working above my pay grade, any advice

Shuhada Davitt

Simply ask them for an acting allowance.
i was asked onto a team where the role of the new job was above my grade, so they put me on an acting allowance - an allowance you get on top of your normal grade salary that is basically for these situations.

if you are doing the work of a grade 5 and you are grade 4, then you should 100% be asking for an acting allowance.

they dont just exist in the civil service.

fvck all that sh!te people are saying about "it might be noticed" - this is the exact thing that people should NOT do, ever, for any company.
ruthless bosses RELY on people thinking "if i do well here, they'll promote me" - THEY WONT.
they literally rely on suckers to do this type of thing all the time.

only do it if you get paid for it. if you dont - Dont worry about "falling out with management" - that will happen ANYWAY when they know you're wise to what they're up to - trying to make you work for free for something they dont want to do themselves. F That!

OMM 0000

Shuhada Davitt wrote: »

only do it if you get paid for it.

I don't agree with this.

You have to think long term.

Developing relationships with senior management and making your case for a promotion are way more valuable than a few months of extra cash.

I guess it depends on what you want. For example, I would happily take a title change over a bit of extra cash. Because then in your next job you can jump up another level again.

For example, let's say you take a supervisor role without extra payment. Then in your next job you can move to an assistant manager role. Do this a few times and you'll be way ahead in your career in 3 or 4 years.

AlanG

Shuhada Davitt wrote: »

Simply ask them for an acting allowance.
i was asked onto a team where the role of the new job was above my grade, so they put me on an acting allowance - an allowance you get on top of your normal grade salary that is basically for these situations.

This is good advice - even if ou don't get it the request should go to higher management who will then be made aware that you are doing these tasks. Most managers don't mind paying for extra work if it is justified so you need to make your case.

Strumms

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I don't agree with this.

You have to think long term.

Developing relationships with senior management and making your case for a promotion are way more valuable than a few months of extra cash.

I guess it depends on what you want. For example, I would happily take a title change over a bit of extra cash. Because then in your next job you can jump up another level again.

For example, let's say you take a supervisor role without extra payment. Then in your next job you can move to an assistant manager role. Do this a few times and you'll be way ahead in your career in 3 or 4 years.

It depends on what you want yes. Right thinking people want a fair wage, for a fair days work and the pay to be relative to the responsibility they have NOW, now, not in years to come. If you are delegated / awarded a job with more responsibility, more effort, more requirements.. there needs to be more pay, forget 4 years down the road, the company could be gone bust. Doing the job now, be getting paid and rewarded for it NOW... ‘promises’ from management don’t mean jack... want me to do the job NOW ? Ok, pay me for doing it, NOW !

OMM 0000

Strumms wrote: »

Right thinking people want a fair wage, for a fair days work and the pay to be relative to the responsibility they have NOW, now, not in years to come.

Not "right" thinking people but "now" thinking people.

I'm not saying there's anything necessarily "wrong" with living in the now and not taking advantage of these opportunities, I'm saying it's the wrong decision long term and it's not the smartest choice.

I know how this works though, you're going to dig your feet in further, etc., so let's agree to disagree.

What level of management are you at? Just curious.

Strumms

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Not "right" thinking people but "now" thinking people.

I'm not saying there's anything necessarily "wrong" with living in the now and not taking advantage of these opportunities, I'm saying it's the wrong decision long term and it's not the smartest choice.

I know how this works though, you're going to dig your feet in further, etc., so let's agree to disagree.

What level of management are you at? Just curious.

Yes think of now, it’s the right thing to do both short and long term. I was in a previous job where we were getting led all around the block with carrot and stick approaches re: if you go above doing (A) it will work positivity for pay negotiation, do (B) and when these promotion(s) come on stream you’ll be a shoe in... pay rises had gone from 4.5 - 5% per annum down to .5% and promotions ? None ever came within our field in 6 years due to the nature of the business the team wasn’t growing and technology was negating the need too for extra bodies..

Never put much sway into management ‘promises’. ‘We WILL do, you WILL have’... oldest trick in the book, carrot and stick tactics ... show me action not promises...Management always prefer words over actions.

beauf

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I don't agree with this at all.

In fact, the opposite is often the case, as companies which are chaotic are crying out for order.

Management are people, and people want order and leadership. Be the person who can provide that.....

That assumes all people (in this case managers) are the same and logical.

They aren't. Some people are dysfunctional, and they are the owner or in charge.

OMM 0000

beauf wrote: »

That assumes all people (in this case managers) are the same and logical.

They aren't. Some people are dysfunctional, and they are the owner or in charge.

Aren't you being a little bit negative?

I don't think your mentality is a good one to have.

I hope I'm wrong and your career works out for you.

beauf

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Not "right" thinking people but "now" thinking people.

I'm not saying there's anything necessarily "wrong" with living in the now and not taking advantage of these opportunities, I'm saying it's the wrong decision long term and it's not the smartest choice.

I know how this works though, you're going to dig your feet in further, etc., so let's agree to disagree.

What level of management are you at? Just curious.

Why not assume hes Trump ?

If you are trying to get a project over the line a manager, owner, etc will always say the extra is worth it. What else would they say.

Of course not following through only works a few times before you lose credibility.

Besides it actually not the core of the issue the OP is asking about. He wants qualified oversight on a critical project. he doesn't mind doing the work.

beauf

OMM 0000 wrote: »

Aren't you being a little bit negative?

I don't think your mentality is a good one to have.

I hope I'm wrong and your career works out for you.

Its just realistic. The world is full every variation of people. you have to plan for it.

OMM 0000

beauf wrote: »

I love the way you always turn these discussions into personal comments, against the forum rules.

Its just realistic. The world is full every variation of people. you have to plan for it.

I always turn these discussions into personal comments?

I'm not allowed point out you're being negative? I'm not allowed wish you well in your career?

I think you're perhaps looking at my comments in the most negative way possible, and that's actually the "trouble" being caused here.

I'll add you to my ignore list so I don't need to worry about offending you.

Strumms

He’s not being negative, he’s being realistic, he has a well equipped understanding and appropriate appreciation for many employers, their poor attitudes, greed funded outlooks when it comes to decision making as relates to their staff.

OMM 0000

Strumms wrote: »

He’s not being negative, he’s being realistic, he has a well equipped understanding and appropriate appreciation for many employers, their poor attitudes, greed funded outlooks when it comes to decision making as relates to their staff.

I don't agree with you. When you know how to play the game (and it is a game) you can turn all this stuff to your advantage.

Or you can complain, have a bad attitude, and get nowhere.

I don't see the point of that. It sounds miserable.

Anyway, that's my advice. It works, I'm proof.

Strumms

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I don't agree with you. When you know how to play the game (and it is a game) you can turn all this stuff to your advantage.

Or you can complain, have a bad attitude, and get nowhere.

I don't see the point of that. It sounds miserable.

Anyway, that's my advice. It works, I'm proof.

Don’t complain, don’t entertain the conversation, just say ‘NO’. There are just too many employers out there who have you doing all this extra, have you going home mentally and physically fûcked yet the promise that it might someday somewhat benefit you career, usually it won’t, usually it’s a ruse for to get you to routinely go over and above, you and your colleagues saving them tens of thousands in manpower per year and six figures even over a decade. Be wide to them, hired as an accountant ? Do accountancy work, they want you to take on payroll ? Fûck em, not your job... stick together and stick to what your job is... YOUR job ONLY.

beauf

Its obvious some people didn't even read as far as this part.

rockhardplace wrote: »

....I've made it clear that I am willing to help as much as possible with these tasks ....

Which just illustrates some people don't do any critical listening. Its likely the OP is having the same issue in his location. They only hear what they want to hear.

Augme

It's a huge mistakes not to either ask for extra money or another benefit when being asked to do extra work above and beyond. If you just do the work and say nothing you'll lose a bit of respect tin the eyes of senior management and they'll generally place a lower ceiling on your future in certain companies and areas of work.

LegacyUser

beauf wrote: »

Its obvious some people didn't even read as far as this part.



Which just illustrates some people don't do any critical listening. Its likely the OP is having the same issue in his location. They only hear what they want to hear.

Yeah I said that I'll help because there doesn't seem to be any other option so far. My boss was very sulky when I put up resistance to doing the work and said made the point that it was outside of my grade. I met a manager today and told them what I was doing and without mentioning the grade or salary they said that I should ask for more money, they basically told me I was locked into doing the project now and I should ask for more money. The project is for the next 6-7 months. It seems like I should wait for my boss to leave and then have a conversation with her boss.

beauf

Money certainly shows someone is serious about the project. No money, not so much.

theboss80

backspacer wrote: »

Would you not consider applying for the post OP, if you are already been assigned the duties for it, you may as well try and see can you reap the financial rewards as well?

+1

Apply for the role and if refused on basis of lack of specialist degree or whatever then use that as your backup for not doing the extra work anyway as you are not suitably qualified....

AulWan

rockhardplace wrote: »

They keep telling me that I am not responsible but I feel like this is gas lighting of the highest order as I am the only one doing the work and that will be the case for a long time as the hiring process takes ages at my organisation.

Get that in writing.

Cupatae

rockhardplace wrote: »

My manager is leaving at a critical time and a lot of work which is above my grade is being foisted on to me. I complained about this to my manager and she got out my job description which is incredibly vague, she is stressed, has been acting irrational so is not the best person to talk to about this. The key thing is that I know for a fact that in other departments people who have the same job as me are not responsible for these tasks. I've made it clear that I am willing to help as much as possible with these tasks but I don't want to be held accountable for high level decision making that could come back to bite me firmly on the ass. The project that we are delivering comes around once in a blue moon and is critical in terms of the economical benefit to the company so it's not something to be taken lightly.

Obviously there is some benefit to me acting above my grade and learning new things in terms of potential future job progression but I feel like the pressure is building up on me and the easy 'not a care in the world' 'leave work at 5' job that I once enjoyed is rescinding into the distance. I know that my employer who is hiring for my bosses position at the moment is not interested in hiring someone who has expertise in my area as they are focusing on another aspect of the job description and they are hoping that this person will learn on the job.
They keep telling me that I am not responsible but I feel like this is gas lighting of the highest order as I am the only one doing the work and that will be the case for a long time as the hiring process takes ages at my organisation.

I had the same nonsense happening me, if you re taking on more responsibility ask for more money, or stick to what you were doing previously, don't do nothing for free or under the notion that they LL "remember" the time you did em a good turn.

Strumms

Cupatae wrote: »

I had the same nonsense happening me, if you re taking on more responsibility ask for more money, or stick to what you were doing previously, don't do nothing for free or under the notion that they LL "remember" the time you did em a good turn.

100%, value yourself and your colleagues , if they want more upwards and more outside of your job description, pay grade and job title, they consult and pay to get it. Your premise for working there is you answering an add with a job title, description and an explained set of tasks in the interview... anything changes in that scope or they want it to, the wages better be prepared to increase to account for that.

I was under the impression it was legal for you to carry out tasks under your pay grade but not above it, without recognition and pay for it.

BattleCorp

Strumms wrote: »

I was under the impression it was legal for you to carry out tasks under your pay grade but not above it, without recognition and pay for it.

Nope, no laws to that effect.