GE Exit Poll 10 pm

McMurphy

dxhound2005 wrote: »

That doesn't sound much like the Change we were promised.

Lol, obviously the two of them finally after 100 years having to merge/coalesce together and finally end the charade that they're not one in the same party is not a change.

Could be the best thing ever happened the state.

I've an open mind. You should too. Be more positive Mr hound.

Fann Linn

threeball wrote: »

My point exactly. All these costs for carrying the people who pay for nothing get passed back. I know of a few people who intentionally defaulted because they knew nothing would really happen to them. Now SF want to make it policy. It's nuts stuff but people only look at the headline and go jaysus that's great.

It was and is policy for the last 9 years. You even say you know people who did it.

And guess what?
SF aren't in power. Your buddies in FG/ FF were.

sondagefaux

ceegee wrote: »

Page 63 of the Sinn Fein manifesto.
"Provide an additional €6.5 billion in order to deliver over 100,000 public homes on public land to meet social and affordable housing needs"

6.5b/100k = 65000

Key word: additional

dxhound2005

If FF and FG get back in, all they will have to do is given the pensioners a big rise, and double the Christmas Bonus. Then call another election. SF will either have to back them or appear to be anti pensioner.

Despite all the sanctimonious claptrap about voters being concerned about homelessness and the HSE, self interest is always first. There would be a far worse outcry if the pensioners were docked €5 a week, than anything we have seen about homelessness.

sondagefaux

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Lord Ross on now. Interesting problem there. He's lost his seat but remains transport minister until a government is formed.

Also, I'd be worried he (and the rest) will try and railroad through some last minute legislation in the interim. From what I've read there's no legal obstacle to that.

Apart from the minor fact that there's no national legislative body in place (the Oireachtas has yet to reconvene)...

sondagefaux

threeball wrote: »

Housing is small fry in comparison to the damage their plans for business will do to this country. Increasing the prsi to 15.7% as proposed will close down half the small businesses in the country. When people cry about business making huge profits it's only a handful of companies. The vast majority are small businesses surviving month to month making not much more than a wage. These would be decimated by such a stupid move.

What percentage of small businesses paying salaries over 100K would you reckon there are?

The proposal from SF is to increase the employers PRSI to that rate on the portion of salaries over 100k.

So if an employee was being paid a salary of 110k, the employers PRSI rate would be 15.7% on 10k of that, not on the full 110k.

Details are important...

dxhound2005

McMurphy wrote: »

Lol, obviously the two of them finally after 100 years having to merge/coalesce together and finally end the charade that they're not one in the same party is not a change.

Could be the best thing ever happened the state.

I've an open mind. You should too. Be more positive Mr hound.

If you want to do ancient history, there was no FF back in the day. They split off from SF. Time to get back together now maybe.

threeball

ygolometsipe wrote: »

You only get to agree not to have the bank sell your morgage to a vulture fund. You still need to pay your mortgage (to the bank). The courts decide bankruptcy cases not SF policy.



However people can be very well intentioned and still default. Financial default applies to individual's and business. In society we value the risk business take on to employ people, hence the LTD post fix (limited liability)
risk is a part of life but I don't see much risk, hopefully we wont ever have another FF government in power.
If FF get elected, sell your house and run for the hills.

It's still another impediment to repossession to which there are too many in this country. We end up paying through the nose for the risk the banks carry. Good intentions are all good and well but everyone has to pay their debts or the economy stalls. If I don't pay the blocklayer on my house, he doesn't pay the builders providers, they don't pay the bank and some or all go out of business, normally the littlest fella but someone has to pick up the bill at the end. If you default and can't at least come to an arrangement you should lose it.

I have as much time for FF as I have for SF. Both populist charlatans whose only goals are short term gratification and completely self serving.

sondagefaux

campo wrote: »

Yep ignore the will of the people that is democracy for sure.

75.47% of those who voted in the general election didn't vote for Sinn Féin.

The will of the vast majority of the people is for SF to not be in government.

elperello

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If FF and FG get back in, all they will have to do is given the pensioners a big rise, and double the Christmas Bonus. Then call another election. SF will either have to back them or appear to be anti pensioner.

Despite all the sanctimonious claptrap about voters being concerned about homelessness and the HSE, self interest is always first. There would be a far worse outcry if the pensioners were docked €5 a week, than anything we have seen about homelessness.

To a certain extent homelessness and health were self interest for many.

Most families have a connection suffering high rent or other housing related problems.
Similarly it would be hard to find a family that has not had a poor experience with HSE.
Agree taking €5 from pensioners would provoke more ire.

threeball

Fann Linn wrote: »

It was and is policy for the last 9 years. You even say you know people who did it.

And guess what?
SF aren't in power. Your buddies in FG/ FF were.

It's obviously not policy as thousands of homes were sold to vulture funds but you keep making it up as you go along.

dxhound2005

In the North if you do not pay your property tax, your house could be repossessed. That might be part of the reason that there are far more repossessions in the North, compared to here.

I would welcome that policy from SF here if they get in.

If you don't pay your rates
If you don't pay your rates or contact LPS to make an arrangement to pay your rates bill, LPS will take legal action against you. A court process means:

additional costs for you to pay
your credit rating could be affected and you may not be able to apply for credit or a loan
you could be made bankrupt
your home could be repossessed
LPS can refer your debt to a debt collection agency

rob316

ceegee wrote: »

Page 63 of the Sinn Fein manifesto.
"Provide an additional €6.5 billion in order to deliver over 100,000 public homes on public land to meet social and affordable housing needs"

6.5b/100k = 65000

Additional.

As in added to whatever else is there already. Everyone knows you can't build a house for 65k.

Didn't mention the size of the home either.

smurgen

Jizique wrote: »

That is why we have the highest mortgage rates in Europe

No that's just the excuse the banks use to justify the rates.

threeball

dxhound2005 wrote: »

In the North if you do not pay your property tax, your house could be repossessed. That might be part of the reason that there are far more repossessions in the North, compared to here.

I would welcome that policy from SF here if they get in.

If you don't pay your rates
If you don't pay your rates or contact LPS to make an arrangement to pay your rates bill, LPS will take legal action against you. A court process means:

additional costs for you to pay
your credit rating could be affected and you may not be able to apply for credit or a loan
you could be made bankrupt
your home could be repossessed
LPS can refer your debt to a debt collection agency

Not a hope they rock the boat and bring in something that will affect their base. If your lifeplan is to pay for nothing then that won't sit too well.

dxhound2005

elperello wrote: »

To a certain extent homelessness and health were self interest for many.

Most families have a connection suffering high rent or other housing related problems.
Similarly it would be hard to find a family that has not had a poor experience with HSE.
Agree taking €5 from pensioners would provoke more ire.

I won't ask about your bad experiences, but myself and family members have had good experience of the HSE over the years. And probably millions of other patient outcomes, which do not get reported in the media.

McMurphy

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If you want to do ancient history, there was no FF back in the day. They split off from SF. Time to get back together now maybe.

We are obviously discussing the pretence that FF and FG have any fundamental differences from one another and there's nothing really noteworthy that sets them apart politically, so far as any of us can see - they exist solely so one can say they're not the other in a perpetual cycle of revolving door power swapping.

However, seeing as you brought up ancient history, and who split from whom back when neither of us were born.

Why (could you tell me) have FG removed all traces of Eoin ODuffy from its own website?

I've looked, and I can't see any mention of him, has me fierce stumped so it has.

The Rape of Lucretia

sondagefaux wrote: »

75.47% of those who voted in the general election didn't vote for Sinn Féin.

The will of the vast majority of the people is for SF to not be in government.

And 84% of TDs returned maintained the status quo.

So really there isnt a grain of truth to the ideas that people voted for change, the establishment was thrown out, the country turned left, or that SF were given a mandate to govern.
Bizarre how so much of the susequent discussion is base on 'facts' such as these, which have no basis in reality.

dxhound2005

McMurphy wrote: »

We are obviously discussing the pretence that FF and FG have any fundamental differences from one another and there's nothing really noteworthy that sets them apart politically, so far as any of us can see - they exist solely so one can say they're not the other in a perpetual cycle of revolving door power swapping.

However, seeing as you brought up ancient history, and who split from whom back when neither of us were born.

Why (could you tell me) have FG removed all traces of Eoin ODuffy from its own website?

I've looked, and I can't see any mention of him, has me fierce stumped so it has.

Fair play to Mary Lou. She has no qualms about her admiration for Republicans who collaborated with the Nazis.

elperello

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I won't ask about your bad experiences, by myself and family members have had good experience of the HSE over the years. And probably millions of other patient outcomes, which do not get reported in the media.

I'm not complaining personally at all.

Of course lot's of people have good experiences but as you say they don't get talked about.

Neither do good experiences tend to affect voting intentions.

threeball

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I won't ask about your bad experiences, by myself and family members have had good experience of the HSE over the years. And probably millions of other patient outcomes, which do not get reported in the media.

The main problem with the HSE is A&E and getting into the system. Once you are in the system most people are very happy with the care they receive. It's an invisible barrier of poor co-ordination at the first point of contact that is the main problem. It's mainly administrative. Although there are issues around care and rehab outside the hospitals.

McMurphy

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Fair play to Mary Lou. She has no qualms about her admiration for Republicans who collaborated with the Nazis.

:pac:

dxhound2005

threeball wrote: »

The main problem with the HSE is A&E and getting into the system. Once you are in the system most people are very happy with the care they receive. It's an invisible barrier of poor co-ordination at the first point of contact that is the main problem. It's mainly administrative. Although there are issues around care and rehab outside the hospitals.

And again if people are putting their faith in SF to improve it, they are ignoring what is happening with the Health Service in the North.

Water John

John Bruton went into Govn't with Official Sinn Fein effectively.
FG in the 50s had a Govn't with the leader of the IRA in Cabinet.

If SF HQ can close down the yahoos in the party posting or clowning, it may help with negotiations.

elperello

threeball wrote: »

The main problem with the HSE is A&E and getting into the system. Once you are in the system most people are very happy with the care they receive. It's an invisible barrier of poor co-ordination at the first point of contact that is the main problem. It's mainly administrative. Although there are issues around care and rehab outside the hospitals.

When you hear Auntie so and so spent three days on a trolley that tends to dominate the narrative rather than she's home fine now.

Maybe you haven't visited her for a couple of years but you still feel aggrieved on her behalf.

Water John

threeball wrote: »

The main problem with the HSE is A&E and getting into the system. Once you are in the system most people are very happy with the care they receive. It's an invisible barrier of poor co-ordination at the first point of contact that is the main problem. It's mainly administrative. Although there are issues around care and rehab outside the hospitals.

There is also a capacity problem but it is true that the care is VG once you get in the door.

rob316

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

And 84% of TDs returned maintained the status quo.

So really there isnt a grain of truth to the ideas that people voted for change, the establishment was thrown out, the country turned left, or that SF were given a mandate to govern.
Bizarre how so much of the susequent discussion is base on 'facts' such as these, which have no basis in reality.

You could turn those figures anyway to suit your argument. It's all a load of nonsense at the end of the day.

Loafing Oaf

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I still believe if Martin wants to force through a deal with SF he will be able to. None of those TDs said they would refuse to serve in a FF-SF government

Apparently Jim O'Callaghan has done this, so apologies for questioning your sincerity Jim...

Suckit

rob316 wrote: »

Additional.

As in added to whatever else is there already. Everyone knows you can't build a house for 65k.

Didn't mention the size of the home either.

Nor does it say that they are houses.

Sinn Féin will use the projected €4 billion to be transferred
from NAMA to the Exchequer as one-off capital investment in public housing.

Sinn Féin priorities:
» Provide an additional €6.5 billion in order to deliver over 100,000 public homes on public land to meet social and affordable housing needs.

That would be €10.5 billion to provide 100,000 homes.
Some of the developers that were helped out by both FF and FG should have paid all that off, yet haven't, still own their portfolios and are building more homes to rent. Box flats, to rent to the council.

Ridiculous.

McMurphy

Don't know if this was posted earlier but this is awkward.

https://twitter.com/ABhoysVoice/status/1227357909945810945?s=19