2020 US Presidential Election (aka: The Trump Coronation)

Blueshoe

Boggles wrote: »

Sorry what? Bush "undeported" people?

:pac:

Your statement was incorrect, don't be A Trump, accept and move on.

My statement was factual. You aren't informed

https://www-nytimes-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/07/13/opinion/sunday/trump-deportations-immigration.amp.html?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=15897943482701&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2019%2F07%2F13%2Fopinion%2Fsunday%2Ftrump-deportations-immigration.html

ohnonotgmail

Blueshoe wrote: »

My statement was factual. You aren't informed

https://www-nytimes-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/07/13/opinion/sunday/trump-deportations-immigration.amp.html?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA%3D#aoh=15897943482701&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From%20%251%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.nytimes.com%2F2019%2F07%2F13%2Fopinion%2Fsunday%2Ftrump-deportations-immigration.html

please tell me yoou didnt read

During the administration of George W. Bush, the number of people removed was far outpaced each year by the number of people returned. During his last year in office, nearly 360,000 people were removed and more than 810,000 people returned — or an average of one person removed for every two people returned.

and think that it meant that the people deported returned to the US.

Blueshoe

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

please tell me yoou didnt read



and think that it meant that the people deported returned to the US.

Was it I that said bush undeported people and threw up a laughy face

notobtuse

Well now, democrats are attempting to use the coronavirus as a way to fix many of their democrat controlled states decades of fiscal mismanagement. Never let a crisis go to waste? Our lovely democrat controlled House has now passed their own $3 trillion coronavirus relief bill. Amongst other things the bill contains about $1 trillion dollars to bail out fiscally mismanaged states. It also contains such things as cash for illegal immigrants. So now democrats want to put the obligation to bail out democrat controlled state pension plans that have been mismanaged and underfunded for decades onto all the US taxpayers. Most states whom are experiencing the greatest fiscal crises are controlled by democrats and much of the crisis they claim they need federal coronavirus funds for are things they had been experiencing before there ever was a COVID-19. Luckily the republican controlled Senate is saying the bill is dead on arrival in the Senate. And Trump would veto the bill anyway if it came across his desk. It’s accepted by most all that a phase 4 stimulus will be needed, but it needs to be targeted to the most crucial economic areas affected directly by the pandemic. I’m sure the democrats know their bill won’t go anywhere and are only doing it to make the evil Trump and the GOP look bad come the November election.

Igotadose

It's o.k. to bloat the budget however Congress sees fit. The Trump Tax Cut showed once and for all the craveness of the tGOP. Just run the printing presses. The COVID bailouts were even worse.

Budgets no longer matter to the GOP. Move on, it's a non-issue.

notobtuse

Today Donald Trump’s approval rating is at 49%. At this point in their presidencies Barack Obama’s approval rating was at 47%, and George W Bush’s at 46%. Many republicans are happy about the numbers but national popularity polls don’t win elections, the electoral college does. I would be more interested in seeing polls by registered voters in battleground states.

Brian?

notobtuse wrote: »

Today Donald Trump’s approval rating is at 49%. At this point in their presidencies Barack Obama’s approval rating was at 47%, and George W Bush’s at 46%. Many republicans are happy about the numbers but national popularity polls don’t win elections, the electoral college does. I would be more interested in seeing polls by registered voters in battleground states.

You wouldn't happen to be selective with you poll choices.

notobtuse

Brian? wrote: »

You wouldn't happen to be selective with you poll choices.

Not that I'm aware of. But no matter what poll you use you are selective in the choice. In this case... Gallup. Care to trash Gallup?

notobtuse

Our lovely biased media keeps telling us Trump’s response and handling of coronavirus will be his undoing in the November election. Hopeful thinking on the part of the democrat’s media handmaidens or the media just trying to influence the election? Journalistic integrity... NOT! Although much can change regarding COVID-19 between now and the election, this poll regarding jobs and COVID-19 doesn’t support the mainstream media’s narrative. The really interesting figure, and the one that will determine the winner, are the independents.

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

Well now, democrats are attempting to use the coronavirus as a way to fix many of their democrat controlled states decades of fiscal mismanagement. Never let a crisis go to waste? Our lovely democrat controlled House has now passed their own $3 trillion coronavirus relief bill. Amongst other things the bill contains about $1 trillion dollars to bail out fiscally mismanaged states. It also contains such things as cash for illegal immigrants. So now democrats want to put the obligation to bail out democrat controlled state pension plans that have been mismanaged and underfunded for decades onto all the US taxpayers. Most states whom are experiencing the greatest fiscal crises are controlled by democrats and much of the crisis they claim they need federal coronavirus funds for are things they had been experiencing before there ever was a COVID-19. Luckily the republican controlled Senate is saying the bill is dead on arrival in the Senate. And Trump would veto the bill anyway if it came across his desk. It’s accepted by most all that a phase 4 stimulus will be needed, but it needs to be targeted to the most crucial economic areas affected directly by the pandemic. I’m sure the democrats know their bill won’t go anywhere and are only doing it to make the evil Trump and the GOP look bad come the November election.

You do know that only 11 States contribute more to the Federal Government than they receive right?

Meaning 39 states get bailied out each and every year by the Federal government

Of those 11 States 5 have Republican Governors and 6 are Democrat led (I haven't the time to check who controls the State houses for each though)

Or that not a single State in the US , GOP or Democrat has a fully funded pension and only 14 are above 80% capitalisation.

I'm not seeing much of a difference in the Red vs. Blue in terms of those that are doing well or badly - looks about even to me.



Bottom line , most States in the US aren't doing a great job financially and there is not a particular D vs. R split in terms of Performance...

This whole "Blue State bailout" is just another piece of "Fake News" from the GOP obfuscating the fact that their policies aren't exactly knocking it out of the park either.

Brian?

notobtuse wrote: »

Not that I'm aware of. But no matter what poll you use you are selective in the choice. In this case... Gallup. Care to trash Gallup?

I’m asking the question because I was sure Obama was over 50%

Brian?

Brian? wrote: »

I’m asking the question because I was sure Obama was over 50%

Easy to forget Obama limped to re-election, shedding 5 million votes. Handy enough win but the enthusiasm from 08 was mostly gone by that point.

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

You do know that only 11 States contribute more to the Federal Government than they receive right?

Meaning 39 states get bailied out each and every year by the Federal government

Of those 11 States 5 have Republican Governors and 6 are Democrat led (I haven't the time to check who controls the State houses for each though)

Or that not a single State in the US , GOP or Democrat has a fully funded pension and only 14 are above 80% capitalisation.

I'm not seeing much of a difference in the Red vs. Blue in terms of those that are doing well or badly - looks about even to me.



Bottom line , most States in the US aren't doing a great job financially and there is not a particular D vs. R split in terms of Performance...

This whole "Blue State bailout" is just another piece of "Fake News" from the GOP obfuscating the fact that their policies aren't exactly knocking it out of the park either.

Tell that to the people of Wisconsin. I doubt they, or other more fiscally responsible states, will buy that load of crap.

Democrats in Illinois who run the state are allergic to “hard choices.” Pension and health care costs for retired state workers are out of control and only a federal bailout can save the politicians from having to file bankruptcy — an embarrassment that would almost certainly lead to a Republican takeover of the legislature.

https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/05/16/wisconsin-lawmakers-to-illinois-were-not-bailing-out-states-with-history-of-reckless-budgeting-n398113

Most every state has some fiscal problems. But some states have made the tough choice of trimming down their budgets while other states continued on their '‘charge it" leap off the cliff. It will be a tough sell to the more fiscal responsible states to bear the burden for the irresponsible democratic states like California, Illinois, New York and New Jersey.

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

Tell that to the people of Wisconsin. I doubt they, or other more fiscally responsible states, will buy that load of crap.


https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/rick-moran/2020/05/16/wisconsin-lawmakers-to-illinois-were-not-bailing-out-states-with-history-of-reckless-budgeting-n398113

Most every state has some fiscal problems. But some states have made the tough choice of trimming down their budgets while other states continued on their '‘charge it" leap off the cliff. It will be a tough sell to the more fiscal responsible states to bear the burden for the irresponsible democratic states like California, Illinois, New York and New Jersey.

How about the Fiscally responsibly New York not being happy with bailing out the fiscally irresponsible Republican states like North Dakota or South Carolina or Alaska??




Missing the point again I see , There is no Red vs. Blue here - There are some good States and some bad States when it comes to Fiscal responsibility. It would seem have nothing whatsoever to do with the particular party in power.

So to suggest that the Democrats are only looking to "fix many of their democrat controlled states decades of fiscal mismanagement" as you put it, is disingenuous at best.

rossie1977

notobtuse wrote: »

Most every state has some fiscal problems. But some states have made the tough choice of trimming down their budgets while other states continued on their '‘charge it" leap off the cliff. It will be a tough sell to the more fiscal responsible states to bear the burden for the irresponsible democratic states like California, Illinois, New York and New Jersey.

California, NY, Illinois and NJ all give more money than they receive in federal funding. Those four states also contribute a huge proportion of the US entire GDP.

Carfacemandog

Danzy wrote: »

It's a tough thing to do but circumstances made it necessary.

No it wasn't, the number of illegal immigrants in the US had been going down since Bush's final year in office.

So what made you say Obama did it?

What insane or awful things has he done ?

Just off the top of my head...

- Encouraging terrorism against elected US officials.

- Calling nazi March attendees “very fine people” in Charlottesville.

- Calling a pandemic a “hoax” that would “go away like a miracle” and suggesting people inject disinfectant to cure it, against all medical advise, in top of claiming he takes “no responsibility at all” for how poorly this ‘hoax’ has been handled. If you can show me Obama, or Clinton, or either Bush, or Reagan, or any modern US president acting like that before, please do.

- Firing a long, long list people who have been investigating him and his staff, the most recent happening just past Friday.

- Asking a foreign power to interfere attack US security infrastructure.

- Believing a country hostile to the US over his own intelligence services and his own Congress (democrats AND Republicans) relating to attacks on US infrastructure and interference in US elections.

- Mocking US military members and war heroes openly, like John McCain, while railing against US citizens using their right to peaceful protest as we saw with the nfl kneeling incidents (which is allowed by the US military code).

- Acting like a teenage troll rather than a president, or even just an adult, particularly on the likes O TV social media with his WWE, iIndroendendence Day, etc memes among others.

- Lying over 18,000 times in less than 3.5 years in office, a rate of about one every 90 minutes which shouldn’t even be possible.

- Illegally profiting directly from businesses he has illegally failed to divest in during office, primarily the $130mn plus spent on his golf trips so far. Before the predictable ‘but obama’ response to this, the Obama family did not own any resorts they went to (and so did not profit from any of these trips, unlike Trump) and the trump family take 12 times as many protected trips as the Obamas did - https://www.citizensforethics.org/trump-family-travel-12x-obama-family/

- Ticking boxes for fascism in a way previously never seen by any US president. https://www.gq.com/story/is-america-heading-towards-fascism

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

Our lovely biased media keeps telling us Trump’s response and handling of coronavirus will be his undoing in the November election. Hopeful thinking on the part of the democrat’s media handmaidens or the media just trying to influence the election? Journalistic integrity... NOT! Although much can change regarding COVID-19 between now and the election, this poll regarding jobs and COVID-19 doesn’t support the mainstream media’s narrative. The really interesting figure, and the one that will determine the winner, are the independents.

I'm not sure that survey tells the story you think it does.

60% of Americans think that Trump bears at least some responsibility for the increase in Unemployment , including 35% of Republicans and 51% of Independents.

How is this evidence that his handling of the Virus isn't going to impact his re-election campaign??

A Majority of people consider that Trump is at least partly responsible for them losing their jobs - Not the Virus , Trump. How is that good news?

His support among GOP voters is ~90% , but a 3rd of them hold him at least partly responsible for them losing their job , what will that number be when they still don't have a job in November if the recovery is as slow as most economists seem to think it will be?


Where's the lack of Journalistic Integrity when the survey supports what they are saying ? - His handling of the virus will be the determining factor in his re-election - As you say , lots of time between now and then but I don't see how he makes those numbers better between now and then to be honest.

The survey above does not paint any kind of positive picture for Trump right now and I fail to see how anyone could view it otherwise.

Igotadose

Danzy wrote: »

What insane or awful things has he done ?

Succeeded in getting impeached because of extorting a foreign power to interfere in the 2016 election. Is that awful enough for you? And borderline insane?

Danzy

Igotadose wrote: »

Succeeded in getting impeached because of extorting a foreign power to interfere in the 2016 election. Is that awful enough for you? And borderline insane?

Impeachment was a dead duck and a stunt.

It was dropped very quickly.

Billy Mays

Carfacemandog wrote: »

No it wasn't, the number of illegal immigrants in the US had been going down since Bush's final year in office.

So what made you say Obama did it?


Just off the top of my head...

- Encouraging terrorism against elected US officials.

- Calling nazi March attendees “very fine people” in Charlottesville.

- Calling a pandemic a “hoax” that would “go away like a miracle” and suggesting people inject disinfectant to cure it, against all medical advise, in top of claiming he takes “no responsibility at all” for how poorly this ‘hoax’ has been handled. If you can show me Obama, or Clinton, or either Bush, or Reagan, or any modern US president acting like that before, please do.

- Firing a long, long list people who have been investigating him and his staff, the most recent happening just past Friday.

- Asking a foreign power to interfere attack US security infrastructure.

- Believing a country hostile to the US over his own intelligence services and his own Congress (democrats AND Republicans) relating to attacks on US infrastructure and interference in US elections.

- Mocking US military members and war heroes openly, like John McCain, while railing against US citizens using their right to peaceful protest as we saw with the nfl kneeling incidents (which is allowed by the US military code).

- Acting like a teenage troll rather than a president, or even just an adult, particularly on the likes O TV social media with his WWE, iIndroendendence Day, etc memes among others.

- Lying over 18,000 times in less than 3.5 years in office, a rate of about one every 90 minutes which shouldn’t even be possible.

- Illegally profiting directly from businesses he has illegally failed to divest in during office, primarily the $130mn plus spent on his golf trips so far. Before the predictable ‘but obama’ response to this, the Obama family did not own any resorts they went to (and so did not profit from any of these trips, unlike Trump) and the trump family take 12 times as many protected trips as the Obamas did - https://www.citizensforethics.org/trump-family-travel-12x-obama-family/

- Ticking boxes for fascism in a way previously never seen by any US president. https://www.gq.com/story/is-america-heading-towards-fascism

- Putting mustard on a burger

-Wearing a tan suit

-Saluting a marine whilst holding a cup of coffee

No wait, that was someone else...

Igotadose

Danzy wrote: »

Impeachment was a dead duck and a stunt.

It was dropped very quickly.

Was his action, of asking Ukraine to 'do us a favor', insane? Kind of was, don't you think?

Impeachment was no stunt. Serious business.

Igotadose

Lincoln project keeping it up: https://twitter.com/i/status/1262391400294952962

Itssoeasy

Danzy wrote: »

Impeachment was a dead duck and a stunt.

It was dropped very quickly.

Just because the senate telegraphed the outcome doesn't mean it was a dead duck or a stunt. It's a constitutional process so again not a stunt.

Dropped quickly how ?

Timberrrrrrrr

Danzy wrote: »

Impeachment was a dead duck and a stunt.

It was dropped very quickly.

And yet, he was impeached.

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

How about the Fiscally responsibly New York not being happy with bailing out the fiscally irresponsible Republican states like North Dakota or South Carolina or Alaska??




Missing the point again I see , There is no Red vs. Blue here - There are some good States and some bad States when it comes to Fiscal responsibility. It would seem have nothing whatsoever to do with the particular party in power.

So to suggest that the Democrats are only looking to "fix many of their democrat controlled states decades of fiscal mismanagement" as you put it, is disingenuous at best.

How about NO STATE gets any coronavirus funding to pay for their pension problems! You can't get any more 'no Red vs Blue stuff' than that!

notobtuse

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

And yet, he was impeached.

Yes he was. And when everything finally comes out that impeachment vote will probably go down as the biggest political travesty in our history.

Timberrrrrrrr

notobtuse wrote: »

Yes he was. And when everything finally comes out that impeachment vote will probably go down as the biggest political travesty in our history.

I doubt that very much.

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

I'm not sure that survey tells the story you think it does.

60% of Americans think that Trump bears at least some responsibility for the increase in Unemployment , including 35% of Republicans and 51% of Independents.

How is this evidence that his handling of the Virus isn't going to impact his re-election campaign??

A Majority of people consider that Trump is at least partly responsible for them losing their jobs - Not the Virus , Trump. How is that good news?

His support among GOP voters is ~90% , but a 3rd of them hold him at least partly responsible for them losing their job , what will that number be when they still don't have a job in November if the recovery is as slow as most economists seem to think it will be?


Where's the lack of Journalistic Integrity when the survey supports what they are saying ? - His handling of the virus will be the determining factor in his re-election - As you say , lots of time between now and then but I don't see how he makes those numbers better between now and then to be honest.

The survey above does not paint any kind of positive picture for Trump right now and I fail to see how anyone could view it otherwise.

I think it says exactly what I think it does. Those numbers for democrats vs republicans are typical regarding Trump. It’s the Independent numers that is most interesting, and they’re the ones who will most probably dictate how the election goes. It’s always been said here people vote with their wallets. It’s no secret that we have and for some time going forward will have high unemployment numbers that everyone directly or indirectly are dealing with. The independents overall don’t put the blame squarely on Trump (26% only somewhat, 36% none, equaling 62% that won’t be blaming Trump as the major cause of the unemployment problem). Important numbers!

notobtuse

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I doubt that very much.

That's okay. No shame in being wrong.

notobtuse

Igotadose wrote: »

Lincoln project keeping it up: https://twitter.com/i/status/1262391400294952962

I'm blocked from seeing the ad but I had to laugh when I saw it was the LincolnProject. LOL. The LincolnProject won’t have any impact on the election. Created by nutjob George Conway, husband to Trump advisor Kellyanne Conway, and the PAC organization has only 1-10 employees. But I’m sure the biased media will give them glowing recommendations and make them out to be much more than they really are. I'll try and watch the video at a later date so I can comment on the content.