2020 US Presidential Election (aka: The Trump Coronation)

Sean.3516

Carfacemandog wrote: »

The media do not cover Trump the way they do other politicians. With other politicians, scandals are covered for quite a long time while with Trump they are tyoicly up and done in a week because he goes off on a gaslight ing spree pretending the previous scandal never happened.

Agreed. The frequency of the scandals in this administration has ended up decreasing the value of the individual scandal. It's gotten to the point where it's just background noise. I think this is due to the fact that the media have broadened the definition of what constitutes a scandal in Trumpland on account of the fact that Trump is just "unlike any other politician." The media could help themselves by focusing on the things that are actual scandals. The Mueller Report was worth covering. Ukraine was worth covering. If there's a feud in the Whitehouse and Trump ends up firing someone important, that's worth covering.

Trump calling the virus the "china virus" is not a scandal. It's not a scandal every time he speaks curtly to a female reporter. His tweets and his daily bickering with Jim Acosta don't warrant full scale think pieces in the New York Times every time they happen.

Everybody knows that Trump is a weird and mean. When the media beats people over the head with it, it becomes background noise.

Sean.3516

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Objective Journalism hasn't existed in the US since Reagan abolished the fairness doctrine.

The opposition to the fairness doctrine was based on the grounds that it violates the First Amendment as the Federal Government engages in viewpoint discrimination when it decides whether or not to grant a broadcasting licence to private individuals on the basis of their coverage.

If the government tried to do that with a newspaper, we would recognise how ridiculous it is.

Quin_Dub wrote: »

The concept of "Here is the News" no longer exists in the US , it is "Here is our opinion of the news" .

Honestly, I don't know when that's ever been the case either before television or afterwards.

Quin_Dub wrote: »

The abolition of the Fairness doctrine was the beginning of the end of bi-partizanship and cooperation in the US.

Again, I'm not familiar with this kumbaya era of which you speak. People have been dug in behind their party lines in the US since the end of Washington's presidency. America has been constantly polarised and always will be. It's only a matter of degree.

Quin_Dub wrote: »

It has also severely impacted the ability for critical thinking - Why take time to think and absorb information and formulate an opinion when you can just tune in to your talking head of choice and be given a fully formed opinion and supporting talking points in neat advertising supported 10 minute chunks?

I think our ability to think critically ended when our methods of getting the news became more passive rather than active. By that I mean, reading a newspaper was not a passive process. You had to actually read it in long form yourself and you naturally thought about what it was you were reading. Informed people read multiple newspapers. As opposed to sitting in front of a screen and having someone explain the news to you in the most condensed form. Also with newspaper the line between reporting and commentary is a lot clearer. As in they are literally in different parts of the newspaper.

ohnonotgmail

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Of course this was commentary. When a journalist says that someone is "angry" or "melts down" , that's an opinion. That's a subjective assessment of someone's demeanour and emotions.

When you refer to a video as "propaganda", that's an opinion. It begs the question as to the veracity of the claims made in the video and the intent of the person who produced it.

Bear in mind, I never said whether or not I thought these opinions were correct or incorrect. I think they were at least partially correct. However good journalists don't inject their opinions into a supposedly objective report of a live press conference.

the reporters did their job. Trump showed a campaign video in the middle of a press conference about a pandemic. That is propaganda. To not call this out would be a dereliction of their duty to tell the truth.

Quin_Dub

Sean.3516 wrote: »

The opposition to the fairness doctrine was based on the grounds that it violates the First Amendment as the Federal Government engages in viewpoint discrimination when it decides whether or not to grant a broadcasting licence to private individuals on the basis of their coverage.

If the government tried to do that with a newspaper, we would recognise how ridiculous it is.

To be honest , if that was the argument then that was a cop-out from the Government of the day - Because the couldn't be trusted to not be partisan , they decided to let everyone to be partisan instead? - Never heard of independent commissions or whatever??

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Honestly, I don't know when that's ever been the case either before television or afterwards.

Just watch the news on TV here and compare it to the US.

For the nightly news - whether you are watching RTE or Virgin media , you will come away from the news bulletin with largely the same information. Likewise in the UK whether you are watching BBC , ITV or Sky news , again you'll come away from the main evening news bulletin with the same basic set of information.

Same with the discussion shows - If you are watching Newsnight , Panorama , or RTE etc. - All of those shows are obligated to have opposing views present during the discussion , Yes they may frame the discussion somewhat based on their personal bias (they are human after all) , but they will all have a dissenting voice there . This is not the case in the US since the Fairness doctrine went.

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Again, I'm not familiar with this kumbaya era of which you speak. People have been dug in behind their party lines in the US since the end of Washington's presidency. America has been constantly polarised and always will be. It's only a matter of degree.

There has always been and frankly always should always be robust argument and disagreement between the Government and opposition about the issues of the day - That's what Parliament is for - Debate the pros and cons , be Devils advocate etc.

What is going on the US today, which has been getting progressively worse over the last 30 years or so is not that at all - It's disagreement not of the issues , but just because the other side want it. As Mitch McConnell said when Obama was 1st elected - "My mission is to make sure that he is a one term President" - Did not care one jot about agenda or policy , no matter what Obama said or did they were going to oppose , just because.

The Democrats can be similarly accused now as well.

There is no thought to what is good or bad legislation etc. It is just "Deny the other guy any victory for anything , not matter who it hurts"

Sean.3516 wrote: »

I think our ability to think critically ended when our methods of getting the news became more passive rather than active. By that I mean, reading a newspaper was not a passive process. You had to actually read it in long form yourself and you naturally thought about what it was you were reading. Informed people read multiple newspapers. As opposed to sitting in front of a screen and having someone explain the news to you in the most condensed form. Also with newspaper the line between reporting and commentary is a lot clearer. As in they are literally in different parts of the newspaper.

I'd broadly agree with you on that , but as in my earlier comment , that issue is amplified on TV by the lack of obligation to have alternative voices present in the "opinions" pieces.

notobtuse

Still nothing happening from Democrats on replenishing the PPP (Paycheck Protection Program) as they remain MIA. Democrats in the House are still off the job and apparently don’t much care about the American worker. Nancy Pelosi is issuing ultimatums from her California Ice-Cream Stash Central and is using the unanimous consent trick to bypass the other 434 elected representatives in the House. Won’t look good at the ballot box in November. Wonder how the biased media is going to try and spin the democrats despicable tactics as a good thing? I'm sure they'll make up something.

amdublin

notobtuse wrote: »

Still nothing happening from Democrats on replenishing the PPP (Paycheck Protection Program) as they remain MIA. Democrats in the House are still off the job and apparently don’t much care about the American worker. Nancy Pelosi is issuing ultimatums from her California Ice-Cream Stash Central and is using the unanimous consent trick to bypass the other 434 elected representatives in the House. Won’t look good at the ballot box in November. Wonder how the biased media is going to try and spin the democrats despicable tactics as a good thing? I'm sure they'll make up something.

Jaysis

We talk about media putting their spin on stuff.

You sure manage to put your spin on things.

This is all your supposition and opinion.

Hey, am just wondering what are you you trying to gain posting all your indoctrination propaganda? on an Irish discussion forum of all places?

amdublin

Tonight's presser will be interesting. Wonder who Trump will blame for today's oil prices.

Apparently, sources say, there will be wild speculation and lots of lies said by him tonight

Timberrrrrrrr

amdublin wrote: »

Tonight's presser will be interesting. Wonder who Trump will blame for today's oil prices.

Apparently, sources say, there will be wild speculation and lots of lies said by him tonight

Well Donny always boasts about how he hits new records all the time, this is a 1st in US history, one wonders if he will boast about it

cilantro54

Incredible stuff on the oil price. What will this mean for the petrodollar? Any impact on the dollar's reserve currency status?

Going to be bad for Canada as well.

On the plus side, it will be bad for Saudi Arabia too.

Lockdown 2020: It was the most interesting of times. It was the most boring of times.

notobtuse

amdublin wrote: »

Jaysis

We talk about media putting their spin on stuff.

You sure manage to put your spin on things.

This is all your supposition and opinion.

Hey, am just wondering what are you you trying to gain posting all your indoctrination propaganda? on an Irish discussion forum of all places?

It's not spin on things from me. Look it up and educate yourself.

Timberrrrrrrr

notobtuse wrote: »

It's not spin on things from me. Look it up and educate yourself.

What's your thoughts on Don's latest history making record?

notobtuse

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

What's your thoughts on Don's latest history making record?

The one where he gets 100% negative reporting from a biased and lying media?

lawrencesummers

Trump is gonna walk back into the Oval Office.


The democrats have decided Their best candidate To oppose Donald is a frail, possibly senile or Early stages Alzheimer’s pensioner who can’t string a sentence together and abuses middle class voters is the best they have.

I’m no trump fan, and if I had a vote I would burn it, but when it’s a choice between someone who can talk utter crap and someone who can’t even talk utter crap the outcome is poor.

Would it have been that hard for the democrats to run someone young and energetic, someone with some class and diplomacy, who might not make the grade this time but is poised to build on their campaign for 2024. Watching some of bidens videos it’s hard to see him physically capable of doing one year in the Oval Office let alone 4 and he sure won’t be able for another election in 4 years.

Cody montana

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Trump is gonna walk back into the Oval Office.


The democrats have decided Their best candidate To oppose Donald is a frail, possibly senile or Early stages Alzheimer’s pensioner who can’t string a sentence together and abuses middle class voters is the best they have.

I’m no trump fan, and if I had a vote I would burn it, but when it’s a choice between someone who can talk utter crap and someone who can’t even talk utter crap the outcome is poor.

Would it have been that hard for the democrats to run someone young and energetic, someone with some class and diplomacy, who might not make the grade this time but is poised to build on their campaign for 2024. Watching some of bidens videos it’s hard to see him physically capable of doing one year in the Oval Office let alone 4 and he sure won’t be able for another election in 4 years.

And yet, he's still far superior than Trump.
I watched him debate Sanders.
He had no issues.

amdublin

^^^^

In reply to poster lawrencesummers

Yawnnnn

It's very clear what narrative you are taking and what your objective is. It's been done to death by a few posters over and over for the last while.

You're late to the race frankly.

Just stop lol

Mental Mickey

He's already in the outer limits IMO

amdublin

Whats with the smirk on his face??

amdublin

Go Kaitlan! Love that girl

Mental Mickey

Looks like they're doing the hokey with so many of them answering questions

MadYaker

Sean.3516 wrote: »

Of course this was commentary. When a journalist says that someone is "angry" or "melts down" , that's an opinion. That's a subjective assessment of someone's demeanour and emotions.

When you refer to a video as "propaganda", that's an opinion. It begs the question as to the veracity of the claims made in the video and the intent of the person who produced it.

Bear in mind, I never said whether or not I thought these opinions were correct or incorrect. I think they were at least partially correct. However good journalists don't inject their opinions into a supposedly objective report of a live press conference.

Oh come off it. They called him out on his lying and he threw the toys out of the pram like the spoiled brat he is. He's incapable of even holding a press conference ffs. A president should not be telling lies on a daily basis.

lawrencesummers

Cody montana wrote: »

And yet, he's still far superior than Trump.
I watched him debate Sanders.
He had no issues.

My goldfish has a superior intellect to Trump.
But neither he nor Biden can string a sentence together.

lawrencesummers

amdublin wrote: »

^^^^

In reply to poster lawrencesummers

Yawnnnn

It's very clear what narrative you are taking and what your objective is. It's been done to death by a few posters over and over for the last while.

You're late to the race frankly.

Just stop lol

What narrative is that?
Are you suggesting that a criticism of Trumps opponent is an endorsement of Trump and unable to see that it isn’t?

kilns

notobtuse wrote: »

The one where he gets 100% negative reporting from a biased and lying media?

as opposed to the 100% positive reporting he gets from a biased and lying media

kilns

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Well Donny always boasts about how he hits new records all the time, this is a 1st in US history, one wonders if he will boast about it

It just proves he cant manage anything from business to politics. Even republicans with half a brain would not let him near being the CEO of even a 2 person company as he would destroy it.

But America has proven it has plenty of idiots (not the majority) who voted him to become the CEO of the biggest entity there can be and what wonderful management job he is doing. One factor of true great management is when handing the company on to the next CEO is it in a better state than what it was, I think again even the dumbest Republicans can agree it is not.

silverharp

Still not sure the Dems will go with Biden, he will get slaughtered

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1252204786059018240

lawrencesummers

silverharp wrote: »

Still not sure the Dems will go with Biden, he will get slaughtered

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1252204786059018240

Be careful, some people around these parts haven’t grasped that it’s possible to have a candidate worse than trump, which is different than saying that is a better candidate.

It looks to me like the democrats are effectively throwing in the towel by picking Biden. He’s a bumbling mess.

Carfacemandog

I'm not big on Biden, but beyond Trumps presidency (who as we speak is again bragging about "better ratings than The Batchelor!!" as tens of thousands die) being a complete disaster, here are some actual policy and performance reasons I came across to prefer Biden:

- Universal healthcare and DARPA of healthcare
- Against death penalty
- Against Private Prisons
- 15 dollar minimum wage
- Support paid sick leave
- Against for-profit charter schools,
- Free 2 year college
- Expand debt relief programs for student debt
- Boost teacher pay
- Against citizens united
- For campaign finance reform
- Taxing carbon emissions
- Pay farmers to help fight climate change
- DACA path to citizenship
- Tax corporations and wealthy to pay for infrastructure
- Scrap past pot convictions
- Increase capital gains tax
- Raise corporate taxes
increase taxes on upper-income Americans
- Better social safety net
- Better global relations and trade
- Better environmental protections
- Better women’s rights
- Less discrimination based on LGBT or race
- More efficient and compassionate refugee / asylum immigration
- Better response to disasters / emergencies
- Less stupid things that causing worry
- More progressive judges
- Respect for rule of law
- Respect for government traditions and institutions
- Expert-driven policymaking
- Ability for government actors to disagree with the President without being fired
- Stop the purge & slow the exodus of experienced public servants from the agencies, and start to rebuild a talent pool for the next 20-30 years
- No more conservative judge
- Accuracy as a constraint on government communications
- No more favoritism of conservative media, no more propaganda relationship between the White House and Fox News
- No more saying ****ty things about political opponents and disfavored demographic groups
- End of the religious right's unprecedented control over policy during this administration and a return to secular policymaking
- President no longer watches 4 hours of Fox News every day or goes golfing multiple times a week
- President no longer spends hundreds of millions of dollars on near-weekly vacations
- Businesses and foreign governments can't spend money on the President's private business interests anymore to curry favor

Boggles

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Be careful, some people around these parts haven’t grasped that it’s possible to have a candidate worse than trump, which is different than saying that is a better candidate.

It looks to me like the democrats are effectively throwing in the towel by picking Biden. He’s a bumbling mess.

At this stage, smeared shít on a stick would be better than the Large Orange Man.

The Americans need to rectify their mess.

MadYaker

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Be careful, some people around these parts haven’t grasped that it’s possible to have a candidate worse than trump, which is different than saying that is a better candidate.

It looks to me like the democrats are effectively throwing in the towel by picking Biden. He’s a bumbling mess.

He isn’t actually a bumbling mess. Trump supporters are blue in the face trying to tell everyone this, it’s getting pathetic, we don’t live in a fantasy world like you. Did you watch the 2 hour debate with sanders? Of course you didn’t.

notobtuse

kilns wrote: »

as opposed to the 100% positive reporting he gets from a biased and lying media

Fake news!