So according to the Sindo,its an FF-FG-Green-Grand coalition then ?

LeinsterDub

omega man wrote: »

Oh I agree but it’s what SF and their supporters have been telling us post election.

It seems to me that there has been talk of mandates from all sides

dxhound2005

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

FF and FG didn't get enough seats to form a government, so team up to form one, even though both sustained huge losses in public support. That would be a kick in the teeth for everyone who abandoned them, only to get stuck with them.

It's a tough old game. And SF might find that they have hit their high water mark, and never get as many seats again. Nobody knows.

tipptom

Feisar wrote: »

Yes they did, I'm not sure you understand how the political system works.

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

redzerdrog

Jesus, this nonsense is painful!

Eric Cartman

whats peoples obsession with the anti commuter, elitist, dublin centric greens. Its like voting for the political wing of donnybrook fair.

dxhound2005

tipptom wrote: »

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

It's not unprecedented. FF went down to 20 seats in 2011 and Labour got 37. In 2001 FG got only 31.

NIMAN

tipptom wrote: »

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

... and so proves that you should never listen to a politician.

careless sherpa

Ezequiel Enough Wife wrote: »

Delighted we are getting more of the same for the next few years.

More insurance issues, more housing issues, more motoring taxes, more USC.

Congrats all!

Throw the greens into the mix for escalating carbon taxes.

Kermit.de.frog

suicide_circus wrote: »

The problem with keeping SF to their natural environment of the opposition benches is that we'll never hear and end of it, old boys club conspiracy, #voteforchange, world's smallest violin etc etc

If SF actually got into government their cough would have been softened forevermore after they at very least failed to deliver the whackier parts of the manifesto and more than likely tanked the economy to some degree

The very thing SF were campaigning on, housing, is turning anyway as supply is ramping up. The next government will get the plaudits. It won't be an issue in 5 years time like it is now.

Health probably still will be.

If a new government is successful with both issues then they won't have a problem.

ChikiChiki

satguy wrote: »

Dinny owns the sindo,, he also owns FG.

Most likely he ordered Leo to start talks with FF. There's a big state contract coming up to lay fiber optic cable, and Dinny wants it.

He doesn't own the Sindo. But on your other point regarding FG, I don't think you're too far off the mark. Certainly he has influence in the party.

is_that_so

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

FF and FG didn't get enough seats to form a government, so team up to form one, even though both sustained huge losses in public support. That would be a kick in the teeth for everyone who abandoned them, only to get stuck with them.

Nah, that's all about numbers, politics and beyond our control once our vote is cast. Voters pulled another none of the above on the system.

dxhound2005

ChikiChiki wrote: »

He doesn't own the Sindo. But on your other point regarding FG, I don't your too far off the mark. Certainly he has influence in the party.

And to distract the public, his papers publish stuff about shadowy unelected managers in the background directing Mary Lou. Clever man.

is_that_so

Eric Cartman wrote: »

whats peoples obsession with the anti commuter, elitist, dublin centric greens. Its like voting for the political wing of donnybrook fair.

They have a mathematically significant number of seats in the context of the formation of government.

Edgware

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

FF and FG didn't get enough seats to form a government, so team up to form one, even though both sustained huge losses in public support. That would be a kick in the teeth for everyone who abandoned them, only to get stuck with them.

And do the people who voted for them and the third party that will make up the coalition have any mandate?

gozunda

Eric Cartman wrote: »

whats peoples obsession with the anti commuter, elitist, dublin centric greens. Its like voting for the political wing of donnybrook fair.

It's cool to support the edgy left ...

Triangle

Idbatterim wrote: »

I cannot wait to see the next budget!!!

want to drop the pension age down to 65? no problem, just dont hike the pension by a fiver a week for the next five years as proposed by FFG. bet you there would be little difference in the cost of the two

There is such a thing as inflation, the small increases they give cover this and nothing else.
On top of that, people are living longer which means ultimately more people going into the oap, increasing the cost of it.

Edgware

tipptom wrote: »

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

S.F. have said they would never recognise Stormont
S.F. have said they would never enter Leinster House
Welcome to democracy

ScallionAyter

gozunda wrote: »

It's cool to support the edgy left ...

Lefties: Travellers should be able to practice their 'traditional way of life'

Also lefties: Get into jail you turf cutting b*stards, your traditional way of life is now illegal.

Umaro

Fine Gael: Sinn Fein and the DUP should put aside their differences in order to form a government

also Fine Gael: we won't put aside our differences with Sinn Fein in order to form a government

Welcome to democracy


(wow lets see how long we can keep this going)

Whitecarstones

Whitecarstones wrote: »

Do people honestly think that overnight people became pro IRA? I don't think so.

People were happy enough to say Americans suddenly became alt right racists by electing Trump even though they gave Obama 2 terms directly beforehand. So yeah we are all IRA apologists now.

is_that_so

Umaro wrote: »

Fine Gael: Sinn Fein and the DUP should put aside their differences in order to form a government

also Fine Gael: we won't put aside our differences with Sinn Fein in order to form a government

Welcome to democracy


(wow lets see how long we can keep this going)

In the north they are the largest nationalist party and the government cannot function without themselves and the DUP. Here we've got a few more options and SF are not the only lovely lady to court.

Jinglejangle69

Umaro wrote: »

Fine Gael: Sinn Fein and the DUP should put aside their differences in order to form a government

also Fine Gael: we won't put aside our differences with Sinn Fein in order to form a government

Welcome to democracy


(wow lets see how long we can keep this going)

And SF didn't talk to the DUP for 3 years.

Would you be happy if FG waited 3 years to talk to SF?

Seems fair.

threeball

tipptom wrote: »

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

Incorrect, FG were open to dealing with FF. Varadkar said the only party he was ruling out was SF.
MM said he wouldn't deal with either FG or SF

all about the mane

threeball wrote: »

Incorrect, FG were open to dealing with FF. Varadkar said the only party he was ruling out was SF.
MM said he wouldn't deal with either FG or SF

And people all knew this before they voted. And I assume they voted accordingly. Now, we are where we are.

threeball

all about the mane wrote: »

And people all knew this before they voted. And I assume they voted accordingly. Now, we are where we are.

Correct. MM left himself no wriggle room by ruling out everyone so FF would have to had got 55 seats + or they couldn't get in to government. LV was cuter and knew the ball mighn't bounce his way so he only ruled out SF which is fair enough as they are the two parties furthest apart when it comes to ideology. Given that fact he numbers only support a FG/FF or FF/SF government. MM playing himself into a corner has more questions to answer as he ruled out both suitors so he is going back on his word whichever one he chooses.

Feisar

tipptom wrote: »

No one and I mean no politician including Martin,Varadkar and all the FG/FF media cheerleaders have said this unprecedented election result gave FG/FF a mandate for government,they all said that people voted for change.
But you already know this.

FG said they wouldn't go in with FF before the election.
FF said they wouldn't go in with FG before the election.

You are right, however that's not how the electoral system works. Falls from grace/rises to power don't matter all that matters is who's left standing when the music stops. We now have three main parties left jockeying for position.

Words like fair, mandate and change are irrelevant.

FrancieBrady

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

And SF didn't talk to the DUP for 3 years.

Profoundly wrong. If you are going to contribute please come here with the facts straight.

uck51js9zml2yt

My own opinion is that it should have been a FF/SF coalition with SF given health and housing. They've said they can fix them, let them at it and be proven that they cant.

As it is we'll have FF>FG> Greens and if they cant fix them in 5 years we will have guys in balaclavas running our country.

Whatever happened to the Monster Raving Looney Party when you need them

votecounts

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

And SF didn't talk to the DUP for 3 years.

Would you be happy if FG waited 3 years to talk to SF?

Seems fair.

That wasn't the case at all.
Arelene foster should have resigned over the Cash for Ash scheme but didn't, hence why Martin McGuiness did the honourable thing.
Then the DUP got their Deal with the Tories and had no interest with powersharing until they got shafted by Boris.
It was only then that the DUP had any intention of going back to power sharing especially with Abortion and SSM on the agenda.
These 2 issues were passed directly by WestMininister which was made them law in the North, which never would have happened otherwise because of their veto. So the homophobes in the DUP got the hump again

The Rape of Lucretia

Umaro wrote: »

Fine Gael: Sinn Fein and the DUP should put aside their differences in order to form a government

also Fine Gael: we won't put aside our differences with Sinn Fein in order to form a government

Welcome to democracy


(wow lets see how long we can keep this going)

The interest in putting aside differences or compromising though, depends on what is to be gained by doing so. For FF and FG, there is little or nothing to gain. Or even a negative if their is a backlash on them for either going back on their promise, or, because the terrorism/murder/bombings/executions tint to SF is still anathema to many FG and FF voters.
At the moment, a coalition between the two is far more attractive to them for that reason, which while historic, is more symbolic and curious, than any great leap of contemporary politics.
So goading FF and FG to compromise just because compromise is good is not really the issue preventing them - they just dont need to because they both have a better option.