GE Exit Poll 10 pm

Cork Boy 53

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

I suppose Leo was drafted in after Kenny as the great white hope but he somehow managed the make the party even worse.

Will always be remembered as the Taoiseach who took a spanking from Mary Lou and brought SF into mainstream politics.

I can understand how he can be so dejected but at the same time he needs to snap out of it. Yeah he won't be Taoiseach anymore but I'd imagine MM would give him a decent post out of sympathy. Transport, Tourism and Sport should suit him and usually a good op for a few pics.

If there is another GE in the fairly near future I reckon Leo won`t be contesting it.

efanton

seamus wrote: »

So, a lot of this stuff is done by convention rather than rules.

I know Leo said that SF had a duty to form a government because they had the most first preferences, but he's wrong. The party with the most seats has the duty to try and form a government. Those with the largest Dáil presence has the public mandate to lead the government.

That doesn't stop other parties from attempting to form government.

When the Dáil first sits, it is the largest party that is invited first to nominate their pick of Taoiseach.
Other parties can then nominate their picks. As far as I know, there is no restriction on this, and it's not strange for there to be 3 or more nominations.

If the largest party nominate a Taoiseach and nobody else does, there's no vote. He's appointed by default. It's traditional, for democratic purposes, for the largest opposition party to nominate their candidate so that a vote can take place and the Taoiseach be democratically elected.

Like you say, there is nothing technically stopping smaller parties from forming an alternative government and nominating their Taoiseach once they have their majority. By implication it means that the larger party don't have one and will be nominating their candidate knowing he'll be defeated.

Thats wrong

The Taoiseach is elected by a single vote of ALL TD's sitting in the Dial.

In theory this could mean the Taoiseach is not a member of the party with the largest number of seats.

Usually a there is a deal struck between parties before this vote takes place if no party has an outright majority

efanton

I see the FF party are already sharpening their knives

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/if-he-had-any-decency-he-would-have-resigned-already-ff-councillor-blasts-martins-leadership-981319.html

lawred2

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

They didnt. They didnt realise they were voting for Up the RA. They tought they were voting for a legitimate party. Now it must be said, most of them probably would have just protested their vote elsewhere, not aware that it was in their best interest to vote for FG or FF, and would inflicted more of the Independents scourge on the country. Others would have gone greens or SDs which would have been manageable.

Oh give over

Cork Boy 53

efanton wrote: »

Thats wrong

The Taoiseach is elected by a single vote of ALL TD's sitting in the Dial.

In theory this could mean the Taoiseach is not a member of the party with the largest number of seats.

Usually a there is a deal struck between parties before this vote takes place if no party has an outright majority

Also the Taoiseach does not necessarily have to be the party leader as happened with John A Costello in the 1940s and 50s.

Idbatterim

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

If there is another GE in the fairly near future I reckon Leo won`t be contesting it.

lets hope so for the sake of the country! Maybe varadkar can try to impress kylie, by telling her he is the Tanaiste next time!

seamus

efanton wrote: »

Thats wrong

The Taoiseach is elected by a single vote of ALL TD's sitting in the Dial.

In theory this could mean the Taoiseach is not a member of the party with the largest number of seats.

Usually a there is a deal struck between parties before this vote takes place if no party has an outright majority

The largest party nominate. And then the other parties are invited to nominate. No, the nomination doesn't have to be a member of the party that nominates them.

There's only a vote when there's more than one nomination - which by convention there nearly always is.

efanton

It seems Leo is taking defeat very hard indeed. To the point where he has become totally delusional

“In terms of what may happen later on in this process, in the next couple of weeks, Fine Gael, my party, is the party of the founding of the State...There’s another party that was founded in 1971 called Sinn Féin which has a fake history that says otherwise, but we’re the ones who founded the State, we’re the ones who established institutions, we’re the ones who made this country a Republic,” he said

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/varadkar-thinks-he-will-be-opposition-leader-of-next-government-981300.html

FG didnt even exist when the state was formed, but why let the truth get in the way of a bit of spin, its never stopped him before

LeinsterDub

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Not a hope. FF and FG would rather go in with SF

They would far prefer to go with each other than go with SF, not sure what gives you the idea they would rather go with SF. People who have voted for them would also far prefer them to go together than go with SF. They wont lose any voters going together they would lose massively going in with SF.

I was listening to the FG TD elected in my constituency this morning on the radio. He said it would be downright dangerous to allow SF get into gov and it must not be allowed (never were truer words spoken). His prediction was FF/FG/GP.

Personally my preference would be FG/FF/Independents as I would much prefer to see the GP kept our of power as I strongly disagree with much of their policies and what they stand for in general but an FG/FF/GP would be far preferable than anything involving SF.

Mantis Toboggan

Cork Boy 53 wrote: »

If there is another GE in the fairly near future I reckon Leo won`t be contesting it.

Yeah I'd say he could run but there's no way FG will allow him be the leader going into an election. 6 counts just to get in!!

Mantis Toboggan

efanton wrote: »

It seems Leo is taking defeat very hard indeed. To the point where he has become totally delusional

“In terms of what may happen later on in this process, in the next couple of weeks, Fine Gael, my party, is the party of the founding of the State...There’s another party that was founded in 1971 called Sinn Féin which has a fake history that says otherwise, but we’re the ones who founded the State, we’re the ones who established institutions, we’re the ones who made this country a Republic,” he said

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/varadkar-thinks-he-will-be-opposition-leader-of-next-government-981300.html

FG didnt even exist when the state was formed, but why let the truth get in the way of a bit of spin, its never stopped him before

Wow, salty words indeed, he's still concussed from the clipping he got from Mary Lou :pac:

Idbatterim

FFG would way prefer to get back into bed with one another, the primary reason being, that if they arent back in together, god knows what SF will do about all thir sweetheart deals and hangers on they enrich...

Idbatterim

Mantis Toboggan wrote: »

Yeah I'd say he could run but there's no way FG will allow him be the leader going into an election. 6 counts just to get in!!

you would think, they are spineless though and look at their useless td's! POD already supporting varadkar to lead the party , dont know what coveney is up to. a load of useless td's and many afraid of their own shadow. Not looking good to get varadkar out, unless he goes of his own accord!

Grab All Association

Talking to a group UL students here in Parkway who gave Quinlivan number 1. Accommodation cost 65% and Health 35% with transportation cost and insurance thrown in.

The older the voter it’d be healthcare that would be the number 1 issue.

Here in Limerick for the past 15 years, FF and FG haven’t listened to people.

This is it

As a FG voter I'm happy with Leo out in front. The dog on the street knew FG were going to get a pasting, the unexpected was the pasting FF got and the protest vote that SF got. Considering the issues and the protest vote FG didn't actually do too badly. I probably expected worse.

McMurphy

efanton wrote: »

It seems Leo is taking defeat very hard indeed. To the point where he has become totally delusional

“In terms of what may happen later on in this process, in the next couple of weeks, Fine Gael, my party, is the party of the founding of the State...There’s another party that was founded in 1971 called Sinn Féin which has a fake history that says otherwise, but we’re the ones who founded the State, we’re the ones who established institutions, we’re the ones who made this country a Republic,” he said

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/varadkar-thinks-he-will-be-opposition-leader-of-next-government-981300.html

FG didnt even exist when the state was formed, but why let the truth get in the way of a bit of spin, its never stopped him before

Yeah, heard that.

Funnily enough I posted this just last night about FG history revisionism.

McMurphy wrote: »

We are obviously discussing the pretence that FF and FG have any fundamental differences from one another and there's nothing really noteworthy that sets them apart politically, so far as any of us can see - they exist solely so one can say they're not the other in a perpetual cycle of revolving door power swapping.

However, seeing as you brought up ancient history, and who split from whom back when neither of us were born.

Why (could you tell me) have FG removed all traces of Eoin ODuffy from its own website?

I've looked, and I can't see any mention of him, has me fierce stumped so it has.

Jamsiek

Grayson Tasty Springboard wrote: »

He said it would be downright dangerous to allow SF get into gov and it must not be allowed (never were truer words spoken).

So he doesn't care what people want, what he wants is all that matters

LeinsterDub

Grayson Tasty Springboard wrote: »

They would far prefer to go with each other than go with SF, not sure what gives you the idea they would rather go with SF. People who have voted for them would also far prefer them to go together than go with SF. They wont lose any voters going together they would lose massively going in with SF.

I was listening to the FG TD elected in my constituency this morning on the radio. He said it would be downright dangerous to allow SF get into gov and it must not be allowed (never were truer words spoken). His prediction was FF/FG/GP.

Personally my preference would be FG/FF/Independents as I would much prefer to see the GP kept our of power as I strongly disagree with much of their policies and what they stand for in general but an FG/FF/GP would be far preferable than anything involving SF.

If that's the case what's MM issue why has he ruled it out?

Jamsiek

Jamsiek wrote: »

So he doesn't care what people want, what he wants is all that matters

80% or people didn’t want SF and of those who did most are too thick to understand what they voted for.

rob316

LeinsterDub wrote: »

You're thinking of the PFJ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WboggjN_G-4

**** off :pac:

Mantis Toboggan

Grayson Tasty Springboard wrote: »

80% or people didn’t want SF and of those who did most are too thick to understand what they voted for.

That's the arrogance that has decimated the monopoly parties.

Grab All Association

If 75% of the electorate didn’t want SF. 77.8% didn’t want FF and almost 80% of the electorate didn’t want FG.

FreeThePants

Jamsiek wrote: »

So he doesn't care what people want, what he wants is all that matters

Frankly after going into government with FF less than a decade after they ruined this nation in a way not seen before, and did all to protect themselves and their mates while forcing the younger generation to leave the country in order to find work, the 'SF can not get in' talk from FG isn't only ridiculous, it's quite revolting.

There is a very, very obvious reason why SF have been growing so much over the last decade (along with PBP and the other small parties), and it's something neither FF nor FG want to address because they can't, it's a decade too late. But the fact is they ****ed an entire generation over to keep the older generations happy for no other reason than political cynicism (older people vote more).

Well, guess what? Older people die more and younger people get older. The damage FF and FG have done to themselves in this regard in the last decade is borderline irreparable, and if they keep it up they'll be about as relevant as Irish Labour before too long.

One part of me would be ok with that, but the other would be worried what vacuum they might leave on the right side of the aisle.

McMurphy

I see Brendan Howlin is to step down as leader of the Labour party, was sad to hear that, Brendan come across as a decent sort, he carried himself well in the leaders debates last week.

FreeThePants

FreeThePants wrote: »

There is a very, very obvious reason why SF have been growing so much over the last decade (along with PBP and the other small parties), and it's something neither FF nor FG want to address because they can't, it's a decade too late. But the fact is they ****ed an entire generation over to keep the older generations happy for no other reason than political cynicism (older people vote more).
.

That’s is totally nonsense. FG certainly didn’t **** an entire generation. The country and economy has improved massively under their time in gov.

I am that generation, came out of college right in the recession and they aren’t perfect but FG certainly are still getting my vote. I certainly don’t feel like I was f*cked over nor would I see anyone I know in my friends and family say they were. All my peers are working, good jobs with good incomes, vast majority own their own homes or are currently buying or building etc.

No doubt people are struggling to rent or buy in Dublin but that ain’t the governments fault no matter how much people try to blame them for it.

SF on the other hand I can only see impacting us in a negative way. More tax, less job opportunities etc etc.

Brendan Bendar

McMurphy wrote: »

I see Brendan Howlin is to step down as leader of the Labour party, was sad to hear that, Brendan come across as a decent sort, he carried himself well in the leaders debates last week.

Had his day.... nicely sinecured.... no need for tears.

Leroy42

McMurphy wrote: »

I see Brendan Howlin is to step down as leader of the Labour party, was sad to hear that, Brendan come across as a decent sort, he carried himself well in the leaders debates last week.

Yates reckons it because he wants to be CC, and can't be if he is party leader.

Oh, and they had a terrible election!

JohnnyFlash

McMurphy wrote: »

I see Brendan Howlin is to step down as leader of the Labour party, was sad to hear that, Brendan come across as a decent sort, he carried himself well in the leaders debates last week.

His brand of relatively realistic and costed social democracy didn’t resonate with the electorate. I’d agree he always came across as a decent skin.

is_that_so

Leroy42 wrote: »

Yates reckons it because he wants to be CC, and can't be if he is party leader.

Oh, and they had a terrible election!

They only lost one seat numerically, which they were expected to do. The unexpected departure of the old guard may be a blessing for them as they rebuild.

JohnnyFlash

Leroy42 wrote: »

Yates reckons it because he wants to be CC, and can't be if he is party leader.

Oh, and they had a terrible election!

Yates and himself would be close enough so I’d say that story might have come from the horse’s mouth.