Greatest League in the World 2024 [new thread available]

srfc d16

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

:pac::pac:

What's funny here?

Oat23

Cape Clear wrote: »

Fella's used to give out about John Caulfield and his "agricultural" styled football.....

John Caulfield with one of the biggest budgets in the league and his pick of players to implement any style he wants?

Sorry for holding him to a higher standard than the likes of Ollie Horgan who has feck all to work with.

Cape Clear

Oat23 wrote: »

John Caulfield with one of the biggest budgets in the league and his pick of players to implement any style he wants?

Sorry for holding him to a higher standard than the likes of Ollie Horgan who has feck all to work with.

Should have been more specific in tying that post in with the discussion around grass growth.

topmanamillion

Oat23 wrote: »

Sorry for holding him to a higher standard than the likes of Ollie Horgan who has feck all to work with.

Bit of a side note, but Horgan has been one of the league's best managers over the last 5 years. You can't under state the lack of resources he has to go out and get players.

But he somehow puts a competitive team on the pitch that deserve to stay up, whilst the likes of Cork with all their natural advantages manage to get themselves relegated.

hardybuck

How far behind would Finn Harps' budget be compared to a Sligo or Cork?

Corholio

pgj2015 wrote: »

we are also world renowned for rain. grass pitches are great the odd time in the summer if we get a few days without rain but a lot of the time it ruins a game. astro pitches havent done Dundalk any harm in the last few years.

The odd time? Grass pitches are fine for practically all a season if looked after correctly. I think a few instances on tv should not be deployed as a 'sure they are all like that' excuse. Grass pitches are perfectly fine in Ireland. I used to work in this area and a lot of time pitches here that do struggle have specific problems that lead to degradation, but this can 99% of the time be fixed with the right treatment. This leads to the funding question which is another days work.

topmanamillion

hardybuck wrote: »

How far behind would Finn Harps' budget be compared to a Sligo or Cork?

You'd be talking about half the budget of Sligo and Cork who are both semi pro outfits with a million euro turnovers.

PTH2009

What is happening with Derrys matches ??

Ohmeha

hardybuck wrote: »

How far behind would Finn Harps' budget be compared to a Sligo or Cork?

I believe Harps and Shels have the lowest budgets but the gap isn't as enourmous to some full-time teams as some may think, their first teamers are all semi-professional with a number of their players on very decent part-time wages so I wouldn't seriously listen to either Horgan or Morris pleading any poverty angle. Too many of the full-time teams in the LOI currently entirely through their own fault are getting terrible value for their money on mediocre full-time professionals from here and abroad

overshoot

From our 2017 account Harps was run on 540k, of that, 230k went on wages (discounting D1/2018). (Donegal daily) Last year was supposed to be presented in spring but then Corona. I'd imagine we are working with more money now but probably not that much as we made a small loss in 2017, mostly covered in 2018.
Topmanamillion is right about our budget v Sligo, their account this year said a budget of 1.3million so about half. (Sligo champion)
A Google of cork says...
"The knock-on effect for the current season is that City have had to cut back in all areas, with current manager, Neale Fenn’s budget for 2020 for players and management only around half of the €1.2m which was available to Caulfield in 2019, down slightly from the 2018 figure, which came off the back of the historic double-winning season." Cork echo

Advantage of fan run clubs, all published. Caulfield had a smaller budget that I'd have thought.

Oat23

overshoot wrote: »

Advantage of fan run clubs

Just one of the advantages. Another being you don't have to speculate on boards.ie what plans your new overlord has for your club in the future. You usually know the plans.

Gavin "shels"

Ohmeha wrote: »

I believe Harps and Shels have the lowest budgets but the gap isn't as enourmous to some full-time teams as some may think, their first teamers are all semi-professional with a number of their players on very decent part-time wages so I wouldn't seriously listen to either Horgan or Morris pleading any poverty angle. Too many of the full-time teams in the LOI currently entirely through their own fault are getting terrible value for their money on mediocre full-time professionals from here and abroad

Depends what you count as a poverty angel... 3 of the younger Shels first teamers have been sorted with accommodation this season, several have gotten full time jobs through Shels, etc... I'd say the budget is low but plenty of these "perks".

topmanamillion

Gavin "shels" wrote: »

Depends what you count as a poverty angel... 3 of the younger Shels first teamers have been sorted with accommodation this season, several have gotten full time jobs through Shels, etc... I'd say the budget is low but plenty of these "perks".

None of the Dublin clubs can play a poverty angel. They're surrounded by some of the biggest school boy clubs in the country with a constant flow of English academy drop outs coming back.
Compare that to the likes of Harps trying to get a player to come to come to play in a town 20 mins outside Letterkenny.
The only reason Rovers are semi pro is so they can in some way compete with part time clubs in Dublin.

joeysoap

kksaints wrote: »

Hard to know what to make of that result for us. Should have taken one of our three good chances in the first half but apart from the goal we created nothing in the second half.

Unless you ship a shedload of goals in the last two matches you can’t be relegated.

pgj2015 wrote: »

There is a lot to be said for astro pitches, it can rain away for a month and you can still play on them and it doesn't effect the quality of the match.

I agree. I watched SR tonight I can safely Athlone Towns Astro pitch ( I forgot they had Astro ) is 100% better than Harps grass pitch. No comparison. Donegal (whether summer or winter) is more suited to Astro.

pgj2015

joeysoap wrote: »

Unless you ship a shedload of goals in the last two matches you can’t be relegated.



I agree. I watched SR tonight I can safely Athlone Towns Astro pitch ( I forgot they had Astro ) is 100% better than Harps grass pitch. No comparison. Donegal (whether summer or winter) is more suited to Astro.

That Athlone pitch looks better than Oriel park. if it had been raining heavy for a day or two, it would put me off going to finn park but if they had an astro pitch I would go.

Zebra3

FAI start proceedings against Derry City.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/soccer/arid-40075022.html

Pawwed Rig

Were Rovers not allowed postpone games due to covid? Seems a bit harsh on Derry to me as it is Rovers who have the log jam of games and not them.
Could get very ugly if Derry end up 9th and having to do a playoff

irish_goat

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Were Rovers not allowed postpone games due to covid? Seems a bit harsh on Derry to me as it is Rovers who have the log jam of games and not them.
Could get very ugly if Derry end up 9th and having to do a playoff

Dublin team though, were the FAI ever going to drop a 3-0 loss on Rovers? I doubt it.

topmanamillion

irish_goat wrote: »

Dublin team though, were the FAI ever going to drop a 3-0 loss on Rovers? I doubt it.

To be fair they wrote to the clubs last week telling them there just was no more room left in the calendar for rearranging fixtures.
It was inevitable clubs were going to have players with Covid. It should have been no postponements from the restart.
This is just shifting the goalposts now, very harsh on Derry at this stage though.

Pawwed Rig

irish_goat wrote: »

Dublin team though, were the FAI ever going to drop a 3-0 loss on Rovers? I doubt it.

Why does it make a difference if it is a Dublin team?

I think they made their bed allowing Rovers to postpone tbh. Can't see how Derry will not take it all the way (unless there is a cash transfer after Shels lose to Rovers or Harps dont beat Waterford and everything gets mysteriously forgotten about).


On related matters 4th and 5th in playoff final for 1st division? Thought Bray would have been all over Longford. Tough league to get out of

hardybuck

It's harsh on Derry but the league can't run on any longer. Every extra week will cost clubs extra money.

Rovers are playing on the 14th anyway, so maybe they'd be generous enough to offer Derry a midweek game at a neutral venue as a goodwill gesture.

shanec1928

but its ok to postpone games in the cup...

topmanamillion

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

On related matters 4th and 5th in playoff final for 1st division? Thought Bray would have been all over Longford. Tough league to get out of

The First Division is getting to the point it should just be a GAA style Championship knockout. 5/9 either end up promoted or in a play off. Verging on the farcical.

Zebra3

irish_goat wrote: »

Dublin team though, were the FAI ever going to drop a 3-0 loss on Rovers? I doubt it.

So when the FAI announced the new rules they knew who would and wouldn’t get Covid?

What’s your alternative plan?

kksaints

https://www.sseairtricityleague.ie/news/expressions-of-interest-invited-for-league-of-ireland-first-division/id-3559

Any takers I wonder? Limerick and/or Treaty United would be the main one I reckon barring another B team or possible Kerry even. I know Cavan/Monaghan have an U-19 team but I can't see them going for it atm. I know there's Carlow/Kilkenny, Mayo and Kildare teams in the other underage leagues but it's impossible to see them going for it without a few years of U-19s at least.

topmanamillion

kksaints wrote: »

https://www.sseairtricityleague.ie/news/expressions-of-interest-invited-for-league-of-ireland-first-division/id-3559

Any takers I wonder? Limerick and/or Treaty United would be the main one I reckon barring another B team or possible Kerry even. I know Cavan/Monaghan have an U-19 team but I can't see them going for it atm. I know there's Carlow/Kilkenny, Mayo and Kildare teams in the other underage leagues but it's impossible to see them going for it without a few years of U-19s at least.

Potential new applicant Clubs/entities who intend to express an interest in competing in the League of Ireland First Division should do so by email by close of business on Tuesday 10th November 2020, stating name, contact and attach current or intended development structures

A week for clubs to decide if they fancy a pop at being a national league club and shoot an email off to one of the lads at the FAI if they do. Amateur hour stuff. :rolleyes:

MonkstownHoop

irish_goat wrote: »

Dublin team though, were the FAI ever going to drop a 3-0 loss on Rovers? I doubt it.

Rovers weren't the first to postpone a game but that probably doesn't fit the narrative

johnnyryan89

kksaints wrote: »

https://www.sseairtricityleague.ie/news/expressions-of-interest-invited-for-league-of-ireland-first-division/id-3559

Any takers I wonder? Limerick and/or Treaty United would be the main one I reckon barring another B team or possible Kerry even. I know Cavan/Monaghan have an U-19 team but I can't see them going for it atm. I know there's Carlow/Kilkenny, Mayo and Kildare teams in the other underage leagues but it's impossible to see them going for it without a few years of U-19s at least.

Would be interesting if both Limerick and Treaty United tried to enter a team. If only one can be picked to enter a team I can't see Pat's team being picked, but would be interesting to see both teams picked. Junior football has been hit hard in Limerick, a few lads might fancy LOI if they can get a few quid expensives even. Main fear would be possible match fixing if you've an influx of junior players as it's going on a lot in the junior game.

Ferris_Bueller

kksaints wrote: »

https://www.sseairtricityleague.ie/news/expressions-of-interest-invited-for-league-of-ireland-first-division/id-3559

Any takers I wonder? Limerick and/or Treaty United would be the main one I reckon barring another B team or possible Kerry even. I know Cavan/Monaghan have an U-19 team but I can't see them going for it atm. I know there's Carlow/Kilkenny, Mayo and Kildare teams in the other underage leagues but it's impossible to see them going for it without a few years of U-19s at least.

I would love to see teams enter from lots of the places you mention but you'd want to be crazy to enter the LOI at the best of times, this year especially. I'd expect some kind of Limerick side to enter but other than that I can't see many applicants.

kksaints

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

I would love to see teams enter from lots of the places you mention but you'd want to be crazy to enter the LOI at the best of times, this year especially. I'd expect some kind of Limerick side to enter but other than that I can't see many applicants.

I agree. I'd love to see all the clubs with underage teams step to the First Division at some stage. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a Limerick application of some sort and possibly a Dundalk B but anything else is hard to see. There's often rumours about some form of Kerry team and I definitely think there will be a team from Kerry in the First Division in the next few years but it's unlikely this or next year.

Pawwed Rig

Any hope of a Monaghan or Kilkenny team coming back? There must be at least a small bit of support still around those areas. I think the vacancy in the first division has to be a Limerick team. There is enough competition in the city with rugby and GAA and Limerick might end up being lost permanently as a venue for top level football.

osarusan

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Would be interesting if both Limerick and Treaty United tried to enter a team. If only one can be picked to enter a team I can't see Pat's team being picked, but would be interesting to see both teams picked. Junior football has been hit hard in Limerick, a few lads might fancy LOI if they can get a few quid expensives even. Main fear would be possible match fixing if you've an influx of junior players as it's going on a lot in the junior game.

Has there been any activity on any new Limerick club forming? I haven't heard of any at all, but am out of the loop.

kksaints

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Any hope of a Monaghan or Kilkenny team coming back? There must be at least a small bit of support still around those areas. I think the vacancy in the first division has to be a Limerick team. There is enough competition in the city with rugby and GAA and Limerick might end up being lost permanently as a venue for top level football.

Kilkenny team is unlikely for a few years. The current underage teams are a joint venture between the Kilkenny and Carlow district leagues to provide top level football for their best schoolboy players. There was an interview with the director of football for the club last year on one of the local radio stations was very noncommittal on progression of the club to Senior level football. Pity because we have the ground for it at least and could probably use Carlow IT facilities for training so there's definitely scope there for a team between the two counties.

hardybuck

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Any hope of a Monaghan or Kilkenny team coming back? There must be at least a small bit of support still around those areas. I think the vacancy in the first division has to be a Limerick team. There is enough competition in the city with rugby and GAA and Limerick might end up being lost permanently as a venue for top level football.

The South East has Waterford FC and Wexford Youths. More than enough for the region, and KK is too small a place to sustain a club IMO, especially with Waterford just down the road.

Monaghan and Cavan have a team in the FAI underage leagues don't they - might be some interest in them continuing that partnership.

Would agree that a team from Limerick has to take that slot for a variety of reasons.

kksaints

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/1103/1175693-shamrock-rovers-appeal-to-fans-to-stay-away/

Smart move by Shams. Should keep the bad PR away if fans do show up at least.

hardybuck

kksaints wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/1103/1175693-shamrock-rovers-appeal-to-fans-to-stay-away/

Smart move by Shams. Should keep the bad PR away if fans do show up at least.

Agreed.

I think they should also offer Derry a chance to play that final outstanding fixture, maybe on Tues or Wed next week before the cup QF. Good PR and is probably the right thing to do.

kksaints

hardybuck wrote: »

The South East has Waterford FC and Wexford Youths. More than enough for the region, and KK is too small a place to sustain a club IMO, especially with Waterford just down the road.

Monaghan and Cavan have a team in the FAI underage leagues don't they - might be some interest in them continuing that partnership.

Would agree that a team from Limerick has to take that slot for a variety of reasons.

I disagree with this tbh, Kilkenny would have a far bigger catchment area than some of the other clubs already in the league such as Cobh, Longford and Athlone and a joint effort between Carlow and Kilkenny would certainly have room for potential. I know Kilkenny is a hurling stronghold but barring Sligo and Dundalk a lot of the other non-Dublin clubs would have pressure from the GAA also. Kilkenny also has a decent Junior soccer league in quality so a club should be sustainable.

CSF

hardybuck wrote: »

Agreed.

I think they should also offer Derry a chance to play that final outstanding fixture, maybe on Tues or Wed next week before the cup QF. Good PR and is probably the right thing to do.

You can’t play it after all the other teams have finished. If those games have all finished, it’s over. I thought they might have pushed them back a bit to slot it in but given that it’s Tuesday now it’s looking less likely.

johnnyryan89

osarusan wrote: »

Has there been any activity on any new Limerick club forming? I haven't heard of any at all, but am out of the loop.

Treaty United. My only concern would be if they even have an interest in a men's senior team as I think most people currently involved were already part of the Limericks women's team before they rebranded as Limerick FC.

Their U17s team play out in the county, and the senior team play in Jackman Park I think.

dan1895

topmanamillion wrote: »

Potential new applicant Clubs/entities who intend to express an interest in competing in the League of Ireland First Division should do so by email by close of business on Tuesday 10th November 2020, stating name, contact and attach current or intended development structures

A week for clubs to decide if they fancy a pop at being a national league club and shoot an email off to one of the lads at the FAI if they do. Amateur hour stuff. :rolleyes:

Gas. I know it's a completely different scenario but if you look at the likes of the MLS or the A League when they are expanding, the teams joining are known two to three years in advance. Who knows what kind of work goes into it before that.
Here? Just drop an email to the association in the next week and your playing ball a couple of months later.

hardybuck

CSF wrote: »

You can’t play it after all the other teams have finished. If those games have all finished, it’s over. I thought they might have pushed them back a bit to slot it in but given that it’s Tuesday now it’s looking less likely.

I think that's the least likely scenario as most of the clubs (i.e. those not in the Cup) would need to absorb the costs of another weeks wages.

hardybuck

dan1895 wrote: »

Gas. I know it's a completely different scenario but if you look at the likes of the MLS or the A League when they are expanding, the teams joining are known two to three years in advance. Who knows what kind of work goes into it before that.
Here? Just drop an email to the association in the next week and your playing ball a couple of months later.

Presumably the notice is just for transparency purposes, and discussions with interested parties have been ongoing behind the scenes?

CSF

hardybuck wrote: »

I think that's the least likely scenario as most of the clubs (i.e. those not in the Cup) would need to absorb the costs of another weeks wages.

Then the only fair scenario is 3-0 Rovers.

topmanamillion

hardybuck wrote: »

Presumably the notice is just for transparency purposes, and discussions with interested parties have been ongoing behind the scenes?

Welcome to the LOI, you're clearly new.

tastyt

dan1895 wrote: »

Gas. I know it's a completely different scenario but if you look at the likes of the MLS or the A League when they are expanding, the teams joining are known two to three years in advance. Who knows what kind of work goes into it before that.
Here? Just drop an email to the association in the next week and your playing ball a couple of months later.

Was reading an article on how clubs are assessed to enter the MLS and it’s light years ahead as you’d expect. They have to have a certain population centre, the grounds must be central or have top class public transport to and from the stadium, they must have top class schoolboy structures and show projections and funds for at least the following 5 years .

Our lads just want an email in a weeks time to let them know you have a feeling .

Btw , the first division just has to be regionalised. There might well be teams in Kerry , Tipp , Mayo that would like a chance to play at a higher level but when the look at the travel costs to go to Galway, Donegal , drogheda etc and players working it just doesn’t make any sense .

joeysoap

Pats had matches postponed too. Is it possible to leave the league unfinished if needs be?

Pawwed Rig

joeysoap wrote: »

Is it possible to leave the league unfinished if needs be?

No. It would make the league a farce

Zebra3

If the league is unfinished, I guess it would be "finished" by a points per game average as other leagues have done.

dfx-

dan1895 wrote: »

Gas. I know it's a completely different scenario but if you look at the likes of the MLS or the A League when they are expanding, the teams joining are known two to three years in advance. Who knows what kind of work goes into it before that.
Here? Just drop an email to the association in the next week and your playing ball a couple of months later.

it's completely different. New MLS clubs are new major clubs, new stadia to be built, players brought in and conferences to be worked out. They're not taking already existing clubs on. They're not taking on NASL clubs like Pittsburgh or Jacksonville.

There isn't a need for 2-3 years advance notice to join the FD. What would you do with the time?

Captain Havoc

hardybuck wrote: »

The South East has Waterford FC and Wexford Youths. More than enough for the region, and KK is too small a place to sustain a club IMO, especially with Waterford just down the road.

Monaghan and Cavan have a team in the FAI underage leagues don't they - might be some interest in them continuing that partnership.

Would agree that a team from Limerick has to take that slot for a variety of reasons.

Kilkenny has enough interest in soccer to sustain a team. I believe the main reason for the demise of Kilkenny City is that Buckley Park is just too far out of the city. It is difficult for kids to get out. I used to have to ask me parents to drop me out, generally it was OK with them and I'd always get a lift back in with someone but I'm sure there were plenty of other kids without a car in the house. In saying that, the path out to Buckley Park is much better these days. I don't see League of Ireland soccer being revived here anytime soon though as the team would need to be moderately successful to attract those fans.