FG to just do nothing for the next 5 years.

James Brown

Mortelaro wrote: »

Basket case private hospitals in the UK looked on the NHS deal as a bail out
Private hospitals in Ireland are profitable with nearly half the country having private health insurance versus the UK's 10 %

No point comparing the cost of hiring the two

May have played a role, but not a 'nothing to see here' as far as any of us know.

Podge_irl

Bowie wrote: »

This is what I've seen:

And from the same article:

“First, payment will be on a cost only open-book model whereby the hospitals will be reimbursed only for the operating costs properly incurred during the period. The costs that will be covered will be limited to normal costs of operating the hospital.

“Under the heads of terms, private hospitals are funded to 80% of their estimated monthly costs in advance by the HSE.

As the Deputy says, €90.2 million was advanced to the hospitals for April.

“We will independently verify that and claw back if we find any issues as we audit it. This will continue to be examined by a committee of public accounts in due course and will be subject to the normal scrutiny by the Comptroller and Auditor General, and I lay an agreement before this House.

Unless you think he is just brazenly lying about the arrangement.

The cost per used bed is going to be high because the hospitals were deliberately left with spare capacity.

Podge_irl

Bowie wrote: »

I think we can find numerous examples though. Varadkar on 'It's worse elsewhere' regarding the homeless situation, Mr. Ralph and his seemingly being okay with the elderly being left to die off and the political use of killings and the victims families to try score points in schoolyard level back and forths to dodge criticism of policy.
As a whole, overseeing year on year worsening societal crises would give that uncaring impression. Then we've the hypocrisy of the 'stability' years which look like repeating...should they decide it's more beneficial than risking another election. They are certainly not in it for the people and we are not 'all in this together' either.

It is worse elsewhere and its pretty natural to want to defend yourself, particularly when your opponents are making out like it is an unprecedented and uniquely Irish crisis. However, that is commentary not policy.

They are clearly trying to fix the societal problems - look at Slaintecare for health as an example - they simply differ on the best way to do it. If they were "uncaring" they could find plenty of ways to trim the social welfare budget. Interventions into the housing market don't exactly have a fantastic track record and ultimately increasing supply is the only long term solution. People are welcome to disagree with their policy goals but it is quite clearly not an easy problem to fix.

Jinglejangle69

Bowie wrote: »

Exhibit A.
Because dem others.....
Doesn't show my comments as unjustified. These things don't cancel each other out.
To be 'hypocrisy' I'd need be making a denial of any equivalence as regards another party(s).

Over to the SF thread so to show your displeasure with them using deaths for political scoring.

satguy

I see notorious drug dealer Larry Dunne died today.

What have Larry Dunne and Alan Dukes got in common.

... Both shouted them same thing as they were being frog marched out of the limelight.

.. "if you think I'm bad, wait till you see what's coming behind me"


I'll get me coat..

James Brown

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Over to the SF thread so to show your displeasure with them using deaths for political scoring.

Yeah, you're still just deflecting though. Your view of SF has no bearing on my view of FG does it?
When SF are in government and their policies are causing misery and they show themselves, IMO, to be as uncaring they will receive same from me.

Furthermore if, when questioned by FG about said policies they respond with tales from Flanagan's antisemetic father Oliver J. or inferring FG has associations with Pegida, I will call them out in a similar fashion.

Redgirl82

Bowie wrote: »

Yeah, you're still just deflecting though. Your view of SF has no bearing on my view of FG does it?
When SF are in government and their policies are causing misery and they show themselves, IMO, to be as uncaring they will receive same from me.

Furthermore if, when questioned by FG about said policies they respond with tales from Flanagan's antisemetic father Oliver J. or inferring FG has associations with Pegida, I will call them out in a similar fashion.

SF are in government and their policies are causing misery. Just look at the North

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

SF are in government and their policies are causing misery. Just look at the North

They are not deserted by the electorate. They are re-elected again and again.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

They are not deserted by the electorate. They are re-elected again and again.

Bit like the Scottish Premiership.....only two in the game, dude.

Nobody else.

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Bit like the Scottish Premiership.....only two in the game, dude.

Nobody else.

5 parties Brendan, plenty of choice if you are 'miserable'. Yet, again and again and again SF get back.

christy c

FrancieBrady wrote: »

5 parties Brendan, plenty of choice if you are 'miserable'. Yet, again and again and again SF get back.

As did FF and FG for years, yet you use that as a stick to beat them.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

5 parties Brendan, plenty of choice if you are 'miserable'. Yet, again and again and again SF get back.

As I said Francie, only two mean anything.

Let me know when St Mirren or Dundee Utd last made a run.

Top lad.;)

McMurphy

christy c wrote: »

As did FF and FG for years, yet you use that as a stick to beat them.

Forward to 2020 and they don't have enough seats combined.


🎶🎵The times they are a changing🎵🎶.

FrancieBrady

christy c wrote: »

As did FF and FG for years, yet you use that as a stick to beat them.

So when SF's vote drops as the voteshare of FF and FG have (from a high of 84% of the electorate to 44%) perhaps then parallels, like the one Redgirl tried desperately to draw, can be drawn.

christy c

McMurphy wrote: »

Forward to 2020 and they don't have enough seats combined.


🎶🎵The times they are a changing🎵🎶.

They certainly have, but you seemed to miss my point.

christy c

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So when SF's vote drops as the voteshare of FF and FG have (from a high of 84% of the electorate to 44%) perhaps then parallels, like the one Redgirl tried desperately to draw, can be drawn.

If you are going to use the electorate as a yardstick of how well a political party is doing, you dont get to completely dismiss the electorate here choosing FF and FG for years.

Topgear on Dave

McMurphy wrote: »

🎶🎵The times they are a changing🎵🎶.

It's not changing that much, the rest are still waiting for them to form the government. :pac::pac::pac:

McMurphy

christy c wrote: »

They certainly have, but you seemed to miss my point.

Na Christy, i got your point alright, but just felt the urge to bring everyone back down to reality, the two party state is gone, most likely forever,.the Rubicon has been crossed.

That's a good thing by the way.

McMurphy

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

It's not changing that much, the rest are still waiting for them to form the government. :pac::pac::pac:

They'll be waiting a while I reckon.

I don't believe there's going to be a coalition with the greens, it's all for show but that's just my belief.

Redgirl82

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So when SF's vote drops as the voteshare of FF and FG have (from a high of 84% of the electorate to 44%) perhaps then parallels, like the one Redgirl tried desperately to draw, can be drawn.

Ahh Francie I simply stated a fact, Sinn Fein are in government and making a complete mess of it. Trying to deny it just says it all.

5, 4, 3, 3, 1 I have 20 quid on the DUP been blamed but 50 on UK

christy c

McMurphy wrote: »

Na Christy, i got your point alright, but just felt the urge to bring everyone back down to reality, the two party state is gone, most likely forever,.the Rubicon has been crossed.

That's a good thing by the way.

Right, but totally separate from what I was saying.

FrancieBrady

christy c wrote: »

If you are going to use the electorate as a yardstick of how well a political party is doing, you dont get to completely dismiss the electorate here choosing FF and FG for years.

Who did that Christy?

The comparison was made to SF in the north...and it doesn't wash...was the point.

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

Ahh Francie I simply stated a fact, Sinn Fein are in government and making a complete mess of it. Trying to deny it just says it all.

5, 4, 3, 3, 1 I have 20 quid on the DUP been blamed but 50 on UK

Here is what you actually said:

SF are in government and their policies are causing misery. Just look at the North

and my answer to you was, but the electorate vote them back again and again. Not so FG, their share of the vote fell to an all time low as did the combined vote share fof FF/FG. Some would call a fall from 84% voteshare to today's 44% spectacular.

Redgirl82

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Who did that Christy?

The comparison was made to SF in the north...and it doesn't wash...was the point.

What doesn’t wash? I asked you what good Sinn Fein has done up North

The best you came up with was parade commissioner and the police. So not sure your pointing finger at other parties.

James Brown

Redgirl82 wrote: »

Ahh Francie I simply stated a fact, Sinn Fein are in government and making a complete mess of it. Trying to deny it just says it all.

5, 4, 3, 3, 1 I have 20 quid on the DUP been blamed but 50 on UK

When this was explained to you elsewhere you changed tack.
My comment on how FG seem uncaring and the examples I cited have nothing to do with anyone except FG.
On your off thread misdirection, SF are not solely in charge up the north. However, feel free to genuinely criticise them for their policies, enacted or not, at least that would be legitimate, if in the wrong thread.
Again SF's/SD's/Greens's/Labour's flaws do not cancel out FG's.

Redgirl82

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Here is what you actually said:



and my answer to you was, but the electorate vote them back again and again. Not so FG, their share of the vote fell to an all time low as did the combined vote share fof FF/FG. Some would call a fall from 84% voteshare to today's 44% spectacular.

I responded to the post by Bowie who said SF are not in government, they are and they are clearly causing misery. Also deaths with covid as they can’t act like adults and discuss with the DUP.

Redgirl82

Bowie wrote: »

When this was explained to you elsewhere you changed tack.
My comment on how FG seem uncaring and the examples I cited have nothing to do with anyone except FG.
On your off thread misdirection, SF are not in charge up the north. However, feel free to genuinely criticise them for their policies, enacted or not, at least that would be legitimate, if in the wrong thread.
Again SF's/SD's/Greens's/Labour's flaws do not cancel out FG's.

They have no policies up the North? That’s the point. Maybe you missed that bit.

I didn’t bring Sinn Fein into the FG thread, you did.

christy c

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Who did that Christy?

The comparison was made to SF in the north...and it doesn't wash...was the point.

You talked about SF getting elected again and again, please dont pretend that this wasn't meant as a positive for SF.

FrancieBrady

christy c wrote: »

You talked about SF getting elected again and again, please dont pretend that this wasn't meant as a positive for SF.

Is getting re-elected again and again not the benchmark for the success of a political party?

christy c

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Is getting re-elected again and again not the benchmark for the success of a political party?

Well back to my original point, that was what FF and FG did for years. Yet you use that as a stick to beat them.