Could Sinn Fein actually run a country ?

SafeSurfer

ednwireland wrote: »

all MLM has to do is throw up the childrens hospital and FG are flat on their faces

Sinn Fein have an excellent record on health in Northern Ireland. Not now, with record waiting lists but during the troubles.

Their then policies resulted in the surgeons with most experience of limb trauma, knee cappings, drilled elbows etc, being based in Belfast. The work of surgeons such as Prof Rab Mollan was pioneering and resulted in huge advancements in the field. They should be given a chance to work their magic here too.

Fann Linn

Hamsterchops wrote: »

If Varadkar & Martin don't bury McDonald in tonight's debate it'll be their own fault, it also depends on whether she's pressurised (or let off the hook) by the interviewer!

Sinn Fein's fiscal policy & economic model really need to be scrutinized, never mind the other 'shady' stuff which hopefully will be brought up tonight.

LOL.
As if it's only SF who have problems with economics.
Just for the record.
'Who brought the IMF in here 10 years ago?
'Who signed and continues to sign off on the most costliest hospital in the world? '

Clue-Not SF.

Jinglejangle69

How's the Norths record on homelessness and health?

Field east

marieholmfan wrote: »

Jean McConville!
Jean!
Jean!


Not Jane and don't let on it was a typo either.
You don't care tuppence about her or anyone else who died in the troubles except as a party political stick to attack Sinn Fein. That stinks!


And by the way if it was a joke of the 'We'll always remember you Jimmy Sands' ilk then is was in very very bad taste!

(1) it WAS NOT a typo error. I attempted to name a few people and you got it in one. So you knew who I was referring to - objective achieved
(2) I might not ‘care twopence’ about Jean - which is TOTALLY beside the point- but I have a major problem with the way the ‘law’ was applied to address their apparent breaking of the law.

Chinasea

The total arrears countrywide at the end of last year was €73.6 million in local authority rent arrears.

Any town cryers in the Sinn Fein department gona tackle this snambolic farce.

Field east

Yurt! wrote: »

Don't buy it. Michael Noonan's priority was getting AIB off the State's books and encouraged funds to come in and hoover up distressed portfolios while paying minimal tax and reinflate property prices. That was FG policy, they need to own it and shouldn't be let off the hook for it.

Is that the full story or are there other parts to it that you are conveniently leaving out . What would you have done with the economy spiraling out of control

facehugger99

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

The State is less than 100 years old and we have gone from being the poorest country in Western Europe to one which is ranked as 3rd in the UN HDI. That happened under FF and FG governments. The man with two pints more than likely doesn’t have a clue how good he actually has it.

Even in 2012 our budget deficit was €19bn, unemployment was almost 16% and thousands of people were emigrating every month.

We're now running a surplus and unemployment is less than 5% - basically anyone who wants a job has one.

But according to some posters (and some of the media/electorate) we are living in a hellhole with the worst Govt to ever hold the reigns of power. Apparently things are so bad that we are contemplating handing power to a party of economic illiterates with ties to terrorists who want to undermine the State.


I'd almost welcome a term of SF in power to give these people a harsh dose of reality - it may wreck the country for generations but fcuk it - I'll emigrate if I have to.

Field east

Yurt! wrote: »

That's my point, I don't think SF are making the claim that they can or will build @ 65k per unit, for reasons I outlined earlier in the thread. That figure is something someone on the thread came up with on a misreading of the manifesto and others are running with it.

100,000 houses and €6.5 Bn. !!!!!!!!!

Field east

smurgen wrote: »

Do you think each unit is going to have a unique architectural design?
Also do you have the same scrutiny of figures from FF/FG or is the bar lower for them?

Sure. So can you put up the no of houses promised by other parties and cost of same to build?

Fann Linn

Chinasea wrote: »

The total arrears countrywide at the end of last year was €73.6 million in local authority rent arrears.

Any town cryers in the Sinn Fein department gona tackle this snambolic farce.

Collecting rents is an executive function for LAs.
Not elected members, now we know FG/FF just loved to get down and dirty with Planning irregularities etc, all in Moriarty, however I don't recall any Shinners or LP cllrs etc being mixed up in same.

Field east

Deleted User wrote: »

For a large scale housing program, exactly how many architects do you need? Can you not get an architect to design a corner terrace, mid-terrace and end-of-terrace, It's not like for 1000 houses you need a 1000 architects.

These are going to be social housing. Pretty basic. Don't like it? Go to a private landlord.

Cherry picking?

10000maniacs

Mary Lou: We are going to put in place a project to build 100,000 social and affordable homes in our term in government.
Claire Byrne: Who is going to build them?
Mary Lou: The builders will come back if there were such a project in place.
Claire Byrne: Where will they live when they come back?
Mary Lou: er….mmm Good question.

Yurt2

Field east wrote: »

100,000 houses and €6.5 Bn. !!!!!!!!!

And? You're repeating yourself. You've misinterpreted the manifesto

Yurt2

Field east wrote: »

Is that the full story or are there other parts to it that you are conveniently leaving out . What would you have done with the economy spiraling out of control

FG policy. Own it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/theres-no-housing-bubble-michael-noonan-wants-prices-to-rise-30168455.html

blanch152

smurgen wrote: »

Do you think each unit is going to have a unique architectural design?
Also do you have the same scrutiny of figures from FF/FG or is the bar lower for them?

Deleted User wrote: »

For a large scale housing program, exactly how many architects do you need? Can you not get an architect to design a corner terrace, mid-terrace and end-of-terrace, It's not like for 1000 houses you need a 1000 architects.

These are going to be social housing. Pretty basic. Don't like it? Go to a private landlord.

It is becoming clearer. North Korea use standardised design and don't need architects.

Some of the rubbish justifying Sinn Fein's figures are ridiculous, but if they are true, it could only be the North Korean model.

marieholmfan

Field east wrote: »

(1) it WAS NOT a typo error. I attempted to name a few people and you got it in one. So you knew who I was referring to - objective achieved
(2) I might not ‘care twopence’ about Jean - which is TOTALLY beside the point- but I have a major problem with the way the ‘law’ was applied to address their apparent breaking of the law.

Who is they? What law? The law against murdering people? What are you talking about?

blanch152

Yurt! wrote: »

That's my point, I don't think SF are making the claim that they can or will build @ 65k per unit, for reasons I outlined earlier in the thread. That figure is something someone on the thread came up with on a misreading of the manifesto and others are running with it.

These are the type of lies that Sinn Fein supporters keep coming out with, blaming anonymous posters for misreading. Let us go back to the source.


https://www.sinnfein.ie/files/2020/SF_GE2020_Manifesto.pdf

There it is clear and unequivocal, in black and white on page 5:

"Build 100,000 homes
over 5 years. This will
include council housing
and affordable homes
for renters and first time
buyers. Cost - €6.5bn"


No misreading, no lying, just plain Sinn Fein speak.

Fann Linn

blanch152 wrote: »

It is becoming clearer. North Korea use standardised design and don't need architects.

Some of the rubbish justifying Sinn Fein's figures are ridiculous, but if they are true, it could only be the North Korean model.

Jeez blanch I thought you'd know better being a Dub. Just look at all those standardised housing units in Dublin. Eg, Drimnagh, Crumlin, , Coolock, Finglas, Walkinstown, Greenhills.

The FG/FF govts of 40s, 50's 60's and 70's must've been using those nth Korean architects and their standard plans.

rdwight

Fann Linn wrote: »

LOL.
As if it's only SF who have problems with economics.
Just for the record.
'Who brought the IMF in here 10 years ago?
'Who signed and continues to sign off on the most costliest hospital in the world? '

Clue-Not SF.

"I intend to support this Bill as my party colleagues did in the Dáil when the vote was taken there in the early hours this morning. We do this because the Bill is in the national interest"

Senator Pearse Doherty, Seanad Eireann, Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Bill 2008

The Nal

They would be an absolute disaster.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/sinn-fein-stumbles-over-tax-as-ira-murder-casts-shadow-38924426.html

Basic stuff.

And she admitted that her party’s plan to raise €107m through a Vacant Site Levy would see a large chunk of that windfall collected from local authorities.

She could not explain who would pay the €12bn subvention Northern Ireland receives from Westminster in the event of a united Ireland.

She was asked to explain how her plans to increase the vacant site levy from 7pc to 15pc would raise €107m when last year it only raised €882,000.

She could not provide figures for how much she expected to raised from income tax or Vat on new homes.

BarryD2

Brock Turnpike wrote: »

Hypothetical scenario...

SF get 35+ seats

Is a coalition possible between SF, Greens, Independents? Mary Lou as Taoiseach.

You think the Greens would go in with Sinn Féin!!!!!!!!!! Chalk & cheese, oil & vinegar there.

Lot of media hype about this rise in SF - de media love a story and hyping it up.

Yurt2

blanch152 wrote: »

These are the type of lies that Sinn Fein supporters keep coming out with, blaming anonymous posters for misreading. Let us go back to the source.


https://www.sinnfein.ie/files/2020/SF_GE2020_Manifesto.pdf

There it is clear and unequivocal, in black and white on page 5:

"Build 100,000 homes
over 5 years. This will
include council housing
and affordable homes
for renters and first time
buyers. Cost - €6.5bn"


No misreading, no lying, just plain Sinn Fein speak.

A. I am not a Sinn Fein member or voter

B. An affordable house does not incur a financial burden to the taxpayer. It is bought at build cost via mortgage just like a house on the open market.

SF themselves have said the cost per unit estimate is 230k

James Brown

Chinasea wrote: »

The total arrears countrywide at the end of last year was €73.6 million in local authority rent arrears.

Any town cryers in the Sinn Fein department gona tackle this snambolic farce.

Looks like FG didn't.

Arrears are irrelevant when it comes to housing supply.

These same people will be/are housed. Your choice is do you want to take out a 25 year lease, a hotel or build our own housing?

They should take rent from source, welfare/wages.

With affordable we make a profit and cover costs. With social, even with arrears, building is better than leasing.
It's time the tax payer had a government looking out for them.

Fann Linn

rdwight wrote: »

"I intend to support this Bill as my party colleagues did in the Dáil when the vote was taken there in the early hours this morning. We do this because the Bill is in the national interest"

Senator Pearse Doherty, Seanad Eireann, Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Bill 2008

I know. I qualified that in my first sentence. However some on here assume it's only SF who can't add up.

is_that_so

Yurt! wrote: »

FG policy. Own it.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/theres-no-housing-bubble-michael-noonan-wants-prices-to-rise-30168455.html

What's the point of a 6 year old link to a "policy" of the previous government?

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

These are the type of lies that Sinn Fein supporters keep coming out with, blaming anonymous posters for misreading. Let us go back to the source.


https://www.sinnfein.ie/files/2020/SF_GE2020_Manifesto.pdf

There it is clear and unequivocal, in black and white on page 5:

"Build 100,000 homes
over 5 years. This will
include council housing
and affordable homes
for renters and first time
buyers. Cost - €6.5bn"


No misreading, no lying, just plain Sinn Fein speak.

Page 65 Blanch:

Provide an additional €6.5 billion in order to deliver over 100,000 public homes on public land to
meet social and affordable housing needs

They were not anonymous, mistaken or likely willfully misinforming people. Anonymous suggests it didn't happen.

marieholmfan

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Page 65 Blanch:

For a blueshirt to get to page 65 he'd have to learn to read first.

Yurt2

is_that_so wrote: »

What's the point of a 6 year old link to a "policy" of the previous government?

I'll walk it back for you...

Poster was claiming FG can't be blamed for the property unaffordability situation and wash FG's hands of the property crisis as if Noonan didn't deliberately stoke on rapid property price inflation...

FG's fingerprints are all over the unaffordability issue, it's not just a matter of a 'by-product of success', they fully intended to stoke the flames of property inflation.

So the point is, if FG still get to use the crash to beat FF over the head with, everyone else can use the housing mess. Fair is fair. They caused the mess this time out.

marieholmfan

is_that_so wrote: »

What's the point of a 6 year old link to a "policy" of the previous government?

The previous Fine Gael government.

is_that_so

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Looks like FG didn't.

Arrears are irrelevant when it comes to housing supply.

These same people will be/are housed. Your choice is do you want to take out a 25 year lease, a hotel or build our own housing?

They should take rent from source, welfare/wages.

With affordable we make a profit and cover costs. With social, even with arrears, building is better than leasing.
It's time the tax payer had a government looking out for them.

It's really not FF/FG/Lab or SF who are to blame for arrears although they are to blame for the almost annual LPT reduction. It's the poor income collection by most councils. Some of the Dublin ones are aggressive on commercial rates but like the majority next to useless on rent collection. What's the government solution to that?