Shooting in Germany

Slowyourrole

I would consider Islamic extremism to be a far right ideology. It would seem to tick all the boxes. Only difference between them and the alt righters is which people they consider lesser.

sid waddell

alastair wrote: »

The record of mass shootings has perpetrators from one side of that spectrum rather more than the other. It became a left vs right debate when some decided to try and dissemble this reality.

And ideology is the key motivating factor in far right shootings.

Every single dog whistling or nakedly racist politician contributes to that cancerous, murderous ideology.

This is basic history.

Nobody should be under any illusions about the threat of the far right. It's the exact same threat as that of the Nazis in the 1930s.

There is no safe dose of fascism, it is a virulent, evil cancer, and I'm sad to say this site is shot through with dog whistling fascists, and even sadder to say they are tolerated.

Burty330

alastair wrote: »

Once again - he didn’t declare or demonstrate any political motivation for his killing spree. That’s confirmed by the police. And where is any Antifa activity covered up? Please try and engage with the facts.

Thats a deflection tactic.

A lot of cases are classed as right-wing despite the shooter not declaring any political motivations.
The Lafayette shooter for example.

If a shooter was a supporter of a far- right political group , he would absolutely be classed as a far-right shooter , regardless of whether or not he declared any motivation for the attack.

The same applies to the Dayton shooting , which was carried out be a left winger.

tjhook

rossie1977 wrote: »

Did Friedman continuously pick a group of people of a certain race or religion and say they were the reason for most of society ills?
Was he overly nationalistic?
Did he believe the military is supreme?
Was he overly sexist and believed women were second class citizens?
Did he want a police state?
Did he has distain for human rights against those he didn't like?
Did he think the national media was biased against his viewpoints and should be controlled so that it was no longer critical of him or those he voted for?
Did he believe corporate power should be protected at all cost while labour power should be very much weakened?
Did he believe religion should play a big role in government?
Did he hate other intellectuals involved in science and the arts who didn't agree with his viewpoints?
Did he believe corruption and cronyism were OK as long as it got or kept his guy in power?
Was he accepting of fraudulent elections as long as it got or kept his guy in power?

If he didn't hold most of those feelings then he wasn't extreme right.

You're highlighting the point I was trying to make. Many of the questions you touch on above have nothing to do with left/right economics. Some have to do with being a despot, some to do with nationalism, some to do with sexism... the only thing those factors have in common is that they are frowned upon in today's world.

You appear to be defining "far right" to mean any and all negative traits. In reality, the world is more complex. E.g. Stalin would tick many of those boxes, but he was economically left, with strong authoritarain beliefs.

Burty330

micosoft wrote: »

No. No it's not a fact. It's an outrageous lie that gets propagated to frequently by people "who want to say it like it is" but actually just want to repeat claims that are easy to verify as untrue. There is considerable evidence that in the US right wing murder vastly outweighs Islamist. In Europe and other "white countries" it's more of a wash but close. Of course - that requires ignoring the number of Muslims murdered by Western countries especially in the second oil war in Iraq. Because their lives don't matter right?



If we are going to address evil we should probably address the fact that Islamic terror was created by the west going as far back as the creation of Saudi Arabia and the desire for oil or the undermining of Iran and Afghanistan

Islamic terror on a global scale blows every other source of terror out of the water. Nothing in this world comes close to Islamic terror

Burty330

sid waddell wrote: »

And ideology is the key motivating factor in far right shootings.

Every single dog whistling or nakedly racist politician contributes to that cancerous, murderous ideology.

This is basic history.

Nobody should be under any illusions about the threat of the far right. It's the exact same threat as that of the Nazis in the 1930s.

There is no safe dose of fascism, it is a virulent, evil cancer, and I'm sad to say this site is shot through with dog whistling fascists, and even sadder to say they are tolerated.

Equating the right wing of today to the Nazi's of the 1930's?? You are deluded , brainwashed and beyond hope.

SnakePlissken

alastair wrote: »

I’d love to see this record of the FBI saying the killings were not politically motivated.

Equally I'd love to see any shred of credible evidence that this school shooting was politically motivated and why it belongs on this false list of right wing attacks.

alastair

Burty330 wrote: »

Thats a deflection tactic.

A lot of cases are classed as right-wing despite the shooter not declaring any political motivations.
The Lafayette shooter for example.

If a shooter was a supporter of a far- right political group , he would absolutely be classed as a far-right shooter , regardless of whether or not he declared any motivation for the attack.

The same applies to the Dayton shooting , which was carried out be a left winger.

The Layfayette killer was pretty unambiguous about his far right motivations. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2016/01/louisiana-theater-shooter-john-housers-hate-filled-journal-released.html

And one more time for luck - the Dayton killer expressed or demonstrated no political motives for his spree. As confirmed by the police.

sid waddell

Burty330 wrote: »

Equating the right wing of today to the Nazi's of the 1930's?? You are deluded , brainwashed and beyond hope.

Did I say "right wing"? No, I didn't. Fine Gael are right wing. Did I equate Fine Gael to the far right? No I, didn't, (even though they flirted with their own racist dog whistler in Wexford a few months back before wisely dispensing with her "services"). So stop trying to lie that I did.

But the far right are increasingly consuming mainstream politics as we see in the US, the UK and throughout Europe. And unchecked, that always leads to one thing. Genocide.

There is NO safe dose of fascism.

alastair

SnakePlissken wrote: »

Equally I'd love to see any shred of credible evidence that this school shooting was politically motivated and why it belongs on this false list of right wing attacks.

So - can you stand over your claim with regard to the FBI or not?

Eric Cartman

Deleted User wrote: »

Posted this elsewhere recently, but here's a list of USA attacks up to the time this comment was posted on Reddit early last year.



It's not a matter of keeping score, but let's not kid ourselves that 'the right' are angels or anything.

https://www.europol.europa.eu/crime-areas-and-trends/crime-areas/terrorism

Of the 12 trends identified in the latest TE-SAT, most related to jihadist terrorism. While there was a large number of terrorist attacks not connected with jihadism, the latter accounts for the most serious forms of terrorist activity as nearly all reported fatalities and most of the casualties were the result of jihadist terrorist attacks.

The attacks in Manchester (with explosives) and Barcelona (with vehicles), which intended to randomly kill and wound as many people as possible, again demonstrated the harm jihadist militants are able and willing to inflict upon EU citizens, legitimised by the interpretation they adopted of selectively sampled religious texts.

Jihadist terrorists can be both directed by the Islamic State (IS) or merely inspired by IS ideology and rhetoric. Jihadist terrorists have been found to use a range of weapons to include bladed weapons, automatic rifles, explosives and vehicles, and are expected to continue to do so.

Jihadist attacks can be both carefully prepared and carried out spontaneously. Terrorists acting in the name of IS have proven to be able to plan relatively complex attacks – including those on multiple targets – quickly and effectively.

In terms of right-wing terrorism, the report notes that politicians, public figures, political parties, civic action groups and media that take a critical view of right-wing extremism, or advocate pro-migration policies, have to be considered as potential targets of right-wing extremist agitation, given the incidences of attacks and physical assaults on them.

Anarchist and left-wing extremists, on the other hand, take advantage of peaceful demonstrations to carry out attacks on government property and law enforcement personnel, the report finds.

Europol considers both left and right wing terrorism as attacks on the government and authorities but states islamic terrorism is Europes largest and most frequent threat.

As a note, Europe often doesn't count sustained economic terrorism which the left and climate alarmist left regularly impose on societies around Europe costing business billions a year and costing lives by delaying ambulances etc...

Burty330

alastair wrote: »

The Layfayette killer was pretty unambiguous about his far right motivations. https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2016/01/louisiana-theater-shooter-john-housers-hate-filled-journal-released.html

And one more time for luck - the Dayton killer expressed or demonstrated no political motives for his spree. As confirmed by the police.

At the end of the day , it doesn't matter what spin to try to apply in an effort to denounce Betts as a left wing shooter. He was heavily ensconced in left wing ideologies.


https://forward.com/opinion/428960/the-dayton-murderer-is-proof-we-need-to-take-left-wing-violence-seriously/

James Brown

So if I read this right, the first page is mostly assuming its Muslim related, then it drifts into news reports with fewer insights and then goes to a vague left verses right, followed by an in depth analysis of the Daytona shooter.
All we need is a follow up puff piece on 'how could this have happened?' With a pic of the perpetrator as a curly haired smiling child.
And people complain the media won't cover attacks? Dropped off the radar already.

sid waddell

Burty330 wrote: »

At the end of the day , it doesn't matter what spin to try to apply in an effort to denounce Betts as a left wing shooter. He was heavily ensconced in left wing ideologies.


https://forward.com/opinion/428960/the-dayton-murderer-is-proof-we-need-to-take-left-wing-violence-seriously/

Seriously, you're pathetic.

The reaction of you and other posters here is utterly transparent.

A far right scumbag murders as many Muslims as he can purely because they are Muslim, which is the entirely logical outcome of far right ideology, always, and you and others are on here trying to deflect, obfuscate, talk about anything you can except the fact that the spread of far right ideology always leads to murder and is completely indivisible from murder and genocide. In the past, now, in the future, always.

Don't think normal people can't see exactly what you're trying to do.

alastair

Burty330 wrote: »

At the end of the day , it doesn't matter what spin to try to apply in an effort to denounce Betts as a left wing shooter. He was heavily ensconced in left wing ideologies.


https://forward.com/opinion/428960/the-dayton-murderer-is-proof-we-need-to-take-left-wing-violence-seriously/

No spin required. The investigation produced not a shred of evidence his spree was politically motivated. Fact.

Nice unbiased source you chose there btw.

MakingMovies2

Impotent angry sad white men are the biggest threat to civilization. No wonder you have the usual band of cohorts on here making excuses

Burty330

Burty330 wrote: »

Even if it wasn't brought up to date , the finding was concluded with a statement of falsity.

Have you taken leave of your senses?.......for the last time, it's not my list. The statement at the end is also not mine. I don't know how you expect someone to include an event to a list when that event occurs about 12 months after the list was compiled.

Burty330 wrote: »

Unless a killer declares themselves far left , then its either a case of mental illness or outright dismissal of their political beliefs.

That excuse is used much more often to disassociate from violent right-wingers in the USA than by liberal minded people to excuse Islamic fundamentalist terror attacks........you need look no further than this thread for an example....

antix80 wrote: »

And most of the perpetrators have mental health issues rather than a well developed political ideology.

Eric Cartman

Eric Cartman wrote: »

As a note, Europe often doesn't count sustained economic terrorism which the left and climate alarmist left regularly impose on societies around Europe costing business billions a year and costing lives by delaying ambulances etc...

Yeah, cos campaigning for more funds to help clean up the planet is on a par with murdering a load of brown people because they don't belong in your country. Get a grip, FFS.

Burty330

sid waddell wrote: »

Did I say "right wing"? No, I didn't. Fine Gael are right wing. Did I equate Fine Gael to the far right? No I, didn't, (even though they flirted with their own racist dog whistler in Wexford a few months back before wisely dispensing with her "services"). So stop trying to lie that I did.

But the far right are increasingly consuming mainstream politics as we see in the US, the UK and throughout Europe. And unchecked, that always leads to one thing. Genocide.

There is NO safe dose of fascism.

We don't live in a fascist society and the conservative party are not far right. Boris was as liberal as you get when he was London Mayor.

When you don't have control , your opposition becomes a far left nazi. Its common and cheap tactic to steal the higher ground.

If you want to really know why Labour was trounced its because people can't identify when the proposal of socialism and communism being an acceptable social economic model.

We are not facing any threat of genocide and people whose harmless beliefs don't stack up with yours are not sleeper agents of Hitler. .

osarusan

Eric Cartman wrote: »

As a note, Europe often doesn't count sustained economic terrorism which the left and climate alarmist left regularly impose on societies around Europe costing business billions a year and costing lives by delaying ambulances etc...

Of all the irrelevant stuff shoehorned into the thread to derail it, this is the most pathetic.

Eric Cartman

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yeah, cos campaigning for more funds to help clean up the planet is on a par with murdering a load of brown people because they don't belong in your country. Get a grip, FFS.

Its still terrorism , even if you just want to call it ‘campaigning’

If we want to start a heirarchy of terrorism we have :

Islam
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Left and right wing political terrorism
.
Economic terrorism caused by protests
.
.
General vandalism.

Where do we stop giving out about it ?

Burty330

alastair wrote: »

No spin required. The investigation produced not a shred of evidence his spree was politically motivated. Fact.

Nice unbiased source you chose there btw.

He was a left winger. FACT.

MakingMovies2

Burty330 wrote: »

We don't live in a fascist society and the conservative party are not far right. Boris was as liberal as you get when he was London Mayor.

When you don't have control , your opposition becomes a far left nazi. Its common and cheap tactic to steal the higher ground.

If you want to really know why Labour was trounced its because people can't identify when the proposal of socialism and communism being an acceptable social economic model.

We are not facing any threat of genocide and people whose harmless beliefs don't stack up with yours are not sleeper agents of Hitler. .

Boris Johnson is a Nazi. Look at the new immigration policy introduced yesterday. Far right neo nazi scum

Burty330

MakingMovies2 wrote: »

Boris Johnson is a Nazi. Look at the new immigration policy introduced yesterday. Far right neo nazi scum

Same as liberal Australia's.

MakingMovies2

Burty330 wrote: »

Same as liberal Australia's.

Look at the far right scumbag in Australia who's burned the country to a crisp. That's what they all want for us.

SnakePlissken

alastair wrote: »

So - can you stand over your claim with regard to the FBI or not?

It's not a claim it's a statement of fact, I could post a source but... why should I?

A poster which you seem to be in agreement with stated that this school shooting was carried out as an act of right wing terror, it's beholden to him to prove such a statement is correct, not for me to prove it as incorrect.

Do you believe the Florida school shooting was a right wing politically motivated act? If so do please post some reputable links to prove me wrong.

alastair

Burty330 wrote: »

He was a left winger. FACT.

Yes, he was. By US standards anyway. But that had nothing to do with his motivations to kill people. FACT. Ask the police.

nthclare

Antifa really did it this time that's for sure.

alastair

SnakePlissken wrote: »

It's not a claim it's a statement of fact, I could post a source but... why should I?

A poster which you seem to be in agreement with stated that this school shooting was carried out as an act of right wing terror, it's beholden to him to prove such a statement is correct, not for me to prove it as incorrect.

So - no evidence to support YOUR claim. Gotcha.

The evidence for the far right motivations of the school shooter were produced. I should know - I uploaded them.

Eric Cartman

alastair wrote: »

Yes, he was. By US standards anyway. But that had nothing to do with his motivations to kill people. FACT. Ask the police.

So are you saying people can have political views and it has nothing to do with them being involved in a mass shooting ?