Another dead homeless person

Oranage2

CinemaGuy45 wrote: »

People for the most part only seem to read headlines.
The internet and smart devices give instant gratification.
There is no nuance in any debate anymore it just like a loud drunken row.

There are two teams here left and right and a few people trying to actually discuss and debate topics.

Of course it's a nice sound bite to say help our own first, and of course most people will agree.

But 'our own' don't want help, there are enough beds for all the homeless people in Ireland but some people don't want to stay usually because of substance abuse or mental problems. I remember reading a story about a homeless man trying to burn down a house in Rathmines of a woman who tried to help him.

As a society you could say we failed them but we don't have the resources to help people at every stage of their life.

CinemaGuy45

Oranage2 wrote: »

Of course it's a nice sound bite to say help our own first, and of course most people will agree.

But 'our own' don't want help, there are enough beds for all the homeless people in Ireland but some people don't want to stay usually because of substance abuse or mental problems. I remember reading a story about a homeless man trying to burn down a house in Rathmines of a woman who tried to help him.

As a society you could say we failed them but we don't have the resources to help people at every stage of their life.

I would rather die than live on the streets so you're right it is emotion that is the motivating factor for many that say let us take care of our own first.

However most of us including myself have no experience of addiction mental illness and what it is really like out there.

There has to be more that society can do for people in this situation.

Oranage2

How much can we help them though

Their parents are abusive - there's social care
They are poor in school - No real help here
They're start misbehaving as a youth -there's a juvenile liaison officer

They can't find a home or job - there is social welfare and temporary housing

They become addicted to drugs - there are addiction clinics

They become homeless - homeless shelters.

So there is help out there, how effective is it is another question but there are services to try and stop this.

Spanish Eyes

There has probably never been so much care for the street people as there is today.

You can lead a horse to water and all that. Kudos to those who are trying anyway. Some will never be saved and we have to accept that.

Dank Janniels

How many homeless Irish people are in them hotels in Rooskey and Oughterard? We look after our own etc etc

limnam

Oranage2 wrote: »

Of course it's a nice sound bite to say help our own first, and of course most people will agree.

But 'our own' don't want help, there are enough beds for all the homeless people in Ireland but some people don't want to stay usually because of substance abuse or mental problems. I remember reading a story about a homeless man trying to burn down a house in Rathmines of a woman who tried to help him.

As a society you could say we failed them but we don't have the resources to help people at every stage of their life.

Some 2,498 children and 3,764 adults are waiting to get an appointment with mental health services.

You do not want to be unwell in this country at the moment.

v638sg7k1a92bx

Is this Sinn Féin’s fault now?

limnam

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

There has probably never been so much care for the street people as there is today.

You can lead a horse to water and all that. Kudos to those who are trying anyway. Some will never be saved and we have to accept that.

I think we need to do a hell of a lot more before we can say oh well

Idbatterim

Martin Lanigan wrote: »

Same clowns that voted for a sponger like Violet-Anne and a racist like Cronin.

have any of these people attempted fraud, like Maria Bailey?

Idbatterim

jcullen222 wrote: »

The homeless issue has been talked about for years, we need something actually done about it, hopefully SF will get into government and live up to their promises.

I think they might improve it, but you cant end it. The system is totally ****ed and even if you were to change it, it would take a while to reap the rewards... (rewards for some) - others want high prices, hence we have them

Spanish Eyes

limnam wrote: »

I think we need to do a hell of a lot more before we can say oh well

Like what? If the supports are there, and they are, and people choose not to avail of them, what do you suggest?

There is a cohort of homeless that will not engage. Not much we can do really unless we put them in chains and take them off the streets is there?

Raconteuse

There have always been rough sleepers with addiction and mental health issues who are unable to live in accommodation. They're not in their situation simply because of losing their home. Giving them a home won't wipe away their problems. They might not even stay there.

Blaming the government is nonsensical, and giving asylum seekers accommodation won't change what I've described above.

Idbatterim

jcullen222 wrote: »

We need to CPO land in rural Fingal, north Kildare etc and build, build build.

the state already has masses of land, even in dublin. take a read of this briefly...

http://www.davidmcwilliams.ie/lets-join-the-21st-century-with-an-easy-fix-for-housing-crisis-once-and-for-all/

joe40

There will always be people rough sleeping and homeless due to drug addiction and mental health issues and in these cases tragedies are inevitable.
I know they need help and it should be given, but the issues are more complex than just providing a house.
To use these tragedies as an excuse to vent anti immigrant bile is just taking advantage of homelessness to pursue a different agenda.

ChikiChiki

Walked from Lesson St to Parnell Sq yesterday evening around 8pm I passed by 4 soup kitchens on the way. There was a large crowd around each with a mix of demographics in the queue young and old. Plenty of kids.

This is not something I remember in all my years working in the city. I was abroad for 3 years up until May last year and it was not that bad before.

I challenge anyone who questions if a crisis even exists to see this for themselves. Next Wednesday night walk a similar route and see. I know a lot of my own friends who don't be near the city would be none the wiser of the scale. Whatever is going on is not right.

limnam

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Like what? If the supports are there, and they are, and people choose not to avail of them, what do you suggest?

There is a cohort of homeless that will not engage. Not much we can do really unless we put them in chains and take them off the streets is there?

How are they there?

Thousands of people on waiting lists for mental health services.

Some people can't even get on with a GP as a lot of GP's are not taking on anymore.

How many dry beds do we have?

it's not a time to shrug that's the way it is.

Lonesomerhodes

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Walked from Lesson St to Parnell Sq yesterday evening around 8pm I passed by 4 soup kitchens on the way. There was a large crowd around each with a mix of demographics in the queue young and old. Plenty of kids.

This is not something I remember in all my years working in the city. I was abroad for 3 years up until May last year and it was not that bad before.

I challenge anyone who questions if a crisis even exists to see this for themselves. Next Wednesday night walk a similar route and see. I know a lot of my own friends who don't be near the city would be none the wiser of the scale. Whatever is going on is not right.

Yes it's bad.

The talk of mental health and addiction issues is interesting. I'm sure many many do have these issues and spoke to several homeless who do have these issues but it's never pointed out in this argument that many wealthy successful and professional people have mental health issues and addiction issues too.

Clearly it's not the addiction and mental health issues alone. Certainly doesn't help.

ChikiChiki

ChikiChiki wrote: »

Walked from Lesson St to Parnell Sq yesterday evening around 8pm I passed by 4 soup kitchens on the way. There was a large crowd around each with a mix of demographics in the queue young and old. Plenty of kids.

This is not something I remember in all my years working in the city. I was abroad for 3 years up until May last year and it was not that bad before.

I challenge anyone who questions if a crisis even exists to see this for themselves. Next Wednesday night walk a similar route and see. I know a lot of my own friends who don't be near the city would be none the wiser of the scale. Whatever is going on is not right.

Are you saying that ALL those eating at soup kitchens are homeless and sleeping rough?

There was a photo of a child eating off a piece of cardboard doing the rounds. When looked into, he lived in a nearby hotel with his mother, who rather than buy him a meal, found it cheaper to go to the nearest soup kitchen!

limnam

Deleted User wrote: »

Are you saying that ALL those eating at soup kitchens are homeless and sleeping rough?

There was a photo of a child eating off a piece of cardboard doing the rounds. When looked into, he lived in a nearby hotel with his mother, who rather than buy him a meal, found it cheaper to go to the nearest soup kitchen!

Are we calling young kids been brought up in a single room in a hotel with no cooking facilities etc not homeless?

Christ.

limnam

limnam wrote: »

Are we calling young kids been brought up in a single room in a hotel with no cooking facilities etc not homeless?

Christ.

Are you saying that they get nothing to eat in the hotel?

limnam

Deleted User wrote: »

Are you saying that they get nothing to eat in the hotel?

I'm saying they're homeless.

limnam

limnam wrote: »

I'm saying they're homeless.

They’ve got a roof over their head, free, gratis and for nothing. And a warm bed. They’re NOT sleeping rough on the streets ergo they’re NOT homeless.

collywobble7

Bowie wrote:

You were being flippant about someone dying. Was pointing it out with sarcasm, It's all there to read.

No he wasn't...

limnam

Deleted User wrote: »

They’ve got a roof over their head, free, gratis and for nothing. And a warm bed. They’re NOT sleeping rough on the streets ergo they’re NOT homeless.

Ah it's enough.

All any kid could want growing up; a hotel room.

greenttc

I liked Irish Grovers sentiment in their post and I thought it was unfair how the OP attacked the post. Asking someone if they are out volunteering or helping directly in order to rubbish a viewpoint is just wrong. OP talked about all the hours he works to support his "foreign wife and child", well perhaps Irish grover also has a family to support and doesn't have time to help any cause directly as you suggested. It doesn't lessen their stance.

I think that we need to understand that we are all helping indirectly through taxation etc and it is our responsibility to vote in leaders who will use government funds in a way we believe in. Every individual in Ireland cannot rush out and volunteer, it would be chaos. I realise there are all sorts of arguments that can be brought up around this and there are issues here but the point I am trying to make is that we are all contributing in some way, we cant all physically get out and help.

The reason I liked Irish Grovers post was that it mirrors my own belief in that we cant have a "them and us" attitude, it is morally wrong. We need to think of a bigger picture and not merely think of our own patch and I think historically Ireland has done this fairly well. All humans are equally deserving of assistance and help, all humans are vulnerable and need to be looked after. We need to recognise the needs of those born in and out of Ireland, everyone is equally deserving. It is the "them and us" attitude that causes so much hate and negativity and blinds us from the basic work that needs to be done. Again, yes, there are issues of some people doing the wrong thing and we may say that they don't deserve help as much but we cannot mar everyone by some peoples wrongs.

Martin Lanigan

Idbatterim wrote: »

have any of these people attempted fraud, like Maria Bailey?

Is doing a charity out of 12k not on a par?

Graces7

Raconteuse wrote: »

There have always been rough sleepers with addiction and mental health issues who are unable to live in accommodation. They're not in their situation simply because of losing their home. Giving them a home won't wipe away their problems. They might not even stay there.

Blaming the government is nonsensical, and giving asylum seekers accommodation won't change what I've described above.

So help them on the streets. My family work in Canada with the huge numbers of rough sleepers ie truly homeless there. After a few months the people become habituated to street life and cannot be housed. Many have eg mental health problems.

So they are helped where they are. Fed, clothed; in bad weather some of the churches open their basements or social halls... we give bales of hay in really bad weather. We cannot cure their ills but we can make them more comfortable. A hot drink on a cold day. A waterproof from a thrift shop. You can get a good rain cape at eg Mr, Price here for a couple of euros.

Lonesomerhodes

Lonesomerhodes wrote: »

Well it certainly didn't help.

Cold, frost, lack of cleaning facilites or warmth etc etc.

Why not look after the man with a basic home rather than millions and billions on direct provision centres.

I know the left leaning loola's will say direct provision centres aren't a home.

Very true.

Neither is a tent in a park or a cardboard in a shop doorway however.

;

this is boring. im bored now.

limnam

limnam wrote: »

Ah it's enough.

All any kid could want growing up; a hotel room.

on the other hand: life aint made up of what kids want growing up.

go give out to the kid's parents. taxpayers arent an ATM neither.

limnam

Deleted User wrote: »

on the other hand: life aint made up of what kids want growing up.

go give out to the kid's parents. taxpayers arent an ATM neither.

Yet people sit and wonder how the fck a party like SF managed to win the popular vote.

It's this. Exactly this.