FG to just do nothing for the next 5 years.

Topgear on Dave

FrancieBrady wrote: »

'Ask questions, but only the ones we think are appropriate'.

Better to spend the time asking intelligent questions Francie, not ones that are totally stupid whilst wearing a tinfoil hat.

FrancieBrady

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Better to spend the time asking intelligent questions Francie, not ones that are totally stupid whilst wearing a tinfoil hat.

I will decline on taking lectures from FG or FF supporters if that is ok.

Most recently we seen the attempts to malign and destroy people who asked questions about the Gardai.

These people would just love to be the arbiters of what an opposition sees as important.

Democracy comes with the caveat that there may be some pointless and indeed, stupid, questioning of power. But we have to put up with that if we truly want democracy.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

We have people concerned about vaccines, we have people concerned that the world is flat and people will sail over the edge, we have people concerned about alien visits and anal probes, we have people concerned that others are stealing all the jobs, when is Aengus going to raise these concerns? Or does he only listen to some concerns?

Rather than scorn and sneer at these people be decent and address their concerns.
Yeah, I wouldn't put Aliens in the same context. We have had people get severe medical issues from state certified medication, (Thalidomide) and we do have people who are concerned about power lines and the like. So tell them they are wrong were they are wrong no need to be an arsehole about it IMO.
You can toddle along with your usual SF bait and switch.

James Brown

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Better to spend the time asking intelligent questions Francie, not ones that are totally stupid whilst wearing a tinfoil hat.

Based on who's standards? "Excuse me Mr. Harris can we ask about Covid 17 and 18?" "Pascal, can we ask about the NCH overrun or are we being big ejits?" "Mr. Varadkar, is Belfast overseas?" :rolleyes:

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

Pretty much smacks of that...only raise concerns of billionaires and the landlord class is allowed under FG it seems.....anything else is to be demonised and sneered at it,it seems


(Ireland is only country of the world,where homelessness isnt regarded as societal issue,only a partisan issue,its mind numbing stupidness here)

You'll find, like climate change, there are people will claim there's no homeless problem at all and of course those who will dismiss it like 'It's worse elsewhere'. Not to mention the effects of Covid #19 not having any bearing on the number of people attending A&E.

Runaways

The desperate scrambling to try drag any conversation away from the topic of FG being completely incompetent even dragging G oh dear Doherty into it Is really telling

The dedication of certain posters consistently over months and years is even more telling

LLol

smurgen

Looks like our nursing home deaths are starting to garner international attention. Will be hard for Leo the 5th to divert attention away from this in the long run.

https://www.euronews.com/2020/05/12/irish-government-under-fire-over-covid-19-deaths-in-care-homes

christy c

smurgen wrote: »

Looks like our nursing home deaths are starting to garner international attention. Will be hard for Leo the 5th to divert attention away from this in the long run.

https://www.euronews.com/2020/05/12/irish-government-under-fire-over-covid-19-deaths-in-care-homes

Your childish "Leo the 5th" comment aside, this will definitely be a black mark against us.

However as I said yesterday, people like yourself were telling us that Borris was making them look bad so things could be far worse.

smurgen

christy c wrote: »

Your childish "Leo the 5th" comment aside, this will definitely be a black mark against us.

However as I said yesterday, people like yourself were telling us that Borris was making them look bad so things could be far worse.

On the financial side if things he made FG seem bad yes. Their support for SME appears to be alot better than Ireland's.

christy c

smurgen wrote: »

On the financial side if things he made FG seem bad yes. Their support for SME appears to be alot better than Ireland's.

Not what you were waffling about before, and obviously the financial side is the most important in a once in a century event like this?

smurgen

christy c wrote: »

Not what you were waffling about before

Lost me? Anything on the content of this post or just pointless message as per usual?

christy c

smurgen wrote: »

Lost me? Anything on the content of this post or just pointless message as per usual?

I'm referring to your previous comment that Borris was making them look bad, just shows how out of your depth you are.

I already commented on the article, nothing pointless in what I posted.

Mortelaro

christy c wrote: »

I'm referring to your previous comment that Borris was making them look bad, just shows how out of your depth you are.

I already commented on the article, nothing pointless in what I posted.

If you google nursing home covid 19 deaths you soon see that half world wide were in nursing homes
It started happening before and during it being realised

For a heretofore unforeseen crisis that mushroomed in a month with no evidence or experience of what worked best along with a world wide extreme shortage of PPE,the blame bile posed by 2 posters on this thread directed at Leo rings very fake
No first time never seen before crisis control can be defined during a 2 month period
3 quarters of the sentences in the posts are that bile
Only 1 quarter is news
Zero is relativity to other countries as that might dilute the bile
Its actually amusing mainly because anyone with sense ie most hearing that bile can see a mile away that it's stupid

Snow Garden

We really really really need a strong government with visionary and teak tough leaders right now.

It's looks like we are going to get Leo 'inaction' Varadkar and Micky 'useless' Martin with a sprinkling of Eamon 'water cress' Ryan. The alternative is Sinn Fein and magical money trees.

We are so doomed.

General Election on Feb 8th and still no government. All the TDs are a disgrace. Gorging on expenses no doubt.
Are we still paying for TDs that lost their seats (e.g. Doherty) ???

smurgen

Mortelaro wrote: »

If you google nursing home covid 19 deaths you soon see that half world wide were in nursing homes
It started happening before and during it being realised

For a heretofore unforeseen crisis that mushroomed in a month with no evidence or experience of what worked best along with a world wide extreme shortage of PPE,the blame bile posed by 2 posters on this thread directed at Leo rings very fake
No first time never seen before crisis control can be defined during a 2 month period
3 quarters of the sentences in the posts are that bile
Only 1 quarter is news
Zero is relativity to other countries as that might dilute the bile
Its actually amusing mainly because anyone with sense ie most hearing that bile can see a mile away that it's stupid

The crisis in the nursing homes was foreseen by the head of the nursing homes Tadgh Daly. It was turned a blind eye to by Simon Harris who chose not to return his calls or have HIQA survey they homes in advance.

James Brown

smurgen wrote: »

The crisis in the nursing homes was foreseen by the head of the nursing homes Tadgh Daly. It was turned a blind eye to by Simon Harris who chose not to return his calls or have HIQA survey they homes in advance.

As I've said, it will be interesting to see how FG bring us back to the world isn't watching crises after this. Imagine people dying from Covid and FG giving us the 'no magic money tree' 'It's worse elsewhere'?
Thankfully Larry Goodman and Denis O'Brien are in the private nursing sector so the cost is no issue.
I do not believe the fiscally conservative party should be talking like money is something to think about later. Crisis is when FG make their money. From water metering sweet deal, the quango with jobs for 'our own' in the wake of a financial meltdown and inviting in and throwing money at vulture funds during the housing crisis, throwing money at pals for private beds at four times the rate the UK is paying is really par for the course with FG.

Mortelaro

smurgen wrote: »

The crisis in the nursing homes was foreseen by the head of the nursing homes Tadgh Daly. It was turned a blind eye to by Simon Harris who chose not to return his calls or have HIQA survey they homes in advance.

Thats pure rubbish, unless you consider less than a week or so a blind eye with tight resources in the middle of a crisis when the emphasis was geared up to hospital bed and icu acquiring
As I said most not interested in the FG hate barrel unlike you would see your persistent bile hyperbole as unfair comment

FrancieBrady

Mortelaro wrote: »

Thats pure rubbish, unless you consider less than a week or so a blind eye with tight resources in the middle of a crisis when the emphasis was geared up to hospital bed and icu acquiring
As I said most not interested in the FG hate barrel unlike you would see your persistent bile hyperbole as unfair comment

You are in denial I'm afraid as this article and the comments show, there is a case to answer here.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/we-have-failed-our-older-and-more-vulnerable-citizens-1.4237079

Edgware

There are several nursing homes where there have been no Covid 19 infections or deaths.
I know personally of two quite big ones who shut off all visiting three weeks before the government ordered it. This was a local management decision. Obviously excellent medical management in place. These places have regularly done this at times of the vomiting bug and flu epidemic. There will be a Tribunal of Enquiry yet in to the handling of this pandemic by Government and H.S.E.

McMurphy

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You are in denial I'm afraid as this article and the comments show, there is a case to answer here.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/we-have-failed-our-older-and-more-vulnerable-citizens-1.4237079

Heard Ciara Kelly this afternoon on Newstalk saying she was saying that nursing homes should have been closed to the public for weeks while Tony Holohan was publicly telling her the opposite.

When the dust settles on this there's going to be an awful lot of angry families out there over this.

Mortelaro

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You are in denial I'm afraid as this article and the comments show, there is a case to answer here.

https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/we-have-failed-our-older-and-more-vulnerable-citizens-1.4237079

Not at all
Its an invited opinion piece inviting commentary's from people with either the usual political axes to grind or unrealistic expectations
I always find it peculiar, the expectation that little old Ireland can escape the fate of other much larger better resourced due to scale, economies
Its a vacuous expectation

FrancieBrady

Mortelaro wrote: »

Not at all
Its an invited opinion piece inviting commentary's from people with either the usual political axes to grind or unrealistic expectations
I always find it peculiar, the expectation that little old Ireland can escape the fate of other much larger better resourced due to scale, economies
Its a vacuous expectation

It all seems to be there. What should have been done but wasn't. And there was no need to point at themuns.

Mortelaro

Edgware wrote: »

There are several nursing homes where there have been no Covid 19 infections or deaths.
I know personally of two quite big ones who shut off all visiting three weeks before the government ordered it. This was a local management decision. Obviously excellent medical management in place. These places have regularly done this at times of the vomiting bug and flu epidemic. There will be a Tribunal of Enquiry yet in to the handling of this pandemic by Government and H.S.E.

Aye, one local to me, Middleton house was on virgin media news last night, no covid 19 there, a better run nursing home you could not find, its where my own Gran died peacefully at a very old age in her sleep
I'd welcome an inquiry when the dust settles because like the prime time investigations, there's a lot of less well managed nursing homes out there who hadn't a hope in the scramble that was this crisis suddenly dropped upon us all
Hard to get every response right in such a short space, doubtless if thin emphasis was diverted from ICU at the start to more nursing home emphasis, we would have had hospital problems to lament instead or most likely both

Snow Garden

Edgware wrote: »

There are several nursing homes where there have been no Covid 19 infections or deaths.
I know personally of two quite big ones who shut off all visiting three weeks before the government ordered it. This was a local management decision. Obviously excellent medical management in place. These places have regularly done this at times of the vomiting bug and flu epidemic. There will be a Tribunal of Enquiry yet in to the handling of this pandemic by Government and H.S.E.

Most nursing homes closed to visitors before the government ordered it. In fact the government or the HSE ordered them to stay open to visitors at the start. I too think there should be an inquiry. They were the obvious weak spot and the government abandoned them until it was too late.

Snow Garden

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1237447726331281408

Snow Garden

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/covid-19-fewer-than-150-carers-redeployed-to-nursing-homes-1.4251680

Covid-19: Fewer than 150 carers redeployed to nursing homes.

Home carers association ‘frustrated’ with lack of progress on testing and PPE supply.

satguy

Bowie wrote: »

Thankfully Larry Goodman and Denis O'Brien are in the private nursing sector so the cost is no issue.
I do not believe the fiscally conservative party should be talking like money is something to think about later. Crisis is when FG make their money. From water metering sweet deal, the quango with jobs for 'our own' in the wake of a financial meltdown and inviting in and throwing money at vulture funds during the housing crisis, throwing money at pals for private beds at four times the rate the UK is paying is really par for the course with FG.

Once again we see how FG can turn a crisis, into a way to make Dinny richer.

They handed him a phone licence to get him started.
They made SiteServ free of debt, so he could put in water meters and lay fiber optic cable.. (to make our lives better)
They let him sell on his phone licence for nearly €400 million profit, and let him off paying tax on that €400 million.
They paid him 3 or 4 time the going rate for hospital beds.
They asked the moriarty tribunal to look at some of this stuff, but refused to give it the power to prosecute. (a toothless sham that cost €30 million)

It's a big joke.. (but the joke is on us, and our children)

James Brown

satguy wrote: »

Once again we see how FG can turn a crisis, into a way to make Dinny richer.

They handed him a phone licence to get him started.
They made SiteServ free of debt, so he could put in water meters and lay fiber optic cable.. (to make our lives better)
They let him sell on his phone licence for nearly €400 million profit, and let him off paying tax on that €400 million.
They paid him 3 or 4 time the going rate for hospital beds.
They asked the moriarty tribunal to look at some of this stuff, but refused to give it the power to prosecute. (a toothless sham that cost €30 million)

It's a big joke.. (but the joke is on us, and our children)

I've no issues with any private business man. It's as regards the tax payer and value for money. I couldn't care less if it was the same players and we were getting value for the tax payer. However it's just not believable that on the entire planet only one man is listed for such varied things, even when we've not sold him the company yet, (at a loss to the taxpayer) to award the contract to.
Not expecting Ireland to escape the faith of other countries but not paying four times more than the UK isn't an unrealistic ask surely?

Mortelaro

Bowie wrote: »

I've no issues with any private business man. It's as regards the tax payer and value for money. I couldn't care less if it was the same players and we were getting value for the tax payer. However it's just not believable that on the entire planet only one man is listed for such varied things, even when we've not sold him the company yet, (at a loss to the taxpayer) to award the contract to.
Not expecting Ireland to escape the faith of other countries but not paying four times more than the UK isn't an unrealistic ask surely?

I've no issues with you having a problem with Dinny,that's your prerogative
However the Irish private hospital system is thriving
The UK private hospital system was in need of a bail out
The two cannot be compared in terms of agreements reached

Private hospitals owners and shareholders, their lenders and landlords stand to benefit from the deal more than the NHS, according to Vivek Kotecha, a researcher at the Centre for Health and the Public Interest, an independent thinktank. He said the deal was “in effect a bailout”

Shares in Spire Healthcare Group, which is listed on the London Stock Exchange, surged after the deal was announced in March. It acknowledged that the deal would provide it “sufficient liquidity and financial stability” to weather the outbreak, leaving it in a “strong position” to bounce back when it can restart non-NHS treatments.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/28/executive-pay-capped-at-private-hospitals-during-nhs-coronavirus-takeover

James Brown

Mortelaro wrote: »

I've no issues with you having a problem with Dinny,that's your prerogative
However the Irish private hospital system is thriving
The UK private hospital system was in need of a bail out
The two cannot be compared in terms of agreements reached





https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/apr/28/executive-pay-capped-at-private-hospitals-during-nhs-coronavirus-takeover

So you didn't read the opening line to my comment, understand my comment or you ignored it.

I've no issues with any private business man. It's as regards the tax payer and value for money. I couldn't care less if it was the same players and we were getting value for the tax payer.

That does not explain why we are using Goodman and O'Brien and paying what we are paying.

Later you'll be citing blind hatred and bias with no reasoning. I've explained the reasoning for my distrust in FG on this.