Domestic Solar PV Quotes 2020

MAULBROOK

alesironi wrote: »

Sent PM, would appreciate if you share details.

thanks
ale

On less you double the amount of panels or get 8 by 400watt panels, forget the Iboost and battery.

Out of interest what size is the invertor

alesironi

MAULBROOK wrote: »

On less you double the amount of panels or get 8 by 400watt panels, forget the Iboost and battery.

Out of interest what size is the invertor

I do not know the size. Would you pls share with me (with PM if not possible publicly) details of how to get a quote like that?

thanks

tails_naf

unkel wrote: »

No, no and don't get an iBoost either. None of that will ever pay for itself. Have a look at some of the other quotes in this thread that are much better than the one you got.

I don't see how the iboost won't pay for itself? It basically ensures 100% self use. I had my system installed for a week before the iboost (eddi in my case) was installed and loads of power went back to thw grid, and that was in October, so I'd much rather it heating my hot water tank. If there were feed in tarrifs that are reasonable then yes the battery and diverter are not required.

graememk

tails_naf wrote: »

I don't see how the iboost won't pay for itself? It basically ensures 100% self use. I had my system installed for a week before the iboost (eddi in my case) was installed and loads of power went back to thw grid, and that was in October, so I'd much rather it heating my hot water tank. If there were feed in tarrifs that are reasonable then yes the battery and diverter are not required.

To heat water using oil or gas, costs about 5c/kwh,

And say if the eddi costs 500 euro, you will need to put in 10,000kwh to break even.

If you have a different reason eg your house is all electric, and use an immersion that will change the balance.

Or if your getting it for a non cost reason (ie not having to light a fire in the summer just to heat water)

Point is, don't get it if the goal is to save money, the payback isn't there.

But if there is a different reason, well it's up to you to judge if it's worth it.

slave1

I just bought myself an Eddi, I think I got a good PV install cost so it wasn’t a totally economical decision, 4 of us in the house and hot water always in demand so it was a comfort purchase.
I don’t have gas so it is 4 hours night rate to heat the tank, I also was to be self consuming so the Eddi will take excess from 150w to 1200w, from 1200w the Zappi will take excess to the EVs....

slave1

In other news I got my post PV install BER result, B1, not bad for a late 1960s semi

AnswerIs42

slave1 wrote: »

In other news I got my post PV install BER result, B1, not bad for a late 1960s semi

Did the BER result come as part of the package from the company that installed your solar system so you could get the grant?

If not, what did it cost you to get it done?

unkel

slave1 wrote: »

I just bought myself an Eddi, I think I got a good PV install cost so it wasn’t a totally economical decision, 4 of us in the house and hot water always in demand so it was a comfort purchase.
I don’t have gas so it is 4 hours night rate to heat the tank

It is well known on here that I try to tell people not to get an immersion diverter for their 2kwp system if they already have efficient gas / oil heating as it will never pay for itself, so it won't save them any money. It's cheaper to export your excess electricity back to the grid for free

You are a good example of where this rule applies a lot less because of combination of:

1. your water heating costs are 8c/kWh, not just 5c/kWh from efficient fossil fuels
2. your system is big, can't remember now, 4,5,6 kwp or something substantial
3. you've saved money with a super price install, now you want the Eddi as a hobby, for self sufficiency reasons, etc. would you even attempt a DIY install on it?
4. household with large hot water needs

Obviously the money saving becomes a lot less if / when we get a FIT, but above still applies

MAULBROOK

slave1 wrote: »

In other news I got my post PV install BER result, B1, not bad for a late 1960s semi

You can now add 5%-10% to your house price if you sell.

I see a few banks are offering good mortgage rates for houses with a BER of B2 and higher. I will be switching next year, happy days

slave1

AnswerIs42 wrote: »

Did the BER result come as part of the package from the company that installed your solar system so you could get the grant?

If not, what did it cost you to get it done?

Separate guy and it cost €240, ethically I don't believe in a link between installer and BER assessor, they should be independent of each other

AnswerIs42

slave1 wrote: »

Separate guy and it cost €240, ethically I don't believe in a link between installer and BER assessor, they should be independent of each other

Thanks for that info. Another cost to factor in.

slave1

unkel wrote: »

It is well known on here that I try to tell people not to get an immersion diverter for their 2kwp system if they already have efficient gas / oil heating as it will never pay for itself, so it won't save them any money. It's cheaper to export your excess electricity back to the grid for free

You are a good example of where this rule applies a lot less because of combination of:

1. your water heating costs are 8c/kWh, not just 5c/kWh from efficient fossil fuels
2. your system is big, can't remember now, 4,5,6 kwp or something substantial
3. you've saved money with a super price install, now you want the Eddi as a hobby, for self sufficiency reasons, etc. would you even attempt a DIY install on it?
4. household with large hot water needs

Obviously the money saving becomes a lot less if / when we get a FIT, but above still applies

3. you've saved money with a super price install, now you want the Eddi as a hobby, for self sufficiency reasons, etc. would you even attempt a DIY install on it?
4. household with large hot water needs

This, yes I will self install, there's nothing to it, take the feed currently going into the timer and install a switch (as I'd like complete control and I have a few lying around), then feed from switch to Eddi and take two feeds off the Eddi for top and bottom elements via independent 20a switch double poles.
Some may say I could avoid all those switches but it's in their schematic and I've no problem with extra wiring and effort

unkel

AnswerIs42 wrote: »

Thanks for that info. Another cost to factor in.

Indeed. Could add a year to the pay back period of the system. You won't of course need this for a DIY install. With a SEAI grant install my final negotiation would be to get them to throw it in. Agree that you won't get a reliable outcome, but who cares, it is only to please the grant criteria and BER is only an adding up exercise anwyay. It says nothing about how much energy your house consumes. My poorly '99 built house was a B rating before I got my PV or my home battery. Probably would get an A rating now if I sealed up my fireplace, which is ridiculous for a draughty house with crap insulation like mine.

garo

BER are a bit of a joke. I got the guy who did my BER to send me the xml file that contained all the information he had gathered to make the rating. It is so easy to game it and there are so many assumptions made that two assesors can come up with wildly different ratings.

slave1

Well the guy who's doing my BER sought a lot of information from me, receipts for windows, insulation work etc to prove the work done etc. He also took a lot of photos to use in the uploads to BER portal so I hope my BER is a non-gamed assessment

garo

Well then. That late 60s has had a lot of work done so. THat's a different matter if you have proof of insulation U-values etc. On a standard build with no work done it can be a finger in the air thing to get U-values for walls etc. They don't do a airflow test so you don't know how much heat you lose via air leaks. And they sure don't measure U values for windows and walls.

slave1

slave1 wrote: »

In other news I got my post PV install BER result, B1, not bad for a late 1960s semi

What was it pre PV install?

Curious how many levels a PV install improves a BER rating.

idc

If they don't know uValues for your walls/doors/windows etc then they are supposed to use defaults of the time. ie they have a document with value used when your house was build!


With my 4.65 kWp, 5 kW inverter and 5.7kWh battery moved my BER rating from a B2 to a B1 ! (had a BER done by same guy only 6-7 months previously!)

MAULBROOK

We went from a C3 to a B2 after PV instal and replacing all lights with LED, personally i don't give a dam how or where that number was plucked from. For once I got a result.

garo

I had the same guy do the BER when we bought the house and 2 years later with a 4.8kWh PV install and fully zoned HW/CH system installed in the interim. Went from D2(277) to C2(199). We have a gas fireplace that is blocked up - but not permanently so - so that adds about 55kWh/m2 to our estimated consumption while in reality consumption is near zero. Our real consumption before PV was 155 kWh/m2 so a high C1 and after PV 118 kWh/m2 so in line with a B3. 80s vintage detached.

The rating improvement from PV depends on the area of your house and size of your panels. The bigger the array and the smaller the floor area, the more the improvement.

worlds goodest teecher

slave1 wrote: »

Well the guy who's doing my BER sought a lot of information from me, receipts for windows, insulation work etc to prove the work done etc. He also took a lot of photos to use in the uploads to BER portal so I hope my BER is a non-gamed assessment

The BER assessor is required to provide evidence in their upload to the SEAI National Administration System. An inspection can be carried out if something seems off or the survey is randomly selected. BER assessor receives penalty points if incorrect information uploaded.

MAULBROOK

garo wrote: »

I had the same guy do the BER when we bought the house and 2 years later with a 4.8kWh PV install and fully zoned HW/CH system installed in the interim. Went from D2(277) to C2(199). We have a gas fireplace that is blocked up - but not permanently so - so that adds about 55kWh/m2 to our estimated consumption while in reality consumption is near zero. Our real consumption before PV was 155 kWh/m2 so a high C1 and after PV 118 kWh/m2 so in line with a B3. 80s vintage detached.

The rating improvement from PV depends on the area of your house and size of your panels. The bigger the array and the smaller the floor area, the more the improvement.

That explains it a bit. Bungalow north wexford with then 16 panels now 20.

DrPhilG

tails_naf wrote: »

I don't see how the iboost won't pay for itself? It basically ensures 100% self use.

How so?

idc

The first time the BER guy was here he told me to get rid of as many draughts like chimney, attic hatches etc. which i did. and sent a photo of a chimney sheep (similar idea to chimney balloon). He was happy with that.
Then when he came 5-6 months later for PV he looks at chimney (which now has a cap on top as well) and says that makes no difference!!! sure anyone could remove that so it can't be counted!
I didn't explain anyone could replace every light bulb with the least energy efficient version they could find, or take the PV panels off the roof as well!

MAULBROOK

idc wrote: »

The first time the BER guy was here he told me to get rid of as many draughts like chimney, attic hatches etc. which i did. and sent a photo of a chimney sheep (similar idea to chimney balloon). He was happy with that.
Then when he came 5-6 months later for PV he looks at chimney (which now has a cap on top as well) and says that makes no difference!!! sure anyone could remove that so it can't be counted!
I didn't explain anyone could replace every light bulb with the least energy efficient version they could find, or take the PV panels off the roof as well!

Sounds like a total Cee Uew Next Tuesday

SouthWesterly

idc wrote: »

The first time the BER guy was here he told me to get rid of as many draughts like chimney, attic hatches etc. which i did. and sent a photo of a chimney sheep (similar idea to chimney balloon). He was happy with that.
Then when he came 5-6 months later for PV he looks at chimney (which now has a cap on top as well) and says that makes no difference!!! sure anyone could remove that so it can't be counted!
I didn't explain anyone could replace every light bulb with the least energy efficient version they could find, or take the PV panels off the roof as well!

Has that with a house I sold. Had a chimney baloon and it was discounted.

A question... I've a d2 (2014).and looking at upgrading my oil burner and getting pv. Will getting the ber done after the panels are in also include the burner for the purposes of getting the pv grant.. Don't know if that makes sense.

worlds goodest teecher

SouthWesterly wrote: »

Has that with a house I sold. Had a chimney baloon and it was discounted.

A question... I've a d2 (2014).and looking at upgrading my oil burner and getting pv. Will getting the ber done after the panels are in also include the burner for the purposes of getting the pv grant.. Don't know if that makes sense.

you have to get a min C rating after installing PV, doesn't say C1, C2 or C3. A more efficient oil boiler will bring up as well.

I went from E1 to C1 recently by insulating cavity and attic, draft stripping, changing boiler, etc although I feel it should have been B3. Installing 2kW PV as soon as restrictions ease so will have to get BER done again.

idc

MAULBROOK wrote: »

Sounds like a total Cee Uew Next Tuesday

Haha no he was actually decent apart from that scenario. When he was here first time he pointed out things i could do simply and he'd hold off on the report. So i did a lot of extra bits and pieces that he suggested and sent that on. Worst was getting windows/door suppliers to give me details so i didn't go with default uValues for when house built.

Back to Solar PV, it did kinda demonstrate that solar on its own may not be enough to get to the BER level you need for grant. for instance if your house was in E or even D2 would solar on its own bring you to a C ?

SouthWesterly wrote: »

A question... I've a d2 (2014).and looking at upgrading my oil burner and getting pv. Will getting the ber done after the panels are in also include the burner for the purposes of getting the pv grant.. Don't know if that makes sense.

Doing both is a good idea as both will improve BER. Any idea how the BER will change with new burner? if it gets you close to the C even if the burner just put you above the threshold in D1 (lets say 230) then the panels will push you into C. so all good.

SouthWesterly

worlds goodest teecher wrote: »

you have to get a min C rating after installing PV, doesn't say C1, C2 or C3. A more efficient oil boiler will bring up as well.

I went from E1 to C1 recently by insulating cavity and attic, draft stripping, changing boiler, etc although I feel it should have been B3. Installing 2kW PV as soon as restrictions ease so will have to get BER done again.

There was wall insulation and a stove done after the ber by the previous owner. I reckoned a 2.2 kW pv on a 161msq house would bring me to c. Could be wrong.

garo

So take your array size and multiple by 1.47. So my 4.8kW array goes to 7000kWh. Now divide this by floor area and that gives you the improvement in BER. So if you had a 100 sq. m. house your BER would improve by 70. If it was a 200 Sq. m house it would improve by 35. That will tell you what your new rating would be with just the BER into account. You could always ask for a pre-install inspection to make sure you would hit the C3 with panels included. I had to give the exact panel model number. And Eddi/battery has no impact on BER.


2200*1.47/161 = ~20 kWh/m2 so definitely not enough to get you from D2 to C3 by itself.

worlds goodest teecher

SouthWesterly wrote: »

There was wall insulation and a stove done after the ber by the previous owner. I reckoned a 2.2 kW pv on a 161msq house would bring me to c. Could be wrong.

The big increase for me was improving the fabric the building. If I had done the PV before the fabric improvements I wouldn't realise the full potential of the PV.

Got rid of the open fire as well and installed triple glazed front and back doors.

SouthWesterly

garo wrote: »

So take your array size and multiple by 1.47. So my 4.8kW array goes to 7000kWh. Now divide this by floor area and that gives you the improvement in BER. So if you had a 100 sq. m. house your BER would improve by 70. If it was a 200 Sq. m house it would improve by 35. That will tell you what your new rating would be with just the BER into account. You could always ask for a pre-install inspection to make sure you would hit the C3 with panels included. I had to give the exact panel model number. And Eddi/battery has no impact on BER.


2200*1.47/161 = ~20 kWh/m2 so definitely not enough to get you from D2 to C3 by itself.

The pre install assessment was my plan.

slave1

garo wrote: »

Well then. That late 60s has had a lot of work done so. THat's a different matter if you have proof of insulation U-values etc. On a standard build with no work done it can be a finger in the air thing to get U-values for walls etc. They don't do a airflow test so you don't know how much heat you lose via air leaks. And they sure don't measure U values for windows and walls.

Yes, well I think yes, I've had the cavity wall insulated, all external walls downstairs have 50mm insulated plaster slabs, various windows at various times with most recent windows on north facing aspect being treble glazed, floor removed and 12in insulated slabs put down, 1.8w LEDs all downstairs, energy saving bulbs remainder of house, multi fuel stove in chimney #1, chimney #2 and 3 closed off, oil burner replaced earlier this year, window openings on north facing aspect all reduced when putting the treble glazed windows in.
I had some receipts, lots of photos from when I was doing the work and the odd bit of visual evidence e.g. cavity insulation "leak".
Basically I can heat the house with a tiny fire, with nights at 6-7degrees or less a third of a bucket of coal and the house is toasty, also if all the doors are open during the day the house naturally heats up very quickly when they are closed...

worlds goodest teecher

slave1 wrote: »

Yes, well I think yes, I've had the cavity wall insulated, all external walls downstairs have 50mm insulated plaster slabs, various windows at various times with most recent windows on north facing aspect being treble glazed, floor removed and 12in insulated slabs put down, 1.8w LEDs all downstairs, energy saving bulbs remainder of house, multi fuel stove in chimney #1, chimney #2 and 3 closed off, oil burner replaced earlier this year, window openings on north facing aspect all reduced when putting the treble glazed windows in.
I had some receipts, lots of photos from when I was doing the work and the odd bit of visual evidence e.g. cavity insulation "leak".
Basically I can heat the house with a tiny fire, with nights at 6-7degrees or less a third of a bucket of coal and the house is toasty, also if all the doors are open during the day the house naturally heats up very quickly when they are closed...

Did you install the insulated plasterboard? Do you have a receipt? My BER assessor did not include it as there was no documentation confirming its presence, dispite me asking him to remove socket covers on the 4 ext walls. SEAI would have accepted pictures. We've gone off the topic a bit, apologies.

Only received my new BER last week and have to get another one after PV is installed.

slave1

Yes, I installed the insulated plasterboards, no receipts but I was able to show him two open sections where I had CAT6 and HDMI cabling protruding, he was able to get a measuring tape in to gauge the depth and I held the tape in as he took photo... sounds like lazy BER guy you had perhaps

garo

I'd love to get some of that work done that you describe slave1. After CoVid and when I have a bit more funds - as you know a big purchase has left me poor this year - hoping to get some of that work done. Might PM you in a year's time.

Rzeznik

I had 2,48kWp installed in Jul. My BER after this changed from 160,35kWh/m2/yr (C1) to 125.22kWh/m2/yr (B3 - B2 is under 125... ).
3 bed - end of terrace, 115sqm . No other work done in between the BERs.

My BER was included in the deal, so no extra cost (happy days )

worlds goodest teecher

slave1 wrote: »

Yes, I installed the insulated plasterboards, no receipts but I was able to show him two open sections where I had CAT6 and HDMI cabling protruding, he was able to get a measuring tape in to gauge the depth and I held the tape in as he took photo... sounds like lazy BER guy you had perhaps

SEAI will require photographic evidence of the insulated slab on all sides of the building. Not hard to get. If you don't have documentary evidence of the u-value or conductivity of the slab a default will be used. Basically its the worst case conductivity but it is better than not including it. This should all be going in the BER thread but it is kinda relevant in obtaining the min C rating for the solar grant.

idc

Anyone else see company offering solar pv system for a euro! You pay your normal electric supplier as usual for grid use but also the pv company bill you for your solar pv usage at 14.5c per kWh ex VAT. Agreement is for 21 years before you can buy the system for 100 euro.

Rzeznik

idc wrote: »

Anyone else see company offering solar pv system for a euro! You pay your normal electric supplier as usual for grid use but also the pv company bill you for your solar pv usage at 14.5c per kWh ex VAT. Agreement is for 21 years before you can buy the system for 100 euro.

Nope, but sounds like a bad deal

Zzippy

Folks, just looking for advice on what to look for when getting quotes.

4 bed detached house in west of Ireland, 230 sq m. Rear roof SE facing, and shed roof SW facing. Could get 2 arrays if that is advisable. Current electiricy usage approx. 4,800kWh/year (possibly lower as both working from home last 7 months).

Oil central heating/hot water and a solid fuel stove which also heats water, but is only used in winter. Turf supply is essentially free, just a bit of labour. No EV and probably not planned for a long time.

Any suggestions on size of installation to look at, and whether a hot water diverter is advised? Any other considerations? Long term we may end up with no one working from home, so daytime usage may decrease again - any ideas when a FIT may be coming?

Also, any recommendations for companies in Galway area?

Deagol

Zzippy wrote: »

Folks, just looking for advice on what to look for when getting quotes.

4 bed detached house in west of Ireland, 230 sq m. Rear roof SE facing, and shed roof SW facing. Could get 2 arrays if that is advisable. Current electiricy usage approx. 4,800kWh/year (possibly lower as both working from home last 7 months).

Oil central heating/hot water and a solid fuel stove which also heats water, but is only used in winter. Turf supply is essentially free, just a bit of labour. No EV and probably not planned for a long time.

Any suggestions on size of installation to look at, and whether a hot water diverter is advised? Any other considerations? Long term we may end up with no one working from home, so daytime usage may decrease again - any ideas when a FIT may be coming?

Also, any recommendations for companies in Galway area?

I have a diverter for the reason you give above. I don't want to spark up oil burner to heat water during the summer - find the diverter excellent way to have hot water during the warmer months. On the odd day I've had a bit of solar heated water during the day I've also found it gives the boiler a kickstart heating the rads.

I'll PM you a supplier recommendation.

bf

Finally got round to ordering PV:

12 PANELS 340 WATT 4.2KW (JA Solar)

3.6 SOLIS INVERTER

4.8 PYLON TEC.BATTERY

WATER DIVERTER I Boost

WIFI DONGLE

Installation of car charger with solar integration (supplied by me)

Working out at €6.5k net of grant

Deagol

bf wrote: »

Finally got round to ordering PV:

12 PANELS 340 WATT 4.2KW (JA Solar)

3.6 SOLIS INVERTER

4.8 PYLON TEC.BATTERY

WATER DIVERTER I Boost

WIFI DONGLE

Installation of car charger with solar integration (supplied by me)

Working out at €6.5k net of grant

Is that the full 3k grant you're getting?

alesironi

Hi everyone

still me (second question in few days) trying to understand PV options.

I got an offer from a company (won't mention) which is very interesting from a budget point of view, for a minimum monthly fee fixed for 10 years (20 euro including grant) will get a 2.1KW PV install, no iboost no battery storage.
For those 10 years they will maintain the system (i.e. if I want to do any modification they will need to make it), but at the same time they told me I own the system from the beginning. THey call this Solar as a Service.

Anyone with experience on this? Pro/cons?

MAULBROOK

bf wrote: »

Finally got round to ordering PV:

12 PANELS 340 WATT 4.2KW (JA Solar)

3.6 SOLIS INVERTER

4.8 PYLON TEC.BATTERY

WATER DIVERTER I Boost

WIFI DONGLE

Installation of car charger with solar integration (supplied by me)

Working out at €6.5k net of grant

Ask for the 5KW inverter, bigger the better IMO. For the same price.

SouthWesterly

alesironi wrote: »

Hi everyone

still me (second question in few days) trying to understand PV options.

I got an offer from a company (won't mention) which is very interesting from a budget point of view, for a minimum monthly fee fixed for 10 years (20 euro including grant) will get a 2.1KW PV install, no iboost no battery storage.
For those 10 years they will maintain the system (i.e. if I want to do any modification they will need to make it), but at the same time they told me I own the system from the beginning. THey call this Solar as a Service.

Anyone with experience on this? Pro/cons?

Several here have gone with them. Try get better off him. He can throw in another panel.
Its a no brainer.
You need to get a C rating for the grant.

gomamochi1

MAULBROOK wrote: »

Ask for the 5KW inverter, bigger the better IMO. For the same price.

Got the zappi 2 included for similar price

alesironi

SouthWesterly wrote: »

Several here have gone with them. Try get better off him. He can throw in another panel.
Its a no brainer.
You need to get a C rating for the grant.

THanks for the answer. Question is do you actually own the panel or lease them? The company I asked they told me I own them but in the terms and conditions on their website they say they own them. They have the cheapest option I found so far and they offer payment in 10 years with (apparently) with no interest, fixed fee. the fee they call it "Service", not repyment. Do not understand the pro/cons and the benefit for the company doing this if I actually own the panels?

Deagol

alesironi wrote: »

THanks for the answer. Question is do you actually own the panel or lease them? The company I asked they told me I own them but in the terms and conditions on their website they say they own them. They have the cheapest option I found so far and they offer payment in 10 years with (apparently) with no interest, fixed fee. the fee they call it "Service", not repyment. Do not understand the pro/cons and the benefit for the company doing this if I actually own the panels?

I'd always default to the thought that if something sounds too good to be true it probably is.

Having read through the T&C's I'd run a mile. For starters, it looks to me that they are advancing credit without having a license to do so, I'd guess they might be in breach of laws around acting as a credit intermediary - but that's just my opinion - I'm no expert on financial things like that!

Scariest part is reading about what happens in the event of failures. Any failures where they deem they can't see a reason are considered to be client damage. So essentially they have the right to come out and say it was the client that damaged it and has to pay for the repairs - just slightly one sided.

Plus, they then can charge very high fees to repair it with no limits on the time span it should take, plus they don't specify how the cost of any parts is calculated. They could theoretically charge €500 a panel if any get broken.

Sorry, for me it's the type of contract that no business would sign, in my opinion, they are hoping that ordinary punters are gullible and will sign this and they then will make money on the replacement parts and labour costs doing so.