Why I'm Voting for FG

Nitrogan

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Everytime Leo attacks Sinn Fein he pushes more voters in that direction and FG are astonishingly blind to it.

He is a very useful idiot to SF.

People are going to turn out and vote for a party associated with crime, terrorism, covering up sexual abuse, murder, fraud, intimidation and the rest to spite Leo Varadkar?


They could just vote FF.

Calhoun

Mortelaro wrote: »

If you think that,you've a serious underestimation of what goes on in political parties
If FG get back as lead party,the first thing they'll have to do is conclude a programme for government with someone else
That's the first place voter mood gets parsed

Unfortunately for FG they have had a long time to try and get what they wanted in place going. The leadership battle not the last election is coming back to haunt them as the comments of looking after those who get up in the morning get brought up.

For allot of Irish people looking at how they have run the government it would look like it has been to the benefit of big business at the same of working people. Look at the Irish water contracts and how another DOB company was given state contracts by FG.

Yurt2

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Replying to Lindsey:

The tweet is not aimed at potential SF voters; it's aimed at SF-phobic voters hovering between FG and FF...

A miscalculation on FG's part. SF aren't the electoral boogyman they were 20 years ago. It's more or less only the chattering classes in the or redbricks in South Dublin that drop their monacle into their teacup at the thought of SF these days.

The accompanying video to that tweet is vomitworthy as well. Whoever is putting together FG's social media this election should consider another line of work.

Calhoun

Yurt! wrote: »

A miscalculation on FG's part. SF aren't the electoral boogyman they were 20 years ago. It's more or less only the chattering classes in the or redbricks in South Dublin that drop their monacle into their teacup at the thought of SF these days.

The accompanying video to that tweet is vomitworthy as well. Whoever is putting together FG's social media this election should consider another line of work.

As I have called out elsewhere the Maria Cahill controversy , and the other kangeroo court ****e combined with their insistence on getting rid of the special criminal court is reason why people are wary of them. The fact that die hards will overlook the protection of rapists tells you all you need to know.

However the electorate are also very contrary and will tweets like Leo's as picking on the underdog and will back them.

Yurt2

Calhoun wrote: »

As I have called out elsewhere the Maria Cahill controversy , and the other kangeroo court ****e combined with their insistence on getting rid of the special criminal court is reason why people are wary of them. The fact that die hards will overlook the protection of rapists tells you all you need to know.

However the electorate are also very contrary and will tweets like Leo's as picking on the underdog and will back them.

Not a SF voter, and as things stands I'm unlikely to give them a preference. But, I do think the SCC has its' problems. It's function is obsolete, and in the first instance, it is a highly unusual feature of a common law system, and SF are not alone in criticising it - the UNHCR called it 'unjustified' for example. Bringing someone before it for tax offenses is absolute nonsense, and I don't care if the person is Osama Carlos the Jackal Bin Laden. It's an abuse of process and the law.

Idbatterim

SF have been claiming to have all the answer for years etc, what happens if they actually do really well this election? will they actually want to form a government, do they actually have any intention of governing?

Fann Linn

Idbatterim wrote: »

SF have been claiming to have all the answer for years etc, what happens if they actually do really well this election? will they actually want to form a government, do they actually have any intention of governing?

I'm prepared to take that chance. After all, take a look at who they could be replacing. Leo, Harris, Murphy, Bailey, Dara,......

Idbatterim

Fann Linn wrote: »

I'm prepared to take that chance. After all, take a look at who they could be replacing. Leo, Harris, Murphy, Bailey, Dara,......

yeah! its rock and a hard place, dont even get me going on varadkar. If he had stuck to his guns of rewarding the early risers alone, he would still have lost seats, but probably not being the largest party. I mean I am glad there has been some backlash, what outcome i want, its actually just so hard to call. there are too many unknowns. Will FF/SF help housing , Maybe, how much use is that, if after 2/3 years they tank the economy again?

This election is the most fascinating ever in my opinion. I mean FF talk a lot, when push comes to shove, will they actually want to go in with SF, who want to build way more housing? FF want rip off prices, of course they cant admit it publicly. Because honestly, if FF do want change and think the opportunity for it is there, they have to go in with SF rather than FG IMO

Calhoun

Yurt! wrote: »

Not a SF voter, and as things stands I'm unlikely to give them a preference. But, I do think the SCC has its' problems. It's function is obsolete, and in the first instance, it is a highly unusual feature of a common law system, and SF are not alone in criticising it - the UNHCR called it 'unjustified' for example. Bringing someone before it for tax offenses is absolute nonsense, and I don't care if the person is Osama Carlos the Jackal Bin Laden. It's an abuse of process and the law.

Problem with SF is they don't like a court that can get at the possible military side but have no issues with kangeroo courts . That's the rub for people.

Mortelaro

Calhoun wrote: »

Look at the Irish water contracts and how another DOB company was given state contracts by FG.

State contracts are subject to a public procurement tendering procedures
Government departments can't hire a taxi these days without 3 quotes
If you have any evidence of corruption in that,you should go to the Gardai

Plumbthedepths

Mortelaro wrote: »

If you have any evidence of corruption in that,you should go to the Gardai

Ah this old chestnut. A former FG minister was found to have been corrupt as was a prominent friend of the FG party. How long in gaol did they serve. I can't remember.

James Brown

Mortelaro wrote: »

But shur you do what you're accusing me of all the time here
I'm not astounded that the game book you use is the it's not me its you retort
It's only possible on the internet
It wouldn't get past Bryan Dobson

You're talking sh*te.
You've no argument on topic. Sit down.

James Brown

Calhoun wrote: »

Problem with SF is they don't like a court that can get at the possible military side but have no issues with kangeroo courts . That's the rub for people.

FG seemed okay turning a blind eye on McCabe's treatment at the highest levels.

Yurt2

Calhoun wrote: »

Problem with SF is they don't like a court that can get at the possible military side but have no issues with kangeroo courts . That's the rub for people.

I'm not in SF, don't vote SF, and I find a court where a flunkie of the government (the AG) can decide that an individual can be denied a trial in front of a jury of their peers for any alleged offence they see fit to be well dodgy and open to abuse.

McMurphy

Mortelaro wrote: »

State contracts are subject to a public procurement tendering procedures
Government departments can't hire a taxi these days without 3 quotes
If you have any evidence of corruption in that,you should go to the Gardai

Digice. Denis O'Brien, FG govt. Enquiry concluded. Corruption took place.
Siteserv. Denis O'Brien, FG govt Enquiry ongoing.
NBP, Denis O'Brien, FG govt. Enquiry imminent - bet on it.


Just coincidental.

James Brown

Mortelaro wrote: »

State contracts are subject to a public procurement tendering procedures
Government departments can't hire a taxi these days without 3 quotes
If you have any evidence of corruption in that,you should go to the Gardai

They can hire a taxi driver for the Irish Water quango board.
Siteserv deal still under investigation....
You're not very good at this diversion thing.

Calhoun

Matt Barrett wrote: »

FG seemed okay turning a blind eye on McCabe's treatment at the highest levels.

I called that out already, but it was under the many policing controversies, bad behavior from on does not excuse another.

Both bad cases one however covers up rape, and it reminds me of the pedophile cover up that SF ran around the same time on a past member. I believe both were subject to the kangeroo court.

Yurt! wrote: »

I'm not in SF, don't vote SF, and I find a court where a flunkie of the government (the AG) can decide that an individual can be denied a trial in front of a jury of their peers for any alleged offence they see fit to be well dodgy and open to abuse.

Unfortunately in Ireland being so small we have very little in the way of protection from criminal organizations who can and will intimate and kill witnesses. Look at the cases down in limerick on how bad it can get.

smurgen

Calhoun wrote: »

Problem with SF is they don't like a court that can get at the possible military side but have no issues with kangeroo courts . That's the rub for people.

Kangaroo court? How many times have FG/FF gone down the route of touthless inquiry or tribunals? At a vast vast cost to the taxpayer.

Calhoun

smurgen wrote: »

Kangaroo court? How many times have FG/FF gone down the route of touthless inquiry or tribunals? At a vast vast cost to the taxpayer.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/ira-rape-victim-calls-for-an-inquiry-into-claim-sinn-fein-tried-to-cover-up-abuse-38127288.html

[Mr McGahon was one of the boys and told of how an IRA kangaroo court was convened in 2002 after the men first brought their abuse allegations to the attention of Louth Sinn Fein councillor Pearce McGeough.]

smurgen

Calhoun wrote: »

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/ira-rape-victim-calls-for-an-inquiry-into-claim-sinn-fein-tried-to-cover-up-abuse-38127288.html

Seems like there's no link?I don't get what you're getting at?

Yurt2

Calhoun wrote: »

Unfortunately in Ireland being so small we have very little in the way of protection from criminal organizations who can and will intimate and kill witnesses. Look at the cases down in limerick on how bad it can get.

Witnesses are still called before the SCC and their names read into the record of the court, so the pretense that is there to protect witnesses is a false one. There are mechanisms to protect and anonymize juries also, I'm sure the state can invest in some one-way glass screens to prevent the undermining of a central pillar of our justice system.


The history of the SCC was that it was introduced during WW2 as they were afraid of the old-IRA undermining Ireland's neutrality, and that juries would in fact have IRA sympathizers as members, not as a means to protect the jury.

James Brown

Calhoun wrote: »

I called that out already, but it was under the many policing controversies, bad behavior from on does not excuse another.

Both bad cases one however covers up rape, and it reminds me of the pedophile cover up that SF ran around the same time on a past member. I believe both were subject to the kangeroo court.



Unfortunately in Ireland being so small we have very little in the way of protection from criminal organizations who can and will intimate and kill witnesses. Look at the cases down in limerick on how bad it can get.

One was an illegal organisation who for good reason didn't trust the authorities. The other the authorities. Hardly like with like. Not defending the IRA or the part SF played. FG/FF likely covered up numerous rapes on behalf of the church not forgetting locking up women for getting pregnant.

Calhoun

smurgen wrote: »

Seems like there's no link?I don't get what you're getting at?

There are many cases and examples of SF using their own brand of Justice through the kangeroo courts. Your more than welcome to do your own research on it.

smurgen

Calhoun wrote: »

I called that out already, but it was under the many policing controversies, bad behavior from on does not excuse another.

Both bad cases one however covers up rape, and it reminds me of the pedophile cover up that SF ran around the same time on a past member. I believe both were subject to the kangeroo court.



Unfortunately in Ireland being so small we have very little in the way of protection from criminal organizations who can and will intimate and kill witnesses. Look at the cases down in limerick on how bad it can get.

You do know it's the U.N and Amnesty International that are against the SCC right? Let me guess they're secretly in cahoots with the Ra also?

Calhoun

Matt Barrett wrote: »

One was an illegal organisation who for good reason didn't trust the authorities. The other the authorities. Hardly like with like. Not defending the IRA or the part SF played.

So that excuses the ongoing harassment of Cahill or the fight for justice both herself and the two boys molested by. A serving member. I guess **** them right ? SF should be just given a pass because the bould FG are not liked.

Calhoun

Yurt! wrote: »

Witnesses are still called before the SCC and their names read into the record of the court, so the pretense that is there to protect witnesses is a false one. There are mechanisms to protect and anonymize juries also, I'm sure the state can invest in some one-way glass screens to prevent the undermining of a central pillar of our justice system.


The history of the SCC was that it was introduced during WW2 as they were afraid of the old-IRA undermining Ireland's neutrality, and that juries would in fact have IRA sympathizers as members, not as a means to protect the jury.

With Ireland being as small as it is I worry if they can truly keep a jury safe, it's only the past year that a member of the DPP was prosecuted for leaking stuff to paramilitaries.

Yurt2

Calhoun wrote: »

With Ireland being as small as it is I worry if they can truly keep a jury safe, it's only the past year that a member of the DPP was prosecuted for leaking stuff to paramilitaries.

Using that logic we should dispense with the DPP as well as juries.

Mortelaro

Matt Barrett wrote: »

They can hire a taxi driver for the Irish Water quango board.
Siteserv deal still under investigation....
You're not very good at this diversion thing.

They can hire a taxi but need 3 quotes
Your answer doesn't have any evidence of corruption
You're not very good at this retort business are you
What next,more Ad hominem like yesterday?

Calhoun

smurgen wrote: »

You do know it's the U.N and Amnesty International that are against the SCC right? Let me guess they're secretly in cahoots with the Ra also?

No I did not but I don't see why that should make a difference.

Let me guess you like covering up rape and pedophilia by Sinn Fein? I suppose if we are straw manning to discredit each other I might as well do it on the basis of your seemingly blindness to some of SF most recent crimes.

smurgen

Nice if the indo to bury this deep and keep harping on about SF.
Another nice 450k report for PWC.FG sure do love PWC!

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/private-firm-to-be-paid-450000-to-find-out-why-national-childrens-hospital-has-overrun-37741506.html