2020 US Presidential Election (aka: The Trump Coronation)

notobtuse

MadYaker wrote: »

He isn’t actually a bumbling mess. Trump supporters are blue in the face trying to tell everyone this, it’s getting pathetic, we don’t live in a fantasy world like you. Did you watch the 2 hour debate with sanders? Of course you didn’t.

I watched it. Sanders was never going to get the Democrat’s nod. It was merely a two-hour competency test for Joe Biden run by a friendly media who relinquished all journalistic integrity by not asking tough and challenging questions or any rigorous follow-ups to the feel-good leftist nonsense they were spewing. It was Biden’s chance to move to the center in anticipation of the general election, but instead he lurched left. He said he was going to institute a ban on deportations, a ban on all new fracking (which won’t play well in Pennsylvania and Trump will eat him alive on), and have nationalized health care for dealing with the coronavirus. Seems Democrats have forgotten Middle America again and what caused them to lose in 2016. Biden won’t get the pass he got in the debate in the general election against Trump, unless for those debates run by the likes of Trump-hating Washington Post, New York Times, and worst of all CNN. Trump would be smart in demanding neutral organizations run the debates or at least demand a fair balance of moderators, which is what will probably happen.
Four debates would probably be acceptable, run by:
1. Washington Post
2. Wall Street Journal
3. One of the big three TV news agencies not friendly to Trump (ABC, NBC, CBS)
3. Fox News

lawrencesummers

MadYaker wrote: »

He isn’t actually a bumbling mess. Trump supporters are blue in the face trying to tell everyone this, it’s getting pathetic, we don’t live in a fantasy world like you. Did you watch the 2 hour debate with sanders? Of course you didn’t.

Here’s the thing.

Supporting Trump and hating Biden or supporting Biden and hating Trump are not the only viewpoints that can exist. Some people are able to think a bit more critically than that.

I’m not a trump fan.

I just think the selection of Biden is terrible and that he is a horrendous candidate to take on the incumbent, that he hasn’t got a chance of winning and they should have picked another person, you would think they might have learned a lesson after Hillary..

lawrencesummers

Carfacemandog wrote: »

I'm not big on Biden, but beyond Trumps presidency (who as we speak is again bragging about "better ratings than The Batchelor!!" as tens of thousands die) being a complete disaster, here are some actual policy and performance reasons I came across to prefer Biden:

- Universal healthcare and DARPA of healthcare
- Against death penalty
- Against Private Prisons
- 15 dollar minimum wage
- Support paid sick leave
- Against for-profit charter schools,
- Free 2 year college
- Expand debt relief programs for student debt
- Boost teacher pay
- Against citizens united
- For campaign finance reform
- Taxing carbon emissions
- Pay farmers to help fight climate change
- DACA path to citizenship
- Tax corporations and wealthy to pay for infrastructure
- Scrap past pot convictions
- Increase capital gains tax
- Raise corporate taxes
increase taxes on upper-income Americans
- Better social safety net
- Better global relations and trade
- Better environmental protections
- Better women’s rights
- Less discrimination based on LGBT or race
- More efficient and compassionate refugee / asylum immigration
- Better response to disasters / emergencies
- Less stupid things that causing worry
- More progressive judges
- Respect for rule of law
- Respect for government traditions and institutions
- Expert-driven policymaking
- Ability for government actors to disagree with the President without being fired
- Stop the purge & slow the exodus of experienced public servants from the agencies, and start to rebuild a talent pool for the next 20-30 years
- No more conservative judge
- Accuracy as a constraint on government communications
- No more favoritism of conservative media, no more propaganda relationship between the White House and Fox News
- No more saying ****ty things about political opponents and disfavored demographic groups
- End of the religious right's unprecedented control over policy during this administration and a return to secular policymaking
- President no longer watches 4 hours of Fox News every day or goes golfing multiple times a week
- President no longer spends hundreds of millions of dollars on near-weekly vacations
- Businesses and foreign governments can't spend money on the President's private business interests anymore to curry favor

That’s some steaming pile of manure

Cody montana

lawrencesummers wrote: »

That’s some steaming pile of manure

Well done on counteracting it.

MadYaker

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Here’s the thing.

Supporting Trump and hating Biden or supporting Biden and hating Trump are not the only viewpoints that can exist. Some people are able to think a bit more critically than that.

I’m not a trump fan.

I just think the selection of Biden is terrible and that he is a horrendous candidate to take on the incumbent, that he hasn’t got a chance of winning and they should have picked another person, you would think they might have learned a lesson after Hillary..

You don't think Coronavirus disaster and the subsequent economic meltdown is going to have an effect no? Things are only getting worse over there. By november if Biden was dead and preserved in formaldehyde he would still win. Trump has failed utterly here and his blame game isn't washing, it looks desperate and pathetically transparent.

Why do you think Biden is such a weak candidate?

duploelabs

lawrencesummers wrote: »

That’s some steaming pile of manure

Counter each point so we can get an understanding of your viewpoint on biden then

lawrencesummers

Cody montana wrote: »

Well done on counteracting it.

Where do you start?
Some claims are so loose in target they shouldn’t be included, some are so fanciful that they can only be laughed at. It’s a joke. Il elaborate more later maybe, but that’s some pile of political hot air

lawrencesummers

MadYaker wrote: »

You don't think Coronavirus disaster and the subsequent economic meltdown is going to have an effect no? Things are only getting worse over there. By november if Biden was dead and preserved in formaldehyde he would still win. Trump has failed utterly here and his blame game isn't washing, it looks desperate and pathetically transparent.

Why do you think Biden is such a weak candidate?

Might check back on that prediction in a few months.

notobtuse

President Trump has announced that he's "temporarily suspending immigration into the United States."

n light of the attack from the Invisible Enemy, as well as the need to protect the jobs of our GREAT American Citizens, I will be signing an Executive Order to temporarily suspend immigration into the United States!

I can see the collective heads of the Trump-hating media exploding… you know, those media dumbasses who have claimed Trump hasn’t been doing enough to protect the citizens from the coronavirus.

MadYaker

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Here’s the thing.

Supporting Trump and hating Biden or supporting Biden and hating Trump are not the only viewpoints that can exist. Some people are able to think a bit more critically than that.

I’m not a trump fan.

I just think the selection of Biden is terrible and that he is a horrendous candidate to take on the incumbent, that he hasn’t got a chance of winning and they should have picked another person, you would think they might have learned a lesson after Hillary..

Blanket statements about Biden being terrible and nothing to back up these statements. Pushing the nonsense about Biden being senile, if it walks like a duck......

ohnonotgmail

notobtuse wrote: »

President Trump has announced that he's "temporarily suspending immigration into the United States."



I can see the collective heads of the Trump-hating media exploding… you know, those media dumbasses who have claimed Trump hasn’t been doing enough to protect the citizens from the coronavirus.

the virus is already rampant. what is he doing to address that apart from publicly abusing state governors? any possibility he might actually take responsibility for something?

lawrencesummers

MadYaker wrote: »

Blanket statements about Biden being terrible and nothing to back up these statements. Pushing the nonsense about Biden being senile, if it walks like a duck......

Just because I don’t like Man City doesn’t make me a Man Utd fan.

duploelabs

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Just because I don’t like Man City doesn’t make me a Man Utd fan.

Yet still not willing to debate the points provided

Outlaw Pete

AOC cheering on the oil price drop. Not a good look for the dems.


https://twitter.com/dcexaminer/status/1252407946362810375


But sure it's not like we didn't know they were secretly loving the negative economic impact that the Coronavirus was having.

notobtuse

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the virus is already rampant. what is he doing to address that apart from publicly abusing state governors? any possibility he might actually take responsibility for something?

Oh, bother. Trump has done plenty, already. His policies will be vindicated as the coronavirus is tracked. His politics have provided real answers for both the present crisis and set the stage for the prevention and mitigation of future pandemics. He has instituted strong borders, protecting our national sovereignty, and is committed to reopening our thriving domestic economy that will ensure a peaceful, prosperous and safe country.

Here is what he’s done as of March 11, 2020:

RESTRICTING TRAVEL FROM IMPACTED AREAS: President Donald J. Trump is taking further action to curb the spread of the coronavirus to the United States from other countries.

• President Trump is issuing a proclamation under section 212(f) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) to restrict travel to the United States from foreign nationals who have recently been in certain European countries.
• Section 212(f) of the INA only applies to the movement of human beings, not goods or cargo.
• The restriction applies to foreign nationals who have been in the Schengen Area, 26 countries in Europe with open borders agreements, in the last 14 days.
• Those who are exempt from these restrictions, such as American citizens, will be directed to a limited number of airports where screening can take place.
• There is extensive travel back and forth between Europe that heightens the risk here in the United States.

LOOKING OUT FOR AMERICAN BUSINESSES AND WORKERS: President Donald J. Trump is committed to protecting American businesses and workers from the impacts of coronavirus.

• The President is announcing an economic assistance package to help support businesses and workers who have been harmed by this outbreak.
• President Trump has instructed the Small Business Administration (SBA) to exercise available authority to provide loans to businesses affected by the coronavirus.
• These loans will help overcome disruptions caused by the coronavirus.
• The President is calling on Congress to increase funding for this program by an additional $50 billion.
• The President will be instructing the Department of the Treasury to defer tax payments for certain individuals and businesses negatively impacted by the coronavirus.
• This action will provide more than $200 billion of additional liquidity to the economy.
• President Trump is calling on Congress to immediately pass payroll tax relief.
• The President announced that he will soon be taking emergency action to provide financial relief for workers who are ill, quarantined, or caring for others due to the coronavirus.
• The President also called on Congress to take action to extend this relief for workers.

LEADING AN AGGRESSIVE, WHOLE-OF-GOVERNMENT APPROACH: President Trump has taken unprecedented steps to protect the health of Americans in response to the coronavirus.

• The President is leveraging all of our resources to respond to the coronavirus, bringing together government and private industry in a collaborative response.
• The Trump Administration declared a public health emergency in January to bolster response efforts.
• President Trump took early action to help curb the spread of the virus from other countries to the United States, providing important time for response and preparations.
• In January, President Trump acted quickly to restrict travel from foreign nationals traveling from China.
• In February, the President restricted travel for individuals recently traveling from Iran.
• The Administration put into place mandatory screening for all travelers coming into the country from Italy and South Korea.
• Travel advisories for severely impacted areas like Italy and South Korea have been raised to their highest level.
• Today, the President directed his Administration to make general-use face masks available to our healthcare workers.
• The Administration’s actions will help make millions of general-use respirators available to keep healthcare workers safe and mitigate transmission of the virus.
• President Trump signed into law more than $8 billion to fund response efforts.
• The Administration has taken bold steps to incentivize the development of therapeutics and vaccines to treat and prevent the spread of the coronavirus.
• Working across the public and private sectors, the Trump Administration continues to drastically expand testing capacity.
• More than 1 million tests have been distributed nationwide, with another 4 million tests being shipped out by the end of the week.
• Testing is now available in every State lab in the country and commercial labs are now deploying tests, which will help generate a dramatic increase in availability.
• The Trump Administration has released guidance on how to keep businesses, schools, community gathering places, and families safe.
• From the start, President Trump has made keeping the public informed a top priority.
• The Administration has announced that health plans with health savings accounts will be able to cover coronavirus testing and treatment without co-payments.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trump-taken-unprecedented-steps-respond-coronavirus-protect-health-safety-americans/

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

President Trump has announced that he's "temporarily suspending immigration into the United States."



I can see the collective heads of the Trump-hating media exploding… you know, those media dumbasses who have claimed Trump hasn’t been doing enough to protect the citizens from the coronavirus.

He's not stopping travel , he's only stopping permanent Immigration ,something he's wanted to do from Day 1 but has been blocked repeatedly by the courts. How convenient that the exigent circumstance of the Corona Virus allows him to potentially fulfill a much failed campaign promise in an Election year.

Are people coming to stay permanently in the US somehow more likely to be contagious than those that are just visiting?

Timberrrrrrrr

notobtuse wrote: »

Oh, bother. Trump has done plenty, already. His policies will be vindicated as the coronavirus is tracked. His politics have provided real answers for both the present crisis and set the stage for the prevention and mitigation of future pandemics. He has instituted strong borders, protecting our national sovereignty, and is committed to reopening our thriving domestic economy that will ensure a peaceful, prosperous and safe country.

Here is what he’s done as of March 11, 2020:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trump-taken-unprecedented-steps-respond-coronavirus-protect-health-safety-americans/

At least you didn't (badly) edit it this time and try to claim it as your own.

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

He's not stopping travel , he's only stopping permanent Immigration ,something he's wanted to do from Day 1 but has been blocked repeatedly by the courts. How convenient that the exigent circumstance of the Corona Virus allows him to potentially fulfill a much failed campaign promise in an Election year.

Are people coming to stay permanently in the US somehow more likely to be contagious than those that are just visiting?

You need to get your head out of the sand and think more than just sickness. President Trump has to look at the nation as a whole, not just spout off talking points of one-thought ponies. And that involves the economy and jobs. The temporary ban will stop bringing in new people as US and world economies are in the midst of crumbling. A historic number of US citizens are now without jobs because of the virus mandates. Why bring in new people to take jobs at lower wages, displacing those hoping to get back to work and those who rely on their higher paying jobs?

I'd say your better than that, but Trump somehow rots the brains of usually intelligent people on the Left.

amdublin

notobtuse wrote: »

You need to get your head out of the sand and think more than just sickness. President Trump has to look at the nation as a whole, not just spout off talking points of one-thought ponies. And that involves the economy and jobs. The temporary ban will stop bringing in new people as US and world economies are in the midst of crumbling. A historic number of US citizens are now without jobs because of the virus mandates. Why bring in new people to take jobs at lower wages, displacing those hoping to get back to work and those who rely on their higher paying jobs?

I'd say your better than that, but Trump somehow rots the brains of usually intelligent people on the Left.

Awful bang of "fardners comin' in an taking air jobs" offa this post

#justsayin'

lawrencesummers

duploelabs wrote: »

Yet still not willing to debate the points provided

I happily will when I get a moment.

lawrencesummers

notobtuse wrote: »

Oh, bother. Trump has done plenty, already. His policies will be vindicated as the coronavirus is tracked. His politics have provided real answers for both the present crisis and set the stage for the prevention and mitigation of future pandemics. He has instituted strong borders, protecting our national sovereignty, and is committed to reopening our thriving domestic economy that will ensure a peaceful, prosperous and safe country.

Here is what he’s done as of March 11, 2020:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/president-donald-j-trump-taken-unprecedented-steps-respond-coronavirus-protect-health-safety-americans/

The death toll tells a different story.

lawrencesummers

notobtuse wrote: »

You need to get your head out of the sand and think more than just sickness. President Trump has to look at the nation as a whole, not just spout off talking points of one-thought ponies. And that involves the economy and jobs. The temporary ban will stop bringing in new people as US and world economies are in the midst of crumbling. A historic number of US citizens are now without jobs because of the virus mandates. Why bring in new people to take jobs at lower wages, displacing those hoping to get back to work and those who rely on their higher paying jobs?

I'd say your better than that, but Trump somehow rots the brains of usually intelligent people on the Left.

Also, a historic number of US citizens are now without their life because of the Virus. Economies recover, dead people don’t.

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

You need to get your head out of the sand and think more than just sickness. President Trump has to look at the nation as a whole, not just spout off talking points of one-thought ponies. And that involves the economy and jobs. The temporary ban will stop bringing in new people as US and world economies are in the midst of crumbling. A historic number of US citizens are now without jobs because of the virus mandates. Why bring in new people to take jobs at lower wages, displacing those hoping to get back to work and those who rely on their higher paying jobs?

I'd say your better than that, but Trump somehow rots the brains of usually intelligent people.

Fair and valid points - BUT , they don't explain a total ban.

Everyone coming to the US with a valid work visa needs to go through an application process before they arrive for approval and validation - It's not like legal immigrants just rock up at the Airport and say "Hi , I'm here about a job".

There will be jobs that you will need that you can't fill , which is why you have immigration today , that's not going to change . Why not just change the criteria etc. ?

To your point above , when someone looks for a visa for an immigrant , Question 1 should be (and actually currently IS for quite a few of the Visa types) Is this a new role or are you replacing an existing employee and have you exhausted the ability to hire locally?

A total ban is a deeply inefficient blunt instrument that will cause as many problems as it purports to solve , but it is a convenient dog whistle to Trumps base and the fulfillment of a campaign promise that the courts have repeatedly blocked.

It's like every piece of Legislation that Trump has tried to implement - Using a Lump hammer instead of a scalpel.

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

Fair and valid points - BUT , they don't explain a total ban.

Everyone coming to the US with a valid work visa needs to go through an application process before they arrive for approval and validation - It's not like legal immigrants just rock up at the Airport and say "Hi , I'm here about a job".

There will be jobs that you will need that you can't fill , which is why you have immigration today , that's not going to change . Why not just change the criteria etc. ?

To your point above , when someone looks for a visa for an immigrant , Question 1 should be (and actually currently IS for quite a few of the Visa types) Is this a new role or are you replacing an existing employee and have you exhausted the ability to hire locally?

A total ban is a deeply inefficient blunt instrument that will cause as many problems as it purports to solve , but it is a convenient dog whistle to Trumps base and the fulfillment of a campaign promise that the courts have repeatedly blocked.

It's like every piece of Legislation that Trump has tried to implement - Using a Lump hammer instead of a scalpel.

Oh, come on, you know why a total ban is necessary. Because a scalpel method will only bring about cries of racism and xenophobia from the democrats and their media handmaidens. Yes, we NEEDED immigration in the past, but with so many businesses shuttered, and the corresponding unemployment, we all know (if you are truthful with yourself) that many of those businesses won't be able to come back. A total TEMPORARY ban is necessary.

Also, that point about displacing an American worker is crap. Many in corporate America finds a way around it.

Quin_Dub

notobtuse wrote: »

Oh, come on, you know why a total ban is necessary. Because a scalpel method will only bring about cries of racism and xenophobia from the democrats and their media handmaidens.

In fact it would be the total exact opposite - The blanket ban will be seen as a racist xenophobic dog whistle , whereas if he came out and said - "we are going to add additional checks and balances to the Immigration process to ensure that Americans that lost their jobs due to the virus are 1st in the queue for new jobs as the economy opens up again" he would be viewed far more reasonably.

I certainly would be far more accepting or something like that.

notobtuse wrote: »

Yes, we NEEDED immigration in the past, but with so many businesses shuttered, and the corresponding unemployment, we all know (if you are truthful with yourself) that many of those businesses won't be able to come back. A total TEMPORARY ban is necessary.

Like his Temporary total ban on Muslims that was absolutely critical that he never got but the sky didn't fall?

notobtuse wrote: »

Also, that point about displacing an American worker is crap. Many in corporate America finds a way around it.

Indeed - The Trump Corporation have exhibited real talent in that regard over the years.


Anyway - All of this is largely moot , because based on his track record on "Twitter legislation" thus far, the likelihood is that this won't actually happen at all or if it does it will bear little to no resemblance to what Trump said.

silverharp

MadYaker wrote: »

He isn’t actually a bumbling mess. Trump supporters are blue in the face trying to tell everyone this, it’s getting pathetic, we don’t live in a fantasy world like you. Did you watch the 2 hour debate with sanders? Of course you didn’t.

they weren't really gloves off debates. Biden against Trump will be brutal. I wouldn't be surprised if the Dems came up with a reason not to have them

notobtuse

Quin_Dub wrote: »

In fact it would be the total exact opposite - The blanket ban will be seen as a racist xenophobic dog whistle , whereas if he came out and said - "we are going to add additional checks and balances to the Immigration process to ensure that Americans that lost their jobs due to the virus are 1st in the queue for new jobs as the economy opens up again" he would be viewed far more reasonably.

I certainly would be far more accepting or something like that.



Like his Temporary total ban on Muslims that was absolutely critical that he never got but the sky didn't fall?



Indeed - The Trump Corporation have exhibited real talent in that regard over the years.


Anyway - All of this is largely moot , because based on his track record on "Twitter legislation" thus far, the likelihood is that this won't actually happen at all or if it does it will bear little to no resemblance to what Trump said.

You’d think but reality trump common sense. A targeted ban doesn't work here... not with our politics. Yeah, that 7 countries listed on Trump's travel ban to decrease the influx of terrorism into the US was attacked from day one and those countries identified in Trump's travel ban were pegged by the Obama administration as most dangerous countries in the world in regard to harboring terrorists. In this day of political correctness it seems it has to be all or nothing.

lawrencesummers

silverharp wrote: »

they weren't really gloves off debates. Biden against Trump will be brutal. I wouldn't be surprised if the Dems came up with a reason not to have them

Biden is unable to hold it together coherently when he is reading off script. Its sad to say that Trump might actually look good debating him. It will be carnage.

duploelabs

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Biden is unable to hold it together coherently when he is reading off script. Its sad to say that Trump might actually look good debating him. It will be carnage.

You're still to respond to those points. You said you're too busy earlier, yet you're still able to post rhetorical jibberish
So cmon then... Address them

Timberrrrrrrr

lawrencesummers wrote: »

Biden is unable to hold it together coherently when he is reading off script. Its sad to say that Trump might actually look good debating him. It will be carnage.

Have you actually ever watched a Trump press conference? He has a script and the moment he looks away from.it he comes out with nothing but absolute stupidity.