Ireland in 3 years under a left wing government.

Yurt2

Ush1 wrote: »

No rage here, I'm not calling people "saps". Fairly sure you've been posting more than me.

When we're in the realm of pretending to be a long term resident of Finland, concocting non-existant oil reserves, and talking about the price of wine trying score points we're witnessing sap behaviour of the highest order.

The level of bad faith arguements, and low quality ones at that, defies belief. It's difficult to process that people can be so bad at this and still come back for more.

Yurt2

Lawson Hallowed Pasteboard wrote: »

"The right?" Fine Gael–led governments introduced same-sex marriage, repealed the 8th amendment, took blasphemy out of the constitution, and loosened the criteria for those who are applying for a divorce — all while bringing the economy back to full employment, increasing the minimum wage, and increasing social welfare spending. How right-wing is that?

It's beyond nonsensical to refer to supporters of the outgoing government as "the right." Many of Sinn Fein's opponents are moderate centrists who don't want to see the country run by far-left ideologues chanting "Up the Ra."

Fine Gael may be some of those things that you describe, and some in SF may have leanings more to the left than others, but I've no doubt that most of the people doing the anti-SF heavy lifting in this thread are wingnuts.

gifted

Geuze wrote: »

Based on their manifesto, yes, as LPT will be abolished, and USC cut.

However, they plan 22bn of extra spending over five years, yet raise just 1.4bn in extra tax.

Am I missing something?

You may have to write a lot slower....the Shinners are slow readers....then the penny might drop with them:D

Ush1

Yurt! wrote: »

When we're in the realm of pretending to be a long term resident of Finland, concocting non-existant oil reserves, and talking about the price of wine trying score points we're witnessing sap behaviour of the highest order.

The level of bad faith arguements, and low quality ones at that, defies belief. It's difficult to process that people can be so bad at this and still come back for more.

Calling people saps really raises the bar and wins an argument.

Yurt2

Ush1 wrote: »

Calling people saps really raises the bar and wins an argument.

Neither does calling evreyone you disagree with a MarxistCommunistNazi. Yet here we are.

celt262

I voted for change.

nkl12xtw5goz70

Yurt! wrote: »

Neither does calling evreyone you disagree with a MarxistCommunistNazi. Yet here we are.

Same logic goes for calling everyone you disagree with a fascist / racist / bigot / reactionary / sexist / homophobe, etc., which the left does all the time.

Yurt2

Lawson Hallowed Pasteboard wrote: »

Same logic goes for calling everyone you disagree with a fascist / racist / bigot / reactionary / sexist / homophobe, etc., which the left does all the time.

I've done that so infrequently, and reserved it for individuals who actually are those things, that it's not worth even getting into. You can check my posting history if you're so inclined. You'll even see me criticising those on the left that do in engage in such posting.

You however, are one of the chief culprits over the last few days at charging into a thread and labeling everyone and their pet cat a dyed in the wool Marxist because they have a different spin on things. I'd suggest you up the quality of your posts but I don't know are you able for it.

Yurt2

As a general rule, for the sake of the forum over the course of the coalition forming process, it would probably be a good idea if people took a bit of a look at the language we use to describe the problems we see in the political process and society at large.

Not everyone who wants to see reform in housing provision is a dole sponger waster;

Not everyone who has a disagreement about taxation is literally Lenin / a Marxist / Enoch Powell;

Not everyone who has a different spin on immigration is a bigot;

There has been a nastiness about things since the election concluded. I have my own opinions what type of person is stoking it (and I don't refer to political orientation here), but standards have been low across the board generally I'd say.

As for having a pop at a SF TD for whooping "up the ra," I think that's fair game. I think casting a cynical eye on some of the smirking and finger jabbing of the mainstream parties is fair game also.

But the way we couch our arguments needs to be a hell of a lot better.

GreeBo

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

What are you taking about? The poster asked for an example of a leftwing government, I linked an article highlighting a left wing Portuguese government. He then proceeded to engage in whataboutery. You on the other hand your usual misrepresentation, what a surprise. Disingenuous as always.

Actually I specifically asked for successful leftwing governments. You gave me Portugal, I then showed you how much better Ireland is than Portugal. You then ran away.

UDAWINNER

gifted wrote: »

You may have to write a lot slower....the Shinners are slow readers....then the penny might drop with them:D

its a good thing that ffg are so good with numbers, oh wait:D

Plumbthedepths

GreeBo wrote: »

Actually I specifically asked for successful leftwing governments. You gave me Portugal, I then showed you how much better Ireland is than Portugal. You then ran away.

Late getting back to you I have a life outside of the internet. At a wedding yesterday great craic , phone switched off till an hour ago. It still is an example of a successful leftwing government. All you have do is look what they achieved after they got handed a mess. Just because the min wage is less than here you wish to claim it's a failure?

Fred Cryton

Anyone seen Chernobyl on HBO? Remember that scene where the nuclear scientist is demanding action from the bureaucrat, and he says "I used to work in a shoe factory, now i'm in charge".

I think that's the issue more than anything. More than a left/right divide (as all Irish parties would be considered left of centre by international standards). This issue is we will have complete incompetents, idiots, populists in charge. The people from your school who used to mitch off class. The local gurriers. They will be calling the shots.

GreeBo

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

t. All you have do is look what they achieved after they got handed a mess.

Sorry, I'm confused why are you talking about FG?

The difference between Ireland and Portugal is a lot more than minimum wage, as I demonstrated with facts.
You seem to be planning on running a country with rhetoric alone.
Why can't anyone pro SF answer the basic questions about the SF manifesto or economic policies?

Yurt2

Fred Cryton wrote: »

Anyone seen Chernobyl on HBO? Remember that scene where the nuclear scientist is demanding action from the bureaucrat, and he says "I used to work in a shoe factory, now i'm in charge".

I think that's the issue more than anything. More than a left/right divide (as all Irish parties would be considered left of centre by international standards). This issue is we will have complete incompetents, idiots, populists in charge. The people from your school who used to mitch off class. The local gurriers. They will be calling the shots.

Simon Coveney got kicked out of his private school and was a university dropout. Gurrier, or the beneficiary of being well-born? Or perhaps both.

Plumbthedepths

GreeBo wrote: »

Sorry, I'm confused why are you talking about FG?

The difference between Ireland and Portugal is a lot more than minimum wage, as I demonstrated with facts.
You seem to be planning on running a country with rhetoric alone.
Why can't anyone pro SF answer the basic questions about the SF manifesto or economic policies?

You know lad I have no idea what your game is so carry on what you're at but I won't indulge your behaviour any further.

GreeBo

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

You know lad I have no idea what your game is so carry on what you're at but I won't indulge your behaviour any further.

Finally you say something that I can believe and get behind.
"You have no idea"

Plumbthedepths

GreeBo wrote: »

Finally you say something that I can believe and get behind.
"You have no idea what my game is"

There fixed your post for you. Anyhoo you carry on lad I'm sure you'll get the 'thanks' from others you crave. I'm done with you.

Fred Cryton

Yurt! wrote: »

Simon Coveney got kicked out of his private school and was a university dropout. Gurrier, or the beneficiary of being well-born? Or perhaps both.

I don't think you'd be afraid of Simon Coveney if you saw him in a dark alley to be fair. That's not the type of gurrier i was talking about.

Plumbthedepths

Fred Cryton wrote: »

I don't think you'd be afraid of Simon Coveney if you saw him in a dark alley to be fair. That's not the type of gurrier i was talking about.

Gurriers in government for the last 13 years did more damage to people's lives than some scrote in an alley.

Bill 2.0

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Gurriers in government for the last 13 years did more damage to people's lives than some scrote in an alley.

Nope.


We now have one of the highest standards of living in the world despite a record breaking recession. Stop acting like we are all in sackcloth and ashes.

Plumbthedepths

Bill 2.0 wrote: »

Nope.


We now have one of the highest standards of living in the world despite a record breaking recession. Stop acting like we are all in sackcloth and ashes.

I lost friends to sucide during the recession, the recession wasn't caused by a gurrier in an alley, it was caused by gurriers wearing suits in banking and politics.
We are on the cusp of seeing a clown who was part of the government that brought the Troika to these shores become Taoiseach with the support of FG.

Yellow_Fern

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I lost friends to sucide during the recession, the recession wasn't caused by a gurrier in an alley, it was caused by gurriers wearing suits in banking and politics.
We are on the cusp of seeing a clown who was part of the government that brought the Troika to these shores become Taoiseach with the support of FG.

That is very misleading. Suicide isnt a rational choice. It is not a product of hardship. It is a mental illness and can happen to the richest or the poorest alike.

Hamsterchops

Question; If Sinn Fein formed a left wing government would the Easter parade on O'Connell St still take place on Easter Sunday :cool:

Traditionally Sinn Fein have held theirs (Easter Monday) the day after the official march, but as a Government party night they have to drop the Monday in favour of the official event?

Plumbthedepths

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

That is very misleading. Suicide isnt a rational choice. It is not a product of hardship. It is a mental illness and can happen to the richest or the poorest alike.

I think this will answer better for what I said.


https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/suicide-rate-rose-15-during-height-of-recession-1.2800500

Edgware

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Gurriers in government for the last 13 years did more damage to people's lives than some scrote in an alley.

A lot of us who were interested in doing a bit of work did allright but of course (and thankfully) the welfare scum were left behind

mynamejeff

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Question; If Sinn Fein formed a left wing government would the Easter parade on O'Connell St still take place on Easter Sunday :cool:

Traditionally Sinn Fein have held theirs (Easter Monday) the day after the official march, but as a Government party night they have to drop the Monday in favour of the official event?

don't worry they used to be good about ringing in warnings

you ll have plenty of notice

woohoo!!!

Edgware wrote: »

A lot of us who were interested in doing a bit of work did allright but of course (and thankfully) the welfare scum were left behind

That's nothing more than a troll comment

Plumbthedepths

Edgware wrote: »

A lot of us who were interested in doing a bit of work did allright but of course (and thankfully) the welfare scum were left behind

When I see someone describe fellow human beings as 'scum' I give their BS the respect it deserves. ...none.

RandomViewer

Bill 2.0 wrote: »

Nope.


We now have one of the highest standards of living in the world despite a record breaking recession. Stop acting like we are all in sackcloth and ashes.

It's not done fairly,corruption is everywhere, FG are blatantly corrupt (children's hospital,Irish water, broadband, ESB smart meter project) if the Coronavirus hits with any force our health system will collapse in days,