FG to just do nothing for the next 5 years.

Darc19

all about the mane wrote: »

Detailing the thread? I’m addressing a post made in the thread.
The numbers are way higher than being reported because we don’t have enough tests to test everyone. This is really simple stuff.

Plenty of tests available. 40,000 arrived last week and hundreds of thousands due.

New test centers set up nationwide.

But a HUGE number of those looking for tests are the usual hypochondriacs that fill a&e up on a daily basis.
I know of two who are waiting and they neither show any signs nor been in contact with many people.

They are also frequent visitors to their gp because it's free

McMurphy

markodaly wrote: »

That was pre-CoronaVirus, this is a new paradigm now. There will be no new government for a few months at the very earliest. The Greens showing in the Dail earlier in the week is a reminder that one does not change the crew when the ship is in danger of sinking.

Check out the date here.




Full article here

Not the time for it Leo, and I repeat this will come back to bite him on the arse.

Sultan_of_Ping

McMurphy wrote: »

Check out the date here.




Full article here

Not the time for it Leo, and I repeat this will come back to bite him on the arse.

Exactly the time for it......any of those populist, dogma driven parties (and I'd include the Greens in that) need to be kept well away from the levers of power until this is sorted. We simply can't afford their approach at this time - once some sense of normality returns we can get back to seeds on window sills, demonising the "rich" and attacking property rights.

handlemaster

McMurphy wrote: »

Seems the shinners are in a bit of a pickle no matter what they do according to some on here.

"Where are the shinners? I've heard nothing from them for weeks, only FG are in the news saying stuff. FG will same us all."

**give an example of how SF are keeping a consistent presence in the media**

"WTF are the shinners doing sticking their oars in, this is no time for them to be making trouble, blahbaty blahbaty blah"

BTW - Leo calling for a govt of unity, that specifically excludes any party in the state, never mind the most popular party, will come back and bite him in his arse when this finally blows over, now isn't the time for this kind of bullsh1t Leo, you've obviously learned the square root of fcuk all from your past mistakes of attacking them.

I dont think so. History tells us people support a a war time government. This is a war. But all parties should be chipping in not looking to score points. They should come out with their suggestions now while we are in the thick not after say we should have done this or that

McMurphy

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Exactly the time for it......any of those populist, dogma driven parties (and I'd include the Greens in that) need to be kept well away from the levers of power until this is sorted. We simply can't afford their approach at this time - once some sense of normality returns we can get back to seeds on window sills, demonising the "rich" and attacking property rights.

This pandemic doesn't favour the poor any less than it does the rich, same for landlords/tenants, what an utterly stupid statement.

In the midst of a health crisis gripping the entire world, now is not the time for Leos strops, the country's politicians need to row in behind one another, and divisive childish nonsense where the caretaker Taoiseach seeks to specifically exclude anyone else will not stand over him when this is settled, mark my words.

Shefwedfan

McMurphy wrote: »

This pandemic doesn't favour the poor any less than it does the rich, same for landlords/tenants, what an utterly stupid statement.

In the midst of a health crisis gripping the entire world, now is not the time for Leos strops, the country's politicians need to row in behind one another, and divisive childish nonsense where the caretaker Taoiseach seeks to specifically exclude anyone else will not stand over him when this is settled, mark my words.

Why would we mark you words?

smurgen

McMurphy wrote: »

This pandemic doesn't favour the poor any less than it does the rich, same for landlords/tenants, what an utterly stupid statement.

In the midst of a health crisis gripping the entire world, now is not the time for Leos strops, the country's politicians need to row in behind one another, and divisive childish nonsense where the caretaker Taoiseach seeks to specifically exclude anyone else will not stand over him when this is settled, mark my words.

Not only that but this crisis is going to give any government blank cheque book to tackle it.given fine Gaels dire handling of large scale projects e.g the NCH I'd rather a party like SF in there to keep oversight. We also need to ensure that our money is stretched effectively.

McMurphy

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Why would we mark you words?

Didn't you say you were putting me on ignore a while ago, simply because I posted links that debunked BS you were pedaling?

Feels great to be off your list again.:D

Shefwedfan

McMurphy wrote: »

Didn't you say you were putting me on ignore a while ago, simply because I posted links that debunked BS you were pedaling?

Feels great to be off your list again.:D

Sorry that must have been someone else


Anyway, why are we marking your words?

Sultan_of_Ping

McMurphy wrote: »

This pandemic doesn't favour the poor any less than it does the rich, same for landlords/tenants, what an utterly stupid statement.

In the midst of a health crisis gripping the entire world, now is not the time for Leos strops, the country's politicians need to row in behind one another, and divisive childish nonsense where the caretaker Taoiseach seeks to specifically exclude anyone else will not stand over him when this is settled, mark my words.

No, it's not that long ago SF were proposing salary caps in the public services (€100k, iirc) and even their current manifesto promises extra taxes on incomes over €140k - thus helping to drive out, or disincentivise the return of, the very professionals (experienced medical and nursing consultants, medical and nursing educators, research staff etc) we need at times like this.

Better off keeping them off the pitch.....which is where they want to be anyway, the last thing they want is to govern when it means difficult decisions have to be made.

Sultan_of_Ping

smurgen wrote: »

Not only that but this crisis is going to give any government blank cheque book to tackle it.given fine Gaels dire handling of large scale projects e.g the NCH I'd rather a party like SF in there to keep oversight. We also need to ensure that our money is stretched effectively.

Yeah, because the "Ash for Cash" scandal demonstrated their capacities in the area of scrutiny and oversight

J_1980

smurgen wrote: »

Not only that but this crisis is going to give any government blank cheque book to tackle it.given fine Gaels dire handling of large scale projects e.g the NCH I'd rather a party like SF in there to keep oversight. We also need to ensure that our money is stretched effectively.

Oh yes the public sector salary cap AND the 60% top tax rate would do wonders now for hiring doctors.
SF and the entire left are a joke, be it Corbyn Sanders etc. they’ve all been found out with their bs and lies. Thats why they never get more than 35/40%.

The only lasting thing from this crisis will be the death of the populist left. Can you imagine Tsipras/Syriza letting in all the Syrian refugees now on top of corona crisis. Total jokers, clueless, utterly useless and extremely low-IQ.

smurgen

J_1980 wrote: »

Oh yes the public sector salary cap AND the 60% top tax rate would do wonders now for hiring doctors.
SF and the entire left are a joke, be it Corbyn Sanders etc. they’ve all been found out with their bs and lies. Thats why they never get more than 35/40%.

The only lasting thing from this crisis will be the death of the populist left. Can you imagine Tsipras/Syriza letting in all the Syrian refugees now on top of corona crisis. Total jokers, clueless, utterly useless and extremely low-IQ.

Leftist policies needed to save people in this crisis buddy.try not to get too upset when they're inevitably deployed.

smurgen

J_1980 wrote: »

Oh yes the public sector salary cap AND the 60% top tax rate would do wonders now for hiring doctors.
SF and the entire left are a joke, be it Corbyn Sanders etc. they’ve all been found out with their bs and lies. Thats why they never get more than 35/40%.

The only lasting thing from this crisis will be the death of the populist left. Can you imagine Tsipras/Syriza letting in all the Syrian refugees now on top of corona crisis. Total jokers, clueless, utterly useless and extremely low-IQ.

Leftist policies needed to save people in this crisis buddy.try not to get too upset when they're inevitably deployed.

J_1980

smurgen wrote: »

Leftist policies needed to save people in this crisis buddy.try not to get too upset when they're inevitably deployed.

Yes thats fine: TEMPORARILY when people are FORCED to not work.

Lefty incompetence is showing in Spain and Italy.
They are ALL silent. How is Sanders praised Italian public option doing. Didn’t even reply to the question in last Sunday debate. Just the usual “M4A is better and cheaper” claptrap. US has 4 times the ICU beds as any european healthcare system except Germany.

Left wingers all exposed as snake oil salesmen, pure highly concentrated BS.


At least this time the left voters are paying for their follies themselves (unfortunately with their lives) instead of other people’s (German, Dutch) money.



Translate this article
https://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/suedafrika-fuerchtet-coronavirus-ausbruch-es-wird-ein-desaster-a-00000000-0002-0001-0000-000170114602

About South africa, again ANc lefty populist governed. Headline you don't need to translate. Corona will decimate this country after being run into the ground by another lefty government. They had the best healthcare in Africa in a bloody apartheid government. Lefty’s can’t even better that low level.

This virus will infect the Left, and hopefully kill it. Thats at least one death to be cheerful about.

https://www.sinnfein.ie/contents/55142
Thats (anc)their brothers/sisters in mind. Thats what happens with Sf /anc /centre left etc sanders: death and despair.

NovemberWren

the sheer brutality of Fine Gael towards the very poor, of former years, may be some lingering (part) reason of why they do not want to align with parties like SF. But in these days also, Fine Gael have deliberately not overseen council housing properly; preferring instead to pay (for votes?) and allow council employees to interminably obfuscate all enquiries.

This 'schizo' attitude of Fine Gael (and FF) to the preferment of Unions; and to the positive detriment of the poor, just may not be quite what Fine Gael started as? They have sold themselves many times now for Union votes.
They may need to re-assess, that Business probably was their main tenet?
They may now be doing this?

As, to exclude SF, who adhere so totally completely to all English corporations being brought in here; is to diminish the business of the people of Ireland?

efanton

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Exactly the time for it......any of those populist, dogma driven parties (and I'd include the Greens in that) need to be kept well away from the levers of power until this is sorted. We simply can't afford their approach at this time - once some sense of normality returns we can get back to seeds on window sills, demonising the "rich" and attacking property rights.

of the the three main parties FG got the least support.
somehow I think the majority of the electorate totally disagree with you.

Why would you be concerned about left of centre parties being involved if the aim for a national government would be to take expert opinion and put that into practice, unless of course you believe FG will refuse to implement expert advice.

I worry when parties and governments cling to power, usually bad things result.

You might not agree with those that did not vote FG, but I believe this is still a democracy. If there is to be a national government the it should include ALL parties who should proportionally make up that government according to the seats they hold.

It is not for FG to dictate what is right or wrong, nor decide who is or is not included in a national government. This i not a dictatorship even though it appears some in FG would prefer that. Dont forget FG have drastically reduced voting rights in the Dail now and they have no mandate to do so. They have every right to refuse to form a coalition with another party but a national government is not a typical coalition, it is a government of all parties.

Personally I would prefer to see a new government formed, or for FG and FF to be honest and say they cannot form a government and make preparations for a new election.

What cracks me up about the FG supporters is this claim that SF or any other party demonises the rich or attacks property rights. Especially when these same supporters obviously are not rich themselves.
Increasing taxation is exactly what FG have been good at, although they have been careful to use levies to hide the amount of additional taxation they have collected. What surprises me is with all the taxation collected FG did such a lousy job providing for the needs of the services that now most depend on in this crisis. No doubt this will become even more apparent in the ext few months.

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

What cracks me up about the FG supporters is this claim that SF or any other party demonises the rich or attacks property rights. Especially when these same supporters obviously are not rich themselves.
Increasing taxation is exactly what FG have been good at, although they have been careful to use levies to hide the amount of additional taxation they have collected. What surprises me is with all the taxation collected FG did such a lousy job providing for the needs of the services that now most depend on in this crisis. No doubt this will become even more apparent in the ext few months.

How exactly can you tell who is rich or not? I guess the comment is in regards to boards.



I have seen numerous times it mentioned on here, what exactly are SF going to do different? the whole manifesto was a joke. Unlike the majority of people who voted I read it. It was pure fantasy and every analyst prior to the election said the same.



So tell me, if FG done such a bad job what exactly makes you think SF will do a better job?



I know I would put my faith in other parties and SF never

efanton

J_1980 wrote: »

US has 4 times the ICU beds as any European healthcare system except Germany.

The US population is currently 327 million.
The population of Germany is 82 million. nearly four times smaller.

You sure you want to give examples like that. Not exactly making a point are you?

efanton

Shefwedfan wrote: »

How exactly can you tell who is rich or not? I guess the comment is in regards to boards.


I have seen numerous times it mentioned on here, what exactly are SF going to do different? the whole manifesto was a joke. Unlike the majority of people who voted I read it. It was pure fantasy and every analyst prior to the election said the same.

So tell me, if FG done such a bad job what exactly makes you think SF will do a better job?

I know I would put my faith in other parties and SF never

The point I was making is if there is to be a National government then it needs to be exactly that, a government made up of ALL parties represented in the Dail.
Personally I think it is an added complication to an already complex problem (the virus outbreak), but I could see the need for one if FF and FG cant get their act together and form a new government.



Every analyst seriously? I take it these were qualified economists and not opinion writers in the papers? Who exactly?

With regards to the rich are you claiming that it would be logical to assume that every FG support on this board would be classed as rich?
Are you going to make that assertion, or would it be more reasonably to suggest that many, probably most, are not?

J_1980

efanton wrote: »

The US population is currently 327 million.
The population of Germany is 82 million. nearly four times smaller.

You sure you want to give examples like that. Not exactly making a point are you?

4 times per capita obviously jeeeezz....clutching straws. Sanders fanboys in denial.
https://www.niskanencenter.org/is-u-s-health-care-well-equipped-for-the-coronavirus/

Private healthcare does have some advantages (a public option should always exists though).
The US also has the highest cancer survival rate. Sanders and the Dear Leader’s followers never mention this. Similarly to swedens (vs usa) lower corporate tax rate, lower wealth taxes (no property taxes) and higher billionaire density. Just pick what you like and spout bull****. Luckily Sanders has been found out. Even Sleepy Joe with a quarter of the fundraising is landsliding him....

smurgen

J_1980 wrote: »

Yes thats fine: TEMPORARILY when people are FORCED to not work.

Lefty incompetence is showing in Spain and Italy.
They are ALL silent. How is Sanders praised Italian public option doing. Didn’t even reply to the question in last Sunday debate. Just the usual “M4A is better and cheaper” claptrap. US has 4 times the ICU beds as any european healthcare system except Germany.

Left wingers all exposed as snake oil salesmen, pure highly concentrated BS.


At least this time the left voters are paying for their follies themselves (unfortunately with their lives) instead of other people’s (German, Dutch) money.



Translate this article
https://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/suedafrika-fuerchtet-coronavirus-ausbruch-es-wird-ein-desaster-a-00000000-0002-0001-0000-000170114602

About South africa, again ANc lefty populist governed. Headline you don't need to translate. Corona will decimate this country after being run into the ground by another lefty government. They had the best healthcare in Africa in a bloody apartheid government. Lefty’s can’t even better that low level.

This virus will infect the Left, and hopefully kill it. Thats at least one death to be cheerful about.

https://www.sinnfein.ie/contents/55142
Thats (anc)their brothers/sisters in mind. Thats what happens with Sf /anc /centre left etc sanders: death and despair.

U.S may have more ICU but has among the lowest ordinary hospital bed capacity in the developed world:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_hospital_beds

Also let's see how the numbers in the U.S work out before we rush to their praises. Regarding the rest of your post you sound somewhat unhinged and I'd rather not even engage this ridiculous type of discussion.

J_1980

smurgen wrote: »

U.S may have more ICU but has among the lowest ordinary hospital bed capacity in the developed world:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_hospital_beds

Also let's see how the numbers in the U.S work out before we rush to their praises.

Yes but the US system is about getting fixed and recovering at home. Healthcare is expensive. Sounds the better system to me to be honest, they have 4-6 times the ICU beds of the praised oz/nz healthcare (see link in previous post).

J_1980

smurgen wrote: »

U.S may have more ICU but has among the lowest ordinary hospital bed capacity in the developed world:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_hospital_beds

Also let's see how the numbers in the U.S work out before we rush to their praises. Regarding the rest of your post you sound somewhat unhinged and I'd rather not even engage this ridiculous type of discussion.

Eventually all governments willl get this under control. Austrian case numbers (centre right under Kurz) are very encouraging. Were one of the first with a lockdown. Ignoring the basket case italy here.
Quality of government will be tested on recovery.

Shefwedfan

efanton wrote: »

The point I was making is if there is to be a National government then it needs to be exactly that, a government made up of ALL parties represented in the Dail.
Personally I think it is an added complication to an already complex problem (the virus outbreak), but I could see the need for one if FF and FG cant get their act together and form a new government.



Every analyst seriously? I take it these were qualified economists and not opinion writers in the papers? Who exactly?

What was your opinion on the manifesto.



Some reviewers
https://www.charteredaccountants.ie/News/the-sinn-fein-manifesto
Some more details here
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/views/analysis/cianan-brennan-the-sinn-fein-manifesto-what-is-doable-what-is-not-981202.html

efanton wrote: »

With regards to the rich are you claiming that it would be logical to assume that every FG support on this board would be classed as rich?
Are you going to make that assertion, or would it be more reasonably to suggest that many, probably most, are not?

That's a guess. How exactly do you quantify rich? just so I know.

J_1980

https://www.france24.com/en/20200321-germany-to-treat-critically-ill-from-virus-hotspot-in-eastern-france

Germany now treating the French, France at capacity. 5 years of PS under Hollande have totally ruined this beautiful country. But it has just been delivered what was ordered (lefty failure), so no sympathy
This is Corbynomics, SF in action etc. been tried a hundred times, always FAILURE. Only the insane expect a different outcome next time.

Plumbthedepths

I see the nonsense posting has been taken up by another since AATM departed.
The lefty bs is getting tried.

smurgen

J_1980 wrote: »

https://www.france24.com/en/20200321-germany-to-treat-critically-ill-from-virus-hotspot-in-eastern-france

Germany now treating the French, France at capacity. 5 years of PS under Hollande have totally ruined this beautiful country. But it has just been delivered what was ordered (lefty failure), so no sympathy
This is Corbynomics, SF in action etc. been tried a hundred times, always FAILURE. Only the insane expect a different outcome next time.

As a rabid free marketer I'm sure you're totally against the idea of any businesses being bailed out right? Survival of the fittest and all that? Also did it piss you off when the markets were closed? Was that against your dogmatic beliefs?

smurgen

J_1980 wrote: »

Yes but the US system is about getting fixed and recovering at home. Healthcare is expensive. Sounds the better system to me to be honest, they have 4-6 times the ICU beds of the praised oz/nz healthcare (see link in previous post).

If it's anything like they US infant mortality rates then god bless America!almost every EU country has a lower one than the U.S.

J_1980

smurgen wrote: »

As a rabid free marketer I'm sure you're totally against the idea of any businesses being bailed out right? Survival of the fittest and all that? Also did it piss you off when the markets were closed? Was that against your dogmatic beliefs?

I am against bailouts.
But if the government shuts businesses and grounds airlines, that’s not exactly a free market either, is it?

What markets closed?