Gardaí: Provo Army Council oversees PIRA & SF

UDAWINNER

UDAWINNER wrote: »

. I await Drews evidence, could be a long wait though

I am very surprised he allowed himself to be brought into this, but I suppose his background as a ruc/ psni man means he would always defend them.
Usually a Garda commissioner would not get dragged into this.

Point is AGS are the intelligence service of Ireland, as such they would be aware of intelligence relating to certain activities, not just republican activities.
Intelligence is different from evidence.
AGS, are not about to come out & release the intelligence they hold on anybody to the general public.
Not should they. They have a job to do. It doesn't involve releasing all the information they have to the public.

FrancieBrady

bubblypop wrote: »

AGS, are not about to come out & release the intelligence they hold on anybody to the general public.

Unless you are politicians on the left, like Mick Wallace and Clare Daly, who coincidentally were looking into and asking questions about AGS corruption.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Unless you are politicians on the left, like Mick Wallace and Clare Daly, who coincidentally were looking into and asking questions about AGS corruption.

Did they release some intelligence on these two?

smurgen

I always find a high amount of twitter comments in proportion to the amount of twitter likes means it hasn't gone down well

threeball

McMurphy wrote: »

Just to stop you there, The Omagh bombing was carried out by dissident Republicans, those that are opposed to the GFA and view Sinn Fein as traitors etc.

The Omagh atrocity was carried out by the same group a certain Ms Cahill belonged to as it happens, the same ms Cahill that was plonked into the Seanad by Burton and Kenny.

Nothing to do with the posts you reference. The poster had claimed they were brave men and women who fought a just cause. We merely pointed out how "brave" these scumbags were.

FrancieBrady

bubblypop wrote: »

Did they release some intelligence on these two?

https://www.thejournal.ie/clare-daly-gsoc-2776449-May2016/

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/alan-shatter-breached-data-protection-rules-by-referencing-mick-wallaces-alleged-caution-in-rte-interview-high-court-hears-35967151.html

McMurphy

threeball wrote: »

Nothing to do with the posts you reference. The poster had claimed they were brave men and women who fought a just cause. We merely pointed out how "brave" these scumbags were.

And I'm pointing out that Kenny and Burton had absolutely zero issues plonking one of these scumbags into our Seanad.

Cork_Langer1

I don't know if this has been posted already, has AGS position only change since Harris came along?

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/clare-daly-gsoc-2776449-May2016/

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/alan-shatter-breached-data-protection-rules-by-referencing-mick-wallaces-alleged-caution-in-rte-interview-high-court-hears-35967151.html

Neither if those were intelligence released by An Garda Siochana

FrancieBrady

bubblypop wrote: »

Neither if those were intelligence released by An Garda Siochana

Sure...the Garda Commissioner didn't tell Alan Shatter about Wallace's caution and the Gardai didn't leak the info about Daly. Sure...silly me.

dxhound2005

Cork_Langer1 wrote: »

I don't know if this has been posted already, has AGS position only change since Harris came along?

Also from 2015 and before Drew Harris, is this later assessment, including things which happened after 2009. It is in line with what the Commissoner said when reporters asked him to give the up to date assessment.

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR15000545

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Sure...the Garda Commissioner didn't tell Alan Shatter about Wallace's caution and the Gardai didn't leak the info about Daly. Sure...silly me.

That's still not intelligence actually released by AGS, as well you know.
They don't release intelligence held on file by the intelligence section.
It's state security

uck51js9zml2yt

timhenn wrote: »

Why? The facts are there, the PIRA were the good guys in a horrible war. Sinn Féin are irrelevant to that.

Good guys don't blow people apart who are just out for an after with family and friends.

smurgen

Very strange

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/garda-ombudsman-says-commissioner-won-t-alert-it-of-complaints-1.4123211

Cork_Langer1

dxhound2005 wrote: »

Also from 2015 and before Drew Harris, is this later assessment, including things which happened after 2009. It is in line with what the Commissoner said when reporters asked him to give the up to date assessment.

http://www.justice.ie/en/JELR/Pages/PR15000545

That reads like the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing, (AGS and the justice department giving different versions)

Wasn't Harris assistant commissioner of the PSNI at the time of the last report!

That all skinks to high heaven.

FrancieBrady

bubblypop wrote: »

That's still not intelligence actually released by AGS, as well you know.
They don't release intelligence held on file by the intelligence section.
It's state security

Seems to me that Gardai release info/intelligence when it suits them.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Seems to me that Gardai release info/intelligence when it suits them.

Nope.
It doesn't.
AGS don't release intelligence held.
& the 2 instances you refered to, were not intelligence released by AGS.

Junkyard Tom

bubblypop wrote: »

Also, nothing excuses murdering the policemen of the state.

Would you also include the vindictive bastards who remained in the RIC during the War of Independence? These people very much consciously threw their lot in with the murderous British occupation forces and were often staunch unionists.

The Black and Tans were foreign mercenary killers - what remained of the RIC were utter lowlifes who pointed out people for assassination - probably worse than the RUC during the Troubles.

But go ahead and try to venerate these lowlifes, that'll be another nail in the coffin of the RIC/Tan faction of Irish politics.

joeguevara

McMurphy wrote: »

From yesterday.

You have to read my post in its entirety. The bolded part was playing advocate to show how Mary Lous statement in essence said that there was an IRA council but she doesn’t answer for it and she is not their spokesman. If there wasn’t an IRA council she wouldn’t have made that differentiation.

Beasty

smurgen wrote: »

Leo Varadkar and Simon Harris conspiracy with the Garda commissioner to tar the most popular party leader of the country as a terrorist.I never thought I'd see the day.

Threads merged

joeguevara

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

She is correct that she doesnt answer for the IRA - but the reason that she leaves unspelled out is that she is subordinate to the IRA council. She is their executive on a political mission, and as such, has no authority to speak for the higher body.

That was exactly my point. The line stating it doesn’t exist was to show how ridiculous her statement was. Her statement reads that it does exist but she has nothing to do with it.

Mortelaro

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You need to think this through and stop ignoring what it was like through the conflict/war.

You are also ignoring something else that makes your thesis unsustainable.
You are saying that those with most to lose immediately trusted SF and literally discarded the SDLP. Yet 20 years later SF are still under suspicion in the south.

That makes no sense as a 'theory'.

Go back and re read what I said
I actually said the opposite
I said that those who vote Sinn Féin now arent doing so because they suddenly agree with the IRA campaign
Of course Sinn Féin are under scrutiny still in the south for the iRA campaign, its in peoples living memory
Elements of the distrust after the civil war a 100 years ago still exist today in the FF vs FG rivalry
Its actually there too in the US southern states still in various forms 200 years after theirs
Dealing with legacy issues is understandably much more raw when theres a living memory and ongoing newer related issues and something in a mass media age Sinn Féin needs to find solutions for

FrancieBrady

Mortelaro wrote: »

Go back and re read what I said
I actually said the opposite
I said that those who vote Sinn Féin now arent doing so because they suddenly agree with the IRA campaign
Of course Sinn Féin are under scrutiny still in the south for the iRA campaign, its in peoples living memory
Elements of the distrust after the civil war a 100 years ago still exist today in the FF vs FG rivalry
Its actually there too in the US southern states still in various forms 200 years after theirs
Dealing with legacy issues is understandably much more raw when theres a living memory and ongoing newer related issues and something in a mass media age Sinn Féin needs to find solutions for

Which doesn't explain your point about the growth of SF support in the north.
The reason SF's support grew in the north is not because the conflict stopped, it's because they succeeded in getting change for the people there.
They are still rewarding them for that.

The reason they are now getting support on the scale they are here is that they have succeeded in getting above the negative campaigning that rises up whenever they challenge the power swap parties, and are offering change for that demographic that want change.
Like the 'southern states' or the civil war here, you will get those who want to drag it back, but they are diminishing, year on year.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I'm a few miles away from Roslea. He was warned about supplying the army and RUC several times.

There are many protestants living happily in and around Roslea, they go to church with my partner and my children.

That is some kind of warped thinking to suggest that a man going about his normal business without fear or favour deserved to be killed as a result.

The mask didn’t so much slip as get thrown away.

Mortelaro

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Which doesn't explain your point about the growth of SF support in the north.
The reason SF's support grew in the north is not because the conflict stopped, it's because they succeeded in getting change for the people there.
They are still rewarding them for that.

They got the changes by arranging the ceasefire
It took time and a lot of work after that to pass out the SDLP,which IS my point
wartime-poor support in the ballot box
Time passes,war cancelled, work done in the community-A rise

The reason they are now getting support on the scale they are here is that they have succeeded in getting above the negative campaigning that rises up whenever they challenge the power swap parties, and are offering change for that demographic that want change.

NO
Most of that new vote is a harvesting of a protest vote
You have added to that the simple 'change ' message that devoid of too much detailed scrutiny worked in the exact same way at harnessing the fed up vote as Boris Johnson's let's get Brexit done Ironically

Like the 'southern states' or the civil war here, you will get those who want to drag it back, but they are diminishing, year on year.

You need to include the troubles in the above
Unfortunately because there are victims immediate families still alive and rogue elements who act above the law will continue to be a problem for Sinn Féin, until something is done to sort it
It's a problem a floating variable protest vote wont mask because that can go anywhere or back home when its less disappointed

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

That is some kind of warped thinking to suggest that a man going about his normal business without fear or favour deserved to be killed as a result.

The mask didn’t so much slip as get thrown away.

Who said anything about him 'deserving' it.


You are lying through your teeth again.

uck51js9zml2yt

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Which doesn't explain your point about the growth of SF support in the north.
The reason SF's support grew in the north is not because the conflict stopped, it's because they succeeded in getting change for the people there.
They are still rewarding them for that.

The reason they are now getting support on the scale they are here is that they have succeeded in getting above the negative campaigning that rises up whenever they challenge the power swap parties, and are offering change for that demographic that want change.
Like the 'southern states' or the civil war here, you will get those who want to drag it back, but they are diminishing, year on year.

Other people don't have to do much "dragging back" when SF have the likes of cullinane in their own ranks.

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

From yesterday.

As usual there is much left unsaid. A simple statement that no current or former members of the Army Council hold influence, sway or position within Sinn Fein will not be made by Mary-Lou for the obvious reasons.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Who said anything about him 'deserving' it.


You are lying through your teeth again.

You were rationalising and justifying it in a disgusting manner. Would be best if you deleted the post.

blanch152

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

A party with paramilitary links organising marches.

Yip, that tends to work out well.

Hurrache wrote: »

First one I've seen in an established democracy to complain they're not getting what they want shortly after an election.

Those who fail to understand and learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

There is a precedent where a party that had most support but not a majority organised rallies and marches to intimidate the political establishment into giving it the reigns of power. It didn’t end well.

Reabh Cronin May remember it.