So according to the Sindo,its an FF-FG-Green-Grand coalition then ?

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Just pointing out your mis analysis. Before the election you were telling anyone who would listen how FF and SF would coalesce because Michael Martin couldn’t be trusted. Now that he is sticking to his word you are saying he would have not stuck to his word if, this, that or the other.

I am the first to admit I got the Sinn Fein seat count wrong. Completely wrong. I predicted they would get 30 seats. It would be a welcome display of maturity for some posters to admit they got things like Martin not sticking to his word wrong too.

Then again admitting one got it wrong is anathema to some people.

Did he or didn't he open the door to SF when he thought he was getting around 50 seats? (the situation I said he would go in with SF)

SafeSurfer

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Did he or didn't he open the door to SF when he thought he was getting around 50 seats? (the situation I said he would go in with SF)

He never said he was prepared to go into government with Sinn Fein. Not during the election campaign or after it. You can grasp at all the half open doors you want. Government with either of the two main parties is firmly closed to Sinn Fein.

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

He never said he was prepared to go into government with Sinn Fein. Not during the election campaign or after it. You can grasp at all the half open doors you want. Government with either of the two main parties is firmly closed to Sinn Fein.

Full on protection of him there. It was plain for anyone to see what he was doing on that Sunday.

Dream on if you think the man is genuine.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Members of FF gun ran for the 'RA not that long ago.

Not that long ago you make it seem like yesterday. Jayus I thought I was old when the youngsters on the net are amazed that 2004 was before facebook!

Plus the key difference is in that period you refer to FF were not running a proxy state in NI, in a completely different manner to the ROI. Plus they actually had to take an oath to the crown to get in the dail door. Could SF do the same for WM?

SafeSurfer

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Full on protection of him there. It was plain for anyone to see what he was doing on that Sunday.

Dream on if you think the man is genuine.

Sinn Fein members on here claim Martin, onthe night of his election count, saying “I am a democrat” and “we will listen to the people” was a signal he was going into coalition with Sinn Fein. But David Cullinane’s shouting “up the ra” was not meant and only said due to tiredness?

Get off the bus!

You just can’t accept rejection. Get over it Francie.

5 years will fly by.

Idbatterim

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Sinn Fein members on here claim Martin, onthe night of his election count, saying “I am a democrat” and “we will listen to the people” was a signal he was going into coalition with Sinn Fein. But David Cullinane’s shouting “up the ra” was not meant and only said due to tiredness?

Get off the bus!

You just can’t accept rejection. Get over it Francie.

5 years will fly by.

five years wont fly by, if you are on the receiving end of the health or housing crisis ! decades of mismanagement and incompetence and we are facing another five years of it? christ!

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Did he or didn't he open the door to SF when he thought he was getting around 50 seats? (the situation I said he would go in with SF)

Is this the one you are talking about?

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/martin-opens-the-door-to-coalition-with-sinn-fein-38941313.

Asked about a coalition with Sinn Féin, he said: "I'm a democrat," before adding, "I listen to the people, I respect the decision of the people."

Nowhere did he say that he would go into collation with SF, it may have been just been code for "if the people want FF to go with SF I will resign, as I am a democrat"

SafeSurfer

Idbatterim wrote: »

five years wont fly by, if you are on the receiving end of the health or housing crisis ! decades of mismanagement and incompetence and we are facing another five years of it? christ!

The paradise that is Sinn Fein governed Northern Ireland is but a hop, skip and jump away.

Fann Linn

SafeSurfer wrote: »

The paradise that is Sinn Fein governed Northern Ireland is but a hop, skip and jump away.

Yep. Sure is.

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Sinn Fein members on here claim Martin, onthe night of his election count, saying “I am a democrat” and “we will listen to the people” was a signal he was going into coalition with Sinn Fein. But David Cullinane’s shouting “up the ra” was not meant and only said due to tiredness?

Get off the bus!

You just can’t accept rejection. Get over it Francie.

5 years will fly by.

Everyone, including political pundits seen it for what it patently was.



https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/martin-opens-the-door-to-coalition-with-sinn-fein-38941313.html

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/fianna-f%C3%A1il-reaction-martin-opens-door-to-government-with-fg-or-sf-1.4167246?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Ffianna-f%25C3%25A1il-reaction-martin-opens-door-to-government-with-fg-or-sf-1.4167246

gormdubhgorm

Idbatterim wrote: »

five years wont fly by, if you are on the receiving end of the health or housing crisis ! decades of mismanagement and incompetence and we are facing another five years of it? christ!

You are a real glass half full fella, nearly full employment, great recovery after the crash, Brexit deal renegotiated, improved infrastructure M17, luas etc.
And to top it all off Lowry won the British open! (no relation to Michael)

Housing and health issues take more time to solve as SF have shown in thier governance in NI.

Idbatterim

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

You are a real glass half full fella, nearly full employment, great recovery after the crash, Brexit deal renegotiated, improved infrastructure M17, luas etc.
And to top it all off Lowry won the British open! (no relation to Michael)

Housing and health issues take more time to solve as SF have shown in thier governance in NI.

the luas? Ha ha! I take it you arent from dublin?

SafeSurfer

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Everyone, including political pundits seen it for what it patently was.



https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/election-2020/martin-opens-the-door-to-coalition-with-sinn-fein-38941313.html

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/fianna-f%C3%A1il-reaction-martin-opens-door-to-government-with-fg-or-sf-1.4167246?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Ffianna-f%25C3%25A1il-reaction-martin-opens-door-to-government-with-fg-or-sf-1.4167246

Quoting the biased, fascist, anti Sinn Fein main stream media now. The ones constantly ridiculed by Sinn Fein members here. Careful Francie, it’s a slippery slope!

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Quoting the biased, fascist, anti Sinn Fein main stream media now. The ones constantly ridiculed by Sinn Fein members here. Careful Francie, it’s a slippery slope!

Keep trying to deflect away from reality there SS.

Loafing Oaf

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Nowhere did he say that he would go into collation with SF, it may have been just been code for "if the people want FF to go with SF I will resign, as I am a democrat"

Not a collation but he did hint at a cup of coffee:p

Of course he didn't say it explicitly, when you're floating a kite like that you need plausible deniability if it doesn't fly...

gormdubhgorm

SafeSurfer wrote: »

He never said he was prepared to go into government with Sinn Fein. Not during the election campaign or after it. You can grasp at all the half open doors you want. Government with either of the two main parties is firmly closed to Sinn Fein.

Fair play to Micheal for sticking to his guns (I think that is an oxymoron?)
I have never voted FF. But he has gone miles up in my estimation in the stance he has taken. A man of integrity and a man of principle. Something other parties should take note of.

gormdubhgorm

Idbatterim wrote: »

the luas? Ha ha! I take it you arent from dublin?

I am and I think it is grand joined up now and all. Some people just like whinging about things I think.
How long would it have taken to get from Tallaght Stadium to Busarus before the Luas? Remember what a pain in the @rse it was to get to Heuston?

FrancieBrady

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Not a collation but he did hint at a cup of coffee:p

Of course he didn't say it explicitly, when you're floating a kite like that you need plausible deniability if it doesn't fly...

Michael had the perfect little tenure as Taoiseach in his sights.

SafeSurfer

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Keep trying to deflect away from reality there SS.

Reality? You are claiming that “everyone seen it for what it is” sic.

No they didn’t.

Did you even read the Indo article you posted and whose headline you have adopted as your own mantra, “leaving the door open to Sinn Fein”.

Reality isn’t what you want it to be Francie. I know that hurts. But look on the bright side you will be the biggest party in opposition. Maybe even a much bigger opposition party if there is another election.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Full on protection of him there. It was plain for anyone to see what he was doing on that Sunday.

Dream on if you think the man is genuine.

Well to be honest Francie I think he is more of genuine salt than many in SF.
A lot of them in it have shady (second hand car salesmen) heads on them. I for one would not buy a car off them. The Dessie Ellis and Cullinane stuff only proved it. No decorum, no class, no honesty.

FrancieBrady

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Well to be honest Francie I think he is more of genuine salt than many in SF.
A lot of them in it have shady (second hand car salesmen) heads on them. I for one would not buy a car off them. The Dessie Ellis and Cullinane stuff only proved it. No decorum, no class, no honesty.

Keep the attention off Michael. Good job, good job.

BarryD2

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Fair play to Micheal for sticking to his guns (I think that is an oxymoron?)
I have never voted FF. But he has gone miles up in my estimation in the stance he has taken. A man of integrity and a man of principle. Something other parties should take note of.

Ditto, not a fan of FF in general but Micheál Martin does have a streak of integrity and decency about him.

Anyway aren't we looking forward to this left grouping minority government? How soon will the announcement be made by Mary Lou? We need to be getting a move on.

gormdubhgorm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Michael had the perfect little tenure as Taoiseach in his sights.

Why wouldn't he?

1) He leads a democratic party NOT just in name only.

2) He has the mandate NOT to go in with SF

3) He at least can appear more statesman like than some of the SF alternatives

FF may not be perfect but at least they are a democratic party whose members are held responsible for thier actions.

Yet it is 'normal' for SF to dance around dead bodies with words - looking to the future on the one hand, while on the other dreaming of thier glorified bits of thier balaclavad past.

FrancieBrady

BarryD2 wrote: »

Ditto, not a fan of FF in general but Micheál Martin does have a streak of integrity and decency about him.

Anyway aren't we looking forward to this left grouping minority government? How soon will the announcement be made by Mary Lou?

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Why wouldn't he?

1) He leads a democratic party NOT just in name only.

2) He has the mandate NOT to go in with SF

3) He at least can appear more statesman like than some of the SF alternatives

FF may not be perfect but at least they are a democratic party whose members are held responsible for thier actions.

Yet it is 'normal' for SF to dance around dead bodies with words - looking to the future on the one hand, while on the other dreaming of thier glorified bits of thier balaclavad past.

We are talking about the FF leader who has consistently washed his hands of what they did in the run up to 2008?

Dear me.

The Rape of Lucretia

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Fair play to Micheal for sticking to his guns (I think that is an oxymoron?)
I have never voted FF. But he has gone miles up in my estimation in the stance he has taken. A man of integrity and a man of principle. Something other parties should take note of.

Absolutely. People bitch non stop about politicians doing u-turns, or not being trustable because they will say anything before an election and do the opposite after. The behavious that prompts much of the disillusionment and apathy about politics and politicians, happy to tar all of them with the same 'dishonest cowboys' type brush.

But in a case of a leader sticking by what he said he would do, and people still moan.So give him credit for having the courage of his conviction.

It must also be said that Rads is of a similar high calibre.

The country could just be about to hit the two best Taoisigh it has ever had, with the same stone (metaphorically speaking, not in an IRA-sniper-at-work kinda way).

The Rape of Lucretia

FrancieBrady wrote: »

We are talking about the FF leader who has consistently washed his hands of what they did in the run up to 2008?

Dear me.

Can you back that up, or is it just creative fiction?

The following is a direct quote from Micheal Martin's apology for his party's role in leading Ireland from boom to bust.

"We made mistakes. We got things wrong and we are sorry for that," said Mr Martin. "No equivocation, no half apology, just the plain, unvarnished truth."

Do you understand what is meant by the phrase washed-his-hands, and were you trying to say something different ?

Feisar

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Why wouldn't he?

1) He leads a democratic party NOT just in name only.

2) He has the mandate NOT to go in with SF

3) He at least can appear more statesman like than some of the SF alternatives

FF may not be perfect but at least they are a democratic party whose members are held responsible for thier actions.

Yet it is 'normal' for SF to dance around dead bodies with words - looking to the future on the one hand, while on the other dreaming of thier glorified bits of thier balaclavad past.

If they'd just say, "yea, a war was on, what do you expect. We were second class citizens. Are we in the occupied six not entitled to the same freedom as everyone else?"

If they'd just do that I could possibly vote for them.

SafeSurfer

FG parliamentary party just announced it intends to go into opposition.

FrancieBrady

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Can you back that up, or is it just creative fiction?

The following is a direct quote from Micheal Martin's apology for his party's role in leading Ireland from boom to bust.

"We made mistakes. We got things wrong and we are sorry for that," said Mr Martin. "No equivocation, no half apology, just the plain, unvarnished truth."

Do you understand what is meant by the phrase washed-his-hands, and were you trying to say something different ?

The rehabilitation of FF is complete.

FrancieBrady

SafeSurfer wrote: »

FG parliamentary party just announced it intends to go into opposition.

Or as it's called by some on here...'whingers and hurlers on the ditch'.