New Dail / New Taoiseach

fergus1001

randomname2005 wrote: »

Or they decide they are on a streak, strategically fail to form a coalition and force a second election where they run more candidates with the hope of being the biggest party.

I see the above as being likely, would be easy to do AND blame it on FGFF for trying to stop them from enacting their mandate from the people

election gold dust: people vote for change, establishments tries to deny them that change

Hodors Appletart

Drumpot wrote: »

Why did they only run 40 candidates? I don’t get it.

because they were destroyed in the Euro and Locals

nobody saw this coming before the nominations closed

Drumpot

randomname2005 wrote: »

Or that. It all comes down to how hungry they are for power and being the most powerful party in a coalition.

I was thinking this. If SF want to take a massive punt for power this would be the strategy to employ.

charlie14

blanch152 wrote: »

Pat Cox was a Progressive Democrat.

Fianna Fail have never mixed with the political parties from other countries in the EP, always ending up in some marginal group. FG did so well through their membership of the EPP.

FG did so well through their membership of the EEP!


That really worked out well for them with Dara Murphy.

The Irish electorate and especially his constituents in Cork North-Central really saw the benefits there :rolleyes:

Mad_maxx

seamus wrote: »

The most depressing part of this comment is the old saying that if everybody is accusing you of bias, then you're probably on the right track.

Sinn Féin in particular would claim that we have quite a right-focussed media. RTE would generally be more flattering towards FF, Denis O'Brien's group did their best to throw everything at Sinn Fein (and would generally be favourable towards FG), and the Irish Times while generally being fair, also give extreme right lunatics plenty of column inches.
Nobody gives a lot of space for left-leaning parties to have their say.

We don't have a very right-wing media like Fox, but we definitley don't have a left-wing one.

The communist left ( Paul Murphy, Richard boyd Barrett, Ruth coppinger etc) pull in about 3% of the vote yet are regularly featured on current affairs programmes, the hard left has always received a vastly disproportionate level of media exposure

RTE are pretty tough on SF, I'll give you that, they favour comfortable middle class socialism, the Labour Party was the clear favourite of RTE for decades until they more or less disappeared, they have been replaced with the Green Party and the Social Democrats

RTE bombard us daily with various aspects of the left Liberal Broad agenda, beit near non stop features on climate change, their obsession with the homeless situation and of course Direct Provision

Then there are the glowing pieces to do with feminism and multiculturalism

.RTE is overtly left Liberal, as is the vast bulk of the media tribe in this country

Pro high public spending
Disapproval towards any party with a tax cutting agenda
Feverishly enthusiastic towards the gay marriage referendum as well as the repeal the eight vote

ancapailldorcha

Mod: No more petty name calling please. A post has been deleted.

Green&Red

Drumpot wrote: »

Why did they only run 42 candidates? I don’t get it.

This result came completely out of the blue, SF did very poorly in the local and EU elections, running more candidates would have jeopardised the ones running. They ran three in Donegal in 2016 and nearly lost the second seat as a result. Its a fine line

seamus

randomname2005 wrote: »

Or they decide they are on a streak, strategically fail to form a coalition and force a second election where they run more candidates with the hope of being the biggest party.

Sinn Féin aren't that wiley. If they strategically fail to form a coalition the parties they negotiate with will reveal what happened during the negotiations. It'll become clear that they never had any intention of forming a government and it was all optics.

I think that would be an even bigger risk than actually forming a coalition and then collapsing it again a few months later.

Drumpot wrote: »

Why did they only run 42 candidates? I don’t get it.

SF themselves didn't even expect this swing. This is genuine fantasy land numbers they've pulled in. 20% was their stretch target, they were hoping to just hold onto the seats they had after they got battered in local elections. They ran 50 candidates in 2016, and just 42 this time around to avoid splitting their vote.

L1011

Green&Red wrote: »

This result came completely out of the blue, SF did very poorly in the local and EU elections, running more candidates would have jeopardised the ones running. They ran three in Donegal in 2016 and nearly lost the second seat as a result. Its a fine line

They did lose the second seat in 2016 as a result and that's likely a core reason for their caution

Green&Red

fergus1001 wrote: »

I see the above as being likely, would be easy to do AND blame it on FGFF for trying to stop them from enacting their mandate from the people

election gold dust: people vote for change, establishments tries to deny them that change

They say the worst day in government is better than the best day in opposition so we'll see.

Realistically SF have no intention of going into government, this is all a game they're playing about a left only government. The numbers aren't there for that despite how many times we hear it. Denis Naughton, Lowry, the Healy-raes are not left by any stretch.

Mick Wallace was on this morning saying SF have to hold off until there is a fully left option.

jimmycrackcorm

Bishop of hope wrote: »

So are they all, none of them expected they wouldn't have to.
This election is an SF victory by a country mile and a huge disappointment to both FF and FG.
The only way for them to show the courage of their commitments now is to form a Govt and keep SF out.

FF need to listen. The people have said they don't want then in government. It's centre left FF and left SF that both increased their vote.

Mad_maxx

I voted FG but absolutely do not want them to enter government this time round

They were roundly rejected by the electorate and besides, SF would only grow larger in opposition, accusing the two traditional parties of power of a stitch up of the electorate

SF have a responsibility to **** or get off the pot

jm08

blanch152 wrote: »

Pat Cox was a Progressive Democrat.

Fianna Fail have never mixed with the political parties from other countries in the EP, always ending up in some marginal group. FG did so well through their membership of the EPP.

I said that Pat Cox came from the same gene pool as Fianna Fail (PDs are a split from Fianna Fail). He left the PDs as well. However, he was in the same group as Fianna Fail in the European Parliament which is now called Renew Europe. Thats the same group that Macron's party is in as well as Guy Verhofstadt, so I wouldn't write off their influence just yet.



The reason why Fianna Fail have not been visible in Europe is because they had no MEPs in the last parliament (Crowley was sick most of the time). They now have 2.

ednwireland

Green&Red wrote: »

This result came completely out of the blue, SF did very poorly in the local and EU elections, running more candidates would have jeopardised the ones running. They ran three in Donegal in 2016 and nearly lost the second seat as a result. Its a fine line

they did lose the second seat, pearse doherty only one elected in 2016 in donegal

Mad_maxx

jm08 wrote: »

I said that Pat Cox came from the same gene pool as Fianna Fail (PDs are a split from Fianna Fail). He left the PDs as well. However, he was in the same group as Fianna Fail in the European Parliament which is now called Renew Europe. Thats the same group that Macron's party is in as well as Guy Verhofstadt, so I wouldn't write off their influence just yet.



The reason why Fianna Fail have not been visible in Europe is because they had no MEPs in the last parliament (Crowley was sick most of the time). They now have 2.

A few came from FG, Michael mcdowell being one

jm08

Mad_maxx wrote: »

A few came from FG, Michael mcdowell being one

Yes, but the founder of the Party was Dessie O'Malley along with Mary Harney and Bobby Molloy mainly because of Charlie Haughey being elected as Leader of Fianna Fail. McDowell then joined in.

nkl12xtw5goz70

I'm wondering if we'll have Mary Lou instated as Taoiseach before St Patrick's Day. Will she fly over to meet Trump? Will she make a grand show of herself and the country? The next couple of years are going to be fun.

IAMAMORON

Brock Uninterested Leader wrote: »

I'm wondering if we'll have Mary Lou instated as Taoiseach before St Patrick's Day. Will she fly over to meet Trump? Will she make a grand show of herself and the country? The next couple of years are going to be fun.

Yeah.... looking forward to the flying pigs building 4 new hospitals, abolishing the USC, closing down the Central Criminal Court.... and rumour has it the same gang of flying pigs are going to build 100,000 gaffs.

It is going to happen for sure.

jm08

Brock Uninterested Leader wrote: »

I'm wondering if we'll have Mary Lou instated as Taoiseach before St Patrick's Day. Will she fly over to meet Trump? Will she make a grand show of herself and the country? The next couple of years are going to be fun.

Sinn Fein have a lot of friends in the US and feel quite at home in the the White House. Isn't Gerry great pals of Trump!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2ZPcPHJAno&feature=emb_logo

From about 13 seconds in.

ancapailldorcha

Post deleted and ban issued. No more sniping please.

Thisonedone

Howlin seems hesitant at going into a coalition with SF, if he doesn’t and instead goes into a coalition with FFG, then labour will be wiped out at the next election. No left leaning person would ever vote for them again.

AllForIt

Womens rights/diversity/equality activists being very quiet on the idea that Ireland may have it's first ever female Taoiseach.

Maybe she's not the right kind of woman.

nkl12xtw5goz70

AllForIt wrote: »

Womens rights/diversity/equality activists being very quiet on the idea that Ireland may have it's first ever female Taoiseach.

Maybe she's not the right kind of woman.

I don't think Mary Lou "Tiocfaidh ár lá" McDonald is quite what many women hoped for in the (potential) first female Taoiseach.

Bishop of hope

Brock Uninterested Leader wrote: »

I don't think Mary Lou "Tiocfaidh ár lá" McDonald is quite what many women hoped for in the (potential) first female Taoiseach.

What type of woman would she have to be?

christy c

There's so many threads on SF that I'm not sure where to ask this. As far as I know SF did not want to appeal the Apple tax ruling, is there any hope of them getting that in to a programme for government? Assuming it's FF and greens as the bookies have it.

Bishop of hope

christy c wrote: »

There's so many threads on SF that I'm not sure where to ask this. As far as I know SF did not want to appeal the Apple tax ruling, is there any hope of them getting that in to a programme for government? Assuming it's FF and greens as the bookies have it.

That's a good question. There's nothing about it per se in their manifesto that I can remember. But then there is that talk of closing off the loopholes that corporations get away with. That came from Mary Lou in the tv debate.

Field east

fergus1001 wrote: »

I see the above as being likely, would be easy to do AND blame it on FGFF for trying to stop them from enacting their mandate from the people

election gold dust: people vote for change, establishments tries to deny them that change

From a technical perspective, what actual % voted for change. On the basis that SF painted FF as being very much part of the outgoing gov , so when you add the % of first preferences to the first preference garnered by the Ml Lowrys’, Healy Reas ! , etc then what is the result. ?

AllForIt

Brock Uninterested Leader wrote: »

I don't think Mary Lou "Tiocfaidh ár lá" McDonald is quite what many women hoped for in the (potential) first female Taoiseach.

I know I'm getting a bit off topic but imo Thatcher was a stunning female leader. MJM is similarly a strong willed leader. What kind of female politician do women want? Someone with hair extensions, is week, softly spoken etc. Overtly feminine?

The fact is she is a woman no matter what her policies so one can hardly cry discrimination when here we have a female leader in the best performing party. But not a single congratulatory comment from women's rights activist's I've heard since late Saturday. Stunning silence actually.

nkl12xtw5goz70

AllForIt wrote: »

I know I'm getting a bit off topic but imo Thatcher was a stunning female leader. MJM is similarly a strong willed leader. What kind of female politician do women want? Someone with hair extensions, softly spoken etc. Overtly feminine?

The fact is she is a woman no matter what her policies so one can hardly cry discrimination when here we have a female leader in the best performing party. But not a single congratulatory comment from women's rights activist's I've heard since late Saturday. Stunning silence actually.

I don't think it has anything to do with her being strong-willed. Overall, Sinn Fein support generally trends male. At a guess, I'd say that women are less comfortable with the party's historical links to the IRA and paramilitary violence.

Field east

AllForIt wrote: »

I know I'm getting a bit off topic but imo Thatcher was a stunning female leader. MJM is similarly a strong willed leader. What kind of female politician do women want? Someone with hair extensions, softly spoken etc. Overtly feminine?

The fact is she is a woman no matter what her policies so one can hardly cry discrimination when here we have a female leader in the best performing party. But not a single congratulatory comment from women's rights activist's I've heard since late Saturday. Stunning silence actually.

I ponder why the silence