2020 US Presidential Election (aka: The Trump Coronation)

timsey tiger

frag420 wrote: »

Talk about obtuse...

notobtuse, reflexive I guess, certainly not acute.

timsey tiger

notobtuse wrote: »

Exactly, how do officers handle things when perps are intermingled and pretending to be peaceful protesters until they aren't?

I think you should pass this information on to the police, because it is news to me that these perps were intermingled and pretending to be peaceful protesters and possibly to them as well.

eagle eye

Ingraham is a disgrace. Drew Brees is entitled to his opinion.
I personally think the kneeling is stupid as it's upsetting lots of people who aren't racist.
The whole approachbl to dealing with racism needs to be rethought imo.
You need to decide what you want before you start trying to fix it and the attitude that I'm not racist so I'm right is not good either.
In a perfect world you meet somebody, exchange names, have a chat and become good friends if you have similar interests maybe. It doesn't matter your colour, religion, politics or anything else.
The problem today is that one guy gets in your face and says that he's white and part of the superior race, another guy is telling you he is African-American and proud of it, another one is saying they are gender neutral and a member of the LGBTQ++.;
All these people are identifying to you that they are different to you and already putting up a barrier between you.
We all despise the first guy but the other two are also creating problems too.
We have to get away from differentiating between people and live as one people, we are all human and that's all that should matter.

timsey tiger

eagle eye wrote: »

I personally think the kneeling is stupid as it's upsetting lots of people who aren't racist.

I really can't see how the kneeling is upsetting, by any metric, it's a respectful pose.

Like I could understand distress caused by a black power salute or turning ones back on the flag/band, but kneeling is universally an indication of loyalty.

I don't get it.

eagle eye wrote: »

The problem today is that one guy gets in your face and says that he's white and part of the superior race, another guy is telling you he is African-American and proud of it, another one is saying they are gender neutral and a member of the LGBTQ++.;

I disagree, the first guy is causing a problem, the other two are reacting to problems caused by others

eagle eye

Lots of people who were in the armed forces at one stage or another get deeply upset about people kneeling. I'm not just talking about Caucasian's.

extra gravy

Carfacemandog wrote: »

Not just FOX News, but several people on here as well in a nutshell:

In case anyone isn't aware, Kevin Durant & Lebron James are among the most famous NBA players around, Drew Brees is among the most famous NFL players around. There's also a bit of irony in there that she refers to peaceful protest and people voicing their free speech (on FOX News of all places) as 'Stalinist' and 'totalitarian'.

Maybe if people had listened back then, what is going on today might not have happened.

You forgot to mention that Brees is white. Funny how he's entitled to speak his mind but KD and Lebron aren't. She's vile.

timsey tiger

eagle eye wrote: »

Lots of people who were in the armed forces at one stage or another get deeply upset about people kneeling. I'm not just talking about Caucasian's.

The question is why?

Overheal

eagle eye wrote: »

Ingraham is a disgrace. Drew Brees is entitled to his opinion.

So was LeBron. But I wager you agree.

I personally think the kneeling is stupid as it's upsetting lots of people who aren't racist.

What is upsetting about it? I genuinely want to know. IMHO the only people upset are the people most comfortable with the status quo: if someone kneels for more almond milk and I see dairy ranchers scrambling for reasons to be upset by that ("Has NOTHING to do with the milk you guys") I look at the situation with strong skepticism.

The whole approachbl to dealing with racism needs to be rethought imo. You need to decide what you want before you start trying to fix it and the attitude that I'm not racist so I'm right is not good either.

Underlined bit: what?

Whole bit: remember that another reason people protest and demonstrate is not because they already figured out a solution or all the solutions or wrote a solid thesis and 20-point plan, a lot of the time people (justly and righteously) protest because they identify an outrage and wish to express their outrage and raise awareness of that outrage and to demand subsequent or concurrent action on that outrage.

In a perfect world you meet somebody, exchange names, have a chat and become good friends if you have similar interests maybe. It doesn't matter your colour, religion, politics or anything else.
The problem today is that one guy gets in your face and says that he's white and part of the superior race, another guy is telling you he is African-American and proud of it, another one is saying they are gender neutral and a member of the LGBTQ++.;
All these people are identifying to you that they are different to you and already putting up a barrier between you.
We all despise the first guy but the other two are also creating problems too.
We have to get away from differentiating between people and live as one people, we are all human and that's all that should matter.

The problem atm with white, and straight pride is that - as the dominant race and persuasion these groups have used, with intent, this position to subjugate the other races and persuasions, throughout the history of western civilization. Fundamentally there is nothing wrong with anyone being proud of who you are, unfortunately, while we are in this period of social upheaval toward equality (which may still take several generations - Blacks and Women having the right to vote only happened a few decades ago) there are still many people left who are toxic in this regard and still wish to exert Supremacy over others. Yes, 'reverse-racism' etc. is still an issue, though I would argue it to be far less pressing than classic white/straight fascism which still resists progressive change.

Billy Mays

The American flag and military fetish is so weird

Overheal

eagle eye wrote: »

Lots of people who were in the armed forces at one stage or another get deeply upset about people kneeling. I'm not just talking about Caucasian's.

And still many others in the military support it. It's textbook free speech and they fought to defend it. You'd see the military split (in some fraction or another) in opinion on flag burning also. Some polled Americans identifying as Republicans for example want you to lose your citizenship if you burn the flag, even though as the party of law and order they should know the supreme court has affirmed, and re-affirmed the right to do so. And it's a tad bit fascist.

Carfacemandog

extra gravy wrote: »

You forgot to mention that Brees is white. Funny how he's entitled to speak his mind but KD and Lebron aren't. She's vile.

Sorry yeah, didn't occur to me to have to point that out since I lived in North America where he's one of the most recogniseable faces in sports.

It's also worth pointing out that Ingraham 'accidentally' did a quick 'seig heil' at a a Republican conference before, and has defended outright white supremacists like Paul Nehlen on her show. And when I say outright, I really do mean outright: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Nehlen#Views

Red for Danger

Its terrible how so many trump supports think black lives dont matter.

eagle eye

Overheal wrote:

So was LeBron. But I wager you agree.

Of course he is entitled to his opinion but he is not being criticised as far as I'm aware.

Overheal wrote:

What is upsetting about it? I genuinely want to know. IMHO the only people upset are the people most comfortable with the status quo: if someone kneels for more almond milk and I see dairy ranchers scrambling for reasons to be upset by that ("Has NOTHING to do with the milk you guys") I look at the situation with strong skepticism.

They feel its disrespecting the flag.

eagle eye

Sorry I meant not being criticised by anybody other than agenda driven idiots.

Overheal

Carfacemandog wrote: »

Sorry yeah, didn't occur to me to have to point that out since I lived in North America where he's one of the most recogniseable faces in sports.

It's also worth pointing out that Ingraham 'accidentally' did a quick 'seig heil' at a a Republican conference before, and has defended outright white supremacists like Paul Nehlen on her show. And when I say outright, I really do mean outright: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Nehlen#Views

As an American who doesn't follow sports: he is nowhere near household recognition yet outside of the sports fans. I had no idea who he was. Definitely no LeBron, or Gronk, etc.

eagle eye

Overheal wrote:

The problem atm with white, and straight pride is that - as the dominant race and persuasion these groups have used, with intent, this position to subjugate the other races and persuasions, throughout the history of western civilization. Fundamentally there is nothing wrong with anyone being proud of who you are, unfortunately, while we are in this period of social upheaval toward equality (which may still take several generations - Blacks and Women having the right to vote only happened a few decades ago) there are still many people left who are toxic in this regard and still wish to exert Supremacy over others. Yes, 'reverse-racism' etc. is still an issue, though I would argue it to be far less pressing than classic white/straight fascism which still resists progressive change.

You don't seem to get what I'm on about. If you are identifying as different then a barrier has been created. A lot of people will climb over that barrier and embrace you but some won't and others just never forget it. In order for a true level playing field for all to exist we need to move past identifying ourselves as different. This is the end game, getting there is going to be very difficult but we have to start at the end and then find the best way there.

eagle eye

Overheal wrote:

As an American who doesn't follow sports: he is nowhere near household recognition yet outside of the sports fans. I had no idea who he was. Definitely no LeBron, or Gronk, etc.

He is actually a great guy, there's not a racist bone in his body. I don't see anything wrong with his opinion.
His reasons for being against kneeling are about his grandfather's who fought in WW2. Here is what he said,

“I will never agree with anybody disrespecting the flag of the United States of America or our country,â€Â Brees, 41, told Daniel Roberts. “Let me just tell what I see or what I feel when the national anthem is played and when I look at the flag of the United States.

“I envision my two grandfathers, who fought for this country during World War II, one in the Army and one in the Marine Corps,†Brees continued. “Both risking their lives to protect our country and to try to make our country and this world a better place. So every time I stand with my hand over my heart looking at that flag and singing the national anthem, that’s what I think about. And in many cases, that brings me to tears, thinking about all that has been sacrificed.â€

timsey tiger

eagle eye wrote: »

You don't seem to get what I'm on about. If you are identifying as different then a barrier has been created. A lot of people will climb over that barrier and embrace you but some won't and others just never forget it. In order for a true level playing field for all to exist we need to move past identifying ourselves as different. This is the end game, getting there is going to be very difficult but we have to start at the end and then find the best way there.

Nice bit of victim blaming there.

Victimized groups have to fight for their rights, they aren't just given to them by their oppressors. You can't fight for your rights without self identifying.

eagle eye

I'm talking about where we all want to be.
I'm trying to make you understand that where we want to be is that everybody is looked at as equals.
Getting there, as I said, is going to be very difficult. What we need to do is look at where we want to be and work our way back from there to now and find the best way forward.
How you call that victim blaming is beyond me.

How do you think we start to get there?

Brian?

eagle eye wrote: »

Of course he is entitled to his opinion but he is not being criticised as far as I'm aware.


They feel its disrespecting the flag.

How can you disrespect an inanimate object?

American style patriotism is bizarre. I will never understand it.

Brian?

eagle eye wrote: »

He is actually a great guy, there's not a racist bone in his body. I don't see anything wrong with his opinion.
His reasons for being against kneeling are about his grandfather's who fought in WW2. Here is what he said,

“I will never agree with anybody disrespecting the flag of the United States of America or our country,â€Â Brees, 41, told Daniel Roberts. “Let me just tell what I see or what I feel when the national anthem is played and when I look at the flag of the United States.

“I envision my two grandfathers, who fought for this country during World War II, one in the Army and one in the Marine Corps,†Brees continued. “Both risking their lives to protect our country and to try to make our country and this world a better place. So every time I stand with my hand over my heart looking at that flag and singing the national anthem, that’s what I think about. And in many cases, that brings me to tears, thinking about all that has been sacrificed.â€

His grandfathers fought to give Kapernick the freedom to express himself however he wanted. Not for a flag.

extra gravy

https://twitter.com/ACLU/status/1268709697131024384?s=19

Expect a tweet shortly...

extra gravy

The ACLU is also taking Trump, Barr and Esper to court for firing tear gas and other weapons on protesters outside the White House, asserting that it was an inhumane violation of the First Amendment.

Overheal

https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/gop-opponent-says-gov-inslee-has-his-knee-on-the-neck-of-business-owners-and-theyre-suffocating/

Safe to say I think the incumbent WA Governor has little to fear from his rival, whom he already leads by 29 points on FiveThirtyEight.

GOP Opponent Says Gov. Inslee ‘Has His Knee On the Neck of Business Owners’ and ‘They’re Suffocating’

kilns

Billy Mays wrote: »

The American flag and military fetish is so weird

It’s the biggest propaganda machine in the world look at a NFL game and how it has become militarized with all the symbolism.

kilns

eagle eye wrote: »

He is actually a great guy, there's not a racist bone in his body. I don't see anything wrong with his opinion.
His reasons for being against kneeling are about his grandfather's who fought in WW2. Here is what he said,

“I will never agree with anybody disrespecting the flag of the United States of America or our country,â€Â Brees, 41, told Daniel Roberts. “Let me just tell what I see or what I feel when the national anthem is played and when I look at the flag of the United States.

“I envision my two grandfathers, who fought for this country during World War II, one in the Army and one in the Marine Corps,†Brees continued. “Both risking their lives to protect our country and to try to make our country and this world a better place. So every time I stand with my hand over my heart looking at that flag and singing the national anthem, that’s what I think about. And in many cases, that brings me to tears, thinking about all that has been sacrificed.â€

Wendell Pierce (from The Wire and other such things) sent him a reply on twitter which was a great piece. He spoke about his father fought in WW2 for the USA and as a black man returned to New Orleans after The war but he had little to no rights. He was not allowed vote, could not choose where he could live and had little civil rights. He said his father taught him to love America for the country that it could be and not what it currently is and to fight for liberty and rights. He added that his father supports Drew Brees week in week out but he too takes a knee at the National anthem.

What’s is there is right America could be the greatest country in the world but it is not it is far from it for many different reasons. I always think of the current America as what the British Empire was all those years ago. You had a certain class of people who for their own benefit wanted to keep another class of people down and not give them the same opportunities and they also too caused much pain and conflict around the world.

America needs brave leaders who will bring them out of the darkness. It certainly is not Trump and Biden despite being a much more decent human being is not that man either. The hope lies in the new generation coming through and people like AOC despite her faults is the one person giving America hope for the future.

DrPhilG

eagle eye wrote: »

You don't seem to get what I'm on about. If you are identifying as different then a barrier has been created.

Like this?



We are not born racist. It is taught. A very clear and true statement, usually accompanied by that very cute video of a 2 little boys, one white and one black, running into each others arms delighted to see each other, caring not a damn that they have a different appearance.

Then you have this shyte, a little girl being trained that she is not only different because she is white, but she should be ashamed of the privilege that her colour gives her.

This is disgusting. Let kids be kids. Teach them from the start that we are all the same.

Professor Moriarty

Overheal wrote: »

https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/gop-opponent-says-gov-inslee-has-his-knee-on-the-neck-of-business-owners-and-theyre-suffocating/

Safe to say I think the incumbent WA Governor has little to fear from his rival, whom he already leads by 29 points on FiveThirtyEight.

Classy.

Professor Moriarty

DrPhilG wrote: »

Like this?



We are not born racist. It is taught. A very clear and true statement, usually accompanied by that very cute video of a 2 little boys, one white and one black, running into each others arms delighted to see each other, caring not a damn that they have a different appearance.

Then you have this shyte, a little girl being trained that she is not only different because she is white, but she should be ashamed of the privilege that her colour gives her.

This is disgusting. Let kids be kids. Teach them from the start that we are all the same.

Or you could argue that teaching kids to understand, respect and support those who may have more difficult lives than them is helping them to live a principled life.

ohnonotgmail

DrPhilG wrote: »

Like this?



We are not born racist. It is taught. A very clear and true statement, usually accompanied by that very cute video of a 2 little boys, one white and one black, running into each others arms delighted to see each other, caring not a damn that they have a different appearance.

Then you have this shyte, a little girl being trained that she is not only different because she is white, but she should be ashamed of the privilege that her colour gives her.

This is disgusting. Let kids be kids. Teach them from the start that we are all the same.

where are you getting that she is being trained to be ashamed to be white? do you read minds now?