they would do is bring this country back to 2008. FF will do this anyway, but FF + SF will do it quicker.

People need to realize that we have a good government that has been fairly responsive to the issues of the day. I have voted FF in the past - I did so in 2011 when the tide was out, and again in 2016.

However, while I have no great love for FG, my vote is based on the fact that FG, on average, has smarter and experienced politicians than FF. I have no time for my local FG politician, but I will vote for her on party grounds. Those suggesting a change from the regime are really naïve in my opinion because although they may make different choices, the options available are the same.

FF will spend more money, but I don't see it managing the economy in a way that will generate the necessary resources to support this. The result will be increased taxes in 2-3 years.

Voting for independents and fringe parties is a wasted vote.

Is it not equally as naive to vote for a party based on your own limited view that they are apparently better than others even though they had very little hand in the direction that we were going because of outside interference.

Maria Bailey, the Ill concieved RIC commemorations, Irish water and the part Phil Hogan played before he got moved off to Europe so he would stop being an embarrassment . Frank Feighen attacking an old man in Roscommon, the many controversy's with the police force that have been mishandled and that's all before you get onto the current big issues.

It's great your a die hard blue shirt but voting is one of the few ways to send a message to politicians that your not happy with the status quo.

Mortelaro

storker wrote: »

FG won't care how reluctantly you give them your vote, or how hard you hold your nose. Politicians don't pick up on that kind of nuance. If FG are voted back in, they won't read say "Well we got back in, but we'd better get our act together or people like Idbatterim might be super annoyed with us next time" - they'll say "The electorate approves of how we do things!" High fives all round and keep doing everything the same way.

I'm prepared to sacrifice a little to put a stop to that kind of thinking.

If you think that,you've a serious underestimation of what goes on in political parties
If FG get back as lead party,the first thing they'll have to do is conclude a programme for government with someone else
That's the first place voter mood gets parsed

ChikiChiki

McMurphy wrote: »

Everytime Leo attacks Sinn Fein he pushes more voters in that direction and FG are astonishingly blind to it.

He is a very useful idiot to SF.