FG to just do nothing for the next 5 years.

Redgirl82

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

So you want them to not get paid for represtenting the people who voted for them?

You must be outraged at the pay rise our TDs got recently even though the country is on its knees financially?


A pay rise which Sinn Fein refused.

How can they represent the people when they won't attend the government?

So if they don't want to go to Westminster why do they deserve a paycheque?

The 3 years the government was stopped because of the childish arguments, did Sinn Fein politician stopped getting paid?

James Brown

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So you don’t understand what a vulture fund, then don’t talk about it

Fair enough. A number of times I've tried to discuss my views on how FG use vulture funds in relation to the housing crisis based on your initial attempt at seemingly genuinely discussing your views on rent arrears etc.
I'll leave you to your childish game play.

Redgirl82

Bowie wrote: »

Fair enough. A number of times I've tried to discuss my views on how FG use vulture funds in relation to the housing crisis based on your initial attempt at seemingly genuinely discussing your views on rent arrears etc.
I'll leave you to your childish game play.

So it’s my fault you don’t understand what a vulture fund is? How exactly are we supposed to have a genuine conversation?

Last time I tried to discuss a subject the poster had no idea about I was warned for being condescending.

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

How can they represent the people when they won't attend the government?

So if they don't want to go to Westminster why do they deserve a paycheque?

The 3 years the government was stopped because of the childish arguments, did Sinn Fein politician stopped getting paid?

Far as I know, they do all the representative duties a public rep does for constituents, but they will not take part in running jurisdictions other than their own which they would be required to do if they sit in parliament.

Bishop of hope

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Tbh any irish politian,that stands in the dail to defend the person that caused famine here,is completly toxic to me anyway


They'd do same again,if given the chance,we are their equals,noone should be defending them

Who is?
And the famine?

efanton

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So it’s my fault you don’t understand what a vulture fund is? How exactly are we supposed to have a genuine conversation?

Last time I tried to discuss a subject the poster had no idea about I was warned for being condescending.

Go on enlighten us. What is your definition of a 'vulture fund' being that your definitions tend to be totally different to everyone else?

Redgirl82

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Far as I know, they do all the representative duties a public rep does for constituents, but they will not take part in running jurisdictions other than their own which they would be required to do if they sit in parliament.

So when they closed down government for 3 years did they still get paid?

dundalkfc10

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

No point, she dosn't have a clue about how it works up North.

The ignoring of what i hoped was a relatively informative post,is telling tbh


Like,why ask questions,if he/she going to.ignore the answers,

Redgirl82

efanton wrote: »

Go on enlighten us. What is your definition of a 'vulture fund' being that your definitions tend to be totally different to everyone else?

Read the thread

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So when they closed down government for 3 years did they still get paid?

Arlene Foster would have none of it:

Arlene Foster said that her colleagues would be working over the summer to find a resolution to the issues preventing a deal.

When asked if MLAs pay should be halted, she said: "That would be a relevant question if we weren't doing any work.

"I have indicated very clearly that we intend to continue the negotiations, the coming together, the talks over the summer months."

efanton

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So when they closed down government for 3 years did they still get paid?

Government was not shutdown. AS far as I am aware the houses of parliament in Westminster were fully operational, although Boris did his best to shut it down to prevent his brexit strategy being interfered with. The UK Government resides in Westminster. Northern Ireland does not have a government.

The Northern Ireland assembly however did cease to work. But do you think it reasonable that Arlene Foster should have been in control of an enquiry dealing with her own handling of the 'cash for ash' debacle, an enquiry that later found her to be responsible for that whole sorry mess. In the end the UK government had to step in and they found that Arlene Foster and the DUP were wrong.

efanton

Redgirl82 wrote: »

Read the thread

I have read the thread, but you seem to have a definition that is different to everyone else.

So just so that I understand what you are saying when yo post I would like you to give me your definition of 'vulture fund'

Redgirl82

efanton wrote: »

I have read the thread, but you seem to have a definition that is different to everyone else.

So just so that I understand what you are saying when yo post I would like you to give me your definition of 'vulture fund'

So you read the thread but still your asking me what my definition of a vulture fund is?

Redgirl82

efanton wrote: »

Government was not shutdown. AS far as I am aware the houses of parliament in Westminster were fully operational, although Boris did his best to shut it down to prevent his brexit strategy being interfered with. The UK Government resides in Westminster. Northern Ireland does not have a government.

The Northern Ireland assembly however did cease to work. But do you think it reasonable that Arlene Foster should have been in control of an enquiry dealing with her own handling of the 'cash for ash' debacle, an enquiry that later found her to be responsible for that whole sorry mess. In the end the UK government had to step in and they found that Arlene Foster and the DUP were wrong.

I didn’t ask about Arlene Foster. I asked if Sinn Fein got paid?

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

I didn’t ask about Arlene Foster. I asked if Sinn Fein got paid?

You think that they'd pay the DUP and nobody else? Them days are gone.

Of course SF got paid as well.

Redgirl82

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think that they'd pay the DUP and nobody else? Them days are gone.

Of course SF got paid as well.

I didn’t ask anything about the DUP. No idea why your talking about DUP

Bit odd to complain about politicians in Ireland getting a pay raise while doing their job and Sinn Fein got paid for doing nothing for 3 years.

FrancieBrady

Redgirl82 wrote: »

I didn’t ask anything about the DUP. No idea why your talking about DUP

Bit odd to complain about politicians in Ireland getting a pay raise while doing their job and Sinn Fein got paid for doing nothing for 3 years.

Where did I complain about politicians getting payrises?

efanton

Redgirl82 wrote: »

I didn’t ask about Arlene Foster. I asked if Sinn Fein got paid?

You asked

So when they closed down government for 3 years did they still get paid?

There is no government in northern Ireland.

What is exactly your point?

MLA's from all 5 parties in northern Ireland that are in the assembly got paid?
So why not ask why did the DUP MLA's get paid?


The northern Ireland assembly got shut down because Arlene Foster refused to allow a fair and impartial enquiry. Every party in the Northern Ireland executive supported the position that Arlene Foster should step aside to allow that enquiry to take place. An enquiry that eventually was carried out by the British government who found that Arlene Foster was responsible for the Cash for Ash debacle.

So what's your point? That SF were at fault when plainly they were not, even the British government eventually agreed with the SF view point.

All the parties in Northern ireland were in favour of an impartial enquiry except the DUP. The UUP, SDLP, Alliance Party and SF all agreed that Arlene Foster should step aside with regards the enquiry but Arlene Foster and the DUP refused and basically held the whole assembly to ransom until the British government stepped in.

So the issue was not that SF stopped the assembly it was solely the intransigence of the DUP. Likewise with the Irish Language act, an act supported by all other parties, the British government, the Irish government, but guess who refused to let it go ahead, yes the DUP yet again,

So if you want to point fingers please point them in the right direction.
Unless of course you also disagree with the current Irish government as well

James Brown

efanton wrote: »

You asked



There is no government in northern Ireland.

What is exactly your point?

MLA's from all 5 parties in northern Ireland that are in the assembly got paid?
So why not ask why did the DUP LA's get paid?


The northern Ireland assembly got shut down because Arlene Foster refused to allow a fair and impartial enquiry. Every party in the Northern Ireland executive supported the position that Arlene Foster should step aside to allow that enquiry to take place. An enquiry that eventually was carried out by the British government who found that Arlene Foster was responsible for the Cash for Ash debacle.

So whats you point? That SF were at fault when plainly they were not, even the British government eventually agreed with the SF view point.

All the parties in Northern ireland were in favour of an impartial enquiry except the DUP. The UUP, SDLP, Alliance Party and SF all agreed that Arlene Foster should step aside with regards the enquiry but Arlene Foster and the DUP refused and basically held the whole assembly to ransom until the British government stepped in.

So the issue was not that SF stopped the assembly it was solely the intransigence of the DUP. Likewise with the Irish Language act, an act supported by all other parties parties, the British government, the Irish government, but guess who refused to let it go ahead, yes the DUP yet again,

So if you want to point fingers please point them in the right direction.
Unless of course you also disagree with the current government as well

You'll most likely get, "What's a government?".

McMurphy

Redgirl82 wrote: »

I didn’t ask about Arlene Foster. I asked if Sinn Fein got paid?

You didn't actually. See here.

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So when they closed down government for 3 years did they still get paid?

The DUP was also part of that government, hence why you got the answer you received. Why would one party get paid but not the other?

Also Sinn Fein don't take their seats in Westminster, not the same thing as:

yourself wrote:

How can they represent the people when they won't attend the government?

They can be in joint partners in the assembly without having to physically attend Westminster, I'd be surprised if you weren't already aware of that tbh.

Beasty

Redgirl82 wrote: »

So it’s my fault you don’t understand what a vulture fund is? How exactly are we supposed to have a genuine conversation?

Last time I tried to discuss a subject the poster had no idea about I was warned for being condescending.

Threadbanned

https://tribunemag.co.uk/2020/05/irelands-right-wing-congeals


Apolgies,if this is wrong place,and i know this is from.the tribute,so mildly prejudiced


But this is a good outside,reading of where irish politics stands at present

Bishop of hope

[Deleted User] wrote: »

https://tribunemag.co.uk/2020/05/irelands-right-wing-congeals


Apolgies,if this is wrong place,and i know this is from.the tribute,so mildly prejudiced


But this is a good outside,reading of where irish politics stands at present

Good piece actually. Tnx for putting it up.
Asks the, questions, I would ask myself, is it time for a change and if it is are SF really that change?

James Brown

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Good piece actually. Tnx for putting it up.
Asks the, questions, I would ask myself, is it time for a change and if it is are SF really that change?

I think that's were FG are making one of many mistakes. It's not really about SF. I think SF were best placed to take the votes of the disgruntled floating voters. The change is instead of drifting back and forth from FF to FG they are looking elsewhere. That's the change. If the SD's had their ducks in a row and Labour grew a personality, (and later dodged Alan Kelly) it could be votes for them too next time around.

Bishop of hope

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Good piece actually. Tnx for putting it up.
Asks the, questions, I would ask myself, is it time for a change and if it is are SF really that change?

It broadly lines up with my view (so.im glad to see someone else like it,ans not just positive confirmation effect!)

Its most certainly time for change,wheter its good or bad at least shinnerz want to do something different



A basic look at how society has panned out in uk and us,puts me off neo-lib/thatcerism policies which fg under varadkar wish to persue (strongly suspect martin will be lead by person of stronger character that is varadkar),and for good or bad,SF are best placed to oppose them

efanton

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Good piece actually. Tnx for putting it up.
Asks the, questions, I would ask myself, is it time for a change and if it is are SF really that change?

Dont know to be perfectly honest, would like to think that SF will deliver.

I see it this way, They know they will only ever get one chance to prove themselves once they actually form a government. With that on their mind they are likely to deliver or try their very best. Not to do so will mean going back to the political margins of Irish politics

One thing is certain, we cant go on as a country the way we have. A country is not only an economy, and if your only measure of success is GDP or GNP, the you are doing something horribly wrong.

What I simply cant understand is why FG are hell bent on their neo-liberal thatcherite policies that have been shown to be a disaster in those countries that vigorously adopted that stance. I lived and worked in the UK. it was a great country to work in until Thatcher destroyed it. Margaret Thatcher absolutely decimated that country and look at the state it is in now. Politicians there cant even agree with other politicians in their own party. Now we have a Taoiseach who idolises Margaret Thatcher and Winston Churchill, ignoring the sorry fate that both ended up in.

Just look at the UK, first it was sell all the council houses, then allow property developers and landlords to go rampant, then cut spending on services especially the health service, then see the basic standard of living for most people in the country drop through the floor until many have to have two jobs just to get by, and many finding they have a better standard of living on social welfare that actually working for a living. What did they expect, if ordinary people with no professional qualification or trade cant survive on minimum wage its obvious they will refuse to work for a pittance that barely pays their rent and groceries.
That sounds all too familiar doesn't it. Ireland is currently just a decade or two behind the demise of the UK. But Leo and his cohort will plough on regardless just like Thatcher, and never have learnt a thing from the mistake of others.

I think FG have cooked there goose a little too much, and they will wither away just like the labour party. FF might survive if they get rid of those at the top and all those who oversaw the financial collapse of this country and swing back to the centre or left again but somehow I think they too are too blind to see what is happening as well and will never regain their strength.

I hope SF do get a chance to form a government. What this country needs now more than ever is a left of centre government or a realignment of what is considered nationally important for a government. If they do a good job, then they will continue to grow, if they fail then they will have only themselves to blame. But the one thing you have to admire about SF is that they are tenacious, they strive and thrive on achieving their goals. If they bring that tenacity to a government then there might be hope for this country yet. I am willing to give them my support and that chance.

Jinglejangle69

efanton wrote: »

Dont know to be perfectly honest, would like to think that SF will deliver.

I see it this way, They know they will only ever get one chance to prove themselves once they actually form a government. With that on their mind they are likely to deliver or try their very best. Not to do so will mean going back to the political margins of Irish politics

One thing is certain, we cant go on as a country the way we have. A country is not only an economy, and if your only measure of success is GDP or GNP, the you are doing something horribly wrong.

What I simply cant understand is why FG are hell bent on their neo-liberal thatcherite policies that have been shown to be a disaster in those countries that vigorously adopted that stance. I lived and worked in the UK. it was a great country to work in until Thatcher destroyed it. Margaret Thatcher absolutely decimated that country and look at the state it is in now. Politicians there cant even agree with other politicians in their own party. Now we have a Taoiseach who idolises Margaret Thatcher and Winston Churchill, ignoring the sorry fate that both ended up in.

Just look at the UK, first it was sell all the council houses, then allow property developers and landlords to go rampant, then cut spending on services especially the health service, then see the basic standard of living for most people in the country drop through the floor until many have to have two jobs just to get by, and many finding they have a better standard of living on social welfare that actually working for a living. What did they expect, if ordinary people with no professional qualification or trade cant survive on minimum wage its obvious they will refuse to work for a pittance that barely pays their rent and groceries.
That sounds all too familiar doesn't it. Ireland is currently just a decade or two behind the demise of the UK. But Leo and his cohort will plough on regardless just like Thatcher, and never have learnt a thing from the mistake of others.

I think FG have cooked there goose a little too much, and they will wither away just like the labour party. FF might survive if they get rid of those at the top and all those who oversaw the financial collapse of this country and swing back to the centre or left again but somehow I think they too are too blind to see what is happening as well and will never regain their strength.

I hope SF do get a chance to form a government. This country needs now more than ever is a left of centre government or a realignment of what is considered nationally important for a government. If they do a good job, then they will continue to grow, if they fail then they will have only themselves to blame. But the one thing you have to admire about SF is that they are tenacious, they strive and thrive on achieving their goals. If they bring that tenacity to a government then there might be hope for this country yet. I am willing to give them my support and that chance.

Council houses were sold off since the 70s in Ireland.

FG's fault yeah?

So blaming FG for everything like you have in your post makes me think its just another rant without any facts to back it up.

BTW, many Irish people move and live in the UK every year.

This notion that its a cesspit and thatcher destroyed it is all paranoid nonsense.

Conspiracy theory tin foil hat.

Boris is a fool, but the UK isn't falling anytime soon regardless of what the anti FG brigade tell us here.

Jinglejangle69

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Council houses were sold off since the 70s in Ireland.

FG's fault yeah?

So blaming FG for everything like you have in your post make me think its just another rant without any facts to back it up.

Nearly sure,hes talking about the uk


Like,its generally accepted varadkar a fan of neo-lib.....look at the uk/us,that is where we are headed under them??


Do irish people,just not comprehend medium to long term.planning

(lads thinking housing sorted lomg term,because collaspe in tourism has seen air bnb back into rental.market,would suggest so)

Brendan Bendar

Deleted User wrote: »

https://tribunemag.co.uk/2020/05/irelands-right-wing-congeals


Apolgies,if this is wrong place,and i know this is from.the tribute,so mildly prejudiced


But this is a good outside,reading of where irish politics stands at present

A long way from mild I’m afraid, riddled with subtle and barbed ‘digs’ , exaggerations, grudging credit, below the belt hits.

Even the strap line refers to right wing.

Not a piece I would give much heed to, I’m afraid.

Jinglejangle69

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Nearly sure,hes talking about the uk


Like,its generally accepted varadkar a fan of neo-lib.....look at the uk/us,that is where we are headed under them??


Do irish people,just not comprehend medium to long term.planning

(lads thinking housing sorted lomg term,because collaspe in tourism has seen aur bnb back into rental.market,would suggest so)

Yeah but he's saying the UK sold their council houses off and now FG are too.

I'm pointing out council houses were sold off since the 70s here, is that Leo's fault even though he wasn't born?

Pure garbage.

You still neutral yeah:)